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FEMA Firefighters Guide ( The UFO Chapter )

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posted on Mar, 23 2004 @ 12:56 PM
I was watching the history channel on UFO?s and they pointed out that FEMA (Federal Emergency Management Agency) had guidelines for a UFO disaster in a US city. It seems like they know more than they let on. It?s the only government document known that seems to consider UFO?s a very real threat.

The following is a excerpt from the official FEMA Manual (Chapter 13).

FEMA?s Firefighter?s Guide Chapter 13


"Near approaches of UFOs can be harmful to human beings. Do not stand under a UFO that is hovering at low altitude. Do not touch or attempt to touch a UFO that has landed. In either case the safe thing to do is to get away from there very quickly and let the military take over. There is a possibility of radiation danger and there are known cases where persons have been burned by rays emanating from UFOs. Don't take chances with UFOs!" In view of the federal law (cited earlier) empowering NASA's administrator to impound, without a hearing, anyone who touches a UFO or its occupants.?


?The two principal hazards noted with relation to UFOs have been attributed to powerful electrical fields which they can project in a general or localized area and the psychological effects they have produced on the general populace or individual contacts.?

?Besides the possible physical effects of approaching a UFO, e.g.. burns, radiation, etc., there may be psychological effects produced by force fields that could induce a hypnotic state in the viewer, loss of consciousness, memory relapse, and submission to the occupants. In a less optimistic scenario, you may have engine trouble upon approaching the scene, and radio contact could be lost with your dispatcher.?


?Some fire chiefs have little confidence in disaster plans, especially those dealing with UFOs or enemy attack. If you develop a plan that sets forth your responsibilities, resources, organizations, supplies information, telephone numbers, and special data that will be useful in obtaining help and fulfilling your role in disaster control, commit it to an electronic medium, a computer with a capability for continuous updating through modern word processing. Bring it forth when the need requires. With a good plan, good leadership, and adequate resources, you may save many lives in any disaster, including attack from possible enemies.?

NOTE: Weird, after my initial search on Google for this information, every subsequent search for ?FEMA?s Firefighter?s Guide chapter 13? I lost my internet connection and had to reset my cable modem and router. Maybe I just being paranoid and this is just a coincidence but I have a hard time believing in coincidences.

[Edited on 23-3-2004 by kinglizard]

[edit on 1-24-2005 by William One Sac]

posted on Mar, 23 2004 @ 01:14 PM
interesting round-up on ufo's in general.

posted on Mar, 23 2004 @ 01:18 PM
you bet its suspicious....i saw it too

any way .....pre war nazi germany ....the germans had a outpost some where in bavaria where peoples cars would suddenly stall....a german officer would show up and inform the people in the car ...that if they waited a short while later there car would be able to start.
now i know some people have laughed at a nazi/alien connection but if you look at some mysterious coincidences there are some glaring points to be made that there was a link......especially if the greys find sustenance in negative emotions...the holocaust and the war was a feast for them.....this also fits in with malefic 4th dimension entities setting up theese scenarios like wars,,,David Icke's books look better every day

[Edited on 23-3-2004 by watcheroftheskies]

posted on Mar, 23 2004 @ 01:21 PM
I am a firefighter and have been for a long time. I have never seen nor heard of this.

posted on Mar, 23 2004 @ 01:26 PM

Originally posted by godservant
I am a firefighter and have been for a long time. I have never seen nor heard of this.

IIRC, it is titled "FEMA: The Fire Officer's guide to disaster management"
(someone correct me if I am wrong)
It is in the 2nd editon of the book. I believe it was released in 1993.

It supposedly was written as a "hypothetical."
But the mystery remains.... Why was it in there in the first place?

[Edited on 23-3-2004 by Facefirst]

posted on Mar, 23 2004 @ 01:28 PM
the whole text is as follows...taking bits and pieces out of context only gives you an inaccurate picture of what the author is truly saying....


The following excerpt appeared in Fire Officer's Guide to
Disaster Control by William M. Kramer and Charles W. Bahme. It
is copyright (c) 1992 by Fire Engineering Books & Videos.


FEW RESIDENTS of the United States, except for those in Hawaii,
have experienced an enemy attack on their hometown in this
century; some think they have. The Great Los Angeles Air Raid of
February 26, 1942, began at 2:25 A.M. when the U.S. Army
announced the approach of hostile aircraft and the cities air
raid warning system went into effect for the first time in World
War II. "Suddenly the night was rent by sirens. Searchlights
began to sweep the sky. Minutes later gun crews at Army forts
along the coast line began pumping the first of 1,433 rounds of
ack-ack into the moonlight. Thousands of volunteer air raid
wardens tumbled from their beds and grabbed their boots and
helmets. Citizens awakened to the screech of sirens and,
heedless of the blackout warning, began snapping on their lights
. . . The din continued for two hours. Finally the guns fell
silent. The enemy, evidently, had been routed. Los Angeles began
to taste the exhilaration of its first military victory. "(1)



In this chapter we will now turn our attention to the very real
threat posed by Unidentified Flying Objects (UFOs), whether they
exist or not. The well-documented and highly publicized War of
the Worlds radio drama by Orson Welles shows how even a
perceived existence to alien creatures can cause very real
disaster-like conditions and panic among a given populace. In
addition, if the apparent visits by alien beings and their space
vehicles should pose any type of threat, it will, as always, be
the fire service that is called upon to provide the first line
of life-saving defense and disaster mitigation .

On April 25,1991, radio station KSHE in St. Louis, Missouri. was
fined $25,000 by the Federal Communications Commission for
broadcasting a mock warning of a nuclear attack during the
Persian Gulf War. The seriousness with which the FCC treated
this case is indicative of the very real panic that can be
created from even illusionary or fictional phenomena. Certainly
if these unexplainable events become more prevalent, the
possibility of panic could be even greater; and again, the fire
department will be the agency called upon to handle the
situation.(35) Hence, as we near the year 2000 and move beyond,
any comprehensive disaster plan should address the potential for
panic and other deleterious effects that might befall a
populated area when unexplainable phenomena occur. We will see,
as we continue our discussion in this chapter, that widespread
blackouts, communication disruptions, and other potentially
disastrous conditions have been linked directly to UFO
sightings. Hence, fire service leaders who want to ensure that
their disaster planning is complete will not neglect an appendix
to outline those things that could be done in preparation for
the occurrence of such phenomena.

