Why would you think there are such things as aliens?

Actually I would ask you why do you think that aliens dont exist. Is it because you are ignorant, or maybe scared of them. Statistically speaking the universe is infinitely big, which means that in the universe there are an INFINITE amount of life forms. If there were less the universe wouldnt be infinitely big. So it is statistically impossible that aliens dont exist. Whether we have been visited is another question altogether. I can make the same argument by asking Why do you believe the Theory of Evolution or God or whatever you believe in, you are only told both of those things exist by other people as well.

reply to post by WitnessFromAfar

I didn't realize that there were incorrect answers here. If I recall correctly, your topic title reads clearly: 'Why would you think there are such things as aliens?" We've answered you simply, because Sol is not the only star. Because Earth is not the only planet. We know these things to be true. Since the environment for life exists, and we know that life exists here on our own planet... My question to you is then clearly: "Why would you not think there are such things as aliens?" Is it because you don't 'believe' in other planets revolving around other stars? Is it because your religion or worldview sees the existence of Aliens as some sort of threat or insult? Is it because you don't like your Science Teacher?

You have answered simply and I accept your answer. For me anyway, just because there is the possibility doesn’t make them be here or anywhere. I wanted to know why people thought differently to me.

Well I guess I’m on the fence, I nether believe or disbelieve they exist I only accept it’s a possibility. I haven’t found an argument that will convince me for sure they exist but I have found strong arguments to almost tip me off the fence.

To answer you’re other questions:-
I know how the bodies in this universe revolve
I am an atheist
I found out that my science teacher died at a class of 1964 reunion.

Originally posted by LokiNinja
Actually I would ask you why do you think that aliens dont exist. Is it because you are ignorant, or maybe scared of them. Statistically speaking the universe is infinitely big, which means that in the universe there are an INFINITE amount of life forms. If there were less the universe wouldnt be infinitely big. So it is statistically impossible that aliens dont exist. Whether we have been visited is another question altogether. I can make the same argument by asking Why do you believe the Theory of Evolution or God or whatever you believe in, you are only told both of those things exist by other people as well.

Just because the universe is infinite (maybe)doesn’t prove anything why do you think they are spending so much money to find other earth planets.
No I’m not scared of them if they exist. No it’s not religion and I’m not ignorant.
What I am is not a follower of sheep and easily swayed by simply believing without more proof.
So I guess I’m still on the fence

reply to post by Learhoag

Regardless of what people believe, it has nothing to do with reality. Beliefs are created by mental conditioning.

Well, and I will have to add to this by saying that belief is created by reality. The reality of actual experiences. Yeah, I guess you 1) have to trust your "lying eye"
2) have to have the common sense to know that when something happens or is seen by more than one person, they are not sharing a "delusion" and in fact its delusional to think that
and
3) when you have seen crafts, with others, had 2 hour time lapses, shared with others, and happen to recall actual abduction memories....you know!!!!

This is happening to ever so many ppl..And the games up! Disclose Now!

You know, when one reaches the end of your reply one still doesn't have any evidence of any other life in the universe except us. I'll accept that by your reply you exist.

Originally posted by WitnessFromAfar

Originally posted by Learhoag
Mental conditioning doesn't create life anywhere in creation; only wishful thinking does.

I would summarily disagree. As an Engineer, I can tell you from firsthand experience that wishful thinking doesn't create anything at all, let alone life in the universe.

But I know what you meant, and you're wrong there too. The universe exists independently of human thought and emotion. How you feel about the universe has absolutely no sway on it's reality.

It is unfortunate to find that reality also seems to have no sway on your own personal universe.

Ignoring evidence does not make it go away.

Originally posted by Learhoag
It doesn't matter if scientists such as Drake create a formula which has no bearing on reality.

Drake's equation in fact for the first time included every vairable (known to date by humans) that would influence the development of life.
This has extreme bearing on reality. It is in effect, an equation describing reality, as best we know it.

And it does matter. It matters a lot.

Originally posted by Learhoag
What you have to accept as real is that there is no evidence of any other human-types anywhere in creation.

Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.

In fact, mainstream science predicts life, even intelligent life, in existence on planets around other stars.

Or did you just think that the evidence of other planets with the habitable zones of other stars should just be ignored because it doesn't fit into your worldview?

I'm sorry, that's not how it works.

In the clear fight here between yourself and all of human science and understanding, I'm officially placing a high wager that you are not going to win.

-WFA

[edit on 7-3-2009 by Learhoag]

[edit on 7-3-2009 by Learhoag]

[edit on 7-3-2009 by Learhoag]

You are sooo wrong! A hypnotist creates belief simply by mental conditioning the subject to believe the subject is seeing something that isn't there (positive hallucination) or convincing the subject with suggestions that he/she cannot see something that is there (negative hallucination).

