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Court won't review Obama's eligibility to serve!

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posted on Dec, 14 2008 @ 10:41 PM
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reply to post by Aermacchi
 


That's untrue. I don't have the entire transcript, but I do have some of the quotes, and if you can infer that she is saying he was born there... then you have no ability to reason.

I never once said that she specifically said that, like I said, I don't have the full transcript. I do have these quotes:

Keep in mind, this is coming from the person that VIEWED his BC
Honolulu Advertiser

"This has gotten ridiculous," state health director Dr. Chiyome Fukino said yesterday. "There are plenty of other, important things to focus on, like the economy, taxes, energy."


She claims the accusations that he wasn't born there ARE RIDICULOUS. This is coming from the person who viewed it.


Fukino yesterday issued a statement saying that she and the registrar of vital statistics personally inspected Obama's birth certificate and found it to be valid.


She viewed his BC, and it was valid.


Fukino issued her statement to try to stomp out persistent rumors that Obama was not born in Honolulu — and is therefore not a U.S. citizen and thus ineligible to run for president.


She did this to quit the crazy speculation.


"There have been numerous requests for Sen. Barack Hussein Obama's official birth certificate," Fukino said in the statement. "State law (Hawai'i Revised Statutes ¤338-18) prohibits the release of a certified birth certificate to persons who do not have a tangible interest in the vital record. ... No state official, including Gov. Linda Lingle, has ever instructed that this vital record be handled in a manner different from any other vital record in the possession of the State of Hawai'i."


She, by law, cannot release the BC or discuss its contents.


As a result, Fukino said she does not believe Health Department officials could release Obama's birth certificate to the public even with his permission, although she would need to get a legal ruling to be certain.


Even with Obama's permission, she still could not release it.

 

With that being said, what do you propose this lady was trying to say? Do you think she was lying? Do you think she was saying nothing?

Also, why else would Hawaii hold his vaulted BC unless he was born there?


Originally posted by Aermacchi
No one can prove anyone has seen it mick and THAT is our point that when you peel away the onion


I've proved multiple times that at least one state official has viewed it...

 

Here's my impression of Aermacchi

Normal Person: Obama was born in Hawaii, here is proof [insert source here]

Aermacchi: Nah Uh!

Normal Person: Why not? I have a valid source, all evidence points towards it.

Aermacchi: Quit blindly following, man! You don't know anything. No one has ever seen it so he must be lying! [Insert more useless rhetoric]

Debating with you is truly a pleasure.

In fact, if you'd like to take this to the debate forum, I'd gladly improve my record by debating you.



posted on Dec, 15 2008 @ 12:03 AM
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Originally posted by Irish M1ck
reply to post by redhatty
 


What? I am not talking about that. I am simply asking why would a judge be any more credible to you than any other government official? Why would you trust a judges ruling over a state official (from the department of health no less - what does she have to gain considering all she has to lose if she was lying)?


It's a mute point, since it will never happen (subject matter jurisdiction), but regarding the Statement from Hawaii Officials...

Think like a lawyer.

Focus on what the Health Director is saying, and also on what she is NOT saying.

Here’s the statement:


"There have been numerous requests for Sen. Barack Hussein Obama’s official birth certificate. State law (Hawai‘i Revised Statutes §338-18) prohibits the release of a certified birth certificate to persons who do not have a tangible interest in the vital record," DOH Director Dr. Chiyome Fukino said.

Fukino said she and the registrar of vital statistics, Alvin Onaka, have personally verified that the health department holds Obama's original birth certificate.

"Therefore, I as Director of Health for the State of Hawai‘i, along with the Registrar of Vital Statistics who has statutory authority to oversee and maintain these type of vital records, have personally seen and verified that the Hawai‘i State Department of Health has Sen. Obama’s original birth certificate on record in accordance with state policies and procedures," Fukino said.


Fukino said that no state official, including Gov. Linda Lingle, ever instructed that Obama's certificate be handled differently from any other.

Having read the above, notice:

1. Fukino is NOT stating that the original birth certificate is a US birth certificate.

2. Fukino is NOT stating that is not a Kenyan birth certificate.

3. Fukino is only stating that a birth certificate (which could be Kenyan) is filed in accordance with the rules.

4. Fukino is NOT saying that Obama’s record is not filed according to Hawaii Revised Statute 338-178 that allows “registration” of birth in Hawaii for a child that was born outside of Hawaii to parents who, for a year preceding the child's birth, claimed Hawaii as their place of residence.