Throughout this book, many of the references to actual events
are based on the experiences of both of the authors. However, in
this area of UFOs and their potential, we are relying largely on
the research and experiences of Charles Bahme. Chuck has made a
considerable study of this subject and is acquiring many
publications and VCR tapes to augment his library on this and
related phenomena. His interest in UFOs was greatly heightened
when Congress in 1969 adopted a law (14 CFR Ch. V Part 1211--
Extraterrestrial Exposure) which gave the NASA Administrator the
arbitrary discretion to quarantine under armed guard any object,
person, or other form of life which has been extraterrestrially
exposed. The very fact that our congressmen believed there was a
necessity for such drastic authority made Chuck wonder if they
had only our astronauts in mind when they adopted it. Could it
be applied to anyone who has had a UFO encounter? Whether it has
or not is not likely to be a topic for public dissemination.

UFO Discussion--Why Now?

The subject of UFOs (Unidentified Flying Objects) was not
included in previous editions of this book. The first edition
was the Handbook of Disaster Control which Chuck personally
published in 1952 following his release from active naval duty
in the Korean War. Although his services in the conflict as
Security Coordinator for the Chief of Naval Operations involved
the creation of a worldwide disaster control organization for
the protection of the physical properties of the Navy, it must
be admitted that the directives approved for this new
organization did not reflect any significant concern for a
flying saucer threat to its shore establishment. That was in the
1950s. Now that we are in the 1990s it is doubtful that the UFO
potential would be brushed off so lightly by our military
security forces. This change of attitude was evidenced as far
back as December 24, 1959, when the Inspector General of the Air
Force issued the following Operations and Training Order:
"Unidentified Flying Objects--sometimes treated lightly by the
press and referred to as 'Flying Saucers'--must be rapidly and
accurately identified as serious Air Force business...."(36)

There is no uncertainty about the reality of the war between
nations on our planet and the disastrous effects of military
actions. The 200 sorties flown every hour against Iraq in the
Persian Gulf provided ample evidence of global war's destructive
power. On the other hand, there are many persons who may believe
that a discussion of the theoretical harm that could be caused
by a real or imaginary invasion of UFOs would be 'far out!" But
this is not so for the thousands of witnesses of unexplained
aerial phenomena. To them it is also serious business.

Chuck's interest in UFOs commenced during the early morning
hours of August 26,1942, while he was roller skating from his
house to the nearest fire station a few blocks away; the wail of
sirens had signaled his recall to fire duty, and with the
stringent blackout orders in effect. driving was not wise;
besides, it was much more exciting to be out in the open where
he could see the spectacular aerial "fireworks" that filled the
heavens all around him. Few residents of the U.S. had ever
experienced a real or imaginary invasion of UFOs like that which
occurred in what has become known as "The Los Angeles Air Raid
of 1942." The Army announced the approach of hostile aircraft
and the city's air raid warning system went into effect for the
first time in World War II. The defense to this "attack" is
described in dramatic terms in the opening paragraph of this

But what enemy had been routed? No one ever knew. All the fire
fighters saw in the sky were the 15 or 20 moving "things" which
seemed to change course at great speed apparently unaffected by
the flak from bursting shells all around them. Rumors that one
had been shot down were never verified, nor was the explanation
that these zig-zagging invaders were weather balloons ever taken
seriously. In any event, for Chuck, that unforgettable episode
aroused a continuing interest in UFOs, rivalling his
professional fields of law and fire protection. The fact that he
subsequently was a member of a group whose sighting of a flight
of UFOs was authenticated by airport radar helped to sustain
that interest.

UFO Background Information

With no intention of trying to prove or disprove the
authenticity of the numerous UFO encounters often related by
very credible witnesses including airline and military pilots,
astronauts, police officers, fire fighters, members of Congress,
and even a U.S. President, the balance of this chapter will
present a brief history and nature of UFOs and their alleged
occupants; their widespread sightings over the globe since
ancient times; their appearance, propulsion origin, and possible
motives for continuing reconnaissance.

A quick look at some of the classic accounts of encounters
documented in numerous foreign and U.S. publications might help
us judge the magnitude of their threat, if any, to social
stability, and, if deemed desirable, propose a fire service plan
for coping with some of the conceivable catastrophic effects
that UFOs could produce on cities and densely populated areas.

For readers who already have made up their minds that there is
no such thing as a UFO notwithstanding the overwhelming evidence
to the contrary, it should be pointed out that there is
circumstantial evidence that disastrous effects have already
been attributed to UFO activity in more than one nation,
including the United States.

UFOs--What Are They?

William Shakespeare put a fitting observation in the mouth of
Hamlet, the Prince of Denmark, that went like this: "There are
more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, than are dreamed of in
your philosophy." Whether Hamlet was referring to those strange
lights or objects that appear in the sky or near the ground and
have no known cause, we will never know, but the World Book
Encyclopedia defines such things as UFOs.(37)

Several theories have been propounded as to what they might be.
Some scientists believe that they are of extraterrestrial
origin--coming from other planets. Military officers conjecture
that they might be alien aircraft. Some attribute them all to
natural causes, such as meteors, comets, sun dogs, light
reflections, marsh gas, ball lightning, even though they must
admit that scientists cannot explain all UFO reports in that
manner. Still others are inclined to believe that they may be
forms from other dimensions which can materialize and
dematerialize at will perhaps by making a wavelength or
frequency transition so as to become invisible to humans. Some
believe they are time travelers from the future.

UFO Classification System

Dr. J. Allen Hynek, Northern University Professor Emeritus of
Astronomy and an advisor to the Air Force's Blue Book Project.
adopted a very simple classification system based solely upon
the manner of observation:

1. Nocturnal lights
2. Daylight disks
3. Close encounters (day or night)
4. Radar readings.
He concluded that this system tells us nothing about the nature
of the UFOs, but can suggest a means for gathering data.(38) He
found that while a large number of such reports were readily
identifiable by trained investigators as misconceptions of known
objects or events, a small residue (about 1.000) were not. These
came from credible witnesses from such widely separated places
as Canada. Australia. South America, and Antarctica. He
concludes with: "Although I know of no hypothesis that
adequately covers the mountainous evidence, this should not and
must not deter us from following the advice of Schroedinger: to
be curious, capable of being astonished, and eager to find
out."(39) Dr. Hynek has an excellent, well-illustrated article
on UFOs in a 1982 book which gives a detailed history of the UFO
sightings, together with the reports of some well-known people
who made them, including President Jimmy Carter while governor
of Georgia.(40)

Shapes of UFOs

Witnesses have described the shapes of UFOs as anything varying
from a sphere to a boomerang. Some have resembled flying saucers
with a lid; others a glowing tube; some as semi-spherical with
colored apertures; some with reddish-orange glows, or fire-like
or sparking discharges. Incredible speed and maneuverabilities
not attainable by aircraft of any kind are commonly observed.
Many of the books and articles in Appendix H have excellent
photographs of these unexplained visitors--photos that have been
checked by experts for their authenticity.

