Last Dulce thread I hope

It seems this thread represents quite a few of us on ATS. I don't have the time or money to go there but I'm sure there are many people that do. So will somebody please just go to where it's supposedly at and report back so we can either investigate further if needed or finally be done with it and focus on things that are actually relevant. I have an open mind and would love to believe in it but we have threads on this subject going back years and the exact location of it and still not a shred of proof so we just keep mulling over and over the same uselss hearsay. This is in no way meant in disrespect to those who believe in it.

The Archuletta Mesa is on Jicarilla Apache land so any travelers may want to look into getting a guide and making sure not to trespass on Tribal land. I think the UFO Hunters kind of summed up the matter. The guide they had seemed flighty and at times seems very uncomfortable discussing certain topics and also refused to take his guests to the secret tunnel complex.


"Velarde also described the Jicarilla Apache people and their attitudes about outsiders who come to Dulce asking about underground bases, cattle mutilations, and other weird subjects. Understandably, most of them prefer to keep their opinions and experiences to themselves. In light of this, it is quite remarkable that the tribal leaders consented to allow the conference on their land, perhaps one of the real ground-zero locations for strange goings-on for the last 40 years, and perhaps longer."
www.ufomystic.com...

Dulce is nonsense. First lets start with John Lear, the security guard that supposedly smuggled all of this top secret information out of the Dulce base was a man by the man of Thomas Costello. Now, the Dulce story came out before Bob Lazar's story did, Bob's only real 2 people he worked with at S4 which is a real area except it is a radar field located within the Tonopah Test Range was Dennis Mariani, Bob's supervisor, problem is in a few interviews of Bob he mentions a man named Jim Taliani who is real and was fired from the TTR because he was recognized voice wise when Bob and John were caught out at the Groomlake road. Gosh I wonder where the name S4 came from. Bob's only close co-worker was a man by the name of Barry Costello. Uuuuh sounds alot like Thomas Costello to me, but I thought he disappeared from Ducle. Man I love the original movie the Andromeda Strain. The Ducle base layout is exactly like the 1 in that 1970's movie. Oh, and how we found out the UFOS came from Zeti Reticuli, I remember Bob saying something about how John Lear and him got drunk 1 night and used the Betty and Barney Hill story for the crafts origins or something along those lines. By the way when in Dulce looking for a base where humans and aliens from planet snoopy poop are doing these dark experiments on each other, DON'T forget to visit the indian casino which has fine slot machines available everywhere. It is a crock of BS. If I were the government I would never let people walk all over my most secret of secret bases and look for entrances. It would be located deep in the NTS where nobody is allowed unless authorized. THAT IS MY SECRET BASE DON'T[snip]WITH MY THING.


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[edit on 7-9-2009 by elevatedone]

The secret base is somewhere in the outfield.

You have to go to it after you leave second base but you can not go to third base until you do.


It's the only way you can get back to home base.


Batter up.

rygi23, there is a constant influx of new seekers coming into ATS every day. Many have no idea how to check what threads have already been posted or even that they should check. All those things we feel are discussed to death are still new and exciting to them. Their enthusiasm is the heartbeat that keeps ATS alive and vibrant. New minds sometimes expound mundane facts into great theories.

Originally posted by debris765nju
rygi23, there is a constant influx of new seekers coming into ATS every day. Many have no idea how to check what threads have already been posted or even that they should check. All those things we feel are discussed to death are still new and exciting to them. Their enthusiasm is the heartbeat that keeps ATS alive and vibrant. New minds sometimes expound mundane facts into great theories.

I agree whole heartedly with you about those beginning to open thier minds to things not in the mainstream and getting excitment out of it. It's great to see that. However, repetative speculation over stories that are so far fetched has two detrimental impacts...those already having an interest exposing truth will see less progress in the matters that are not far fetched, and our mission to get more people into this interest is hindered because stories like Dulce are so hard for them to fathom, and understandably so. Proving our arguments are valid, or atleast likely so, will lead to a greater sense of relavency to so many more people.

The dulce base controversy will never die because rumors are hard to dispell. At first I thought this was some kind of crazy science fiction story made to sell or perhaps a disgruntled goverment employee trying to get even but unfortunately the more you dig the more you find. It took a great amount of time and effort to assemble the puzzle but in the end I think it was worth it.

Chances are dulce and many other underground/underwater bases exist in the usa, indo-china border, pacific islands, bahamas area, etc. Do we have proof? Obviously not but that might be a good thing until we, as a human species, are ready to cope with such harsh realities. Perhaps they hide the truth to protect us from going totally ape # and society breaking down to chaos. Some people are mature and can handle almost anything but others are not. Just imagine the repercusions if governments where about to disclose everything they knew to us. I remember losing sleep on many occassions just pondering what *could* be true and what that *might* mean for our imminent and distant future.

I could expand this more to general conspiracy discussion but I prefer sticking to the topic at hand. Dulce has been discussed by many people but visual confirmation of the actual base is impossible to get because it is deep underground; probably a mile or two underneath the archuleta mesa. Perhaps there are a few clues on the surface but only native americans residing on the reservation will have knowledge and access to them, if any exist. For everyone else the land is STRICTLY OFF LIMITS and people risk getting arrested for tresspassing if they ignore the warnings. Don't bother going there!

