General Christain talk.... Music, doctrine, etc. All civil replies welcome!

reply to post by Joecroft


I think you guys are getting too deep for my blood with this "subconcious" thing. The best way I describe it is like a vault. A vault with a complex combination. For traumatic events that are forgotten deep in the subconcious, certain things may trigger flashbacks. These are the combinations of the lock being opened.... the right trigger for the right event. Say you were shot years ago by driveby shootings. A gunshot fired would be a trigger point to bring that traumatic thing back up. My wife had that problem once. In 2003 she got in a car wreck that nearly killed her. She had to learn to walk, talk and function her age. She was life-flighted to Columbus Regional Hospital in Columbus, GA. Every time she hears the sound of a prop or helecopter, she cringes in agony.

If you guys get a chance, check out my new thread called "The 7 Revivals of the Roman Empire..... The Middle Ages, Nazism, and the EU."

www.belowtopsecret.com...

It's a very long opening for a thread because I posted 2 chapters to a book on this subject with very valuable information. I urge you all to check it out and flag it if you like it.

reply to post by badmedia

Originally posted by badmedia
Are you familiar with vector searches? Each vector is just a "dimension". Every word is it's own vector So you store the information in a normal relational database, but each entries gets a vector value.

I had heard of something similar but this is the first time I have heard of the name “vector”, thanks for posting and explaining it.

Originally posted by badmedia

So it becomes a "shape" database, and it is much more efficient because you aren't going along matching up every word across the entire database and so forth. You just go to "area" that is relevent and pull matches from there(which you can further manipulate/order after).

I guess now they are designing databases that are like this. I've just done it on my end through code in the past.

www.vectordatabase.com...

It’s pretty amazing stuff, I have just been looking it up online. It takes those base vector values and uses Pythagoras theorem and algebra, to work out the magnitude for each document. When a query is run, it multiplies that query with each value/row in a document, which produces a figure, which is termed the “dot product”. Finally the query works out the cosine value, by dividing the “dot product” figure by the magnitude. If the cosine value returns the value 0.0000 then it basically means there is no relevant search criteria there, to be found.

This seems like a great way of looking for something especially in extremely large databases by targeting an area first, before doing another search. It’s gives it a dimensional form…I was kind of thinking about a 3 dimensional database when I wrote my initial comment and with some kind of unique 3 dimensional shape to it, that would enhance the databases capability. I’m not entirely sure what though…I think I’ve been watching too much of the Matrix philosophy , which you posted on the other thread.

Originally posted by badmedia

This stuff makes me wonder about the soul less beings of revelation. I can see that as being people who literally have no soul(robots basically), AI(same thing really), or corporations who are treated and given the same rights as an individual, and is used by those who have power to do their bidding. I usually lean towards corporations on these things, but some of this technology stuff - if successful puts a huge wrench in that.

That thought about soul less beings, reminds me of those Alien bodies that were (apparently!) discovered at the Roswell crash site. They were described at various points as being robotic, cold and soul less. I personally don’t believe that God would have allow us (by design) to transfer our whole being, into a machine. We may be able to put our memories into them in the future, but not our souls…so yes, if that happens, there could well be, these entities walking around, with just memories and no souls.

-JC

reply to post by Locoman8



I haven’t really seen that many Christian movies other than “The Passion of the Christ”

Ben Hur was the first movie I ever saw with Jesus in it. I think I was about 12 when I first saw this film…it’s 50 years old now, so I thought it deserved a mention.




- JC

reply to post by Joecroft


I have yet to see Ben-Hur. The Passion of the Christ is good but falsely portrays Jesus as a long-haired hippie and the Jews of that time are dressed all wrong. Mel Gibson is very anti-semetic, though I'm a fan of his work.

The Ten Commandments is another good one. Also, the Nicholas Sparks book turned movie "A Walk to Remember" is very good and christian oriented with a sweet looking Mandy Moore playing the lead.

reply to post by Locoman8


Hello All

I much prefer the old hymns from wesley etc

hope everyone is well

Little one is away so had a bit of time this weekend

Take Care all

david

THE RESURRECTION... a wonderful hope for our deceased loved ones:

reply to post by holywar


Agreed! Many christains don't understand the point of the resurrections. The first resurrection happens when Christ returns to earth and resurrects His saints. The second happens after the 1000 years of peace on earth. It is a fleshly resurrection of judgement. This second resurrection will be the one that nearly all of earth's population will be part of. This is the hope of seeing your loved ones. Unlike popular belief that judgement is a sentence to "hell", it's quite the opposite. You are taught God's true ways and at that point you either accept what your eyes and ears see and hear, or you don't and die a second death.

