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Starchild Skull DNA Testing Proves Not From This Earth

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posted on Dec, 11 2008 @ 05:12 AM
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reply to post by tezzajw
 

wtf? Not all of those have been from my posts.
Nice try tazzjaw, but your campaign of attacking me, which ISNT EVEN ON TOPIC, wont work. the skull is HUMAN.

X and Y chromosome = fully human.


and ive tried to explain to you time and time again that the human race began on earth,science has shown common descent among the organisms on Earth meaning that human beings evolved into humans, ON EARTH

soo then you go back even fruther questioning the origin of life itself. I give you the science and again you proceed to steeer the debate toward attacking me. this is a entertaining tactic but wont work. all you do is keep going back a little farther in time and in doing so you have gone wait the hell off topic. this thread isnt debating the origins of life, we are talking about a SKULL. this SKULL is fully human and non alien as shown by DNA tests revealing and X and a Y chromosome
and now all your doing is arguing SEMANTICS
and its pure crap and displays the utter weakness of your position with regards to the skull. instead of going on evidence, you are trying to invent things to support it, and this is fallacious.



posted on Dec, 11 2008 @ 05:13 AM
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Originally posted by tezzajw

Originally posted by jfj123

Originally posted by tezzajw
Again, conclusively, how did life begin on Earth?

Since there is no amount of evidence that would convince you how life began on earth, there is no point in trying to explain it.

Since you don't know and would only be taking a guess, I can see why you won't try and explain it.

Nice dodge! Well done!

[edit on 10-12-2008 by tezzajw]


Actually, it's not a dodge in any way. My "guess" is based on all the other conversations I've had with you in other threads and no matter how much real, scientific data I posted, you NEVER believed me or anyone else that disagreed with you. So based on my past experience with you, I've determined it would be a waste of my time now


If you don't believe anything I've posted, which would be business as usual, look it up. The evidence is all around you and easily available in a myriad of scientific journals.



posted on Dec, 11 2008 @ 05:15 AM
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reply to post by farflungheroe
 


ahh another hoagland claim. Hoagland is a pseudo scientist and has zero credbility.


heres a whole section on hoaglands various "claims"

www.badastronomy.com...



posted on Dec, 11 2008 @ 05:16 AM
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reply to post by farflungheroe
 


It would be very inefficient to seed a planet like this. Think about it...Aliens would travel all this way to simply toss some organic/non-living compounds into the earth environment, then wait and hopefully they'd create life? Seems like a really bad idea. If any alien race were to actually seed the earth, they'd want to start with what they want in the end, as evolution could take organic compounds in ANY direction over billions of years and they have no way of knowing what they would end up with.



posted on Dec, 11 2008 @ 05:17 AM
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reply to post by jfj123
 


jfj123 all hes doing now is arguing semantics.


the original position, that this skull is half alien has failed so hard that he is just going further and further back in the life cycle to try and find an out, to try and explain somehow it could still be "alien"


but finding both a X and Y chromosome is prety conclusive. It means the child was male, with human parents which means this was likely a hydrocephallic skull



posted on Dec, 11 2008 @ 06:26 AM
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Originally posted by NavalFC
wtf? Not all of those have been from my posts.
Nice try tazzjaw, but your campaign of attacking me, which ISNT EVEN ON TOPIC, wont work. the skull is HUMAN.

The quote was your's. Look on page 8 of this thread. I don't make up quotes. You typed it and I quoted it. You typed that you had the answers to the orign of life, not me.

There were only two other people who used to call me 'tazz', which you have done twice. It wouldn't surprise me if you're a past banned member who's reincarnated himself. I may be wrong and that's cool, but some typing habits are hard to break. I know that one of the people who called me 'tazz' was later banned, although he didn't spend much time on the Alien/UFO forum. Note to self, NavalFC, type my name as it's stated, unless you want your own name disrespected. Remember, the Moderators are always watching, they're not idiots. They sort that kind of stuff out fairly quickly.



this thread isnt debating the origins of life, we are talking about a SKULL. this SKULL is fully human and non alien as shown by DNA tests revealing and X and a Y chromosome.

which means this was likely a hydrocephallic skull

I must have missed that part. Thanks for clearing it up. So you're sure that aliens don't also have X and Y chromosomes?

Only likely to be a hydrocephallic skull? That doesn't instill a great degree of confidence, does it?

Would that condition explain the symmetry of the skull and the larger brain capacity?



posted on Dec, 11 2008 @ 06:36 AM
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reply to post by tezzajw
 


Why don't we cut to the chase.
Why don't you tell us what amount of evidence would convince you that the skull is from earth? Please be VERY specific.

