Obama Citizenship Case A Waste Of Time: Federal Judge

Originally posted by xyankee
I just don't think the people who post, that are defending Obama really care.

If the fringe really cared about the facts and the constitution regarding this matter they themselves would have put this to rest, however it appears the habit of ignoring the facts and repeating the same thing over and over again shows the unwillingness to accept the new president.

I dont know whether one can effectively fabricate reality for themselves... it appears the fringe is trying to do that over this matter and I tell ya it aint healthy.

I will even bet they feel he is not a natural born citizen based on the facts presented as well,

What facts? Have you been to the other birth certificate threads? Have you actually taken the time to look at how each of these fringe accusations have been debunked and met with actual law? Go to those recent threads regarding the BC conspiracy and actually look at why these accusations are false and not accepted by law and by commonsense. Have a look at what has been found and actually counter the fact.

The burden of proof lies soley on those who make the accusation because as far as I can see it, the minority fringe doesnt account for the majority of the population or the state and health officials, or the major political opponents who really didnt oppose authenticity.

It just shows how patriotic you all are!

What if you dont believe what the rightwing fringe says your not "patriotic"? This is the same deal you folks tried back in 2003... seriously now you have no place telling which americans are patriots and which are not.

Originally posted by ChrisF231
Yeah, here we go:

www.worldnetdaily.com...

I wish he would just show us the damn birth certificate .... unless of course he is trying to hide something.

Ron Polarik, if that is his real name, lol, the self-proclaimed "expert" who "proved" that document in question is FAKE, is, and I cannot go easy on him here, an idiot.

He is one of those loonies who see an UFO in part of the image size of 4x4 pixels...

Of course, he never provided a photo of himself (BooHoo, he is scared that Obama gonna get him, lol, yeah, 'right).

It is beyond laughable that he did what he did knowing THIS.

Now, that is what I call ignorance...

Can someone tell me what it will take to get this sob to release the documents?

Originally posted by xyankee
I just don't think the people who post, that are defending Obama really care. I will even bet they feel he is not a natural born citizen based on the facts presented as well, It just shows how patriotic you all are! You should be ashamed. You do not deserve to be in the land of the free!

[edit on 7-3-2009 by xyankee]

No I think most of us and most Americans including Republicans believe Obama was born in Hawaii.

reply to post by Leto


So you don't think that the 300,000 who would like definitive proof matter? and don't tell me that they will want to complain about something else because, at least for me, I will shut right up and support him, Seriously! But not until he comes forth with what is requested.

reply to post by Southern Guardian


Sure I do, you know why? because if there was an issue that you left wing liberal scarred chickens had a problem with I would be fighting for getting it out. I am not for either side I just want the dam truth! period! I don't care who it is in office.

What difference does it make who is being asked? THEY SHOULD JUST DO IT!!!! now shut up, and show me the documents, I will scream I LOVE OBAMA. But you know he can't and your desperate to keep your "savior","cuz you gotz Obama" that is why you make fun of the people who want the answers.

Your going to be sorry, wait and see! sooner or later it will get out. When it does I don't think ATS will be such a fun place for you anymore.

[edit on 7-3-2009 by xyankee]

reply to post by smokingman2006

Like it or not, I have been following this case along with many millions of other active US Military and Veterans who have sworn to uphold and defend the US Constitution for life. This particular case needed to be denied in order to rise to the level of the US Supreme Court for a final decision. Judge Robertson's comments upon approving Mr Obama's request for dismissal only happened after several other other steps were made first. Foremost of those were the hearings of reasons for the lead attorney for the plaintiff's request to have additional attorneys not licensed in Washington DC to be admitted to the case pro hac vice.

I'm no attorney. But, it seems that everything is well aligned for this case to move on up.

The key issue in this particular case, at this particular juncture, is why it is not frivolous to ask the question in the first place, "Is Obama the true Commander-in-Chief?" for the millions who remain under oath, and subject to the Uniform Code of Military Justice. We might be (many are already) subject to following potentially illegal orders, just like the defendants in the Mi Lai Massacre courts-martials, if Obama can not prove he is a natural born US Citizen. As Obama has already ordered many of us into Afghanistan, we need an answer. What will be next, an order to shoot to kill a demonstrator outside the White House?

What remains remarkable is that Obama would rather spend untold amounts on attorney fees than produce a valid birth certificate. What is he trying to prove? That he doesn't have to? That he knows how the system works so well that he can pick and choose which rules he will or will not follow?

For being the candidate for peace in 2008, he could do a lot to put the whole issue to rest by not trying to prove he is smarter than the rest of us by simply presenting a bona-fide birth certificate.