Christians believe that Jesus exists even though there is no historical evidence to prove so. Perfect example of a belief created by mental conditioning.

I've had six solid UFO sightings and I videotaped one. I accept the reality of UFOs, unquestionably. I don't "believe" UFOs are real, I know they are.

But aliens and alien abductions is another story and for them there is no evidence and hearsay tales and claims don't make them real, except in the mind.

Mental conditioning creates beliefs, there is no other way.

Originally posted by mystiq
reply to post by Learhoag

 

Regardless of what people believe, it has nothing to do with reality. Beliefs are created by mental conditioning.

Well, and I will have to add to this by saying that belief is created by reality. The reality of actual experiences. Yeah, I guess you 1) have to trust your "lying eye"
2) have to have the common sense to know that when something happens or is seen by more than one person, they are not sharing a "delusion" and in fact its delusional to think that
and
3) when you have seen crafts, with others, had 2 hour time lapses, shared with others, and happen to recall actual abduction memories....you know!!!!

This is happening to ever so many ppl..And the games up! Disclose Now!

[edit on 7-3-2009 by Learhoag]

reply to post by Learhoag


So before you had personal sightings of UFO’s were you on the fence as I am?

No, I've never been a fence-sitter. I've also never been a believer and after becoming a hypnotist in the 1960s I learned why I wasn't nor am I a believer for beliefs are created by mental conditioning. Once you become of mental conditioning, it can't happen to you.

I was introduced to UFOs in 1957 by a military pilot (a Captain) who befriended me. One day while having dinner at their base lodging he loaned me a copy of "FLYING SAUCERS HAVE LANDED" by George Adamski. That opened me up to a new world. I always wondered what it was that people were seeing but I never became a believer for I needed evidence to convince me. That didn't come until 1980-something when I saw a UFO just above the ground through binoculars and I immediately started trembling. I had other quality sightings and once you experience something you become a knower. So I went from wondering straight to knowing.

You don't have to sit on the fence any longer. The reality of UFOs is supported by overwhelming circumstancial evidence in the form of photos/films/videos. Just don't believe anything, wait for irrefutable evidence to affect your mind, a sighting is preferred. When it comes to things that are difficult to understand and accept just keep an open mind and allow for all possibilities. But don't believe for if you do, then it's all in your mind.

Don't be a Humpty Dumpty, we all know what happened to him!

Originally posted by majestictwo
reply to post by Learhoag

 

So before you had personal sightings of UFO’s were you on the fence as I am?

[edit on 7-3-2009 by Learhoag]

Originally posted by Learhoag
You know, when one reaches the end of your reply one still doesn't have any evidence of any other life in the universe except us. I'll accept that by your reply you exist.

Fair enough, you're absolutely right. We don't have evidence (at least not accepted by mainstream science) of other life in the universe from my reply.

I would humbly submit however that the Battle of Los Angeles is best explained by a visiting alien spaceship. And this, to be fair, is linked in my signature where it says, 'Your evidence is right here'.

I re-read your posts, and I apologize for my harshness with you. It wasn't exactly fair. I just get so tired of people refusing to make the logical conclusion that since the environment for alien life exists, it's likely out there. It's a ridiculous thing to argue against, and it brings out the worst in me when I see someone attempt to make that argument.

To be perfectly honest about things, we DON'T have evidence of life out there. BUT, the important part is, in absence of that evidence (deciding either way for certain) what is our best guess?

Our best guess is based upon Science and Math, and frankly, the Expectation, based upon the observable evidence, is that we will eventually find evidence for extra-terrestrial life, if we keep looking for it hard enough. It's likely out there.

That's science's best guess to date, and it bugs the crap out of me when people act like that best guess is 'crazy'. It isn't crazy at all, it's Predicted by the Scientific Method. And even should the Scientific Method prove the Expected result false (say if we explore the entire universe, define it's borders, and find ZERO life), then EVEN STILL, the original hypothesis isn't crazy.

It's what the evidence Predicts.

I guess that's my whole point here.

-WFA

Originally posted by majestictwo

If you have seen a UFO or Alien or been abducted this is not likely to be of any interest.

For those that have never seen a UFO or alien why would you believe in them. Why do some say it is teeming with aliens and that they are here and they have always been here.

Is it because you have heard it repeated by others so many times that you believe it. Is it because you are easily influenced. Is it because you believe in so many fake videos. Please give some logic to this crazy notion. Oh and don’t say it’s because there are that many suns and planets and galaxy’s it’s got to be true, it doesn’t have to be true.

