The Risk of a Total Systemic Meltdown Is Now as High as Ever!!!

Originally posted by oconnection
reply to post by rufusdrak

 

Both my rifles and my .45 are registered, nothing illegal going on, thank you though lol.

[edit on 1-10-2008 by oconnection]

Well I'm actually from New York City and that's where some or most of my family is, I just happen to be staying at the moment in a more rural community in NJ so I may very well be amongst the city folk to go under first when the SHTF.

I am in NJ as well, and this will not be the place to be went ish hits the fan. Western PA or upstate NY is your best bet for immediate places to go. You won't want to be in any city, for obvious reasons. If society goes under, the area will suddenly seem much more crowded.

Dunwichwitch - your post resonates with me greatly. After this battle is played, both sides will need much healing and the ability to master forgiveness. I do truly believe that a world can exist without money as technology is so far advanced, that upon its release, the only existence we know of would disappear forever.

oconnection - if you are to have guns, I'd be weary that they are registered. If martial law was to be imposed, you can bet the registered guns would be the ones they'd go after first. Forget being legal anymore. Their version of legal is horrendous as they don't even come close themselves. Why should we? You're better of governing yourself under your own set of laws.

Nonetheless, the title of the thread is spot on. If you haven't begun preparing, you should do so now. To get to the new age the planet is heading towards, one must first survive the largest reformation in planteary history.

Originally posted by grimreaper797
I am in NJ as well, and this will not be the place to be went ish hits the fan. Western PA or upstate NY is your best bet for immediate places to go. You won't want to be in any city, for obvious reasons. If society goes under, the area will suddenly seem much more crowded.

Aye, the Adirondacks sound nice right about now, and aren't too far - relatively speaking.

Originally posted by oconnection
reply to post by dariousg

 

This is my ultimate concern. A student of history will tell you that most major wars were in fact fought over for economical reasons. For example the Revolutionary War was fought over because of very sort of thing. Many believe that the Civil War was also fought over for the very same reason.

So my concern that a major, very destructive war could be fought over this. Take away our freedoms, that's more or less allowed but take away our money and watch what happens.

I believe that's why the higher ups in office are so afraid currently and why they're deploying the 3rd brigade under Northcom.



[edit on 1-10-2008 by oconnection]

A student of history would be wrong. Wars are never fought for economic reasons; but economic reasons are usually used as an excuse for why wars are fought to hide the truth.

For example, the Revolutionary War was fought because Louis XVI wanted to get back his American properties from the British and the Civil War was fought because the English stole the King's son and occupied his house. My source is Huckleberry Finn; An American book which commerates these events. You should read it.

A major war is already being fought and those people who are "higher up" from your perspective are deploying troops under Northcom because a major war is about to end; either the enemy will peacefully surrender or be wiped out with extreme predjudice.

As far as your freedoms and money, you are not even a consideration in any of this. Just stay out of the way!

Yes Canada will weather this storm a little better than our friends to the South. Our Banking system is fundamentally more secure as we have better oversight and our banks did not have all their money invested in ludicrously risky ventures. Sure some took some big hits due to the sub-prime fiasco. Federally we've posted surpluses for the last decade and our government is more fiscally responsible because they know we the people want it that way. We can weather any storm because we have the Credit to back it up with resources up the wazoo.

Listen to Ron Paul. He is a smart man and is the only one who knows how to get you out of this trouble. What the government is feeding you is all lies. If 700 Billion is approved and given to the FED they are going to turn around and lend out another 6.3 Trillion($1 dep - $10 loan). The FED's only guarantee on that loan is you the American Taxpayers because it's you that backs the FED. So essentially 700 Billion is going to become 7 Trillion and when that happens say hello to hyper-inflation. I'll be buying rolls of US dollar bills to wipe my ass because that'll be about all your dollar will be worth once this is over.

There's too much bad debt in the market, plain and simple. A real Free-Market system unlike the fascist system rearing it's head right now would get rid of that bad debt thus correcting the system for the better. Investors would no longer invest in companies that took excessive risks and losses and the bad companies would be weeded out paving the way for new companies to come in. All this bailout does is tell Wall Street that "Hey don't worry about operating under basic business models and sound accounting practices, just rape, pillage and steal as much as you can. When you go boobs up will just bail you out. Don't worry it's only the taxpayers money and the future of the country. But hey, who cares right?"