History of UFOs

For hundreds of years mysterious objects in the sky and strange
moving lights have been reported by many people, including the
military pilots in World War II who called them foo fighters,
("Where there's Foo, there's Fire"). In the middle of the 1900s
flying saucers were increasingly observed in the United States
and other countries. Scientists at the University of Colorado
hired by the Air Force from 1966 to 1968 to study this type of
aerial phenomena could explain most of the UFO reports as a star
(Venus), meteor, planet, balloon, rocket, artificial satellite,
etc. Sometimes atmospheric conditions, aircraft exhaust trails,
or unusual lighting conditions may produce optical illusions
that observers thought were UFOs. After investigating more than
12,000 reports, the U.S. Air Force was unable to explain where
the unexplained UFOs come from, but apparently concluded that
the national security was not threatened by them.(41) The
emphasis of the university's team, headed by Edward U. Condon,
seemed to be more concerned with the establishment of the
emotional stability or instability of those who reported the
sightings than with other evidence.

Psychiatrists have examined the witnesses who claimed to have
encountered UFOs and even been taken aboard their craft, such as
the two shipyard workers in Mississippi, and found that they are
not unbalanced people.(42) "They're not crackpots. There was
definitely something here that was not terrestrial."(43) Dr. J.
Allen Hynek agreed, and added. "Where they are coming from and
why they are here is a matter of conjecture. but the fact that
they were here on this planet is beyond a reasonable doubt."(44)

The Air Force. after 20 years of being deluged with UFO
sightings and spending millions of dollars on their
investigation, decided to drop the inquiry business and turned
the project over to a Kensington, Maryland, group called NICAP
(National Investigation Committee on Aerial Phenomena). This
left NASA (National Aeronautics and Space Administration) with
part of the task of trying to run UFO sighting reports,
including many by its own Apollo and Skylab astronauts. By 1974
over a score of astronauts saw and photographed UFOs during
their flights beyond the earth's atmosphere.

Early in the Apollo 11 mission, which culminated in the moon
walk, astronauts Neil Armstrong, Edwin Aldrin, and Michael
Collins reported sightings of what seemed to be a UFO during the
first half of their flight to the lunar surface. There were many
more sightings by U.S. and Soviet Astronauts. On November
11,1966, Gemini XII astronauts Jim Lovell and Edwin Aldrin said
that they saw four UFOs linked together, and on October 12,
1964, three Russian astronauts aboard Voskod reported that they
were surrounded by a "formation of fast-moving disc-shaped

UFO Organizations

In addition to NICAP, some of the other organizations that
study UFO phenomena are MUFON (Mutual UFO Networks), CAUS
(Citizens Against UFO Secrecy), GSW (Ground Saucer Watch), CUFOS
(the Center for UFO Studies), and APRO (Aerial Phenomena
Research Organization), an Arizona nonprofit scientific and
educational organization, founded in 1952.(46)

Why the Secrecy?

In their book UFOs Over America, authors Jim and Carol Lorenzo
charge that the CIA (Central Intelligence Agency) has been
closely involved in the collection and suppression of UFO
information. "Witnesses to the phenomena have been bribed,
coerced, and threatened by the CIA, who wanted valuable evidence
given to them alone."(47) One reason given is that military
intelligence may view the UFOs as a tool of either a known or
unknown potential enemy. "If these vehicles prove evasive and
surreptitious, all the more reason to suspect them.... the
probability looms large that the minds behind these vehicles may
well be gathering intelligence of their own."(48)

Another reason for secrecy may lie in the hope of obtaining
knowledge relating to advanced propulsion methods and anti-
gravity systems before other potential enemies on earth may
acquire it. Hence, though many nations are secretly
investigating UFOs, they are reluctant to share their findings.
Robert Lofton, in his book Identified Flying Saucers, claims
that the Air Force became the "goat" in the effort of the CIA to
debunk many sightings by pilots, radar technicians. and reliable
civilian observers. He thinks that the suppression of
information about how dangerous UFOs can be is wrong. After
citing a case where a child was burned over 50 to 60 percent of
her body by a low flying UFO and then taken to an Air Force
hospital, no one would explain why her clothes were not burned
at the same time. He also describes another burn case in New
Mexico and another man who recently received a sledge-hammer
like blow that knocked him unconscious by the force field of a
100-foot diameter UFO. "The public ought to be told the danger!
. . . Nothing helps rumors and panic more than ignorance."(49)

Major Donald Keyhoe describes in his book Aliens from Space,
The Real Story of Unidentified Flying Objects the difficulties
he had in 1957 in trying to get the truth from government
agencies after he was director of NICAP, the world's largest UFO
research organization with over 30 subcommittees in the U.S. and

According to some UFOlogists the attempts at cover-up by the
CIA extend to destruction of evidence that it could not
confiscate. Apparently some of our nation's important leaders
have been denied access to some UFO secrets in the possession of
an agency of the United States, the very existence of which is
classified above top secret.(51) Senator Barry Goldwater, a
retired Air Force Reserve Brigadier General and pilot with many
decades of flying experience, was quoted as saying "I certainly
believe in aliens in space. They may not look like us, but I
have very strong feelings that they have advanced beyond our
mental capabilities." He said he was refused permission to check
the Air Force files on UFOs and added, "I think some highly
secret government UFO investigations are going on that we don't
know about--and probably never will unless the Air Force
discloses them."(52) He said that he put faith in the reports of
the Air Force, Navy, and commercial pilots who reported
instances where a UFO would fly near them--right off their
plane's wing--and then just zoom away at incredible speeds. "I
remember the case in Georgia in the 1950s of a National Guard
plane going after a UFO and never returning. And I recall the
case in Franklin. Kentucky, when four military planes
investigated a UFO. One of them exploded in midair and no one
knows why."(53)

Unleashed by the policy of Glasnost (greater openness) the
Soviet media felt free to include accounts of UFO sightings. A
Tuss report of October 10, 1989, reported a large shiny ball or
disk hovering over a Voronezh park; residents saw the UFO land
and three creatures similar to human beings emerged, accompanied
by a robot.(54)