The case is not frivolous. Judge Robertson surely knows it. But, he has to cover all of the bases to make sure he follows the rules.

Who wants a bunch (several million) of Active Military and vets to have doubts about the validity of their command? Certainly not anyone who wants to accomplish the lofty goals that Obama claims he is committed to achieve. Thus it just adds coal to the fire, literally, for Obama not to prove he is a natural born citizen.

reply to post by xyankee


We make fun of you because it's a silly non-issue, because you can't deal with the fact that you lost the election, and you're making crazy stuff up out of thin air in some demented crusade to somehow overturn the election based on some kind of nonsensical incomprehensible time travel theory, or whatever.

It's not a "liberal vs. conservative" thing either, as most mainstream conservatives seem to think the "controversy" is as silly as I do.

Obama's produced documents, the State of Hawaii has released them, and you guys say they're fake

There is no point in trying to talk to people that are determined to play make-believe no matter what you say.

Obama is under no more obligation to keep producing paperwork over and over than he is to have a biopsy performed to "prove" he is not a Reptilian

Originally posted by BFO
I'm no attorney. But, it seems that everything is well aligned for this case to move on up.

Based on what? On what WND and the blogs say?

I think the keyword in your statement is you're not an attorney. And if you think this case well aligned to move on up then you don't even have a superficial knowledge of the law and what's involved here.

The key issue in this particular case, at this particular juncture, is why it is not frivolous to ask the question in the first place, "Is Obama the true Commander-in-Chief?"

You always make it about the question, or the right of asking the question. The Judge didn't say the question was frivolous, he said the case was, and dismissed it accordingly.

What will be next, an order to shoot to kill a demonstrator outside the White House?

You're kidding right? The little fantasies you people make up, and the delusions you believe, are reaching truly mind-blowing levels.

What is so funny about this is....how is this exactly a waste of time? How long does it take for a Judge to declare Obama to show his long form BC. What like 5 seconds? There is no need to look at any evidence here. Just have him show it. Simple really.

Good lord, this further shows that something is being kept from the public. They must know something we don't(or being paid off to dismiss). What a joke.

This corruption (in all end of our government) must end!!.....every form of it NOW!!!!

This is really getting old. I wish one judge will say screw it, and order President Obama to release the vaulted edition of his BC and get it over with.

I mean he could tell him that this is getting stupid and to do us all a favor by releasing it for the world to see.

Until that happens the exteme far left nuts will have the "stolen" 2000 election and the extreme far right nuts will have this.

Originally posted by converge

Originally posted by BFO
I'm no attorney. But, it seems that everything is well aligned for this case to move on up.

Based on what? On what WND and the blogs say?

pacer.psc.uscourts.gov...
Hollister v. Soetoro, et al
U.S. District Court, District of Columbia, Case #08-022540
Only problem is, you have to register. And don't even think about spoofing your IP address, unless you want the NSA crawling up inside your computer, Comrad!

Since you are pretending to be an attorney, maybe you would like to pretend to understand it better than I do.

The key issue in this particular case, at this particular juncture, is why it is not frivolous to ask the question in the first place, "Is Obama the true Commander-in-Chief?"

You always make it about the question...

Always?
You don't even know who I am. How could you possibly know what I "always" say or do? I rarely say or do anything the same way twice, let alone always. Sounds like -someone- is on the defensive here. hmmm...

What will be next, an order to shoot to kill a demonstrator outside the White House?

You're kidding right? ...

Sort-of, actually. That was what you might call a spurious remark. Based on your knee jerk reaction, I'd say it worked rather well ')

Actually, "outside the White House" is an immense realm that would include Afghanistan. But as far as the extent Obama will use against dissidents inside the USA, you are right. He will probably only use rubber bullets, pepper spray, tear gas and the typical stuff that is supposed to be non-lethal, at least during his first term. Unless our riot cops/paramilitary and/or US Military & Reserves start using those Israeli "rubber" bullets. Those ones -are- lethal.

The part that apparently went through your awareness without leaving a trace is the gist of the Hollister v. Soetoro case. That is, US Military and Vets have a need to know who is authorized under the US Constitution to originate lawful orders. A person elected to the Office of US President but not a "Natural Born Citizen" can not do that. For Active Duty US Military, Reservists and Veterans this is a huge dilemma, especially for the tens of thousands headed for Afghanistan under Obama's orders. How would you like to be laying your life on the line and possibly be required to take the life of another human being under orders that might be unlawful. Even having a doubt in a soldier or marine's mind, since there has been no conclusive proof of Obama's citizenship in fact, could lead to a whole new rash of PTSD Veterans. They might be called something like, "The Unsure About Lawful Order Afghanistan Invader Syndrome Veteran". It is not funny! And it is not far fetched, either. If you are not military, you probably can not imagine. If you think it is no big deal, then go enlist!

