New and "Improved" Boolean search

I have seen a great number of complaints regarding the new search tool. It seems to be not nearly as effective as the old tool and really does not facilitate users in discovering whether information has been posted previously or not.

I'm just wondering what the specific benefits of the new search tool are?

and

Why was there a switch in the first place?

I certainly don't remeber there being as many complaints about the search tool as there are now.

I'm not trying to criticize, just offering input regarding things I have seen lately. I love the site in general and think all the mods/designers/etc...are doing a wonderful job....but there's always room for improvement!

Lukefj

[Edited on 20-4-2004 by Lukefj]

Originally posted by Lukefj I have seen a great number of complaints regarding the new search tool.

Really? Where are they? No one has been complaining to me.

Why was there a switch in the first place?

Because a plain text search of 400,000+ posts was proving too taxing on the server (search queries lasting more than 60 seconds) and the results being difficult to search through (common topics would return over 50 pages).

I certainly don't remeber there being as many complaints about the search tool as there are now.

I'm still confused about this.

I'm not trying to criticize, just offering input regarding things I have seen lately.

Really... where's the input? What search are you trying to complete?

I think its awful!

Apologies like but I was very keen on the last search engine.

NObody tell me to do a search if I ever repeat a previously aired view or question because I just wont do it anymore!

I agree that the new search tool seems to be less effective in retrieving the queried text. I got many more relevant �hits� when I used the old one. The argument can be made that the new search engine is superior in every way to the old search engine, but if people aren�t able to use it effectively that argument is moot.

I have to say I dont like the new search tool but if you put in the right words I can normal find what im looking for i liked the old one better but things change

[Edited on 20-4-2004 by SE7EN]

SO,

I was reading a post earlier today by elevatedone and it was stated that a search was done twice for the topic he was posting and nothing was returned by the search, but it turned out that Valhall had recently posted on the topic.

I think you can also see from the above posts that elevatedone is not alone.

I also find the new search dificult to use and receive limited results.

However, I understand that there are obviously restraints, especially re. resources as this is a wonderfully free site.

Thank you for your speedy response to my post. It is appreciated.

Regards,
Lukefj

Edit: spelling [Edited on 20-4-2004 by Lukefj]
Edit: wrong name of poster

[Edited on 20-4-2004 by Lukefj]

When I use the search engine I�m typically looking to see if the thread I�m considering posting has already been posted. Maybe the �Search for matches in� on the search engine should be defaulted to �Thread SUBJECT lines only� instead of �thread POSTS only�. That way it would return results from the thread topic by default, so that the people that don�t use the search engine properly will return the results they are looking for without them having to study workings of the engine.

Originally posted by kinglizard Maybe the �Search for matches in� on the search engine should be defaulted to �Thread SUBJECT lines only� instead of �thread POSTS only�.

You can choose either one manually. Well... I've done a search, and since the new engine launched, 5 individual members have complained the searches are not returning what is expected... but there are a long list of "excellent!" type responses in the thread announcing the new search. If I don't know your problems, there's nothing that can be done. Please help me... give me an example search that is returning a less-than-expected result, and we can look at how you should be searching. A boolean search is much more accurate as the entire content of a post is indexed. With that improved accuracy and speed comes some new techniques you need to learn for searching. I've never been disappointed by my searches... but I'm familiar with boolean search. Again... give me an example, and I can show you how to improve the results.

If you hate the new search tool you can use Google. You can go like this, in the google bar:

site:abovetopsecret.com [.....]

[....] = what you want to search for.

It'll bring up results. It's not updated as frequently, but it works.

[Edited on 20-4-2004 by ktprktpr]

An example as you requested. I typed in "HIV" and searched for posts on the topic. However no results were matched becasues I didn't type in "H.I.V." I think this type of perfection is what is limiting the results we receive.

I don't know if that can be altered, my guess is no.

I do see the value in the new search tool, I think we just need to be more diligent in how we enter our search criteria. In the end I think any complaints, including my own, are based on the increased comlexity of the new tool. The old engine maintained the "KISS" rule, which made it simple and easy to use.

Then new one appears to be less so.

Thanks again for your response SO.

Lukefj

Originally posted by SkepticOverlord
You can choose either one manually.

Again... give me an example, and I can show you how to improve the results.

Yes I now agree that the new search engine is superior to the old one. I just spent some time reading end exploring the search functions. However I think most people don�t do this, I know I didn�t until just now. Previously when I searched I would enter in the word query and press results, by default it returned �thread POSTS only�, then I would be discouraged because I didn�t realize I was searching for �thread POSTS only�. I doubt my experience is a unique one. If the default was �Thread SUBJECT lines only� many more people using the engine that didn�t spend the time to learn its intricacies would find the topics they were looking for. I presume that the majority of people searching are looking for duplicate thread topics and not replies. If It returned �Thread SUBJECT lines only� by default the person that wasn�t familiar with balloon searches wouldn�t need to be. They would just enter the word query press results like many do and they would get the results that the majority are looking for. Then with time, familiarity and desire they could explore the more detailed aspect of the search function.



[Edited on 20-4-2004 by kinglizard]

Originally posted by Lukefj An example as you requested. I typed in "HIV" and searched for posts on the topic. However no results were matched becasues I didn't type in "H.I.V." I think this type of perfection is what is limiting the results we receive.

The old engine would have given you the same result in this case. Here's an example of how to use the search tool for your search: In this case, it will return threads with both "HIV" and "H.I.V." ... but eliminate threads that contain "AIDS" and require the word "virus" to be within the returned results. Also don't forget to make sure the date range is set to the proper time-span, in this case, "fom the beginning" which will search all posts. And, with this search tool, you can jump to the specific post that contianed your search result by clicking on the PostID, rather than the entire thread which was a major shortcoming of the old search.

I definitely liked the old search tool better. It was very effective. The new one is worthless. I don't even bother with it anymore.

I don't mean to criticize, but its highly aggrivating. Just throwing in my two cents.

maybe we need a new tutorial or something, because when it gets to the point that EastCoastKid and I agree...something is VERY wrong.

Never heard me complain about it, I have told members I like it. But opinions are like a-holes, everyone has one.

so... instead of simply saying "it sucks" or "it's worthless" why not help by posting a search you've tried? It's not that the tool "sucks", it's that you're not using it correctly.

Are you people all high? Do you not remember the old search?

IT SUCKED!

Go play around and learn how to make the Boolean search work for you instead of whining its too complicated. It is far more powerful than the old search. You can do everything you did then and more.

Luke you would not have found it even if you did use the old seach because you didn't put H.I.V. But in the old search you would have to have guessed the words preceding and/or following in the correct order as well.

Okay, you guy's suck when you make me do work, you know it?

Tell me what I did wrong - and don't fall back on "you should have done this plus this plus this" because new members aren't going to know the "plus this plus this plus this" stuff...IT PROMOTES DUPLICATE POSTS!

Here is my search on "thead posts only":



and here is the result:



and here is the result on "thread subject lines only"



Do you realize how many threads/posts have been made in the past 3 months on Peak oil?

NOW! I bet this one won't hit either!

Originally posted by EastCoastKid
I definitely liked the old search tool better. It was very effective. The new one is worthless.

I don't even bother with it anymore.

.

same here, i have to go to bts to search for something now..

Originally posted by Flanker same here, i have to go to bts to search for something now..

Thanks so much for the informative input.