Apparently the Russians felt no need to suppress this report
which was poked fun at in Newsweek and Time magazines(55) but
not in U.S. News and World Report: "A scant few decades ago,
both the U.S. government and the media treated flying objects as
no laughing matter--which even Congress looked into. In 1966,
Representative Ford responded to a rash of sightings in his home
state of Michigan by calling for, and getting, a House hearing
on UFOs."(56)

UFO Missions

Many reasons have been advanced for the purpose of the UFOs
visits to our planet. Although some of the persons who
apparently have been the subjects of genetic investigation, such
as the family of Whitley Streiber may not agree, the majority of
those who have studied possible UFO visitors feel that they are
friendly. Mr. Streiber described his experience as terrifying,
and believes that these "little figures with eyes that seem to
stare into the deepest core of being are asking for something.
Whatever it is, it is more than simple information. The goal
does not seem to be a sort of clear and open exchange that we
might expect; whatever may be surfacing, it wants far more than
that. It seems to me that it seeks the very depth of soul; it
seeks communion."(57)

From the thousands of reports he has studied. William
Spaulding, aerospace engineer and head of the Arizona-based
Ground Saucer Watch, believes that a pattern indicates that UFOs
are here on a surveillance mission: the fact that a majority of
sightings occur around our military installations, research and
development areas leads to the conclusion that a methodical
study is being made of the earth and its defensive and offensive
capabilities. "The phenomena is not unlike our own space
explorations: scout ship survey: soil samples; landing."(58)

In his book Incident at Exeter, John Fuller discusses the
seeming affinity of UFOs for electrical power lines in the
northeastern part of the United States. In a later section of
this chapter dealing with the effects of UFOs on our terrestrial
activities, we will see how this affinity may have been
responsible for causing 36 million people to lose power over an
area of 8,000 square miles.(59)

Because of our recent adventures into space, there are some who
speculate that UFOs are more concerned with what we will do
there than in settling here. In any event, the Air Force's
official publication (issued by the Government Printing Office
1968) called Flying Objects says that 'No UFO has been
determined to represent a threat to our national security. '
That conclusion, however, should not rule out less disastrous
consequences than the overthrow of our government.


Regardless of its past evaluations, the Air Force could be
wrong about a number of things. "It can't even guess within a
couple of billion dollars what one of its planes is going to
cost; maybe, despite the skepticism of the scientists and other
investigators, the UFOs sent from other planets do exist and
have visited earth."(60) And maybe they have exhibited some
destructive effects, whether or not intentionally in every
instance, which we need to consider when drafting a plan for
coping with an emergency situation where UFOs are involved. Some
of these documented effects are as follows.

UFO Hazards

The two principal hazards noted with relation to UFOs have been
attributed to powerful electrical fields which they can project
in a general or localized area and the psychological effects
they have produced on the general populace or individual

Force Field Impact

The disruption of air and ground travel has often been reported
in the presence of UFOs. The ignition systems of auto and
aircraft engines have apparently been affected by energized
force fields to such an extent as to stop their operation; the
headlights and radios have also ceased to function. Here are a
couple of examples. In Buenos Aires, on March 29, 1978, "A
strange force shut off their engine and headlights of their
Citroen CG, lifted it 15 feet off the road, then set it down a
minute later and 75 miles to the north." The driver had noticed
a yellow and violet light shining in his rear view mirror while
driving the last leg of a long stock car race, and he realized
that it was approaching too fast to be a competitor. A month
later a Colombian bank manager and a navy officer had their car
headlights go off when buzzed by a UFO, with the navy man
suffering temporary paralysis. Other South American countries in
which similar actions were reported around that time included
Argentina, Chile, Peru, and Uruguay.(61)

These effects have also been noted to influence the controls and
instruments of aircraft, e.g., the pilot of a Piper PH-24
reported that his controls became inoperable when he was
approached by three disk-shaped objects, 10 to 12 feet in
diameter, over Mexico City on May 3,1975.(62) Similar cases have
been reported by military pilots, illustrated by the classic
case of the near mid-air collision of an army helicopter with a
UFO on October 18, 1973, over Ohio, where not only did both the
UHF and VHF radio wave- lengths go dead temporarily, but the
downward movement of the helicopter with its four occupants was
levitated upward by a green beam from the UFO in time to prevent
its crash into the ground.(63)

Communications Disruption

In addition to the impedance of radio transmissions and
reception, such as that described in the preceding incident,
telephone interference has occurred, illustrated by the chagrin
of President Lyndon Johnson in having his conversation from the
Texas White House cut off while talking to assistants in
Washington, D.C.(64) The ability to render inoperable all
electronic forms of communications, including those that
control the launching of defense weapons systems, has been
considered within the range of UFO capability. Whether this
could extend to the erasing of recorded computer data such as
bank records, personnel data, FBI, CIA, and NSA files, along
with critical information of every kind, is not beyond the realm
of possibility.

Regional Power Blackouts

It has long been suspected that UFOs have the capability of
blacking out a city, state, or many states by exerting a force
field sufficient to overload the circuits of public and private
utility installations. "Few things are more disturbing than to
be plunged into pitch darkness without warning; it is dangerous
for masses of people. It paralyzes cities, blocks highways,
stops trains, leaves elevators suspended between floors. In
general it simply plays hell with the modern way of life."(65)
You would think that the power companies would have achieved
sufficient reliability in their high tech systems that a mass
failure such as that which blacked out New York and New England
in 1965 would never happen--but it did. Although, as we have
mentioned before, it was known that UFO activity was associated
with disturbances with compasses. instruments, ignition systems,
radios, etc., it was inconceivable that it could also interfere
with generation and distribution of electrical power. Such a
connection was also inferred in November 1953, when a glowing
red object went over a residential area of New Haven,
Connecticut, causing lights to dim out on both sides of the
object's path and then come on when it went out of sight.

Power failures were also reported in association with UFOs in
Brazil in 1957 to l959~ Rome, Italy, in 1958; and Mexico in
1965. Likewise, in Uberlandia, where the power station operators
promptly closed the circuits when the UFO apparently caused them
to open, it did no good, and they were unable to restore the
power until the UFO departed.

"The Granddaddy of all blackouts to date was the stygian
blanket that fell over 30 million people in the northeastern
corner of the U.S. during the early evening rush hour period on
November 9, 1965."(66) Relay services that were supposed to
automatically transfer the load in case of failure in one area
to an alternate source malfunctioned. Military communications
relying on public power without alternate backup systems also
failed, but communications were operable to make a quick public
announcement that there was no military emergency. Though it was
largely over by the next morning, the official explanation about
a malfunctioning small device in a Canadian hydroelectric
generating plant never accounted for the failure of millions of
dollars worth of electronic devices to shift the load when the
breakdown occurred.