Important decision you have in the US. Take the pain now, don't bail out these companies no matter what they tell you. They're trying to blackmail you into this deal telling you the world will end if this doesn't go through. The pain of not bailing them out will be severe and hurt most Americans financially. However once things are corrected it will get better. The pain will be over much quicker than with the bailout. The bailout is only preventing the inevitable. Major Economic Correction.

reply to post by DEEZNUTZ


Here here!

Yes, they do have a heck of a decision to make, and I don't think all of them quite realize the severity of the options they have on hand.

Turns out their representatives just went ahead and voted their own version through anyhow... just shows you how well (or not so well) they represent their people really.

Bailing out the financial institutions now just postpones the market failures, in the end, causing them to be worse, not only because the investors have time to get their fingers ready on the proverbial sell button... but also because the economy has to bare the brunt of the added cost of the bailout, plus their own economic failures.

If the financial institutions were allowed to collapse, then that's the hard part over with, and the economy can get back to building itself back up again.

Make no mistake about it...
They're taking out a loan... giving that money to a bunch of incompetent people who can't pay it back themselves...
... and YOU the taxpayer are their guarantor.
The loan has been made out in your name, but you don't get a penny of it... all you get is the privilege of paying it off for them.

Does the average American have $3,500 spare dollars laying around to give out to incompetent companies? That's the way I look at it.


You are also correct that the Canadian financial system is much more secure than the American one. Our systems operate differently from one another... the causes of the american failures can't occur here... of course, there are ways our economy can fail that the american economy can't aswell... but we haven't hit those problems.


So essentially, we just have to deal with a reduction in sales, while our clients scrounge up the money to start buying from us again.

Some companies will fall, some will benefit from their falling... it's your standard shakeup.

Kind of makes you realize why Bush was so keen on pushing the NAU/SPP through... he wanted us to shoulder their debt for them.
Good thing that didn't go through!
I was at that protest... kind of gives me a bit of pride.

reply to post by johnsky


The whole problem with this problem is people(All people) not just the corporate types got themselves in over their heads. The whole mortgage crisis is due to predatory lending but the people that got themselves into mortgages that they couldn't afford are also to blame. I'm a transit driver here in Vancouver and make an above average wage but I'm also smart enough to know that I can't afford a house in this market as much as I would like to buy one I won't because I can't afford it. Yes these lenders were telling them that they could make it work but these people need to take responsibility. If you work at Wal-Mart on the floor or something. Guess what you can't afford a house. If you got a mortgage that you can't afford that's your problem. Why should the rest of the taxpayers pay for your mistake. It's the same with Wall St. They threw sound accounting and business practices out the window got themselves in a pinch and want you to pay for it.

Me personally I would tell them where they could shove that 451 pages of useless paper.


My American neighbors, PLEASE don't let them bully you into this action. It's not going to work. It will only delay the inevitable and the consequences will be much worse. Take a moderately painful hit now or pass this bill and see your economy wiped out. Then the rest of the world really will own the US, your dollar won't be worth crap and foreigners will own your country outright.

And yes the NAU will never get support in Canada. It's your mess and Canadians don't want to take on debt that's not theirs. We're making strides economically and ours is probably one of the most stable in the world right now.

I think today/tomorrow (Friday) will see the 10,000 barrier for the last time for a while. 9000's early next week unless a MIRACLE happens, bailout or no bailout.

I wonder what percentage of the public realizes that this 700 billion + 488 billion (military spending) package is already doing more damage as the troubled system looks at its options and sees the huge wall of debt coming at them. There's not a chance in frozen hell that those assets the gov buys will be worth anything by the time they sell. It's going to be years and they don't have the manpower to maintain the properties. You can bet, however, that they will be "harvested" for their copper pipes and fixtures. This money is TOILET MATTER.

Really, I just don't understand the logic.

