Report: Obama Offers to Scrap Missile Shield If Russia Cooperates on Iran

This is the same idea, i had replied in another post months ago..scrap the missle shield in europe. This whole thing with the Russians going global now too, started becuase fo the european missle defense shield..its an excellent idea! thier was NO need for it in the first place.

reply to post by LiquidLight


You are not being ignorant at all. You ask a good question.

why is it America's job to secure Europe? Any Europeans care to give their point of view on this matter?

The most I can figure is that NATO approved. However, it is clear that the US was pushing the agenda IMO.

NATO has approved US plans for part of a controversial missile defence shield to be stationed in the Czech Republic, but Russia is strongly opposed to the plan.

www.abc.net.au...

Originally posted by Bunch
This missile shield program is one prime example of the overblown, out of control, way over budget and ineffective weapon programs that the DOD have. They should have scrap it a long time ago and I think Russia would call the US bluff on this one and do nothing.

They already know that our current financial situation calls from programs like this to be terminated.

The current financial situation was CAUSED by the same people that want an end to anything even remotely connected to freedom, liberty and capitalism. Oh...... Einstein...... the anti missile system has worked five times in a row. And, if anything is out of control and over budget, it's Americas entitlement programs and the 4.3 trillion dollars debt BHO has put us and our great grandchildren into.

Originally posted by ziggy1706
This is the same idea, i had replied in another post months ago..scrap the missle shield in europe. This whole thing with the Russians going global now too, started becuase fo the european missle defense shield..its an excellent idea! thier was NO need for it in the first place.

Ummmmmmm .... excuse me? Have you not been paying attention? Russia has been using it's quasi-democracy to re-arm and make preparations for becoming a world Communist power again. They've been doing it since the early 90's, so don't try to blame Bush on this. On the other hand, BHO was surrounded by Socialist/Marxists and Communists since he was 9 years old. Do some research on Axlerod and his parents.

So, the president is making this offer in hopes that Russia will help convince the Iranians to release the American hostages they're holding... Wait, damn! Wrong crappy liberal president who's economic decisions are further wrecking a horrible economy he inherited... Sorry, I get confused sometimes.

I am not pleased with this idea at all. I have felt (and have posted this right here months ago when this missile shield issue was heating up) that this shield could be a catalyst to a second cold war and an arms race between us and the Russians. Furthermore, I said then and say now that a second cold war would be exactly what the doctor ordered to get us out of this economic free fall. Never in this country's history has the American middle class experienced a greater growth in wealth and status than at the height of the cold war. I am 100% opposed to the US making any concessions or cutting any deals that lead towards anything but high tension between us and them.

I've been expecting this for a while - IMO Obama never intended to continue the European NMD base plan, it's a pricey, pointless white elephant.

But he was waiting to trade abandoning the program for some sort of concession from the Russians: and now we know what it is

reply to post by xmotex

IMO Obama never intended to continue the European NMD base plan, it's a pricey, pointless white elephant.

Many people have felt this way.

Don't you think the Russians might have had the same thought?

Why would they make concessions if they know Obama isn't serious about the program in the first place?

Because if they don't he could still choose to continue the program, need or no.

Also, regardless, the Russians are getting something they want.

In turn they can afford to make some kind of concession, and improve relations with the US, which haven't been overly cordial lately.

If we're not putting our stuff in their backyard and surrounding them with military bases, as we've been doing for the last few years, they really have no reason to be at odds with the US.

You'll notice that US relations with Putin were pretty cordial before we started pushing NATO eastward.

I expect that trend to end as well: Georgia & the Ukraine will almost certainly not be joining NATO under an Obama Administration - just watch.

reply to post by jam321

Do you think it is a wise move on Obama' behalf?

My God, NO, NO, NO!!!

This PROVES that Obama is a fool. Isn't there ANYONE in his inner circle that can tell him that you cannot trust the Russians. First of all, the Russians are providing Iran with help in gaining nuclear material. Second, look at what Putin did in Georgia. Third, as a former KGB, Putin's background makes it clear that HE cannot be trusted.
Bush was foolish enough to fall for Putin's "charms", saying that he looked into his eyes, and saw his soul. Yeh, the SAME soul that ordered Russian troops into Georgia, and is threatening to take control of the northern polar area.