Fireballs Over Syracuse--The Blackout Connection

Airplane pilots reported that UFOs were being chased across
Pennsylvania about 4:30 P.M., and electronics and construction
engineers who were driving in the area of the Syracuse airport
saw UFOs moving about 5:30 P.M., just prior to the Great
Blackout. A veteran flight instructor who had been flying over
Syracuse on a training flight saw a glowing globe over the power
lines leading to the Niagara Falls generating plant. Hundreds of
others saw the glowing object in the sky on the night of the big
power failure.

That was on November 9th. On December 2nd, about 700,000
persons in Texas, New Mexico, and Mexico also had their power
fail. It was said to have originated in a regular failure in El
Paso; then on December 5th, three nights later. 40,000 homes
plus military installations in the area of East Texas were also
blacked out--overloaded! Missile grounds (White Sands), Fort
Bliss, Holloman Air Force Base, and numerous airports were all
blacked out (with no emergency power backup), and this was when
President Johnson's telephone call to the White House in
Washington, D.C. was cut off. In response to his request for an
explanation, President Johnson was told that his calls were fed
into a cable system that went dead when the surge of power
caused by the El Paso regulator blow-up hit it, and the backup
batteries didn't work. Though it may be debatable whether the
above cases of electrical transmission failure were merely
coincidences with UFO activity, an incident on April 18,1962,
involving a UFO that had been tracked from New York, through
Kansas to Eureka, Utah, was well documented. The Air Force
spokesman admitted that the object had landed, and during the 42
minutes that it was on the ground near the power station there
was no power, but it was restored when the UFO left. The object
was pursued by jet interceptors summoned from Phoenix and Stead
Field in Reno until it exploded over the Mesquite Range in
Nevada in a brilliant glare that was visible over five

UFOs--The Panic Hazard

The second major disastrous effect that UFO activity, real or
imagined, can have on the populace, is the creation of fear,
panic, flight, and all kinds of irrational behavior. We have
mentioned already the rather well-documented case of hysterical
contagion and mass hysteria created by War of the Worlds, the
radio drama by Orson Welles about an invasion of Martians. It
was broadcast on Halloween of 1938 during the period of the
invasions of Germany into Austria and Japan into China. "The
drama, realistically presented in the form of news bulletins and
interviews concerning an alien spaceship landing in New Jersey,
resulted in many kinds of hysterical actions, including
thousands of panic-stricken phone calls, wildly fleeing
automobiles, and impromptu shot gun brigades."(68)

Though most persons reporting UFOs do not interpret them as
personal threats, it is possible that some of the large volume
of reports may be attributable to hysterical contagion. In any
case, one of the reasons often cited for the tight secrecy on
government UFO research findings is the need to prevent the
possible panic that a revelation of the truth might arouse.
Rumors that people were being abducted, dematerialized, burned,
made radioactive, rounded up and impounded, liquidated with ray
guns and lasers or shipped off to Mars or Venus might well give
rise to fear--fear of the unknown. Hysteria could cause
frightened persons to imagine that their water was poisoned, the
air contaminated with undetectable but lethal aerosols or nerve
gases. With hundreds of UFO squadrons zooming across the
landscape from California to New York, Toronto to Mexico City,
communications disrupted, widespread power failures, airports
and railroads paralyzed, highways turned into giant parking lots
of immobilized vehicles full of terrified motorists, the problem
of restoring order and sanity would be a tremendous challenge to
all of the emergency services, assuming their personnel would
remain calm, detached. and able to resist the human impulse to
put the safety and well being of their own families ahead of the
public's. To make matters worse, some of the more excitable gun
owners might be tempted to rush out Rambo fashion, and in utter
disregard of the damage that falling bullets might cause
innocent residents below their fallout, start firing at the
evasive objects regardless of the range.

Personal Hazards--Physiological

The force field affects on the physical environment--
communication, transportation, illumination, and computerized
data storage--have already been considered. We might have added
that some physical effects have been observed at locations where
UFOs have landed-- circular patterns of crops destroyed by heat
or radiation and baking or sterilization of the soil at the

On a more practical basis there may be grounds for concern that
more than just the environment can be adversely affected by UFO
actions. While pursuing UFOs, military aircraft have disappeared
in mid-air, exploded, and suffered harassment. Persons on the
ground have sustained serious burns, paralysis, and "blows" from
a force field, radiated emissions, or rays and beams that have
been described like that of a "stun-gun"(69)

In 1980, three witnesses saw a red ball of light hovering above
houses in Kuala Lumpur, Malaysia, when suddenly a bolt of blue
light shot down and two houses burst into flames.(70) An Indiana
man saw a bright light flash pass his window; the power went off
in his house so he went outside to investigate and found a
brilliantly lit object hovering above him; when he started to
walk toward it his body commenced to tingle and he was unable to
move until the object disappeared. A similar tingling sensation
swept over another man in Lvnn, Massachusetts. one night when he
approached a domed object with a red glowing cone rising from a
parking lot. He too was immobile until the object moved out of
sight. Some believe that even animals may be at risk by UFOs; in
trying to account for the death of 15 ponies, the leader of an
investigative team believed they were crushed by the anti-
gravity field of a flying saucer as it took off.(71)

Thus, UFOs may not only have the power to control some of our
military and industrial establishment's highly technical
scientific hardware, they may also possess the ability to impose
pain and control over people who attempt to attack them, even to
the extent of "liquidating" them in one way or another.


In view of the fact that many UFOlogists believe that we are
fast approaching a time when overt landings of UFOs will become
less remarkable, and in the absence of our knowing whether their
visits are friendly or hostile, it would not be remiss to give
some thought to the part that fire departments might play in the
event of the unexpected arrival of UFOs in their communities.
For example, what would be your course of action as an incident
commander at the scene of a school ground where a UFO has
crashed into the boiler room, rupturing a fuel line, and
ignition has occurred in the spilling oil, endangering the
occupants of the craft who are trapped in the wreckage? If your
rescue attempts are successful, and two of the five small alien
creatures are injured but still alive, how do you dispose of the
dead and treat the survivors? How would the presence of children
on the school grounds affect your actions? What persons and
agencies would be notified?

The authors have never read any advice on these matters. The
following admonition was printed on the inside front jacket of
Frank Edward's book on flying saucers:


"Near approaches of UFOs can be harmful to human beings. Do not
stand under a UFO that is hovering at low altitude. Do not touch
or attempt to touch a UFO that has landed. In either case the
safe thing to do is to get away from there very quickly and let
the military take over. There is a possibility of radiation
danger and there are known cases where persons have been burned
by rays emanating from UFOs. Don't take chances with UFOs!"