Anyone with very much understanding about the legal issues of Obama's eligibility to be President of the United States knows this is not about the hoax started by the, so called, Dr Polarik. For all anyone knows, he could be under contract with a subsidiary of the Obama campaign/transition team to prepare hokey looking birth certificates and other documents to distribute over the Internet. That would explain why he knows exactly where the pixels mismatch the backgrounds. It would also explain why he has guarded his identity so obsessively. Because once the people, who think that is the reason Obama's birthplace is unknown, find out those Internet documents are TOTALLY IRRELEVANT to ANY of the cases currently being considered in various courts around the country; they are going to be one big bunch of pi**ed-off rednecks looking for "Dr. Polarik". And I will be one of those rednecks.


[edit on 3/8/0909 by BFO]

Originally posted by xmotex
reply to post by xyankee

 

We make fun of you because it's a silly non-issue, because you can't deal with the fact that you lost the election, and you're making crazy stuff up out of thin air in some demented crusade to somehow overturn the election based on some kind of nonsensical incomprehensible time travel theory, or whatever.

It's not a "liberal vs. conservative" thing either, as most mainstream conservatives seem to think the "controversy" is as silly as I do.

Obama's produced documents, the State of Hawaii has released them, and you guys say they're fake

There is no point in trying to talk to people that are determined to play make-believe no matter what you say.

Obama is under no more obligation to keep producing paperwork over and over than he is to have a biopsy performed to "prove" he is not a Reptilian

I don't think you can read. If you could you would see that I don't care who won the election! It makes not difference. DO YOU UNDERSTAND, IF IT WAS SOMEONE ELSE IN OFFICE I WOULD FEEL THE SAME WAY!

Originally posted by jd140
This is really getting old. I wish one judge will say screw it, and order President Obama to release the vaulted edition of his BC and get it over with.

I mean he could tell him that this is getting stupid and to do us all a favor by releasing it for the world to see.

Until that happens the exteme far left nuts will have the "stolen" 2000 election and the extreme far right nuts will have this.

to xmotex
SEE! here is something I will say to those who think the way I feel about this is far "right" I think that the election was stolen in 2000 as well. Now does that make me a lefty? no. I just want what is right and fair. AND GOD '___' YOU SHOULD TO.

[edit on 8-3-2009 by xyankee]

[edit on 8-3-2009 by xyankee]

Originally posted by BFO
pacer.psc.uscourts.gov...
Hollister v. Soetoro, et al
U.S. District Court, District of Columbia, Case #08-022540
Only problem is, you have to register. And don't even think about spoofing your IP address, unless you want the NSA crawling up inside your computer, Comrad!
Since you are pretending to be an attorney, maybe you would like to pretend to understand it better than I do.

You can read the complaint here. You don't need to be an attorney, or spoof IP addresses.

The complaint was distributed online, by Berg's people, long time ago.

I didn't pretend to be an attorney, I was pointing out that you admittedly weren't one (from the start we know that you probably don't have a good knowledge of the law), and then I qualified further saying that if you think this case had any legs, then you don't even have a superficial knowledge of the law.

Also already distributed on the Internet is the actual memorandum by Judge Roberts, that starts off with:

This case, if it were allowed to proceed, would deserve mention in one of those books that seek to prove that the law is foolish or that America has too many lawyers with not enough to do.

You claimed this case was well aligned to move on up, but you clearly have failed to read the Judge's opinion.

Plaintiff having invoked both diversity and the federal
interpleader statute, 28 U.S.C. § 1355, I do have jurisdiction. Because plaintiff’s only claim invokes the interpleader statute, however, the suit must be dismissed for failure to state a claim. I have already called the interpleader claim “frivolous” in two interlocutory rulings [#10 and #14], and I do so again here.

As the defendants noted in their motion to dismiss, “interpleader allows a party exposed to multiple claims on a single obligation or property to settle the controversy and satisfy his obligation in one proceeding.” Commercial Union Ins. Co. v. U.S., 999 F.2d 581, 583 (D.C. Cir. 1993). It is typically used in insurance cases where the plaintiff holds property on behalf of another but does not know to whom among several adverse parties the property should be transferred [#9 at 8]. Resort to interpleader is inappropriate when it “is sought for improper or ulterior purposes.” Wright & Miller § 1707 (3d ed. 2001).

Plaintiff has not cited a single case that lends even colorable support to the notion that his alleged “duties” can be the “money or property” to which the interpleader statute applies. ...

This suit will accordingly be dismissed.