If Obama goes through with this, he has just given the Russians the signal to continue to take over former USSR republics, as well as Eastern European countries such as Poland. It is no secret that Russia wants to PUNISH POLAND for their staunch alliance with the US.
Obama is throwing Eastern Europe under the train.

First, he continues the destruction of our economy, then our culture, and now our allies, while Iran, with Russia's covert help, develops nuclear weapons, with NO COUNTERMEASURE.

Prof, seeing that you are against Obama's offer, Don't you think that the US placing those missile shields will renew the Cold War?

Do you think America is ready for another Cold War?

reply to post by jam321

Do you think America is ready for another Cold War?

Ready or not, it will happen either way. However, if Obama is sucker enough to believe the Russians, he'll be giving them a big head start. In addition, if he goes ahead with this, he will signal to the Russians, as to what a fool he is, and they and their allies will take him, and the US to the cleaners, with more "touchy-feely-do-good-cumbayaya-giveaways."
Why not just throw the white flag up on the White House lawn, and surrender to those who would destroy us. He's just taking a little longer to do it.
What do you expect from a "President" who spend the better part of his short partial term in the Senate, campaigning to become the agent of CHANGE. This sure is change. God help us all.

This is posturing on our part just like the whole pull out of Iraq deal. People we are bankrupt kapeesh? This stuff is happening whether you like it or not. Its to bad we didnt pull back and cut before we bankrupted ourselves but hey what can you say? You will see our empire shrink dramatically over the next 10 years due to our bankruptcy and it will be under all sorts of pretexts but just know its 100% because we are broke. Thank our two party crime family in Washington for this.

[edit on 2-3-2009 by tjeffersonsghost]

Some deal indeed. It is like two wolves deciding who gets to eat the sheep. They will eventually share the sheep and each will leave with a full belly. Iran is a big issue with both players in a pain in the arse kinda way. They are playing good cop bad cop, but in the end the results will be the same.

Russia and the US are better friends than one could ever imagine. Always keep that in mind. They need each other and they know it. They also know that they are both hungry and Iran is looking pretty tasty right about now. Soon, the knives will come out and the Persians will never see it coming.

Ask the Georgians about it. The US set them up and the Russians knocked them down. Two peas in a pod.

TJ is right.

The last administration practically bankrupted this country trying to turn us into a global military empire.

Fortunately, most Americans have absolutely no interest in ruling the world.

The current administration isn't going to try, and a lot of armchair generals are going to be pretty bent at watching their dreams of a Pax Americana crumble, no doubt.

But it was a terrible idea in the first place, and we can't afford it anyway.

reply to post by xmotex

The current administration isn't going to try, and a lot of armchair generals are going to be pretty bent at watching their dreams of a Pax Americana crumble, no doubt. But it was a terrible idea in the first place, and we can't afford it anyway.

Right, and the tooth fairy really exists. I'll believe that when Obama tells Israel that they can go it alone, that we don't support them anymore, and we will stop giving them the $3 Billion dollars a year in military aid, AND when Obama REVERSES his decision to send 20,000 MORE American troops into Afghanistan, and pulls them all out.

Originally posted by ProfEmeritus


Right, and the tooth fairy really exists. I'll believe that when Obama tells Israel that they can go it alone, that we don't support them anymore, and we will stop giving them the $3 Billion dollars a year in military aid, AND when Obama REVERSES his decision to send 20,000 MORE American troops into Afghanistan, and pulls them all out.

We wont be in Afghanistan for much longer my friend. You see Obamas 10 yr budget? He left very little money in the budget past 2011 which says to me we will be mostly out of both Iraq and Afghanistan by then. We are broke man and behind the scenes our creditors are telling us "If you want us to keep buying your debt you need to make some cuts" and cuts are coming. Trust me our crime family in Washington does not want this. They want perpetual war but its being forced on them. That is the difference.