In view of the federal law (cited earlier) empowering NASA's
administrator to impound, without a hearing, anyone who touches
a UFO or its occupants. it would be inadvisable to make personal
contact unless you are willing to submit to NASA's quarantine
requirements, should the law be invoked.

Besides the possible physical effects of approaching a UFO,
e.g.. burns, radiation, etc., there may be psychological effects
produced by force fields that could induce a hypnotic state in
the viewer, loss of consciousness, memory relapse, and
submission to the occupants. Jacques Vallee, author of The
Invisible College cautions that we should consider psychic
effects, such as space-time distortions experienced by
percipients of craft-like devices which appear to fade away--
dematerialize--and then reappear; of alien, strange voices or
thoughts that may effect involuntary changes in the manner in
which witnesses may react in such circumstances.(72)

Perhaps the above warnings of Edwards and Vallee are a little
too cautious and apprehensive to adopt as a general pattern of
conduct in every situation. In the absence of overt acts
indicating hostility, there may be no danger in approaching a
landing (or landed) UFO with a positive, solicitous attitude of
wanting to be of service. This nonaggressive mental state may be
telepathically sensed by those aboard or emerging from the
craft; a form of nonvocal communication is a possibility. It
goes without saying that any display of firearms or other
weapons on your part could be construed as unfriendly and likely
to thwart your intention of conveying a helpful attitude.

In a best case scenario, you may be able to obtain guidance as
to the appropriate actions to take, whether of a life-saving
nature, e.g., in quelling a fire, abating a spill, and of
preservation of property, or even in the reduction of
apprehension on the part of your response team and the

In a less optimistic scenario, you may have engine trouble upon
approaching the scene, and radio contact could be lost with your
dispatcher. If at night, your headlights could go out, the city
could be blacked out, and your portable generators may
malfunction when you attempt to use them for fans and portable
lights. It would certainly be an inopportune time for your
comrades to announce that they had decided to take their
pensions, effective immediately.

In any event, the incident could provide invaluable experience
for further training in coping with rare and difficult
emergencies. Whatever "inside" information you are able to pass
along to your fellow officers and citizens of the world might
help to alleviate unreasonable fear, so that there would be less
likelihood that we would ever again experience the panic and
hysteria that was created by War of the Worlds a half century
ago. Truth is the best cure for the unknown. A list of some of
the available books on Unidentified Flying Objects (UFOs) is
found in Appendix H.


Some fire chiefs have little confidence in disaster plans,
especially those dealing with UFOs or enemy attack. If you
develop a plan that sets forth your responsibilities, resources,
organizations, supplies information, telephone numbers, and
special data that will be useful in obtaining help
and fulfilling your role in disaster control, commit it to an
electronic medium, a computer with a capability for continuous
updating through modern word processing. Bring it forth when
the need requires. With a good plan, good leadership, and
adequate resources, you may save many lives in any disaster,
including attack from possible enemies.


1. Smith. Iack. "The Night L.A. Bombed." Los Angeles Times,
September 9, 1975, Part

1, p. I .

2. World Book Encyclopedia, Volume 21, p. 21, Chicago, IL Field

Educational Corporation, 1976.

3. Cloud, Stanley W. "Gathering Storm" in Time, September 3,
1990, pp. 24-28.

4. "Secret History of the War" in Newsweek, March 18,1991, p.28.

5. "Snubbing People Power" in U.S. News ~ World Report, April
8,1991, p.38.

6. World Book Encyclopedia, Vol. 21, p.22. Field Enterprises
Educational Corporation, Chicago, IL 1976.

7. "Preparing for Iraqi Chemical Warfare," photo and story in
Time, September 3,1990, p.26.

8. "Steel Rain' in Newsweek, March 18,1991, p.31.

9. See note 2, volume 9, p. 416.

10. See Chapter 8 for a more in-depth discussion of terrorism.

11. Gilliam. l. "A-Bomb Materials Can Be Stolen, Expert Says,"
Los Angeles Times,

December ll. 1975, Part Il, p. 1.

12. Nuclear Blackmail Emergency Response Plan for the State of
California, Officer

of Emergency Service, State of California, June 1976.

13. "After the Storm" in Newsweek, March 11, 1991, pp. 26-29.

14. Nuclear Attack and Industrial Survival, McGraw-Hill
Publishing Company Special Report, 1962, p.52.

15. Willenson, K., and L. Norman. "Missiles on the Move" in
Newsweek, February 16, 1976, p.42.

16. CBS News broadcast, April 1991.

17. Disaster Planning Guide for Business and Industry, Defense
Civil Preparedness

Agency, 1974, p.7, U.S. Government Printing Office, Washington,

18. L. A. Postal Report, Volume 10, No. 9, April 23,1965, p.2,
Los Angeles, CA.

19. Worldwide Effects of Nuclear War--Some Perspectives, a
Report of the U.S. Arms

Control and Disarmament Agency, 1975, p. 5, U.S. Government
Printing Office,

Washington, D.C.

20. Ibid. p. 6.

21. "Turning Up the Heat on the Greenhouse" in Newsweek, April
22, 1991, p. 69.

22. See note 19, p. 6.

23. Seenote 19, p. 5.

24. "Deadly Meltdown" in Time, May 12, 1986, p. 39.

25. "A 'Big 50' for Pearl Harbor in USA Today, Thursday, May 9,
1991. p. 3A.

26. Bahme,.Charles W. Fire Officer's Guide To Disaster Control,
Ist ed., Boston, MA:

NFPA 1978, p. 340.

27. Fire Effects of Bombing Attacks, Technical Manual 9-2,
October 1959, Office of Civil

Defense Mobilization, U.S. Government Printing Office,
Washington, D.C.

28. Fire Aspects of Civil Defense, TR-25, Office of Civil
Defense, ~uly 1968, p. 4, U.S.

Government Printing Office, Washington, D.C.

29. World Book Encyclopedia, 1991.

30. Disaster Operations, Defense Civil Preparedness Agency,
1972. p. 29, U.S. Government Printing Office, Washington, D.C.

31. Bruno, Hal. "The Wait May Be Over at FEMA" in Firehouse,
Vol. 15, No. 5 (May

1990) p. 10.