IMO thomas castello and phil schneider sounded very convincing discussing what they knew. Thomas Castello had an ultra-7 top secret clearance and was head of security at the time. He described seven levels of which the bottom three housed aliens and important lab work was done. He also mentioned that dulce was connected to the underground maglev system that interconnected at least a hundred bases throughout the mid and far west. Dulce is the probably the central hub of this joint human-alien endeavor.

Phil Schneider was a geologist working on these underground labs/bases and gave many lectures before "committing suicide" in his own house by strangling himself with piano wire(yeah right). He mentioned conducting all kinds of ground surveys and helped build many of them. While working at dulce he said he was shot by gray aliens and he returned fire killing a few.

Originally posted by rygi23
It seems this thread represents quite a few of us on ATS. I don't have the time or money to go there but I'm sure there are many people that do. So will somebody please just go to where it's supposedly at and report back so we can either investigate further if needed or finally be done with it and focus on things that are actually relevant. I have an open mind and would love to believe in it but we have threads on this subject going back years and the exact location of it and still not a shred of proof so we just keep mulling over and over the same uselss hearsay. This is in no way meant in disrespect to those who believe in it.

That is an EXCELLENT IDEA!! My fiancea and I have already priced out the plane tickets, the hotel cost, and rental car cost. Unfortunelty, we are not 25 yet and cant rent a car. But we do plan on going in the area, Im hoping for a week stay and hopefully plan it around a Ufo convention in Racheal, or Rosewell Or somewhere in the area. My grandfather was in the air force and he was allowed information of top secret information and he told my grandmother that they take it to a side of a mountain in the desert and that there are things in that place you wouldnt believe and thats all he would tell her, he died when my mom was 1 and I truely believe he was talking about dulce.. My grandmother said that he would be gone for 3 weeks sometimes even a month at a time and he wasnt allowed to call her. I wish he was still around for me to ask!! But yea we should plan somekind of investigation of our own!! Anyone intrested send me a message, we were thinkin april of 2010???

I watched the UFO hunters episode on Dulce and I have to agree with that guy Pat if I remember correctly. This is BS on the highest order and I realize it is a or can be a business industry and when researched into this subject as well as I am, you spot every possible fraud like John Lear or Linda Molton Howe. I realize there is a cause to keep people's interest in this subject but this is absolute total....total unadultered bullsh@t. There is noone named Thomas Costello, but there is a very vivid imagination named John Lear who wants people to believe he's got some kind top secret information about something. He's pretty much set for life, so when you dissect his BS claims and maybe even try to press those doubts against him he's already gone on to his next sneeky thought of aliens from planet chaboobee trying to take over us.

I believe they are moving the entire Dulce underground complex to a million square foot facility under Washington DC.

OK, now seriously, Dulce would be an odd place for the feds to do anything. Indian land comes under tribal rule. I suppose they could have paid off the tribe to keep their mouths shut.

Why find out the facts when you can perpetuate the myths with endless studies that include impossible to verify facts such as a secret interview with the former workers, stuff like that.

They keep expanding Groom Lake and the TTR, yet there is no shortage of people that claim the functions have been moved to secret locations. When you prove the secret location is devoid of much of anything, they scream "UNDERGROUND!"

Originally posted by gariac
I believe they are moving the entire Dulce underground complex to a million square foot facility under Washington DC.

LOL, here we go again! 110 million to be exact ;o) I've updated that thread and more very soon with specifics. This thread should demonstrate to ya atleast a lil bit that I'm not a crackpot believing everything. About what I expected from this thread, nonbelievers like myself and believers w/o proof.

If you want to go to Dulce, simply rent the movie from 1971 called the Andromeda Strain. The exact base layout in that movie is the same as the one portrayed as Dulce. Someone, I suspect John Lear decided to add 2 more new levels with absolute nonsense to grow a cottage industry. I like people in the field of Ufology such as Stanton Friedman, Richard Dolan or Richard Sauder who go on only what they can prove through government documents and let you make your own decision. No claims of aliens eating humans and cross breeding them with monkeys, etc etc. Don't even start with Bob Lazar becasue if you are a believer in that story, I will tell you things you probably never wish you thought you heard. I'm very hardly trying to kill the Dulce story, thru facts and references to many other things taken from past and future accounts of secret bases that were all thrown together to make some nonsense people really don't either have the time to put 2 and 2 together or don't have very good memories to catch what someone said in a certain interview, then when I hear it is a fraction of a second when I remember what that and this person, movie or interviewer said. If you don't believe me, just ask and I will give you a run down of all the nonsense and you will start back to where I did. Legitimate government document's and credible people's testimony. Whats worse, knowing or not knowing? Can be tough sometimes.