Originally posted by Joecroft
Ok lets just say that our minds through some unknown process, have access to every possibility in the universe, that gives us free will, through our filtered, brain, system (possibly the subconscious or unconscious mind). Having that access is similar to AI having a database of options, but the AI of course, has to be programmed with random number generators, to make it appear to be life like. (illusion of life). We have this infinite knowledge, filtered through our mechanical/biological brains but how does that help us to make a choice. Its helps to a certain extent, in that it makes us aware of the options/choices but how do we then choose.

For example, say you have an orange, a banana and a kiwi fruit in front of you and someone says, “choose only one”. Now lets just imagine for a moment that you can break free from this filtered brain system and now have access to infinite consciousness. You now know all there is to know about oranges, bananas and kiwi fruit. How do we now choose one? I mean other than just saying “I like kiwi fruit” lol, what are the other mechanics involved in making a choice, regardless of the options in front of us, unless of course the choice is obvious.

Its seems to me it is our ability to make choices, that is a crucial component of our intelligence, as well as being subconsciously aware of all options that gives us our freewill.

- JC

It is completely illogical, which is why I couldn't get it in the program. Had it been logical, then I could have applied that logic. But I simply couldn't do it. Even if I gave it all possible choices, I still wouldn't be able to make it have a choice. I would have to force it to do such, and that is not free will. I guess really the first step to free will could be the will to be.

I am slow in replying because I've been in a huge causality discussion in the philosophy forum about this. And am somewhat burned out. They would say this is all proof freewill doesn't exist, and that choice is just a matter of causality. But they forget that something had to make that initial choice even if it was simply a matter of causality after.

As such, I can't really say how exactly it works. But, the part of all possibilities is a requirement of freewill, and also a requirement of being all knowing. To restrict the possibilities is to restrict the intelligence. And yet, at the same time it must also be able to do that when it wants, in order to have that experience and understand it - which is a possiblity in itself.

It's why if you talk to a Buddhist or something, they would say leave all logic at the door. What it is "to be", "to understand", "to observe" and "to create" is illogical and beyond logic, beyond science.

Even scientists can't get around it. With the big bang theory, you either get something coming from nothing(illogical), or an eternal atom with no beginning which for some reason just "happened/decided" to explode into all that we see(also illogical).

I would say being subconsciously aware of options is our creativity. Which is what allows us to create logic, where as that which is bound to and by logic is unable to see anything beyond the logic it follows. We are able to say "What if" and then play it out in our heads. Create logic and see how it goes etc.



[edit on 8/2/2009 by badmedia]

Originally posted by Joecroft
It’s pretty amazing stuff, I have just been looking it up online. It takes those base vector values and uses Pythagoras theorem and algebra, to work out the magnitude for each document. When a query is run, it multiplies that query with each value/row in a document, which produces a figure, which is termed the “dot product”. Finally the query works out the cosine value, by dividing the “dot product” figure by the magnitude. If the cosine value returns the value 0.0000 then it basically means there is no relevant search criteria there, to be found.

This seems like a great way of looking for something especially in extremely large databases by targeting an area first, before doing another search. It’s gives it a dimensional form…I was kind of thinking about a 3 dimensional database when I wrote my initial comment and with some kind of unique 3 dimensional shape to it, that would enhance the databases capability. I’m not entirely sure what though…I think I’ve been watching too much of the Matrix philosophy

, which you posted on the other thread.

Yep, that is how it works. But not limited to only 3 dimensions, since they are imaginary, we can create as many as we want.

Did I post a movie about the matrix and philosophy in that thread? I can't remember. Here it is anyway just in case.