32. See note 30, p. 40.

33. The U.S. Government Printing Office, Washington, D.C. has
several publications available as of 1991 which suggest measures
that can be taken to safeguard dwellings and other buildings, in
preparation for a nuclear attack; they illustrate the relative
protection afforded for fallout radiation by various types of
construction and in various locations within a building. Two
available from the U.S.Government Printing Office, are Fallout
Protection and ln Time of Emergency, both Office of Civil

34. Weldon, Curt. "The Fight for Fire Protection" in Firehouse,
Vol. 16, No. 4 (April

1991), p. 20.

35. Radio Broadcast on station KSHE, St. Louis, MO, reported on
April 25, 1991.

36. Edwards, Frank. Flying Saucers--Serious Business, NY: Lyle
Stuart,965. p. 315.

37. World Book Encyclopedia, World Book Inc., 1988, Vol. 20, p.

38. Sagan, Carl, and Thornton Page. UFOs--A Scientific Deoate,
Cornell Univ., 1972, p. 44.

39. Ibid. p. 51.

40. Readers Digest. Mysteries Of The Unexplained, p. 219.

41. Steiger, Brad, Editor. Project Blue Book. NY: Ballantine
Books, 1976, p. 170.

42. Uphoff, Walter and Mary lo, New Psychic Frontiers, Colin
Smyth Ltd., 1975. p. 152.

43. Ibid., quoting Dr. James Harder, University of California.

44. Ibid. p. 152.

45. Macomber, Frank. "UFOs Spotted by Astronauts Still Haven't
Been Identified," Santa

Cruz Sentinel, April 17, 1974, p. 30.

46. APRO's addre$s was given as 3910 E. Kleindale Rd.. Tucson,
Arizona, 85716.

47. Lorenzen, lim and Coral. UFOs Over America, NY: Signet.
1968, pp. 182 et seq.

48. Ibid. p. 186.

49. Lofton, Robert. ldentified Flying Saucers, NY: David McKay
Co., 1968, p. 86.

50. Kehoe, Donald, Major. Aliens From Space, The Real Story of
the UFOs, New York:

Doubleday, 1972.

51. Friedman, Stanton. Cosmic Watergate, New Realities, 1979;
Hvnek, l. Allen.

"UFOs." This World, Aug. 30, 1981, p. 13.

52. Zullo, Allan A. "I Believe That Earth Has Been Visited By
Creatures From Outer

Space," National Enquirer, December 1973.

53. Ibid. p. 2.

54. Press Democrat, October 10, 1989, p. A-5; also reported in
weekly news magazines;

see notes 22 and 23.

55. Time, October 23,1989; Newsweek, October 30,1989; UFO
update, Omni, January


56. U.S. News ~ World Report, "UFOs in Uncle Sam's Closet,"
October 23, 1989, p.


57. Streiber, Whitley. Communion, NY: William Morrow, 1987, p.

58. Adamski, George, lnside the Flying Saucers, NY: Paperback
Library, 1967. p. 11.

59. Fuller, John. lncident at Exeter, cited in UFO Update, in
New Realities,1978. p.52.

60. "Shooting Down The Flying Saucers," Los Angeles Times,
December 15,1959, Pt.

Il, p. 5.

61. Boudreaux, Richard. "South Americans Take UFOs Seriously,"
Los Angeles Times,

November 29, 1978. Pt. VI, p. 7.

62. See note 6, p. 224.

63. Randles, Jenny. The UFO Conspiracy, NY: Sterling Pub. Co..
1990, p. 105.

64. See note 1, p. 267.

65. See note 1, p. 255.

66. Ibid. p. 259.

67. Ibid. p. 269.

68. See note 4, p. 216.

69. Blundell, Nigel, and Roger Boar. The World's Greatest UFO
Mysteries, NY: Berkeley Books, 1990, p. 175.

70. Ibid. p. 176.

71. Ibid. p. 179.

72. Vallee. Jacques. The Invisible College, NY: E. P. Dutton,
1975 p. 6.

- -



Above Top Secret, Timothy Good, William Morrow, NY, 1988.

Aids to Identification of Flying Objects, Air Technical
Intelligence Center, Gov't Printing Office, Supt. Doc., 1966.

Aliens Among Us, Ruth Montgomery, Fawcett Crest, NY, 1985.

Aliens from Space--The Real Story of UFOs, Donald E. Keyhoe,
Doubleday, NY, 1972.

Beyond Earth. Man's Contact with UFOs, Ralph and Judy Blum,
Bantam Books, NY, 1974.

Breakthrough to Creativity, Shafica Karakulla, M.D., De Vorss
and Co., Marina Del Rey, CA, 1967.

Chariots of the Gods, Erich Von Daniken, Putnam, NY, 1970.

Clear Intent, Barry Greenfield, Prentice Hall, Englewood
Cliffs, NJ, 1987.

Communion, Whitley Streiber, William Morrow, NY, 1987.

Extraterrestrial Visitations from Prehistoric Times to the
Present, Henry Regnery Co., Chicago, 1970.

Flying Saucers--Letters to the Air Force on UFOs, Bill Adler,
Dell Books, NY, 1967.

Flying Saucers--Serious Business, Frank Edwards, Lyle Stuart
Inc., NY, 1966.

Identified Flying Saucers, Robert Lofton, David McKay Co., NY,

In Search of Extra Terrestrials, Alan Landsburg, Bantam Books,
NY, 1967.

Inside the Flying Saucers, George Adamski, Paperback Library,
NY, 1967.

Insights for the Age of Aquarius, Gina Cerminara, Theosophical
Pub. House, Wheaton, IL, 1973.

Intruders, Budd Hopkins, Random House, NY, 1987.

Mysteries Of the Unexplained, Readers Digest, Readers Digest
Assn., Pleasantville, NY, 1982.

New Psychic Frontiers, Walter and Mary Jo Uphoff, Colin Smythe
Ltd., and Bolger Pubs., Minneapolis, MN, 1975.

Project Blue Book, Brad Steiger, Editor, Ballantine, NY, 1976.

Strange World, Frank Edwards, Lyle Stuart, NY, 1965.

Strangers Among Us, Ruth Montgomery, Fawcett Crest, NY, 1979.

The Intruders, Budd Hopkins, Random House, NY, 1987.

The Invisible College, Jacques Vallee, E.P. Dutton, NY, 1975.

The Possibility of Intelligent Life Elsewhere in the Universe,
U.S. House Committee on Science and Technology, Govt. Printing
Office, 1975.

The Roswell Incident, William L. Moore, Grosset and Dunlap,

The UFO Conspiracy--The First Forty Years, Jenny Randles,
Sterling Pub. Co., 1989.

