Michigan 15-year-old dies after police Taser him

Originally posted by toasted
That seems like an awfully high number!

Try working for a city police department or big county SO and that number is NOT high..lol. People have NO idea the amount of crap that happens in one shift.

Were there any typical behaviors that stood out above the others that you felt needed tasering? [ I'm just trying to get a feel for the situation(s) ]

Dopers and Drunks...they are not fully aware of their stupidty. Plus in that state they are extremly hard to just subdue because their pain tolorance is MUCH higher then when not under the influence. So the level of force used sometimes has to be raised.

If you had no taser, what would your options be?

I have had to subdue many without one, and normally it was an old fashioned whoopin with a baton and maybe spray. But of course it was all dictated by the situation

And how crummy will you feel when some out of control fool you taser, goes down and never comes back up?

I won't...sorry but if your fighting me, and I have to use a taser to stop you, that means your behavior and YOUR behavior alone is what caused you to get tased and end up dead. I have taken lives in the line of duty and it isn't easy, but if you think I am going to lose sleep over those who make the choice to back me in a corner...your wrong. I could have just as easily been the one in a box.

Is a person who is just being civil disobedient a legit candidate for tasering?

No, someones mouth will never make me take out my taser. If they are resisting by simply NOT following orders and are NOT being physical, I will simply escort with my hands..no other force needed.

What are the guidelines for using a taser? By this I mean, how long of an interval are you "suggested" to use on the subject. I just have a hard time believing that a quick "tase" would render someone dead/unconscious. They need to install a device on the taser that monitors how long and how many times a taser is used on shift. If the numbers don't add up, well you got your "smoking gun" for evidence that brutality was taking place.

Originally posted by saabster5
What are the guidelines for using a taser? By this I mean, how long of an interval are you "suggested" to use on the subject. I just have a hard time believing that a quick "tase" would render someone dead/unconscious. They need to install a device on the taser that monitors how long and how many times a taser is used on shift. If the numbers don't add up, well you got your "smoking gun" for evidence that brutality was taking place.

The taser works in 5 second bursts. After the 5 seconds it stops unless the user pulls the trigger again, then you get another 5 seconds. Now with a pre-existing medical condition it will only take that one 5 second burst to render you dead or in serious condition. As Taser International court records confirm the taser has only been the outright cause of death in I believe one case out of THOUSANDS, and out of over a million uses since it was put on the market.

The taser does have a device (internal hard drive) that records EVERY time it is used and for how long. That data is downloaded and saved by every department. That is how I know I used a taser 161 times. And your right, because it IS all recorded I have seen guys get fired for screwing around with the device.

reply to post by rcwj75


Thank you for the info. Helped clear up a lot of misconceptions I had regarding its use. For me, seeing a taser pointed my way I think would do the job at getting me to submit to the officers wishes (the electric fence for our horses taught me electricity is not my friend at a young age). I feel for the family. And although I support non-violent means to enforce public safety, the real issue here is that law enforcement will always have a bad rap for trying to do what they are sworn to do. Protect and Serve or something to that effect at least. When you have police called to your residence for violence or whatever the case may be, these individuals need to recognize that an arbitrator was called in to reconcile differences. And that is what these arbitrators are trained to do. There might be some bad apples in the lot, but overall I think law enforcement does a lot better job at serving justice to the communities than did the vigilante mobs of the 19th century. And I also believe it says something about the youth of this world and lack of respect for authoritative figures.

Where is the billy club.

They don't club people any more.

Better than using a Tesla weapon.

The closest high technology we use today from Tesla.

Dam shame.

Originally posted by rcwj75

See this is asking for trouble. Spoken like many who have NEVER been is the shoes of a LEO. Not being mean or a prick...but we are human. Can I fight...YES, but when you find yourself in some of the situations I have been in you BETTER know what to do or your putting a lot of people at risk. How, let me explain ONE incident. 2 very intoxicated males vs ME...taser one and verbally get the other to comply. The taser saved my behind and others...why, because IF, IF an officer loses a fight with a suspect he just handed over a pistol, and 3 high cap magazines...I would much rather tase a jerkoff then put the public at that risk.

How is it asking for trouble? I'm very confident I need not be a LEO to speak the truth. We're all human here, anyone can fight. I'm talking about abuse-of-force issues, and the progression of force that has become lost to Taser. In too many cases, they have been inappropriately used as a weapon of first resort.

Your 2 very intoxicated males vs ME... There is other means of dealing with this situation, but it's becoming a lost art due to Taser abuse. But hey I wasn't there, for all I know these guys may have been loud and rude like most drunks.... but still that's no reason for a Taser. If they wanted to fight, sure Taser them, it's up to you to decide on the level of force.

BUT your number one thought should be to de-escalate the situation safely as possible, for everyone..... far as I'm concern Taser's are not safe and are being abused.

Oh yeah!
Everyone knows Taser International court records is B.S. There's plenty of independent medical investigators who have found that Taser's are deadly. The problem with these independent people, they can't take on a corporate bully, thus the public is brainwashed into thinking they are safe.

Originally posted by rcwj75

Again, not having ever been in these types of situation you view unarmed suspect as unharmful...I knew some guys like that once...they were both killed in the line of duty...now their name is on a wall in DC and the guys who killed them are still free.... assumption is the mother of all f'up! Armed or Not, people can be a SERIOUS threat.

Anyone can be a serious threat, sure...... but first resort to Taser, situations become more complicated. And for those many situations I'm talking about, are the ones that end up in the news or on youtube ect. Hope not to see you there....


[edit on 25-3-2009 by imitator]

The Illuminati hold all of Tesla's technology.
Just a wee bit has been approved for this taser.
There is an overall scientific control and they hold court on
any capital projects that will break their control.

Let taser out they say, soon more and more of the bad
side of Tesla technology will be out.

They can zap cattle at night and see how long their immune
systems can last.
As remote as one can get since the "Conspiracy Theory"
movie indicated the heart attack was sure sign of a rub out.