5. Fukino’s statement, therefore, does not rule out that Obama could have a Kenyan birth certificate but still filed according to Hawaii Revised Statute 338-178 that allows “registration” of birth in Hawaii for a child that was born outside of Hawaii to parents who, for a year preceding the child's birth, claimed Hawaii as their place of residence.

6. Fukino’s statement, also does not rule out registration of birth of a child born outside the US but registered in Hawaii.

That statement failed to resolve any of the questions being raised by litigation and press accounts.

That brief comment does not affirm whether the birth certificate in the “record” is a Certification of Live Birth or a Certificate of Hawaiian Birth.

In Hawaii, a “Certificate” of Live Birth resulting from hospital documentation, including a signature of an attending physician, is different from a “Certification” of Live Birth.

For births prior to 1972, a Certification of Live Birth was the result of the uncorroborated testimony of one witness and was not generated by a hospital. Such a Certificate could be obtained up to one year from the date of the child’s birth.

For that reason, its value as prima facie evidence is limited and could be overcome if any of the allegations of substantial evidence of birth outside Hawaii can be obtained.

The vault (long Version) birth certificate, per Hawaiian Statute 883.176 allows the birth in another State or another country to be registered in Hawaii. Box 7C of the vault Certificate of Live Birth contains a question, whether the birth was in Hawaii or another State or Country.

Therefore, the only way to verify the exact location of birth is to review a certified copy of the original vault Copy.

Since it would take a congressional or court order for the original vault copy to be produced, the only parties that can be entrusted to review it properly are Congress or a judge.

Which would you prefer?



posted on Dec, 15 2008 @ 12:07 AM
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reply to post by redhatty
 


So when she said the accusations that Obama was not born in Hawaii are "ridiculous" she was saying...?

Thanks.

*Edit to add:

And it's not a moot point. If you won't believe one government official based off of word, what good would another one do? Who cares if a court case accepted it, looked at the evidence, and agreed that Obama was born here, you wouldn't believe them anyway.

His BC WILL NEVER BE RELEASED FOR PUBLIC REVIEW, meaning you people will NEVER be satisfied. That's my point.

[edit on 12/15/2008 by Irish M1ck]



posted on Dec, 15 2008 @ 01:03 AM
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Originally posted by Aermacchi
Oh so you DO understand then when Obama shows us a COLB that he must show us the birth certificate he keeps telling everyone backs it up. You DO know that he is the one making the claim he is a US Born here American while he "Brazenly" "clings to this assertion he need not prove it but with amateur looking crap made photoshopped fakery from a flop blog called factchicken.org

Ha ha ha Ill let this one stand on its own merit . What are you 6 years old?


I could ask you the same question. Although I have to say, by age 6 I already knew how to spell "I'll".


Just telling you your behavior is childish is an insult to children everywhere.


That's actually a pretty good insult! You're finally producing something of value. Mind if I use that one once in awhile?


It's always racism or bigotry with you nightsparrow and always your way and no other way so Ill not bother to confuse you with the facts till you are all "Growed up like"


It'd be really nice if this pot would stop whizzin' on my kettle.


See it's all you ever knew how to do and all you'll ever know how to look.


Ooooh, screen caps! You actually went to all the trouble of taking screen caps (poor ones that cut off half my remarks; lousy editing on your part--you probably couldn't fake UFO pics if you tried), saving those caps to an image hosting site, and then posting them on ATS just so you could take a dig at lil' old me?!?

I'm astounded.

I'm not sure if this proves you're totally unhinged, or if you're just pathetically trying to hit on me. (I should let you know up-front, so there's no disappointment on your part--I'm very much spoken for.) Either way the level of obsession you're displaying both in regards to the Obama issue and in regards to me personally is far beyond anything I would expect from a rational human being in complete control of their mental faculties. Praytell, have you considered shock therapy? Or have you had a little too much?

It matters not. You've become a most amusing plaything.

NOW DANCE, LITTLE PUPPET!! AND SING THAT "LIMBERLEGS" SONG!!!



posted on Dec, 15 2008 @ 01:25 AM
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Originally posted by Irish M1ck
reply to post by redhatty
 


So when she said the accusations that Obama was not born in Hawaii are "ridiculous" she was saying...?

Thanks.

*Edit to add:

And it's not a moot point. If you won't believe one government official based off of word, what good would another one do? Who cares if a court case accepted it, looked at the evidence, and agreed that Obama was born here, you wouldn't believe them anyway.

His BC WILL NEVER BE RELEASED FOR PUBLIC REVIEW, meaning you people will NEVER be satisfied. That's my point.

