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God does not govern people.
Satan is not the only one who says man will become like gods knowing both good and evil. God repeats this exactly.
When you understand the truth
Jesus = God, as such Jesus is older than Satan.
To twice slay the slain,
By dint of the Brain,
Is but labour in vain,
Unproductive of gain,
And so I shall bid you 'Adieu'!
Originally posted by star in a jar
On other subject, I don't understand Satanists and their ideas that they are Gods and that they can do what they want? This idea does not hold water since if another satanist wanted what another satanist had, or wanted... Since they think they are Gods, they could do whatever they wanted...
Do you see where I am going with this?
If everybody was a satanist, Wars, kidnaps, murders, rapes, theft would EXPLODE.
Originally posted by The time lord
The devil has one last plan which is to destroy everything that God has created on Earth and in heaven, his plan in the end is to stop men going to Heaven where he was cast out of and t bring many Angels and many people to Hell with him.
So does it sound like order and chaos are one of the same? It is not actually, chaos is like earth and the universe with a computer virus where sin.com grew and grew and became worse with every generation that was to come.
Originally posted by ZenaV
Burdman is right. The fact is; Jesus has always been around as long as GOD as he IS GOD. They created Satan...blah blah blah blah blah
Originally posted by Lasheic
Is that so? Then it is in direct contradiction to the statements of the person I was responding to.
This is the problem with biblical debates. Adherents claim one truth, but everyone has their own distinct interpretation of it which is often so diametrically opposed that it even leads to violence and fighting. That is not the hallmark of truth. Truth is demonstrable. It is testable. It is the same across all peoples and all cultures. Gravity, is a truth. All people who live on a mass of sufficient size will experience it. There is no fighting or debate on the matter. (what causes it, however, that may be a different story - but that it exists, no) If God is truly omnipotent and omniscient, the creator of all things, then why is his truth not so obvious as even a simple celestial mechanic that he supposedly designed?
If the knowledge of Good and Evil was the exclusive purview of the Gods, and by eating of the fruit - mankind came to know good and evil - then Satan did not lie to Eve. They did become as gods, because they were given the knowledge of Good and Evil - which was a trait exclusive to Gods.
Further, I don't understand where you're coming from when you talk about the rules of getting into heaven. Without knowledge of good and evil, then one could not distinguish between the two - and would commit acts both good and evil with impunity and without regard to the effects of their actions. They'd be like other animals who do not have complex social structures and morals guiding their interactions.
If being "Good", a goal of the commandments, is to prime a person for entry into heaven - then how stacked is the game against mankind even before "the fall" if they cannot recognize good from evil? Of course, they could be automatically granted entrance into heaven - but then, that would be allowing a creature who cannot distinguish between good and evil into a VIP section which is only supposed to allow good. This proposition makes no logical sense.
Again, even those who make careers out of studying the scriptures of the various world religions cannot come to any sort of a consensus about what the "truth" is. The Truth is not elusive. It does not hide from those that seek it. It does not deceive. The truth simply is. I find it audacious how so many people can claim that so much of humanity is "lost to the truth" - yet we can decode the human genome, observe the radiation caste of the beginnings of the universe, and have a decent enough grasp on such wholly confusing subjects such as Quantum Mechanics to make predictions with alarming accuracy. This is especially ironic as, usually, it seems it's the least educated and least well informed of the public who hold the banner of "understanding the truth" which seems too complex a subject for even our best and brightest minds who have unlocked the secrets of the universe to comprehend. Again... all the while never actually coming to any sort of a clear or concise agreement on exactly what that truth is.
I could be wrong here, but I don't recall Jesus ever actually saying that he WAS God. He made reference to being one "with" god, in purpose, but only that he is subservient and obedient to God - and that anyone with sufficient faith can preform the same miracles as he. If God and Jesus truly are the same being - then does it make sense that, as Jesus was dying on the cross, he would ask "Father, why have you forsaken me?". Would he not have asked... "Why have I forsaken myself?"
IIRC, this was a major point of contention during the Counsel of Nicea when bringing together the different sects of Christianity under a single banner. Christ's divinity was not decided by celestial revelation, or by Christ himself, but was decided by committee and popular vote. What came out of the counsel, including the concept of a trinitarian god, was called the Orthodoxy and the foundation of the modern Christian faith.
Or perhaps I should let AronRa explain the concept of truth and why religion apparently seems to lack any of it.
1. A member of an ancient Jewish sect that emphasized strict interpretation and observance of the Mosaic law in both its oral and written form.
2. A hypocritically self-righteous person.
Originally posted by badmedia
reply to post by angel of lightangelo
I'm not really sure what part of Jesus = God you are not understanding here. I don't actually follow Jesus, I follow God. Jesus even says if you know Jesus, then you also know the father(god).
I really don't care which came first. Lets just deny ignorance here and make the true statement that you believe Satan was first, because Jesus is not god, and they believe Jesus came first because Jesus is god.
1Judge not, that ye be not judged.
2For with what judgment ye judge, ye shall be judged: and with what measure ye mete, it shall be measured to you again.
3And why beholdest thou the mote that is in thy brother's eye, but considerest not the beam that is in thine own eye?
4Or how wilt thou say to thy brother, Let me pull out the mote out of thine eye; and, behold, a beam is in thine own eye?
5Thou hypocrite, first cast out the beam out of thine own eye; and then shalt thou see clearly to cast out the mote out of thy brother's eye.
Originally posted by angel of lightangelo
You do not? Go talk to a jewish person for a minute and then get back to me.
Who are they? anyway? Only Christians believe Jesus and God are the same person. The problem is that not only Christians believe in the the same god from the old testament as them. So who are "they" and what makes Christians so arrogant as to believe that their severely altered story is the only right one?
Originally posted by angel of lightangelo
So every single person is going to have their own belief and come to their own conclusion and this entire thread is completely pointless. I do not know why I keep reading it.