Google Video Link

That thought about soul less beings, reminds me of those Alien bodies that were (apparently!) discovered at the Roswell crash site. They were described at various points as being robotic, cold and soul less. I personally don’t believe that God would have allow us (by design) to transfer our whole being, into a machine. We may be able to put our memories into them in the future, but not our souls…so yes, if that happens, there could well be, these entities walking around, with just memories and no souls.

Yeah, I seen that too. That would basically fall under the category of robots and such, that have no soul.

But I generally see corporations as fitting the bill best in revelation. Because corportions are things the greedy power hungry people use as a means of control and such, and now they are given all the individual rights of a person with a soul.

I guess it's just a matter of how long things go on. If it all ended tommorow, I'd guess corporations were it. If it goes on a good bit longer, who knows what will come up and fit the bill, because the robots and such like you mention certainly have the ability to fulfill it. Imagine armies of them and such, terminator style etc. Yuck.





[edit on 8/2/2009 by badmedia]

Btw, omegapoint posted this in another thread, but it is from a scientist and is talking exactly about this.

"The God Theory" by Bernard Haisch

www.thegodtheory.com...

Bernard Haisch, Ph.D., is an astrophysicist and author of over 130 scientific publications. He served as a scientific editor of the Astrophysical Journal for ten years, and was Principal Investigator on several NASA research projects. After earning his Ph.D. from the University of Wisconsin in Madison, Haisch did postdoctoral research at the Joint Institute for Laboratory Astrophysics, University of Colorado at Boulder and the University of Utrecht, the Netherlands. His professional positions include Staff Scientist at the Lockheed Martin Solar and Astrophysics Laboratory; Deputy Director of the Center for Extreme Ultraviolet Astrophysics at the University of California, Berkeley; and Visiting Scientist at the Max-Planck-Institut fuer Extraterrestrische Physik in Garching, Germany. He was also Editor-in-Chief of the Journal of Scientific Exploration. Prior to his career in astrophysics, Haisch attended the Latin School of Indianapolis and the St. Meinrad Seminary as a student for the Catholic priesthood. The God Theory is his first solo book. He is married, with three children, and lives in the San Francisco Bay Area with his wife, Marsha Sims.

Anyway, check out what he says.

If you think of white light as a metaphor of infinite, formless potential, the colors on a slide or frame of film become a structured reality grounded in the polarity that comes about through intelligent subtraction from that absolute formless potential. It results from the limitation of the unlimited. I contend that this metaphor provides a comprehensible theory for the creation of a manifest reality (our universe) from the selective limitation of infinite potential (God)...

If there exists an absolute realm that consists of infinite potential out of which a created realm of polarity emerges, is there any sensible reason not to call this "God"? Or to put it frankly, if the absolute is not God, what is it? For our purposes here, I will identify the Absolute with God. More precisely I will call the Absolute the Godhead. Applying this new terminology to the optics analogy, we can conclude that our physical universe comes about when the Godhead selectively limits itself, taking on the role of Creator and manifesting a realm of space and time and, within that realm, filtering out some of its own infinite potential...

Viewed this way, the process of creation is the exact opposite of making something out of nothing. It is, on the contrary, a filtering process that makes something our of everything. Creation is not capricious or random addition; it is intelligent and selective subtraction. The implications of this are profound. If the Absolute in the Godhead, and if creation is the process by which the Godhead filters our parts of its own infinite potential to manifest a physical reality that supports experience, then the stuff that is left over, the residue of this process, is our physical universe, and ourselves included. We are nothing less than a part of that Godhead - quite literally.

This is the understanding the father gave me, and is what I call the father/son relationship.

reply to post by badmedia

Originally posted by badmedia
I am slow in replying because I've been in a huge causality discussion in the philosophy forum about this. And am somewhat burned out. They would say this is all proof freewill doesn't exist, and that choice is just a matter of causality. But they forget that something had to make that initial choice even if it was simply a matter of causality after.

Yes, I have read some of the posts on that thread you mentioned and you have put your point across extremely well, considering the amount of heat and animosity flying around.

I agree, that there could have been no causality in the beginning but only possibly after…unless the universe works in some kind of circular perpetual motion loop, but even then something would have had to start it up. I think it was Stephen harwking, who had the theory that black holes, were constantly sucking in matter and throwing it out again, creating a perpetual ongoing motion of big bangs.