[edit on 11-12-2008 by jfj123]



posted on Dec, 11 2008 @ 08:09 AM
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Originally posted by NavalFC
reply to post by Mozzy
 


This is complete bogusness!!!!
Are people really this gullible?

[edit on 6-12-2008 by NavalFC]


are you new here?


Seriously, this kind of crap is what keeps me going on ATS, I get so annyoned on a daily basis that my fellow humans are so ridiculously gullible and ignorant that it makes me want to continually post how stunned I am.



posted on Dec, 11 2008 @ 11:47 AM
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I have no actual opinion on this skull. It looks like a skull of someone with a significant birth defect to me.

That being said, I see some problems on here with the ideas of debunkers. The ideas are being treated disrepectfully, and often tossed aside with a sneer with little real fact or assumptions on how life works.

mtDNA could be from one animal or person, and the nuclear DNA from another.

For example, there are plans right now to use a rabbit's ovum with the nuclear DNA extracted. Then pipette in the DNA of a human into that rabbit ovum.

These will be allowed to develop long enough for science to extract stem cells. Theoretically, these could be allowed to develop if implanted. The people born of this would have the mtDNA of the rabbit and the DNA of the human whose nuclear DNA was inserted. I believe that they would be 99.7% the same.

(BTW, it will be illegal to implant and bring to term these blastocytes. In an animal or a human. Of course, I expect that there will be some labs set up in places with lax laws where that won't last long.)

We already have the technology to create chimeras. Take the DNA of a human and another animal and combine them. If you took the DNA of a human woman, extracted her eggs and removed the nuclear DNA then inserted some chimera DNA and implanted the final product, you could have a chimera. A human-hybrid with hybrid DNA done in a lab, and the mtDNA of the human egg donor, and maybe implanted and incubated in a different human or the same human.

In this case the story being told by this burial site could be more that the woman is the human-chimera's surrogate mother.

This is not as "outlandish" or impossible as the angry debunkers are making it sound.

You could pick up the mtDNA from a test, but the protein markers to test out the nuclear DNA might not bind to the nuclear DNA of this chimera. So if you found the nuclear DNA, but it won't test it isn't an illogical (maybe far-fetched) presumption that the nuclear DNA has foreign proteins.

Alternately -
You could also apply this essential logic to the 13 mtDNA "daughters of Eve." Of which at least one is suspected to possibly be a neandrathal. Select out 13 females, and extract their eggs. Alter nuclear DNA of the male and the female, and pipette the product into other females.

Or another human specieis uses the eggs of 13 local females to carry the genetic legacy of the human "non-terrastrial" species to re-populate the Earth with a significantly larger nuclear DNA base than a mtDNA basis for the locals.

This could explain the fact the "young X" problem, where the X chormosone appears to be much much much younger than the Y chromosone in the human species. The touted reason for this current is that our ancestors were compatible with our cousin species for a long period of time where there was a significant amount of cross breeding. Which apparently only happened one way - INTO the human species and not back into a cousin sapiens who are currently still around without a "younger" X.

For the theory of pan-spermia - where life is intentionally seeded from another place to here and why that unrealiable method would be used. Consider that we are bio-electric beings. As are all the other forms of life. We are essentially "powered" by our electro-magnetic planet, and our Sun (local star.) What if you cannot get outside of the range of your "power pack," your local star? It could be that we are "keyed" to our star, or that life cannot exist away from an electro-magnetic source to power lifeforms. It might be that the only way you could transfer life from one place to another at all is in the basic compounds.

Or perhaps lifeforms must be keyed to the local star(s) in order to reproduce further. So you could have an egg/sperm (nuclear dna) combinations of some sort, but they must to grown locally in order to live and continue to reproduce.

Dismissal is intellecutal laziness.



posted on Dec, 11 2008 @ 12:44 PM
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reply to post by jfj123
 


yes it would, but as i said i actually thought of this as a way to find definitive proof of evolution, in that case simply 'dumping' what you want to end up with would be a bad strategy.

now this is all speculative so in my mind it is just one of the options.

darn we are going off topic a lot.

as for the skull, i know that there is a lot of peculiar features, but to me it is still just a freak of nature.



posted on Dec, 11 2008 @ 02:14 PM
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reply to post by tezzajw
 


Tezzjaw No, aliens dont have HUMAN X AND Y CHROMOSOMES. They were HUMAN Xs and Ys and as far as the large skull capacity, again fully explained by a Hydrocephallic skull, those are all signs.
did you not seeth pics of hydrocephalic skulls that blaine posted?
The so called increase brain capacity isnt from having a larger brain
en.wikipedia.org...

Having Human X and Y chromosomes mean the child was a human male with a human mother ad father since a XY combination is only achieved by one parent contributing each of the sex chromosomes.