The Unexplained, Allen Spraggett, Signet, NY, 1967.

The World's Greatest UFO Mysteries, Nigel Blundell and Roger
Boar, Berkeley Book, 1990.

The World's Last Mysteries, Readers Digest, Pleasantville, NY,

UFO Abductions, Philip Klass, Prometheus Books, Buffalo, NY,

UFO . . . Contact from the Pleiades, Lee and Brit Elders,
Genesis III Pub. Co., Phoenix AZ, 1984.

UFOs From Behind the Iron Curtain, lan Hobana and Julien
Weverbergh, Bantam Books, NY, 1975.

UFOs Over the Americas, Jim and Coral Lorenzen, Signet Books,
NY, 1968.

UFOs--A Scientific Debate, Carl Sagan and Thornton Page,
Cornell University, NY, 1972.

We Are Not The First, Andrew Thomas, Putnam & Sons, NY, 1971.
Copyright ~ 1992, Fire Engineering Books & Videos Park 80 West,
Plaza Two, 7th floor, Saddle Brook, Nl 07662


DR. WILLIAM M. KRAMER has baccalaureate degrees in Industrial
Management and Business Administration, a master s degree in
Industrial Relations, and a Ph.D. in Administrative Management
from the University of Cincinnati; and a master's degree in
Business Administration from Xavier University. He has edited
numerous course guides for the Open Learning Fire Service
Program and published numerous fire service journal articles. He
is chairman of the seven- University National Open Learning
Educational Consortium, Associate Professor and Director of the
Open Learning Program at the University of Cincinnati, a
District Fire Chief for the City of Cincinnati and the
educational commentator for American Heat video productions.

CHARLES (CHUCK) BAHME is the author of many fire service
articles as well as books, including the Handbook of Disaster
Control, predecessor to the Fire Officer's Guide to Disaster
Control, Fire Service and the Law, Fire Officer's Guide to
Dangerous Chemicals, Fire Protection for Chemiculs, Fire
Officers Guide to Emergency Action, Firemen's Law Book, and Fire
Officer's Guide to Extinguishing Systems. After responding to a
devastating chemical explosion in the City of Los Angeles he
wrote its Dangerous Chemicals Code, the first comprehensive set
of regulations ever adopted by any municipality pertaining to
hazardous materials. Following his naval service in World War II
he was called upon to write U. S. Navy: Structural Fire Fighting
for the Chief of Naval Operations. In thirty years of service
with the City of Los Angeles Fire Department he advanced through
the ranks from recruit to deputy fire chief, the rank he held at
the time of his retirement. During that period he augmented his
A.B. degree from UCLA with a Juris Doctor degree from
Southwestern University. Through the same years he served with
the U. S. Navy: six years of active duty during World War II and
the Korean conflict, and twenty-eight years with the Naval
Reserve, in which he retired with the rank of Captain. Chief
Bahme is an attorney at law with admission to practice in
California, before federal district courts, the Supreme Court of
the United States, and the highest court of military appeals. He
has taught courses in fire protection engi- neering a UCLA, and
fire administration at USC and various state, national, and
international conferences. He has served in Europe and the Far
East for the Department of Defense and the U. S. State
Department. In recent years he has been teaching a course in
Political and Legal Foundations of Fire Protection as a faculty
member of Cogswell College's Open Learning Fire Service Program.
He has also served as the NFPA's Fire Extinguishing Specialist,
its Western Representative, and as chairman of its Committee on
Hazardous Chemicals Fire Fighting. Upon his moving to Lake
County, California, he served as the chairman of his local
Kelseyville fire district's board of directors and as a disaster
control visor to his local Red Cross chapter.

posted on Mar, 23 2004 @ 01:29 PM

Originally posted by godservant
I am a firefighter and have been for a long time. I have never seen nor heard of this.

It looks like the book was published by FEMA in 1992. The following information is from the library of congress

Fire Officer's Guide to Disaster Control
William M Kramer and Charles Bahme
Published by Fire Engineering Books and Videos, Saddle Brook, NJ
641 pages
ISBN 0-912212-26

posted on Mar, 23 2004 @ 01:29 PM
google returns no results for "FEMA Firefighters Guide". interesting.

posted on Mar, 23 2004 @ 01:35 PM

posted on Mar, 23 2004 @ 01:36 PM
Guess I have heard of it now. At next months meeting I will ask why we haven't been trained for UFO attacks and I'll get thrown out of the window.

posted on Mar, 23 2004 @ 01:37 PM

There is a kind of a story and review of the book on that site.

posted on Mar, 23 2004 @ 01:39 PM

This information is provided by FEMA as a guide for local and government agencies to follow in case of an emergency or disaster. If they didnt think it was a possibility they wouldnt include any information regarding a UFO Disaster. They obviously think the threat is real and created a plan to deal with it.

posted on Mar, 23 2004 @ 02:15 PM
I guess we've been looking in the wrong direction
for comfirmation of ET. Either that or the government
slipped up on releasing this in 1992.

UFO's are real. Not figments of anyone's imagination.
Scary thought.

posted on Mar, 23 2004 @ 02:33 PM
its as good as them coming out and saying ....yup they exist
ive known for a long time they did

posted on Mar, 23 2004 @ 02:39 PM

Originally posted by watcheroftheskies
its as good as them coming out and saying ....yup they exist

Exactly, they cant come out and say due to the research and testing of a recovered space craft from Zeta Reticuli, we have determined the following..

posted on Mar, 23 2004 @ 02:47 PM
I did a google search for it, and despite what the other guy said somewhere above, I received 9,480 results.

posted on Mar, 23 2004 @ 02:56 PM
none of this is in the download "starchild" gave us, you know?

i would like to see a copy of this book before i go using it as proof.


posted on Mar, 23 2004 @ 03:25 PM
link 2268/inktomi-bkasin-20/ref%3Dnosim/102-0261181-9325732

Appears you can buy it.

posted on Mar, 23 2004 @ 03:33 PM

Originally posted by jhh 2268/inktomi-bkasin-20/ref%3Dnosim/102-0261181-9325732

Appears you can buy it.

You need to make sure that it's the 1992 2nd editon. I think the link you provided is to the 1998 release.


posted on Mar, 23 2004 @ 03:39 PM
search.barnesandnoble.... com/textbooks/booksearch/isbnInquiry.asp?userid=2WF3A26H1G&isbn=0912212268&TXT=Y&itm=1

This one is dated 1992, but it looks the same. Questionable if either of them would have it. I'll probably check my local college barnes and noble later this week.

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