Originally posted by badmedia
Even scientists can't get around it. With the big bang theory, you either get something coming from nothing(illogical), or an eternal atom with no beginning which for some reason just "happened/decided" to explode into all that we see(also illogical).

I started a thread a while back, suggesting that statistically most everyday things around us are designed by us and that, that should be a good indicator, that everything else, that isn’t made by us, is most likely designed as well…statistically speaking. After I posted my thread, there seemed to be a barrage of atheist threads starting up, but not one atheist came on to my thread, to try and refute the idea!

Originally posted by badmedia
Anyway, check out what he says.

If you think of white light as a metaphor of infinite, formless potential, the colors on a slide or frame of film become a structured reality grounded in the polarity that comes about through intelligent subtraction from that absolute formless potential. It results from the limitation of the unlimited. I contend that this metaphor provides a comprehensible theory for the creation of a manifest reality (our universe) from the selective limitation of infinite potential (God)...

If there exists an absolute realm that consists of infinite potential out of which a created realm of polarity emerges, is there any sensible reason not to call this "God"? Or to put it frankly, if the absolute is not God, what is it? For our purposes here, I will identify the Absolute with God. More precisely I will call the Absolute the Godhead. Applying this new terminology to the optics analogy, we can conclude that our physical universe comes about when the Godhead selectively limits itself, taking on the role of Creator and manifesting a realm of space and time and, within that realm, filtering out some of its own infinite potential...

Viewed this way, the process of creation is the exact opposite of making something out of nothing. It is, on the contrary, a filtering process that makes something our of everything. Creation is not capricious or random addition; it is intelligent and selective subtraction. The implications of this are profound. If the Absolute in the Godhead, and if creation is the process by which the Godhead filters our parts of its own infinite potential to manifest a physical reality that supports experience, then the stuff that is left over, the residue of this process, is our physical universe, and ourselves included. We are nothing less than a part of that Godhead - quite literally.

Wow… that just about summarizes most of what we have been discussing so far

“Limitation of the unlimited”…that has got to the most profound concept I have heard for a long time. One thing that has come to my mind whilst discussing this, is the concept of discoveries especially in medicine. Most people would say that medicines were discovered rather than invented. But when it comes to making and designing things, peoples call it “Inventions” but it could be argued that everything is being discovered, because it already exists.

Still…I have many questions and a lot more to uncover but this has definitely made me think.



- JC

reply to post by Locoman8


As a scotsman, this is the song I listen to whenever I need to remember why its worth facing the struggles on the path of life.

I am facing a very difficult time and this song has been a blessing to me.

I thought some people might appreciate it....



I dont normally put personal posts on ATS but then again this is BTS



[edit on 4-8-2009 by XXXN3O]

reply to post by XXXN3O


Thanks for shareing. Yes, this is BTS and I happen to like BTS because you can talk about anything here without a lot of "off-topic" post deletions. I don't like the fact they don't have the star system on bts as they do on ats but at least people can flag. Anywho, you're a scot huh? Well, bagpipe amazing grace fits well with the region. You do know that you guys are descendants of the lost 10 tribes of Israel? As are we here in America. Great Britain and the United States are from the tribe of Joseph.... more accurately, the tribes of Ephraim and Manasseh, the two sons of Joseph. If you want to learn more about this, check out my thread on Britain and the US in bible prophecy here...

www.belowtopsecret.com...

What do you guys think of this video? I would consider it to be "holy" in a way, as it is speaking the truth about society today. While it's not saying things in a good way exactly, it's pointing out how screwed up the way society acts.

And she calls it all "being taken over by the Fear".

