Obama: Time To 'Stop Clinging To' Unworkable Health Care System

at last count 49 million , or 20% of the US citizens below 65 do not have insuarnce - this is the working population.


that figure is set to rise as employer health care goes the way of the dodo - you want a job? great heres your pay - want health care/dental care/gym memebership - theres the application forms , its only $200 a month for each membership - and thats single. want it in the job package? we`ll get back to you.

as the recession bites deeper , the `perks `ill be lost or your position is suddenly no longer there as the company restructures.

the not only do you not have all those health plans - you can`t afford your home loan.... and the spiral starts there.


in today`s climate - keeping food in the cupboard , a roof over your head and light and heat come before any luxury.

Originally posted by TheAmused
..............
if you entire argument to socialized health care is you ritch don't want to help the poor..
that's sad in itself.

Do we run around calling canada socialist nazi scum bag's?no we don't.
................

Obviously you have no idea what you are talking about... The Canadian healthcare system SUCKS. Many Canadians have to come to the U.S., and pay out of pocket for procedures that are not allowed under the "universal healthcare", and they are not rich Canadians...

President Obama wants to take $300-313 BILLION dollars from Medicare, and Medicaid to pay partly for his "free Socialist healthcare", the rest will be paid in taxes, and estimates put the money needed as much higher than those $300-313 BILLION dollars from Medicare, and Medicaid...

Under President Obama's healthcare, THE GOVERNMENT, and not the doctors, dictate what procedures can patients have, IF THEY ARE AFFORDABLE....

Seriously, the people who think Socialized healthcare is the solution are deluding themselves.

Most of the "Socialized healthcare" around the world ARE BANKRUPT.... Yet the LEFT wants the U.S. to make the same mistakes as the rest of the world...

The LEFT calls this,"joining civilization".... Yeah, the same European civilization where they kill each other over SOCCER GAMES.... The same civilization where in many cities women have to wear a Jihab not to get raped by Muslim youth gangs for not covering their faces, and or get scarred as a show to other women to cover their faces...

Great civilization you got there Europe.....



[edit on 2-7-2009 by ElectricUniverse]

Originally posted by Mainer
I find it odd that a Country requiring mandatory community funded education as a basic right thinks health care is somehow less worthy.

You say "less worthy" as though you think a government funded program would improve quality and reduce cost. This is the exact reason it hasn't happened as of yet. The current system is providing the best health care in the world for an affordable cost.

I think you might be onto something with the current problem of our educational system. Maybe we need to start taking steps to a more privatized system without government intervention our education system would improve and attain the quality of our university system.

[edit on 2-7-2009 by Bugman82]

reply to post by Bugman82


This brings me to the newly and biggest endorser of Obamas health care reform, Wal-mart, they now are looking into this with a money sign and profit in their eyes.

With their walking clinics to be opened in their stores and the ones that are already opened and their ready pharmacy they could make a big profit from this.

Get your 15 minutes check out and then go pick your Chinese and Indian manufactured medication at the wal-mart clinic checkout counter.

Originally posted by Bugman82

Originally posted by Mainer
I find it odd that a Country requiring mandatory community funded education as a basic right thinks health care is somehow less worthy.

You say "less worthy" as though you think a government funded program would improve quality and reduce cost. This is the exact reason it hasn't happened as of yet. The current system is providing the best health care in the world for an affordable cost.

I think you might be onto something with the current problem of our educational system. Maybe we need to start taking steps to a more privatized system without government intervention.

Exactly.

The education system is poor and Obama is going to stop a voucher program in DC that's helping young minority kids. The kids are happy and their families are happy.

But to liberals it's not about education it's about the Teachers union.

Again, this is not about healthcare, it's about artificially bringing down health care costs to save Medicare. You always have to look for the politics behind the emotion.

Saying everyone is needs Healthcare sounds good but there's other ways to achieve this without the government wasting and spending more money.

reply to post by Harlequin


Health insurance is a racket. The medical industry is a racket. The working class are unable to afford the cost of insurance, therefore are forced to use emergency services which are more expensive by far. The entire system is a fraud. If only people would understand that their health is in their own hands. But people cling to the fantasy that the medical industry has thier best interests at heart and will bend over backward to help when its needed.

People, the "professionals" are working a J.O.B. and could care less about your aches and pains and illnesses. Learn what nature itself has provided. All it takes is a willingness to learn how to treat minor symptoms naturally. Preventive herbals will take a huge bite out of the medical machine's profits if only more people would learn about and rely on them before they are labeled as poisons by the FDA and other regulatory agencies!

There is wisdom is the old ways. One of which is not going into debt. The other is to know how to live off the land. That includes knowledge of plants and herbs, their uses both remedially and culinary. When people understand that their health is in their own hands, then the need for a universal health care system will be moot.

The health care I've received in my lifetime has been far from adequate even though I have insurance. The testing and recommended surgeries have cost into the hundreds of thousands of dollars, yet my health has not improved because of their "expertise". Exactly the opposite because I will not take their poisons/medications. I started treating my own condition with positive results.

If I ever need someone to set a broken bone or stop a hemmorage, I'll seek medical help. For everything else, including conditions such as chronic anemia, I'll treat myself with confidence and knowledge of natural remedies. Most of the health conditions we face and suffer from are caused by the very consumption that is collapsing our economy and country.

reply to post by Hazelnut


I agree and I also treat my most common ailments with natural remedies, but my high blood pressure Is the only thing I do half and half so I can stay on only one medication and the rest is natural remedies even when my doctor disapprove of it.

I believe that the big medical business is nothing but a big scam and the big pharmacy is all behind it.

reply to post by marg6043


I agree with you Marg6043 and am proud of your attempts to take responsibility for your own health. Its not easy these days because of the belief system in place that demands our health be placed into a "system" for optimal results. Its just not true.

