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The Case for Diesel

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posted on Sep, 29 2008 @ 03:46 AM

Yes I know there are far more people driving Cars, Vans, SUVs’s , Pick ups, 4X4’s etc with petrol ( gasoline) powered engines than there are driving similar vehicles running Diesel engines, But hang on a moment is that a good thing for us claiming to be switched on survivalists?

Some points I think need chewing over by the preparedness communities especially those with retreats, homesteads, secure homes and bug out plans.

If (or more likely when) TSHTF and fuel availability & storage becomes a major issue what will society in general start doing?

Lets accept that most of us already keep our vehicles topped off most of the time and also keep a few gallons of fuel stored for “The Day” but nearly all of us must admit that overall we have not got enough fuel cached to get by with.

Question?, What are the general public going to do as soon as finding fuel supplies become difficult ?

Answer Yes they are going to form huge queues at almost every petrol (gas) station they can, the rest of this tale you already know, huge queues, long waits, rationing, violence, riots, people getting killed for a gallon of fuel, the public will go berserk in next to no time at all.

(This scenario came 100% spot on accurate during the 2005 hurricane season in the US)

So what are the big boys and the prepared people doing?

What do the Railways (Railroads) Truckers Maritime trade boats use as fuel? What do Farmers choose as fuel for their tractors, ploughs, etc? What do the military choose to power their vehicles?

Diesel, Yes Diesel, This fuel is found almost everywhere a survivalist would choose to look. Its safer to handle and store than petrol, its got a better shelf life untreated than petrol and its used to power most of our commerce.

So whilst Joe Q public is waiting in the ever growing queues for his ration of petrol, or burning his house down after poorly stored petrol fumes ignited in his garage, the switched on survivalist will have not only more safely stored fuel, but be using the same fuel he will need to run his tractor at his retreat or homestead. He will be able to cache diesel far easier than gasoline, he can ‘OBTAIN’ more from truck depots, rail refueling points, farm supply points, boat yards, truck stops etc. All places that offer nothing to the general public will be good places for survivalists to visit.

Next time you are out and about have a look around and try to identify places you could ‘Source’ petrol (gas) and diesel. Petrol in general is only available at fuel stations and in other petrol powered vehicles (cars, lawn mowers and jet skis?).It’s only found in fairly small quantities as well. If you are lucky you will be able to fill your vehicle and a few jerry cans from a retail source before government restrictions or shortages become an issue.
But look at places you can find diesel in an emergency and in what quantities? Trucks alone have tanks that carry many hundreds of gallons of diesel, truck stops hold huge amounts in comparison to petrol stations. Look at you local railroad locomotive, even the smallest carry 1500 gallons of diesel whilst the mainline locos can carry as much as 6000 gallons.

Coastal vessels have fuel bunkers of around 500 gallons whilst deep water vessels carry many thousands of gallons, Consider those facts plus the places the trucks, locos and boats refuel at? , buying, storing, caching, scrounging, stealing, and finding you name it diesel has a huge advantage over petrol (gasoline) powered vehicles.

Also in recent years modern diesel engines have advanced technologically, to a point that the power issues that traditionally separated diesel vehicles from petrol (gas) powered vehicles has been eroded. So that unless you are into sports cars a turbo diesel can and will match your gasoline powered car in everything except the 0-60 MPH stakes, plus modern diesels are still more economical than petrol engines.

Then of course when it comes to the reliability and vulnerability aspects of comparing the two types of engine diesel wins hands down.

I am also advised that certain types of heating oil can be used to run a diesel engine. Certainly after the lessons learned from Hurricane Katrina you need to carry enough fuel to travel 3x the distance to your retreat, this allows for diversions and long periods of slow driving in heavy traffic.

So in closing If you have a rural retreat or bug out plans and you believe that sourcing fuel is going to be a major issue common sense directs you to choose the good old compression ignition engine.

posted on Sep, 29 2008 @ 06:15 AM
Star/Flagged. This is something everyone should know and consider for the long run.
The only downside to diesel is the price per unit, In the US its considerably more than the highest grade gas.

posted on Sep, 29 2008 @ 06:30 AM
The early 80's debacle of chevy's diesel crossovers are still fresh in peoples minds. The x engine. Designed for gas and retrofitted for deisel. It was a huge failure.

I had one. Inherited from my father who worked at the brookpark chevy plant for 28 years.

It was loud, it was smelly. And you had to 'wait' for the glowplugs to heat up to turn it over. And was such a beautiful car. On the outside.

Todays turbodiesels are 30 percent cleaner than gasers. Ford will only sell its 65 mpg diesel focus to Europe.

A joke in and of itself.

posted on Sep, 29 2008 @ 06:50 AM

Originally posted by jpm1602
The early 80's debacle of chevy's diesel crossovers are still fresh in peoples minds. The x engine. Designed for gas and retrofitted for deisel. It was a huge failure.