I have never seen a UFO or alien or anything unusual, I do think it’s a possibility but I don’t think its fact.

Actually, it does have to be true. There's a little thing called the "Law of Averages," which has served the scientific community well since the inception of the scientific community. That, coupled with common sense, has convinced most astronomers and planetary scientists that life exists elsewhere in the universe.

I choose to take their expertise over yours.

Therefore, you're wrong and I'm right.

HA HA HAHAHA...HA HA.

Well there is some pretty good evidence that alien life exists on Mars. Remember the Mars rock with the little squigley things that some NASA scientists identified as fossilized microbes? That rock also had traces of amino acids, basic to life.

Also, there's water on Mars, an atmosphere, plenty of sunshine, and traces of methane.

I have never seen a martian lifeform (as far as I know) but I can imagine that they could exist. I really have no problem with that idea.

Some scientists have speculated that viruses, lichens, water bears, and certain bacteria could survive the conditions in space and could actually traverse vast distances of the vacuum of space and still be viable.

There is actually a theory that viruses are constantly raining down on Earth from space. This theory is over 100 years old.

Then there is the theory that life on Earth may have come from Mars or some other place.

So, I have no problem with the idea that some of the life here on Earth might have come from space.

If you accept the idea that life might exist on Mars, that some life on Earth may have come from space, and that all life on Earth may have originated elsewhere. Then it is really not a stretch to believe in advanced life elsewhere or that they might come here as well.

reply to post by DarthChrisious

Actually, it does have to be true. There's a little thing called the "Law of Averages," which has served the scientific community well since the inception of the scientific community. That, coupled with common sense, has convinced most astronomers and planetary scientists that life exists elsewhere in the universe. I choose to take their expertise over yours. Therefore, you're wrong and I'm right. HA HA HAHAHA...HA HA.

I guess you haven’t been able to read through the whole thread – I understand.

I was not offering any expertise and you are welcome to believe.
I am presuming your last sentence is your little joke – But sorry I don’t see anyone is right or wrong here. As I’ve tried to explain on numerous occasions thus far, I can’t make that leap without seeing. I need to see to conclusively say yes they exist. If for example, a person asks me if I think aliens exist I could only reply “there is a strong possibility” I just couldn’t bring myself to say “absolutely they do exist”

See last line of OP.

Thanks for your honesty, I appreciate it. But we humans still have no evidence, period. What would you say is the evidence not accepted by mainstream science? I can't conceive of any. The reality of UFOs do not provide any evidence, just wonderment and speculation.

My opinion of the "Battle of Los Angeles" is, once again, that we don't know what happened there. The only photo that seems to exist, surprisingly considering that newspapers should have provided top-notch coverage!) doesn't show enough detail to come to a solid conclusion that it was a "visiting alien spaceship." It's an unknown. I've seen enhanced versions of the photo and the enhancement has to be taken into consideration and only an open mind can be kept.

I don't accept the reality of any other kind of life simply because there is no evidence. The evidence that exists shows alien (to human) craft connected with the Moon but nothing farther than that. So, technically, you could say that there's some kind of alien life out there but we have no concept of who or what or where from. We don't know what the possible aliens think of us and it seems to me that if they consider us at all, they simply just don't give a damn. But I do not accept tales or claims of any alien/human interaction.

My best guess is that we simply cannot make positive statements when there is nothing to support it.

Unlike yours my opinion is that science depends on repeatable results. Scientists don't speculate, they demand evidence. Theoretical physicists such as Michio Kaku, who I ran into today at a local flea market, deals with possibilities but these possibilities are theoretical and do not depend on evidence. Theirs is a what if world. My world is, show me the evidence first.

A belief is just that; it doesn't require evidence.

BTW, as you may have guessed I am not a scientist. But I've learned enough in my 70 years to trust science first and foremost.

Originally posted by WitnessFromAfar

Originally posted by Learhoag
You know, when one reaches the end of your reply one still doesn't have any evidence of any other life in the universe except us. I'll accept that by your reply you exist.

Fair enough, you're absolutely right. We don't have evidence (at least not accepted by mainstream science) of other life in the universe from my reply.

I would humbly submit however that the Battle of Los Angeles is best explained by a visiting alien spaceship. And this, to be fair, is linked in my signature where it says, 'Your evidence is right here'.

I re-read your posts, and I apologize for my harshness with you. It wasn't exactly fair. I just get so tired of people refusing to make the logical conclusion that since the environment for alien life exists, it's likely out there. It's a ridiculous thing to argue against, and it brings out the worst in me when I see someone attempt to make that argument.