[edit on 2-3-2009 by tjeffersonsghost]

Pretty ironic, Reagan got the USSR financially on its knees in the 80's through the last arms race[of the cold war] with the Star wars program.
Now Obama bows before Russia to cancel the shield program.
One way or another the Russians already know the shield is worthless cause their RS-24 ICBM's can counter the shield.Maybe the Russian still don't like those toys in their backyard and cooperate, on the otherhand maybe they also make more profit from a war with Iran, in fact both the US and Russia can gain some, still they're both the same countries with its militairy-industrial complex..its like xman_in_blackx said, they might be handy to each other..

[edit on 2-3-2009 by Foppezao]

reply to post by tjeffersonsghost


Makes no sense to send troops into harm's way for a war that Obama may soon end. Maybe Obama plans to borrow the money at a later date so he can continue the war in Afghanistan.

When the baby boomers retire, we are in even deeper trouble.

Originally posted by mrmonsoon
reply to post by Ownification

 

I beg to differ with you.

Even if (and I personally don't believe this) were not trying to make nuclear weapons, wether the US/NATO/EU thinks they are or not does have great meaning.

Not to fall to the tired,"Glass parking lot" statement...
But, seriously, if the US/NATO/EU thinks they are, they may attack to distroy it.

Since Iran has placed it nuclear facilities under heavily populated cities ( yes, it was a calculated risk to protect the nuclear equipment, not the people above it).

I seriously doubt that all the radiation of their refining and the nuclear tipped weapons needed to get them that far underground. (special ground penetrating weapons,"Bunker Busters")

Development continued, with weapons such as the nuclear B61, and conventional thermobaric weapons and GBU-28. One of the more effective housings, the GBU-28 used its large mass (2,130 kg / 4,700 lb) and casing (constructed from barrels of surplus 203 mm howitzers) to penetrate 6 meters (20 ft) of concrete, and more than 30 meters (100 ft) of earth.[6] The B61 Mod 11, which first entered military service in January 1997, was specifically developed to allow for bunker penetration, and is speculated to have the ability to destroy hardened targets a few hundred feet beneath the earth.[7]
While penetrations of 20–100 feet (30 m) were sufficient for some shallow targets, both the Soviet Union and the United States were creating bunkers buried under huge volumes of soil or reinforced concrete in order to withstand the multi-megaton thermonuclear weapons developed in the 1950s and 1960s. Bunker penetration weapons were initially designed out of this Cold War context.

Wikipedia

The reason I reference Nuclear tipped bunker busters is that the only way enough explosive power ( to penetrate all the Earth and steel reinforced concrete to get to the refining equipment) in a small enough package to fit in a bunker bunker, is a small nuclear explosion.



[edit on 3/2/2009 by mrmonsoon]

I get your point that because of this suspicion they could be attacked and in result a great catastrophe might arise. Here's the problem which need to be taken in to consideration when thinking about this issue: You are merely stating that if you are weak then you have no rights.

Let's apply this same scenario within a small community inspite of nations. To say that a girl shouldn't study even though she has the right to do so but if she does some people would kill her is absurd. That is just extremism, if not explain how so. Think about it, the West complains about Muslims extremists who threaten people constantly but this just shows that both sides are as extreme. Hope you understand.

If one was to oppose the Muslim extremism then surely that individual should also oppose the Western extremism.

Well, Folks, here is Russia's answer, hot off the presses:
drudgereport.com...

RUSSIA BRUSHES OFF OBAMA: NO 'HAGGLING' Tue Mar 03 2009 09:15:17 ET Russian President Dmitri Medvedev on Tuesday showed willingness to discuss the US-planned missile defense system opposed by Moscow, but without 'haggling' linking it to Iran.

In other words, Russia will accept nothing short of UNCONDITIONAL SURRENDER by OBAMA. So much for his "touchy-feely-flower-power diplomacy.
When will they realize how much of a hole people like Obama are putting this country in?