I had one. Inherited from my father who worked at the brookpark chevy plant for 28 years.

It was loud, it was smelly. And you had to 'wait' for the glowplugs to heat up to turn it over. And was such a beautiful car. On the outside.

Todays turbodiesels are 30 percent cleaner than gasers. Ford will only sell its 65 mpg diesel focus to Europe.

A joke in and of itself.

I must admit to little knowledge of diesel vehicle availability in the US of A, I know Mercedes sell the Sprinter Van under the Dodge Badge, but I dont know if its diesel or gasoline powered, In the UK JEEP sell one or two of their products with a good turbo diesel but again I dont know if its available for the US. Its crazy in my mind because diesel dominates the trucking industry in the US of A, the Mexicans and canuc embrace diesel, it appears its the American civilian population who are limited to gas powered vehicles.

What does that lovely vehicle the Ford Econoline van use for an engine, its looks like a great candidate for conversion into a BOV, BTW American folks if you are rich have a look at the site

[edit on 29-9-2008 by Northern Raider]

posted on Sep, 29 2008 @ 07:04 AM
i believe that the issue selling diesel powered cars in the states has something to do with the US particle emission regulations. it costs more than people are willing to spend to make the particle emissions low enough to pass US guidelines.

basically, the american government want you driving gasoline powered cars.

just so you know, a diesel engine is a multifuel engine, almost any hydro-carbon will run it. you can even use the oil left in the fryers at mcdonalds if you get really stuck.

posted on Sep, 29 2008 @ 11:50 AM
In a true survival case, my father suggests distillation of rotting debris to make your own alcohol for running your vehicle. In fact it runs clean, and can easily made from all kinds of decaying material. He went on to talk about Gordon Campbell dismantling the ministry of forestry and handing out the powers to the logging companies that were going bankrupt, and how the entire thing needed to be back in government hands, with the very plants making pulp turned into alternate fuel, with reforestation being a prime concern as well cleansing the debris and rotting material that make up a large amount of cO2 in our atmosphere. That the entire thing could be managed very well, but not in the hands of the wolves.
Need to learn how to do the mod on a vehicle in case of an emergency.

posted on Sep, 29 2008 @ 01:39 PM
I truly don't believe that is correct pieman. With the advances in turbo diesels they are in fact 30 percent cleaner then gas engines. Which would put it in ulev status, ultra low emission vehicle.

At least that is what I read.

My brother bought a high end vw last year. Turbo diesel. He gets 39 in the city with it and he has a lead foot.

[edit on 9/29/2008 by jpm1602]

posted on Sep, 29 2008 @ 06:25 PM
Audi won Le Mans some years back.

They put a highly modified Diesel engine the year after that and they won again.

and diesel smells better

posted on Sep, 29 2008 @ 10:43 PM
Diesel cost more but you get more MPG.
In most cases in a sitX you could run a diesel with crankcases draining's, transmission fluid, veg oils, turpentine,
Plus there are many plant oils where the plants are easy to grow and process.
it take a lot less to use alternative diesel fuels then to try to distill ethanol and there are a lot more out there.

There is even a fish in the southeast US that could be processed for fish oil and run.

Two cajuns in Louisiana run boats with nets on the front and process the fish for fish meal for gardens and fish oil that they run there diesel boats with.

In a SitX there will be a lot of diesel in underground tank that someone with the knowledge of how to get it out will be able to use.

posted on Sep, 29 2008 @ 10:56 PM
I used to be a facility manager for a local dialysis center. We had a buried 1500 gallon diesel tank that was on the checklist to maintain. Tied to our emergency generator.

I was talking to one of the filling guys one day and asked him how long diesel could store before going bad. He told me that although it may get a bit algaed over time, it is basically good for perpuity.

posted on Sep, 30 2008 @ 07:43 AM
There are many tanks like that behind dentist and doctors offices.
also in a SitX the small diesel generator can be useful.
The phone company also has these at there main (COs)and remote switch buildings.(ROs)and microwave sites.

The trick is getting the fuel out of a underground tank.

The best way i have found is to displace it with another liquid.

I worked as a generator mechanic for the phone company for a while.

Also there are some beautiful battery and inverter systems at phone company buildings. they run the phones till the generator warm-up and come on line.

posted on Sep, 30 2008 @ 07:57 AM
People, it's all good and well, but diesel is not nearly as radically survivalist as the wood gas (a form of syngas). You can use wood, for gossake, to run your car. As long as you can find a shrub on the curb, you are in business. Can't beat that!

posted on Sep, 30 2008 @ 08:07 AM
I'd avoid modern turbo/injected diesel engines for a many complex parts to go wrong and may be prone to problems if you use other oil-based fuels as an emergency backup

posted on Sep, 30 2008 @ 11:16 AM
reply to post by buddhasystem

I always dreamed about building one like that!!

G... I wish I had the knowledge to really build myself one!


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