The Judge said he had jurisdiction because the plaintiffs invoked 28 USC §1355, but as the Judge points out, that statute doesn't apply in what is being claimed by the plaintiffs.

The case would have some legs alright, if it was even a case, but it's not. It's a waste of the Courts time by some people who clearly don't even know the law.

Not only that, but the Judge now ordered them (Hollister's counsel) to show how they shouldn't be sanctioned by this frivolous law suit.

For the reasons set forth in an accompanying memorandum, the defendants' motion to dismiss [#9] is granted, and John D. Hemenway is ordered to show cause within eleven days of the date of this order why he should not be sanctioned under Rule 11(b) of the Federal Rules of Civil Procedure.

[edit on 8-3-2009 by converge]

Oh, goody! Another birth certificate thread!

I loved the line in the OP about too many lawyers.

"This case, if it were allowed to proceed, would deserve mention in one of those books that seek to prove that the law is foolish or that America has too many lawyers with not enough to do," U.S. District Judge James Robertson said in his written opinion.

Bravo!

Originally posted by xyankee
So you don't think that the 300,000 who would like definitive proof matter?

They matter in that their lives are as worthy as anyone else's. But we don't just get to "demand" anything we want and get it. In those terms, no, doesn't really matter that they're screaming for proof - they have already gotten it and aren't going to get MORE proof. They've got proof already, they just choose not to believe it.

300,000 people believe they were impregnated by a lizard person. And believing that is as rational as believing Obama was born in Kenya.

And for those saying he should just release his vault copy, it's not his to release! It belongs to the state of Hawaii. Yes, he could probably get a copy of it, but why should he? Some nobody on the internet would just claim it a fake and show all the "believers" how it's "fake" and we'd be onto our next set of frivolous lawsuits. And every one of you would instantly believe this nobody with NO proof of his credentials like lemmings and it would start all over again.

THAT'S why he won't release it. It's a waste of time, money and energy for NOTHING. You WANT to believe. With NO facts, you want to believe. That's the problem.

'He has personal reasons for not revealing the B.C. It isn't malevolent' says a friend of mine. He claims to be family friends with the Obamas and I have no reason to think he is lying-- Of course, there is no reason you should believe me or him.

I speculate the certificate says 'bastard' or 'illegitimate' lists out a birth defect or sexually transmitted diseases of the mother-- certainly stuff he wouldn't want to get out.

But the man has done Cocaine and Marajuana--- I don't see how the birth certificate can be so much worse. I mean this man is supposed to be the example for our black youth? He has showed them you can do coke and one day be President. Love it.

WHY ARE WE ELECTING MEN WHO HAVE DONE COCAINE? I DON'T GET IT? IS THE WHOLE WORLD MAD?

[ANSWER: Yes.]

Originally posted by ragman
I speculate the certificate says 'bastard' or 'illegitimate' lists out a birth defect or sexually transmitted diseases of the mother-- certainly stuff he wouldn't want to get out.
But the man has done Cocaine and Marajuana--- I don't see how the birth certificate can be so much worse.

It doesn't matter what you think, or assume to know about Obama or how he thinks, what matters is that until a Court orders the original birth certificate to be inspected, he doesn't have to disclose anything.

It's his right.

WHY ARE WE ELECTING MEN WHO HAVE DONE COCAINE? I DON'T GET IT? IS THE WHOLE WORLD MAD?

Why is this relevant? Either for Bush or Obama? It would be if they were doing drugs while in Office.

Since the supreme court gave the 2000 election to Bush they should come out with a statement "he had an American mother, he IS an American citizen and he was elected by the American people so it doesn't matter anymore"

End of discussion

I smell a conspiracy…a conspiracy to turn brother against brother, sister against sister, dog against cat!

From what I have seen around my neighborhood so far it’s having the greatest inroads on turning the dogs against cats. That doesn’t mean brothers and sisters won’t soon be trying to scratch out each others eyes over this soon.

…This just in: Too late they already are.

Since the erstwhile President Obama see’s no need to clear this up, and since the vast majority of those angrily stating to their opponent “You are no lawyer or document expert” while of course they happen to be no lawyer or document expert either…

I propose the following.

An official coin toss! Heads…his Birth Certificate is real…tails it isn’t!

Hey wait…Heads should be his Birth Certificate isn’t…tails should mean it’s real!

Uh huh! Yes…no,

I get heads…

No I get heads…

Do not…

Do too!

Do not…

Do too!

Yeah well your mother wears Army boots! Oh, I can’t help it the economy was so bad she had to join up! Your Father lives in a cave…Oh, I can’t help it the economy was so bad he lost his house…

Ah, pardon me…seems I need to get back to the drawing board on another solution with this one!