[edit on 12/15/2008 by Irish M1ck]


Can you show us where she says ANYTHING like that? Underline it please because Mick, I do NOT see fukino saying anything like this he accusations that Obama was not born in Hawaii are "ridiculous" I wouldn't be surprised if Obama made that prepared statement because Fukino is so careful not to lie and yet never confirms he was Born in the United states anywhere in that statement.

Redhatty made some other valid points as only those with a tangible interest should have a right to see it. Well we DO have that right but even if we didn't I would accept a Judge or member of congress statement on that .



Main Entry: 1tan·gi·ble
Pronunciation: \ˈtan-jə-bəl\
Function: adjective
Etymology: Late Latin tangibilis, from Latin tangere to touch
Date: 1589
1 a: capable of being perceived especially by the sense of touch : palpable b: substantially real : material
2: capable of being precisely identified or realized by the mind
3: capable of being appraised at an actual or approximate value


The language in reds post also suggests why it is the Vaulted BC and NOT the COLB, that confirms one way or the other what Obama's true status is and to date NO ONE has seen his BC. You keep saying you have proven it and you have not. You read words in paragraphs that are no where in the original quotes not to mention that she "allegedly" seen this BC, NOT verifiable by you or anyone else, so, again, we have always asked to see only ONE thing and have only been shown items and documents not tangible and not seen by anyone else as tangible evidence. Only fakery and manufactured images posted on a dressed up blog named factchicken.org

Even her opening statement complaining that this is getting ridiculous, was said purposely to establish timidity among anyone pressuring them incase the statment she gave didn't go over anyone's head. She didn't lie, because she, like everyone else NEVER answered the original ongoing query, being , WHERE WAS HE BORN and NOT whether or not someone recoreded a the record there. Anyone can do that but not everyone that has done that was BORN THERE.



His BC WILL NEVER BE RELEASED FOR PUBLIC REVIEW, meaning you people will NEVER be satisfied. That's my point.


It was done with McCain when everyone was saying HE wasn't qualified and it will be done with Obama or this will never end and it is no way to start his term in office. I for one still can't understand when you really think about this, you have no idea who this guy is and THAT should tell you something. Again, we are not asking for a kidney, just his damn BC and nothing less will prove what a birth certificate is by its very invention, created for in the first place. To prove where he was born, when and to whom. Anything less is what most people get away with when your a Government Official like those we know are so corrupt in Chicago. After the recent arrest of their Governor, you may have a clue as to why those of us that are wise don't just believe everything a "Government" official says. This may come as a surprise to you Mickey, but they LIE

A LOT



posted on Dec, 15 2008 @ 01:37 AM
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Originally posted by The Nighthawk

Originally posted by Aermacchi
Oh so you DO understand then when Obama shows us a COLB that he must show us the birth certificate he keeps telling everyone backs it up. You DO know that he is the one making the claim he is a US Born here American while he "Brazenly" "clings to this assertion he need not prove it but with amateur looking crap made photoshopped fakery from a flop blog called factchicken.org

Ha ha ha Ill let this one stand on its own merit . What are you 6 years old?


I could ask you the same question. Although I have to say, by age 6 I already knew how to spell "I'll".


Just telling you your behavior is childish is an insult to children everywhere.


That's actually a pretty good insult! You're finally producing something of value. Mind if I use that one once in awhile?


It's always racism or bigotry with you nightsparrow and always your way and no other way so Ill not bother to confuse you with the facts till you are all "Growed up like"


It'd be really nice if this pot would stop whizzin' on my kettle.


See it's all you ever knew how to do and all you'll ever know how to look.


Ooooh, screen caps! You actually went to all the trouble of taking screen caps (poor ones that cut off half my remarks; lousy editing on your part--you probably couldn't fake UFO pics if you tried), saving those caps to an image hosting site, and then posting them on ATS just so you could take a dig at lil' old me?!?

I'm astounded.

I'm not sure if this proves you're totally unhinged, or if you're just pathetically trying to hit on me. (I should let you know up-front, so there's no disappointment on your part--I'm very much spoken for.) Either way the level of obsession you're displaying both in regards to the Obama issue and in regards to me personally is far beyond anything I would expect from a rational human being in complete control of their mental faculties. Praytell, have you considered shock therapy? Or have you had a little too much?

It matters not. You've become a most amusing plaything.

NOW DANCE, LITTLE PUPPET!! AND SING THAT "LIMBERLEGS" SONG!!!


Is that the best you got ? Guess you renegged on your not wasting time on my posts eh son. Gee I read that monosyllabic diatribe of yours and all I get is one long ad-hom about my photoshop skills? hey I am no Obama forger and and I know you Obama kids know a good photoshop work when you see one but what is your point?