Lily Allen - The Fear Lyrics

I want to be rich and I want lots of money
I don’t care about clever I don’t care about funny
I want loads of clothes and f***loads of diamonds
I heard people die while they are trying to find them

I’ll take my clothes off and it will be shameless
‘Cuz everyone knows that’s how you get famous
I’ll look at the sun and I’ll look in the mirror
I’m on the right track yeah I’m on to a winner

Chorus
I don’t know what’s right and what’s real anymore
I don’t know how I’m meant to feel anymore
When we think it will all become clear
‘Cuz I’m being taken over by The Fear

Life’s about film stars and less about mothers
It’s all about fast cars and passing each other
But it doesn’t matter cause I’m packing plastic
and that’s what makes my life so f***ing fantastic

And I am a weapon of massive consumption
and its not my fault it’s how I’m program to function
I’ll look at the sun and I’ll look in the mirror
I’m on the right track yeah I’m on to a winner

Chorus
I don’t know what’s right and what’s real anymore
I don’t know how I’m meant to feel anymore
When we think it will all become clear
‘Cuz I’m being taken over by The Fear

Bridge
Forget about guns and forget ammunition
Cause I’m killing them all on my own little mission
Now I’m not a saint but I’m not a sinner
Now everything is cool as long as I’m getting thinner

Chorus
I don’t know what’s right and what’s real anymore
I don’t know how I’m meant to feel anymore
When we think it will all become clear
‘Cause I’m being taken over by fear

So it's saying bad things, but as it's saying it so directly, it seems to pointing them out for how dumb it is.

[edit on 8/6/2009 by badmedia]

reply to post by badmedia


I agree with you, its actually amazing that so many young people listen to this and do not realise that the song is actually about them in many ways apart from positive.

There are many other forms of music trying to break through both good and bad.

reply to post by badmedia

Originally posted by badmedia
What do you guys think of this video? I would consider it to be "holy" in a way, as it is speaking the truth about society today. While it's not saying things in a good way exactly, it's pointing out how screwed up the way society acts.

The video reminds of “Alice in Wonderland” meets “The Prisoner” lol…

as for the lyrics…I believe it’s talking about famous woman and celebrities, in a very subtle way, and pointing out just how messed up their lives are and how messed up society is.



- JC

reply to post by Joecroft


I don't know why it took so long for me but I finally added you as a friend. And thank you for adding me. I mentioned movies on this thread and then noticed that you started your own thread on inspirational movies so I'm going to check it out.

reply to post by badmedia


Hi. Thank you so much for posting this about vector databases. Very interesting!
Can you please clarify something for me, though?

You wrote: "Base Vector value = 2,1,2,1,1,2,1,1,1"
- If I understand you correctly, this is the frequency of each word in the text, right? For example, the first word "dog" is mentioned twice, therefore the first number is 2.

Next: "The first entry now has it's own vector value of: 1,1,1,0,0,0,0,0,0"
- I am afraid I don't follow this part. What first entry? Can you please explain and use another example as well?

Much obliged.

Walter.

Originally posted by walterkatz
You wrote: "Base Vector value = 2,1,2,1,1,2,1,1,1"
- If I understand you correctly, this is the frequency of each word in the text, right? For example, the first word "dog" is mentioned twice, therefore the first number is 2.

Yes, that is correct.

Next: "The first entry now has it's own vector value of: 1,1,1,0,0,0,0,0,0"
- I am afraid I don't follow this part. What first entry? Can you please explain and use another example as well?

The base vector is created using the entire database. This creates a key for positions that is valid across all entries. Each individual entry of that database is then given it's own vector as well, but now we use the base vector for the positions. That is what gives us the 0's, because while the word does exist in the database, it doesn't have any occurrences in the particular entry.

So, from the previous example:

Database:

The dog killed the cat
Cats eat fish
The sun is bright
The sun shines on dogs butt sometimes.

Base Vector value = 2,1,2,1,1,2,1,1,1
Base Vector key = Dog, killed, cat, eat, fish, sun, bright, shines, butt

The first entry now has it's own vector value of: 1,1,1,0,0,0,0,0,0

"The dog killed the cat" vector = 1,1,1,0,0,0,0,0,0
"Cats eat fish" = 0,0,1,1,1,0,0,0,0
etc

I underlined the key part because I only implied it rather than showing it before. It's probably what caused the confusion. You also do that with the incoming search strings, to apply the math. So really, it's 3 vectors total.

Make more sense this time?

reply to post by Locoman8


Some of you may be amazed that I post this, considering my anti-Christian posts in other places on this board. However, I am not anti-theist, and I grew up Baptecostal, so I still have a deep love for beautiful gospel music.

Two of my favorites are:

Thou, O Lord

and

I'm Amazed

Peace,
Daniel