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Rethinking Bird-Brains

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posted on Dec, 3 2008 @ 10:49 PM
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Originally posted by Good Wolf
reply to post by Enigma Publius
 


I tihnk humans have always underestimated the intelligence of these birds because their body language doesn't communicate much to us. Simply they just don't "look" that smart.


I think we think of speaking cognatively as the ultimate expresion of intellegence, and so tend to overlook animals that might be smart, but in different ways.

For instance my dogs are smart enough to learn the meaning of certain words, even the ones we haven't specifically taught them. Even my fish have learned to swim to the bottom of the tank when I walk near, beauese they know that might mean food.



posted on Dec, 3 2008 @ 10:58 PM
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reply to post by asmeone2
 


Yep. I have a terrier. I never taught her anything, yet she learnt just about every command you could think of including 'Go put your toys in the car'.



posted on Dec, 3 2008 @ 11:03 PM
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More videos:

Talking starling:


Talking raven:


Magpie looking in the mirror: (this is for you Lashiec



Another Egyptian Vulture:


Short video about falconry:



posted on Dec, 3 2008 @ 11:04 PM
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Originally posted by Good Wolf
reply to post by asmeone2
 


Yep. I have a terrier. I never taught her anything, yet she learnt just about every command you could think of including 'Go put your toys in the car'.


Haha. The funniest thing is how they have learned to manipulate us when they want to go out; they will start fighting until we throw them all outside.



posted on Dec, 3 2008 @ 11:07 PM
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reply to post by asmeone2
 


Until they work out the carpet is more comfortable to "go" on than cold wet (or icy) grass and concrete.



posted on Dec, 3 2008 @ 11:09 PM
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Originally posted by Good Wolf
reply to post by asmeone2
 


Until they work out the carpet is more comfortable to "go" on than cold wet (or icy) grass and concrete.


Ugh, don't remind me, one of them is old and incontinent, luckily i have a stone floor, at least.



posted on Dec, 3 2008 @ 11:13 PM
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reply to post by asmeone2
 


Mine don't have any excuse, they are just sneaky. It's difficult to punish a dog for a deed it did 20 minutes ago because they won't understand. Luckily if you catch them in the act once and are severe with them they seldom consider repeat offences.



posted on Dec, 3 2008 @ 11:19 PM
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Originally posted by Good Wolf
reply to post by asmeone2
 


Mine don't have any excuse, they are just sneaky. It's difficult to punish a dog for a deed it did 20 minutes ago because they won't understand. Luckily if you catch them in the act once and are severe with them they seldom consider repeat offences.


Yes, that is very true. He actually is housebroken, but he is about 12 years old now and has some medial issues so he really *can't* hold it.



posted on Dec, 3 2008 @ 11:25 PM
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reply to post by asmeone2
 


Allie, my terrier is 10, but for them 'old' isn't till about 15.


.......BUT back to birds and the topic, I was trying to get a crow fora pet for the exact reason brought up in this thread but they are pests in NZ and as such are not allowed to be kept as pets here. BAH humbug!

I think if I can get as a pet in New Caledonia then fly back I can have one as a pet but I'm not sure I'd be worth putting a single corw through 6 months of import quarantine.



posted on Dec, 3 2008 @ 11:28 PM
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reply to post by Good Wolf
 


I don't think so. I think the "Smartest" birds are those that have been hand-raised by their owners since they were very young, thus establishing a strong bond. So even if you got a young crow you would probably loose your most teachable moments to the quarentine.

I want to do some experiments with the ones here, and see if they will recognize and eventually approach me me if I leave food out.



posted on Dec, 3 2008 @ 11:42 PM
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reply to post by asmeone2
 


You should see if you can get them to speak at all. I know that crows imitate all sorts of sounds as a means to an end.



posted on Dec, 3 2008 @ 11:44 PM
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Originally posted by Good Wolf
reply to post by asmeone2
 


You should see if you can get them to speak at all. I know that crows imitate all sorts of sounds as a means to an end.


I would like to try that too but it may take more effort than I can really put into it.

I do notice, though, that the individual crows have distinctly diffrent "voices."



posted on Dec, 3 2008 @ 11:46 PM
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reply to post by asmeone2
 


It wouldn't surprise me if they had accents, too. I know they have their own family languages and community languages at the same time.



posted on Dec, 3 2008 @ 11:50 PM
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Originally posted by Good Wolf
reply to post by asmeone2
 


It wouldn't surprise me if they had accents, too. I know they have their own family languages and community languages at the same time.


Never thought of them having "Regional" accents but that makes sense in a way.

This group definitely seems ver close-knit. There are about 10 in all, I'd guess, and they usually flock around together.

It is difficult for me to tell them apart, since I rarely get a good look at them, but I would like to be able to match each bird to its voice one day.

They are kind of bullies, though. I think they have chased all the mockingbirds away and are working on the blue jays.



posted on Dec, 3 2008 @ 11:59 PM
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reply to post by asmeone2
 


When doing my own research, I remember reading that one thing that had been observed was that the less tough dominant crows would lie to the more dominant crows regarding the location of food. I thought that was pretty interesting. They have very complex social structures.



posted on Dec, 4 2008 @ 12:04 AM
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reply to post by Good Wolf
 


That is very interesting! I would love to see your source if you still have it, it definitely takes intellegence to lie.

I got a not-so-good video of the crows earlier this morning, it didn't show what I wanted to; there were 2 of them on top of the tree branch shaking the bird feeder and the ones below were eatng off of it.

I swear some of these guys have a 4 foot wing span. That would be huge, for a peT!


Well, I'm off to bed now.



posted on Dec, 4 2008 @ 12:19 AM
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reply to post by asmeone2
 


I'll see what I can did up, most of it was talking about their ability to come up with novel ideas to unfamiliar problems.



posted on Dec, 5 2008 @ 07:30 PM
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That video of the crows utilizing cars and street lights is pretty crazy. Makes sense that they would adapt to ever expanding cities and so on by finding new ways to get to food.



posted on Dec, 5 2008 @ 07:52 PM
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reply to post by XSilencedxdream
 


Crows are an animal that our expansion doesn't impose on because they are very adaptable, they are able to adapt to us as we change.



posted on Dec, 5 2008 @ 09:52 PM
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Originally posted by Good Wolf
reply to post by XSilencedxdream
 


Crows are an animal that our expansion doesn't impose on because they are very adaptable, they are able to adapt to us as we change.


Many species of birds have adapted, if not benefited, from human expansion.

Bird feeders.

Bird baths.

Duck ponds.

Parking-lot birds.

Birds of prey, especially, seem to benefit; they really like the high telephone polls and signs around my house as perches, (A hawk once took out one of my neighbor's chihuahuas!
) Like this falcon(warning: he's eating)and roads mean easy meals to vultures and crows and other carrion-eaters.

[edit on 5-12-2008 by asmeone2]



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