Got anything pertaining to the topic ? I won't respond to your sophistry and immaturity. Grow up kid, you got no class and I got no time to babysit BS posts.



posted on Dec, 15 2008 @ 02:30 AM
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Good let man serve in peace..I mean how much worse can he do unless you shallow minded retards only judge him because he is black....Its your intolerance that is killing this country......Go suck off George Bush since he is clearly so much better in your racists eyes..He only ruined this country and probably cost some americans to lose their houses and jobs.......



posted on Dec, 15 2008 @ 08:23 AM
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Originally posted by Aermacchi
Is that the best you got ? Guess you renegged on your not wasting time on my posts eh son. Gee I read that monosyllabic diatribe of yours and all I get is one long ad-hom about my photoshop skills? hey I am no Obama forger and and I know you Obama kids know a good photoshop work when you see one but what is your point?


See, and now you're boring me again. Accusations of ad-hom attacks when all you've done since you came to this thread has been "attack, attack, attack". See, you're doing it again; "you Obama kids" and more accusations of Obama's BC being faked. Speaking of which:


Got anything pertaining to the topic ? I won't respond to your sophistry and immaturity. Grow up kid, you got no class and I got no time to babysit BS posts.


Kid? I'm probably older than you. And as for anything "pertaining to the topic" I have made many, many, MANY requests for your evidence to prove your accusations. You have refused every single request, and backed up each and every single one with an ad-hom attack.

So, in the interests of fairness, I'll ask you again:

Where is your evidence?

IF you really, truly believe the accusations you continue to make against Obama, then perhaps you can finally put your money where your mouth is.

Present your evidence.

If you refuse I'll have to assume you don't really have any, and that you're on ATS for the sole purpose of wasting peoples' time.



posted on Dec, 15 2008 @ 08:33 AM
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Originally posted by ConservativeJack




what are you talking about

honestly

like, what's your guys deal? You racist??? You think Obama is not who he says he is? That's OFFENSIVE.




I find your offence offensive and your ridiculous use of the term "racist"- what if a black or mixed race person has issues with this and wishes to know the truth, is that ok, although a white person cannot *surely this is racist*


[edit on 15-12-2008 by blueorder]



posted on Dec, 15 2008 @ 09:16 AM
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Originally posted by Irish M1ck
reply to post by redhatty
 


So when she said the accusations that Obama was not born in Hawaii are "ridiculous" she was saying...?

Thanks.

*Edit to add:

And it's not a moot point. If you won't believe one government official based off of word, what good would another one do? Who cares if a court case accepted it, looked at the evidence, and agreed that Obama was born here, you wouldn't believe them anyway.

His BC WILL NEVER BE RELEASED FOR PUBLIC REVIEW, meaning you people will NEVER be satisfied. That's my point.

[edit on 12/15/2008 by Irish M1ck]

Yes I too would like to see a direct quote from your un-named "she" saying the accusations are "ridiculous." Not a media spin, a direct quote. A you tube video would be sweet!

Most of the rest of your post above is an attempt to continue to build your strawman. I won't play the logical fallacy games. Good try though


Sooner or later, after Obama takes office and passes a law, someone will be arrested for not following it. Then and only then, if the person fights the charges in court, will the courts finally have subject matter jurisdiction to review if Obama is legally President.

Of course, by then the repercussions would be so much worse, but none of the people arguing to support Obama think about that. What the future may hold if and when this matter is finally heard on the merits by a court, and the repercussions of the same does not seem to cross the minds of many people.

I, personally, have been actively engaged with my Senators and local Representative regarding the Congressional challenge at the counting of the votes. I am hoping that my state will be the one to make history by presenting the challenge.

And I will continue to hope.



posted on Dec, 15 2008 @ 09:19 AM
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Uh... you guys? Anyone heard anything about whether the Supreme Court said anything about the Wrotnowski case? I know they didn't put it on the docket Friday, so it was probably denied, but has anyone heard?

Thanks.



posted on Dec, 15 2008 @ 09:32 AM
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reply to post by Benevolent Heretic
 


The SCOTUS Blog says they are supposed to have information at 10 am today but I'm guessing it won't be posted on the blog till this afternoon.



posted on Dec, 15 2008 @ 09:53 AM
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reply to post by Irish M1ck
 


your point is correct; we will not get to see bo's bc (maybe after it's too late and precedent set for illegals to be potus)
plus, there are waaay too many crooks involved
not to mention the 3 law firms he has on the case. one would think bs would respect the voters enough to show the dam thing instead of paying a fortune to keep it secret!
either way he's being a disrespectful jerk ...
course what can you expect, like my dad always said
"you are who you hang around with" and boy howdey bs has a loooong list nefarious associates.



posted on Dec, 15 2008 @ 09:56 AM
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reply to post by redhatty
 


reply to post by Aermacchi
 


Way to prove that you guys don't actually read anything that is posted by anyone else.