It is quite possible a alien base like dulce does exsist under the town of dulce.But the goverment knows nobody will ever find it or breach there security protocols.The base is too deep and the security mesures are so tight nobody could enter or escape from that base anyway.Some people who may have worked there may have leaked some infomation about the base.Of course the infomation leaked does not directly breach security protocols and the goverment knows this.They have nothing to worry about.A army of ufo , alien fans can search every bush and rock for miles and find nothing.The goverment hides its bases quite well and the entrences to the bases even better.The security protocols are the best and nothing could get though them except another type of alien intrusion by different aliens.The chances of that happening is very slight as the base contains fourteen species of different aliens.

Posts like ^^^ is why I started this thread.

[edit on 11-9-2009 by rygi23]

I make weekly trips to outside the west end of dulce . Subcontracted to gas producers for work around existing well sites . The area of Archuleta mesa and generally in 100 miles around Dulce is like Swiss cheese with all the natural gas and oil wells . Some areas have well heads every 1/4 mile other locations will have 2-6 wellheads at the same location angle drilled and these may be spaced 1/2 to 1 mile apart . Sacred sites are often angle drilled to prevent conflicts with the spiritual beliefs of the native tribes .

With as much natural gas and oil being pumped out of that area I find it to be next to impossible for a underground base of any depth or size being located on Archuleta mesa . Gas and oil pockets will extend for miles at varying depths .

If there is a base they have been dodging oil and gas companies drill bits like crazy . Depending what formation they are drilling into a well can be 5 miles deep . Then after the well is drilled many time they set off a charge down hole to fracture the geological formation to allow better flow of oil or gas so besides being drilled 95 % of the wells have had a huge explosion set off under ground .

The plausibility of a base is extremely remote from my knowledge of the area .

reply to post by RyanLA123


What makes you an expert on the alleged dulce base? You think Bob Lazar and John Lear are the only links? Not a chance mate! Do some research on Jason Bishop, Phil Schneider and Thomas Castello for starters.

Then look into de-classified rand documents that speak of underground base construction and LANL laser drilling patents filled in the early 70's but quickly forgotten/ignored. Not suspicious enough?

Me thinks your a bit lazy

Originally posted by Lostinthedarkness
I make weekly trips to outside the west end of dulce . Subcontracted to gas producers for work around existing well sites . The area of Archuleta mesa and generally in 100 miles around Dulce is like Swiss cheese with all the natural gas and oil wells . Some areas have well heads every 1/4 mile other locations will have 2-6 wellheads at the same location angle drilled and these may be spaced 1/2 to 1 mile apart . Sacred sites are often angle drilled to prevent conflicts with the spiritual beliefs of the native tribes .

With as much natural gas and oil being pumped out of that area I find it to be next to impossible for a underground base of any depth or size being located on Archuleta mesa . Gas and oil pockets will extend for miles at varying depths .

If there is a base they have been dodging oil and gas companies drill bits like crazy . Depending what formation they are drilling into a well can be 5 miles deep . Then after the well is drilled many time they set off a charge down hole to fracture the geological formation to allow better flow of oil or gas so besides being drilled 95 % of the wells have had a huge explosion set off under ground .

The plausibility of a base is extremely remote from my knowledge of the area .

The odds of accidently side-drilling into such a base are very remote and by no means proves anything. You can never deny 100 access but 99.9999% is more than enough!

Earthcitizen, there is no one named Thomas Costello, well there maybe somewhere in the world but he was not a security guard at Dulce. ONCE AGAIN, the Dulce story came out before Bob Lazar's story did. According to Bob Lazar the only man he worked with on the saucer was a man named Barry Costello, UUUUUH wasn't he Thomas Costello from Dulce? I guess they are related. Listen to Bob say it from his own mouth.

Just because the Rand Corporation comes out with a tunnel boring machine you saw on UFO HUNTERS doesn't mean they used it to build a ultra top secret base in Dulce. They probably used it to bore a few tunnels in the NTS and NORAD and thats it. The machine is probably sitting in a warehouse somewhere gathering dust. The Dulce base layout I have to say looks alot like the one called Wildfire in the 1971 movie The Andromeda Strain. Go to google video and compare the 2, I don't think you will like what you find in regards to comparison.

John Lear, Linda Molton Howe and others love to use their brains to create such nonsense it's incredible, but it is a business for some and new material is needed from time to time, whether real or not. Listen to people like Stanton friedman, Richard dolan, Richard Sauder and Kevin Randle my man, not these people.

Oh when in Dulce please don't forget to visit the indian casino which has fine slot machines avaible everywhere. SMILE with a bright ding!

I agree with allot of what you say and I have doubts about Dulce being anything but a myth. I don't believe the subject isn't relevant however. Maybe it isn't to you and me but I'm sure that there are others out there that feel it is and they have a right to have a thread on the subject. I don't dismiss Dulce 100% there may be the day that another (God forbid) thread comes up with some info that has some kind of proof of a base. I don't know if I've made any sense, at any rate have a good day freind.

reply to post by RyanLA123


Your right on the money. My view on U.F.O's and D.U.M.B's has changed significantly over the years. It took me awhile to realize that there isn't allot of hard evidence out there even documents have me wondering there seems to be controversy about the MJ-12 documents being fake it seem's like it's always back to square one. The only thing I can put stock in is videos of sightings and even then one has to be very discerning. I don't discount that allot has and is going on in regards to the subject but hard evidence insn't easy to come by.