I witnessed four close relatives undergo long-term, health care beginning with high blood pressure which turned into various internal life-threatening conditions which evolved into them taking an astronomical amount of prescription medications. The medications themselves interacted with each other harmfully, causing even worse conditions. All four of them died while under medical care and consuming massive quantities of prescription drugs. None of them improved or even survived. But the bills kept on coming even after their deaths. Its a sad, sad situation.

reply to post by Hazelnut


You just posted exactly what happened to my mother, after she was diagnosed with high blood pressure in her 40s by the time she was in her late 50s she was on 9 different medications and still at 59 she had a small hart attack and at age 61 a stent by the time she was 65 she is now a full blown diabetic (not related ot weight as all the medications rendered her unable to eat).

Now she have to take insulin even when in her mother side of the family my grandmother at 84 is doing fine and so her two sister also in their 80s.

So where the high blood pressure and the diabetes came from? I always tell my mother that the cocktail of pills damage her liver.

The problems with her arteries was due to 40 years of been a smoker.

[edit on 2-7-2009 by marg6043]

Originally posted by TheAmused
i don't see the big deal over free medical care.

we all pay tax's.
and 90% of the one's that don't pay tax's are the MOTHER of YOUR children.
AKA housewife's.

if you entire argument to socialized health care is you ritch don't want to help the poor..
that's sad in itself.

Do we run around calling canada socialist nazi scum bag's?no we don't.


Personally myself i am tired of working 2 job's for 7 dollar's a hour..
just to pay bill's and tax's and food and diaper's.

When i got a failing heart that i CAN NOT even afford to go see a specialist!!!
2 major heart attack's..
only medical care a person with 2 job's can afford is a family doctor..who give's ya pill's...and say's you really need to see a specialist before it get's worse.
Ironic if ya ask me.

So what's wrong with EVERYONE getting EQUAL medical care in America?
not one dang thing ...accept the rich will have to pay more tax's.
and they can't take it with em.
and the tax they will get back at the end of the year in the form of a tax return.
rich people dodge tax's by giving money to charity's.
for the tax break.
So why fuss about a charity that help's your country out more.



Ok let me make sure I understand your socialist statement. You think that it is a good thing for me to give you money for nothing just because we had the same op and I just applied myself more so I make more money? If this is what you ment then sure, he** just take it all and Ill keep turnin the wheel for ya. Lets F*&^*in do it.

I spent a number of years working within a U.S. federal government health care facility, the VAMC. Fiscal waste and inefficiency was absolutely mind boggling.

As just an example, there use to be what was called the “central court.” It was an area on the research-floor of the hospital where labs would dumb equipment and supplies, which were no longer of interest to them. A typical daily heap consisted of tens-of-thousands-of-dollars worth of new material that had been in many cases purchased without intent to utilize, but simply to expend budgets so as not to influence future budgets.

This perpetual pile of untraceable booty, all of which was being paid for by the taxes collected from hard working Americans, drew a regular crowd of scavengers. It didn’t take a rocket-scientist to realize that much of this unmarked treasure was probably without difficulty finding its way into undeserving hands (i.e. blackmarkets)

F.T.G.


[edit on 2-7-2009 by seasoul]

If "natural herbs" were so great then we wouldent have needed to develop antibiotics, chemotherapy, ACE inhibitors, etc.

Could you possibly inform me why the leading cause of death before about 1939 was infection?

Could you possibly inform me why the cancer survival rates are higher then ever before and continuing to rise?





[edit on 2-7-2009 by ChrisF231]

Originally posted by ChrisF231
If "natural herbs" were so great then we wouldent have needed to develop antibiotics, chemotherapy, ACE inhibitors, etc.

Could you possibly inform me why the leading cause of death before about 1939 was infection?

Could you possibly inform me why the cancer survival rates are higher then ever before and continuing to rise?





[edit on 2-7-2009 by ChrisF231]

I could guess that the reason infection was the leading cause of death (claimed) was the same as it is now, ignorance of the facts.

Cancer survival rates (claimed) are disputable. Cancer itself is disputable. People are susceptible to bacteria and viruses, germs and bugs. A full and complete understanding of the natural remedies is a science in itself. The problem occurs when profits for treatment become an institution.

My mother was treated for a hemmorage by the USAF in Tei Pei Taiwan in 1969. Fifteen years later she was diagnosed with cervical cancer, suspected to be a development from the botched hysterctomy. She underwent radiation therapy that left her a shell of her previous self. And for the next seventeen years, under heavy medication, she lost most of her internal organs before she decided to go to hospice where she died 7 days later by morphine injections.

Originally posted by Rockstrongo37
Let me ask you a question, “Do you have health insurance?” Most employed people here in the US do.

Having health insurance doesn't mean you are taken care of. In my own practice I cannot begin to number all the insured patients who terminated their treatment after one or two sessions simple because they were overwhelmed after receiving the first bill or two. The reasons are always the same. Their deductibles are set far to high to be of any practical use to them. As minimum wage workers, many with two or more children they simply cannot afford their uninsured heath care costs.

reply to post by ChrisF231


Don't confuse the propaganda cancer will kill you, treatments will help you live a littler bit longer depending the cancer you may have, but the side effects of them will damage your organs regardless you will die eventually of related side effects.

My grandfather die of 100 years old he had prostate cancer for about 25 years and refuse treatment.

My father had prostate cancer earlier than my grand father he refuse any surgery but agree to one treatment that was when he was 65 at 76 he still have the cancer, and he is a believer of natural medicine, his doctor told him that he should be death by now.

God figure.

[edit on 2-7-2009 by marg6043]

reply to post by TheAmused


Amen my friend

[edit on 2-7-2009 by Rockstrongo37]