The "unnamed" person you are asking about is state health director (of Hawaii) Dr. Chiyome Fukino. She is the one who personally viewed and verified Obama's birth certificate. Here is where she said that:

Here is the link again, maybe you could actually take a look at it this time

"This has gotten ridiculous," state health director Dr. Chiyome Fukino said yesterday. "There are plenty of other, important things to focus on, like the economy, taxes, energy."

So, in what likely will be a vain attempt to halt the inquiries, Fukino yesterday issued a statement saying that she and the registrar of vital statistics personally inspected Obama's birth certificate and found it to be valid.

Will this be enough to quiet the doubters?

"I hope so," Fukino said. "We need to get some work done."


Again.


Fukino issued her statement to try to stomp out persistent rumors that Obama was not born in Honolulu — and is therefore not a U.S. citizen and thus ineligible to run for president.


This is the state department of health employee who viewed Obama's birth certificate. She released those statements to help calm down the accusations and she called it "ridiculous".

Of course, it didn't work, because you people are relentless and won't quit until you see it yourselves because you are egocentric.

Here is the link again, maybe you could actually take a look at it this time

Here is the link again, maybe you could actually take a look at it this time

Here is the link again, maybe you could actually take a look at it this time

Here is the link again, maybe you could actually take a look at it this time

Here is the link again, maybe you could actually take a look at it this time

[edit on 12/15/2008 by Irish M1ck]



posted on Dec, 15 2008 @ 10:00 AM
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reply to post by redhatty
 


Excellent analysis!!!!!! (sorry for the short post)



posted on Dec, 15 2008 @ 10:03 AM
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reply to post by Irish M1ck
 


The article states she said it, but does not directly quote her....Anyone have a DIRECT QUOTE FROM HER stating she has seen it and verified it?



posted on Dec, 15 2008 @ 10:09 AM
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reply to post by habu71
 


You do realize that it is unprofessional for them to just take a giant quote and publish it. That is why some is paraphrased. Good thing I'm eclectic so I can satisfy the insatiable needs of the people on this board (you guys can't produce one shred of evidence but I have to quote someone 8 different ways from 4 different valid sources) :

Another Article That Won't Get Read

"Therefore, I as Director of Health for the State of Hawai‘i, along with the Registrar of Vital Statistics who has statutory authority to oversee and maintain these type of vital records, have personally seen and verified that the Hawai‘i State Department of Health has Sen. Obama’s original birth certificate on record in accordance with state policies and procedures," Fukino said.


Are you happy now? I've produced a direct quote from her sayting she has verified it and seen it, and that she believes the accusations are "ridiculous".

What the hell else could you possibly want?

[edit on 12/15/2008 by Irish M1ck]



posted on Dec, 15 2008 @ 10:20 AM
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reply to post by Irish M1ck
 


Again, review this post again and see the list of the things she is NOT saying.

You choose to believe the media spin and statement as a confirmation.

Many of the rest of us don't.

Either way, there is an official statement that basically says a whole lot of nothing. Go back to the link above and read the official statement yet again and tell me exactly what it confirms.



posted on Dec, 15 2008 @ 10:34 AM
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reply to post by redhatty
 


Media spin? Your entire argument is based off of blogs and frivolous lawsuits and you think I need to worry about media spin?

Look, I know you want me to be stupid, but I have a memory long enough to know that you're taking me in circles. I saw that post, and I asked you why, if she saw the BC and it was not from Hawaii, she would call the accusations "ridiculous".

You then said, "let me see that quote, I don't believe she said that". Then I provided it.

So, you can dance around it all you want but, here are some questions I have for you:

-Unless she is a liar, why would say that it is "ridiculous"?

-Why would the state of Hawaii hold his birth certificate unless he was born there?

-Can you provide documentation to back up that states hold birth certificates of people who were not born there?



posted on Dec, 15 2008 @ 10:43 AM
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Thanks, Jenna.



Originally posted by Irish M1ck
What the hell else could you possibly want?


I just find that so funny! Sorry.


Originally posted by redhatty
Again, review this post again and see the list of the things she is NOT saying.


She also didn't say that Obama's NOT a child molester.
She didn't say that he wasn't dropped off in Hawaii by aliens.
She didn't say that he isn't a secret Muslim, people!



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