To be perfectly honest about things, we DON'T have evidence of life out there. BUT, the important part is, in absence of that evidence (deciding either way for certain) what is our best guess?

Our best guess is based upon Science and Math, and frankly, the Expectation, based upon the observable evidence, is that we will eventually find evidence for extra-terrestrial life, if we keep looking for it hard enough. It's likely out there.

That's science's best guess to date, and it bugs the crap out of me when people act like that best guess is 'crazy'. It isn't crazy at all, it's Predicted by the Scientific Method. And even should the Scientific Method prove the Expected result false (say if we explore the entire universe, define it's borders, and find ZERO life), then EVEN STILL, the original hypothesis isn't crazy.

It's what the evidence Predicts.

I guess that's my whole point here.

-WFA

You don't seem to be aware that there was another documentary where they showed many rocks that had similar "squigley things" on them but had no connection to Mars; earth rocks! The claim for the "Mars rock" makes me laugh.

Originally posted by lunarminer
Well there is some pretty good evidence that alien life exists on Mars. Remember the Mars rock with the little squigley things that some NASA scientists identified as fossilized microbes? That rock also had traces of amino acids, basic to life.

Also, there's water on Mars, an atmosphere, plenty of sunshine, and traces of methane.

I have never seen a martian lifeform (as far as I know) but I can imagine that they could exist. I really have no problem with that idea.

Some scientists have speculated that viruses, lichens, water bears, and certain bacteria could survive the conditions in space and could actually traverse vast distances of the vacuum of space and still be viable.

There is actually a theory that viruses are constantly raining down on Earth from space. This theory is over 100 years old.

Then there is the theory that life on Earth may have come from Mars or some other place.

So, I have no problem with the idea that some of the life here on Earth might have come from space.

If you accept the idea that life might exist on Mars, that some life on Earth may have come from space, and that all life on Earth may have originated elsewhere. Then it is really not a stretch to believe in advanced life elsewhere or that they might come here as well.

[edit on 8-3-2009 by Learhoag]

[edit on 8-3-2009 by Learhoag]

reply to post by majestictwo


No harm. I was just wondering exactly what sort of answer you were looking for in your original post, as I wasn't certain exactly what you were asking.

While I am convinced of certain paranormal phenomena as being a reality, I do not believe simply due to claims alone. I do not really put much stock into videos of photos at all, unless there is rock solid, credible witnesses, circumstances, and testimony behind it, and sceptics have failed to give a rational, intelligent explanation. Videos or photos simply mean nothing to me unless there is a strong, verifiable story behind it.

There are all the philisophical arguements (the sheer number of stars, galaxies, and planets that could support life, interpretations of ancient religions and art, ect) but those don't really add weight to the UFO debate, just offer interesting speculation. It's the mountain of evidence from the past 100+ years, from everyday people to the highest ranks of governments everywhere, that has convinced me, especially when dealing with military, technical, and scientific people who have encountered UFOs.

reply to post by Skadi_the_Evil_Elf

While I am convinced of certain paranormal phenomena as being a reality, I do not believe simply due to claims alone. I do not really put much stock into videos of photos at all, unless there is rock solid, credible witnesses, circumstances, and testimony behind it, and sceptics have failed to give a rational, intelligent explanation. Videos or photos simply mean nothing to me unless there is a strong, verifiable story behind it.

This is it right now for me, what you have written here says it all for me.
I may be toppling from the fence but not that much.

There are all the philisophical arguements (the sheer number of stars, galaxies, and planets that could support life, interpretations of ancient religions and art, ect) but those don't really add weight to the UFO debate, just offer interesting speculation. It's the mountain of evidence from the past 100+ years, from everyday people to the highest ranks of governments everywhere, that has convinced me, especially when dealing with military, technical, and scientific people who have encountered UFOs.

These are all very strong reasons to believe. If this were a court case the evidence probably still wouldn’t be there (IMO). I think you would still need some hard evidence like a real alien body part or part of a UFO. That’s what I feel anyway and that’s why I wanted to know why others just believed.

I haven’t come across anyone else that has my opinion or feeling call it what you will. The circumstantial evidence is strong indeed but the hard evidence is not. Sure it could be withheld I grant you but that has to be proven too. I’ll take a look at some of the articles presented in this thread and see if it helps.
MJ2

reply to post by Learhoag



I may have been hasty in my previous post – possibly there is someone that thinks similarly to me. If I were to believe in the circumstantial evidence, then I particularly like this line of yours.

But I do not accept tales or claims of any alien/human interaction.

I agree I just dont see the need for it.

I just think that we are just one planet in all these planets that we haven't been able to reach in one galaxy among millions to which we don't know the expansion of..
how can we be the only ones?