Dare I say but i think you need to bone up on basic biology.

[edit on 11-12-2008 by NavalFC]



posted on Dec, 11 2008 @ 02:17 PM
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Originally posted by jfj123
reply to post by tezzajw
 


Why don't we cut to the chase.
Why don't you tell us what amount of evidence would convince you that the skull is from earth? Please be VERY specific.

[edit on 11-12-2008 by jfj123]



jfjf he obviously wont accept any. This skull has been shown to be human, having human X and Y chromosomes was pretty concrete, but all he does is try to "invent" some reason why it could still be alien

we know its human, and the type of deformities this skull has are easily xplain by hydrocephallus, they arent new, butaain tazzjaw relishes in his alien skull belief.



posted on Dec, 11 2008 @ 02:18 PM
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reply to post by tezzajw
 


OK so its tezz. I mis saw. your point?> How about staying on topic tezz?


how about actually looking at the evidence, TEZZ



posted on Dec, 11 2008 @ 02:20 PM
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reply to post by Aeons
 


Aeons now your just trying to invent facts where no evidence points to to support a baseless claim (and not doing a good job of it either)



posted on Dec, 11 2008 @ 02:46 PM
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reply to post by tezzajw
 



If the foramina (pl.) of the fourth ventricle or the cerebral aqueduct are blocked, cereobrospinal fluid (CSF) can accumulate within the ventricles. This condition is called internal hydrocephalus and it results in increased CSF pressure. The production of CSF continues, even when the passages that normally allow it to exit the brain are blocked. Consequently, fluid builds inside the brain causing pressure that compresses the nervous tissue and dilates the ventricles. Compression of the nervous tissue usually results in irreversible brain damage. If the skull bones are not completely ossified when the hydrocephalus occurs, the pressure may also severely enlarge the head. The cerebral aqueduct may be blocked at the time of birth or may become blocked later in life because of a tumor growing in the brainstem.


en.wikipedia.org...
bolding my emphasis.

In otherwords, enlarging of the skull capacity is only seen in skulls that are not ossified. I'm not sure if this is the case in this instance, or if any research has been done by the skull's owner to ascertain this. And unless evidence is put forth stating it was ossified, it's entirely possible this is a case of hydrocephalus.

As for x and y chromosomes being impossible for aliens...it's a bit foolish to state with any certainty what is or is not possible for extraterrestrial beings. We simply don't know at this point. (this part was directed at naval)



posted on Dec, 11 2008 @ 02:56 PM
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No. We absolutely can do that. The laws to clear making these clones for use of making stem cells lines was cleared earlier this year in most of the first world nations.

Rabbit ovum, cleared out of rabbit DNA with human nuclear DNA inserted. Any person born this way would have a new mtDNA strand that could be added to the human pool. However, the laws state that these clones will be terminated very quickly after a sufficient number of stem cells can be harvested for a new stem cell line.

We absolutely make chimeras already. Scientists have created multiple animal/human chimeras by combining inter-species DNA. There are several medical mice that fit the chimera billing. A pig, and I'm sure that there has been some new ones added to the list since I last checked.

The recombined DNA of a human and an animal is then inserted into an empty egg and implanted after the blastocyte starts growing. mtDNA of one animal, and the nuclear DNA of two others.

None of this is science fiction, or my imagination. Our science is doing this today. The assumption that you cannot put a hybridized human into the egg of another human that has been emptied is false. We can and are doing this as a species today with other mammals.

There is current debate going on about the human rights boundary for simian hybridization with our DNA for medical research purposes. If you combine a chimp/orangutang/gorilla and a human's nuclear DNA, and then it is inserted into an empty ovum.....is research on such a creature unethical? Does it fall into the boundaries of being human and therefore the product has human rights? How much human do you have to be to be protected by human rights?

Today we can do this.

Just because it doesn't involve freaky human alien porn, doesn't mean it isn't possible.



posted on Dec, 11 2008 @ 03:14 PM
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reply to post by Aeons
 

A couple of magnificent posts, Aeons.

Welcome to ATS!



posted on Dec, 11 2008 @ 03:15 PM
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DNA from another world would be a great find. Nobody has found any DNA that is not from Earth. Thanks for the misleading title.



posted on Dec, 11 2008 @ 03:21 PM
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reply to post by earthman4
 


You're assuming that we'd be able to tell the difference. This may or may not be the case. Intelligent species may arise only when conditions are exactly like earth, and only as a function of the same biological processes that produced humans. Then again it may not. It's unkown.



posted on Dec, 11 2008 @ 04:06 PM
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reply to post by optimus primal
 

I assume nothing. Assumptions were made and not by me.



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