Might be a good time to buy shares in whoever supplies the equipment that prints the money. I'm guessing pitney bowes or ibm.



[edit on 3-10-2008 by Atlantican]

Originally posted by Atlantican
There's not a chance in frozen hell that those assets the gov buys will be worth anything by the time they sell. It's going to be years and they don't have the manpower to maintain the properties. You can bet, however, that they will be "harvested" for their copper pipes and fixtures.

Really they would be better to burn them all down.

[edit on 3-10-2008 by In nothing we trust]

Now THIS is juicy! From New York times:


Bank Limits Fund Access by Colleges, Inciting Fears

www.nytimes.com...

Excerpt:

On Monday, Wachovia announced that it would resign its role as trustee of the fund, and would limit access to the fund to 10 percent of each college’s account value. On Tuesday, Commonfund said that by selling some government bonds and other assets held in the fund, it had succeeded in raising its liquidity to 26 percent.

Still, Wachovia’s announcement sent shock waves through higher education, sending hundreds of college presidents rushing to check their financial vulnerability on every front.

Ugh.. I'm screwed. I'm on Oahu until Feb 09. Small island, LOTS of people, no fresh water, no room for crops (unless 3/4 of the population goes bye-bye) all food is imported... you get the idea.

Let's try to hold this thing off until after Feb, alright?!?

A sinking stock market is not necessarily bad. People have been taught this and parrot it as if it should not happen. and what's up with the canadian talking about wiping his ass with US dollars?This is the twilight zone.

Only part of the system is melting down. jeez, I guess noone has a stomach for war and can't stand to see the suffering of people who sorely deserve to suffer. If the last two weeks have brought this, you are really gonna mess your pants once it becomes clear what is really happening.

Originally posted by oconnection


The rich are currently buying up all the available gold so If you have any saved I'd hang onto it being that it has tangible value.

"Investors in gold are demanding “unprecedented” amounts of bullion bars and coins and moving them into their own vaults as fears about the health of the global financial system deepen. ...'

RE: UBS (AG)- a Zurich based bank

UBS said it will exit commodities, but not precious metals,
UBS will scale back Real Estate and Securitization as well as proprietary trading.

this e-mail announcement from UBS Chairman Peter Kurer
regarding the UBS Investment Banking Unit.


so one of the worlds remaining, well-heeled Investment Banks, will keep trading the precious metals but drop trading in the broader 'commodities' sector. So, even with the recent kinda severe drop in Gold & PM, what do they (the Investment Bank CEO & Directors) know, that we can only guess at?

reply to post by bruxfain


I used that reference only to illustrate as stated in my previous posts that this deal will destroy the dollar. A BBC economist used the example that if this goes through a roll of toilet paper will be worth more than a roll of dollar bills.

Another ATS'er used this quote and I forgot how awesome Bob Marley's words are. This should be taken to heart by all.

"Emancipate yourself from mental slavery...none but ourselves can free up our minds" Bob Marley- Redemption Song

Deez

[edit on 3-10-2008 by DEEZNUTZ]

Originally posted by grimreaper797
History has shown the opposite to be true. Anyone that believes that people will do anything but hand over their rights to government, in exchange for their wellbeing, is foolish.

The most monsterous of leaders came into power when the people were weak with desperation and poverty. Central Governments take root when the people are too poor to survive on their own.

Should our economy, and then our country, fail as a result of this crisis, what will come out of the ashes will not be pretty. History has shown us that good only comes when we aspire to something higher, not when we cling to survival.

Dude star 4 U imagine Hitler with 50 thousand nuclear warheads and the most frightening array of biologic weaponry ever known to human kind.

Get ready folks it's gonna get real ugly real fast!

You can bet your back side that this will usher in a new monetary system. One that is apart of a "world economy". This crisis is completely manufactured and it was designed to do just that. Of course what do I know...I'm just some conspiracy nut job, tin foil hat wearing moron.

If it comes down to a revolution in the US(which I highly doubt). Canadians will back up the American people. Maybe not our military, but our people are pretty well armed too and when it comes down to it, your our brothers & sisters to the south and we love you all.