Dropa Stones

First, here's a link:
paranormal.about.com...

While I'm sure this has probably been raised here before, this is the first I've heard of such a thing (so I apologize for not seeing an earlier thread). I wanted to get some people's take on it, hoax? or just plain weird?

Summary (in case you don't want to go to the link): Over 700 9" stone disks found in Chinese caves that look like records, but the grooves are actually microscopic heiroglyphcs, that were translated as being the story of crashed aliens...

this is fascinating, anyone know any other sites, are the stones viewable by the public, has this been proven a hoax yet?

I would venture to say this is an elaborate hoax. Not so much on the story itself, but by the amazing lack of any other piece of information to be found. When you search the web for "Dropa Stones" you'll find lots of returns (200+), but almost all of them are this article, copied-and-pasted, complete with the same pictures. If this were a real story, there would be some other pieces of material in alternate forms.

Internet Legend.

another chinese paranormal thing is here:

www.cityweekend.com.cn...

this is a real journalistic site, not some teenager writing b.s.

XAOS

The pyramid is real, but someone here(William OneSac?) has seen it and says it's being misrepresnted.

The Dropa Stones are hoaxes. You can't translate something without a base for the code (a plate or table of ancient Chinese characters that copy a text from one language to the other; the Rosetta Stone.) With just little scrawls of hieroglyphs, you don't know if they represent syllables (ala Egyptian) or whole words (Chinese/Japanese) or some combination or individual letters (English). You can't even guess how many letters total are in the language (we hardly use Z or Q or X in our manuscripts, but they're letters in our language).

There's lots of other problems with the story that indicate it's a real hoax. Including the problem that "Tsum Um Nui " (the name of the Chinese Professor) isn't a Chinese name. Or a name in any other language.

And there's no tribe named the Dropa in Tibet or any other Himalayan area.

And Beijing University doesn't have an "Academy of Prehistory" (nor does any other university in China)
www.geocities.com...



And you can't test stones with an oscilloscope. That's just silly.

I was pretty sure it was the case, but as I said, the first I've heard of 'em, so I wanted some input...

Thanks all!

I just heard of this too. There was a show on the History Channel on this last night. Very interesting! I'd like to know more. And where are the alien bodies they found? Who has them now?
I'm not convinced that it's impossible to decipher the code. That all depends on what they left in the code. They may have even left some sort of key index that's meant to help decipher it. How would you know?
Does the History Channel regularly cover hoaxes as if they're real history? I can't say I've seen them being outright misleading like that before. The show didn't seem to imply that it's a hoax at all.

[edit on 14-12-2004 by Damned]

�This one plate, dated to be between 10,000 and 12,000 years old - older by far than the great pyramids of Egypt - was fantastic enough, but the wonder was multiplied manyfold.�

My wonder is how they dated it. If the disks were stone, then it�s obvious that C-14 dating wasn�t used, and 10000 to 12000 years is too close for most radionucleides. So, where does the author get the date information?

�In all, 716 such plates were found. And each held an incredible secret. The groove, upon further inspection, was not a groove at all, but a continuous line of strange carved hieroglyphics - writing! The tiny, almost microscopic characters were in a language never encountered before. It wasn't until 1962 that another Chinese scientist� Dr. Tsum Um Nui��

That is not a Han name. It is made up by someone who doesn�t understand how Chinese names work.

�� the groove turned out to be an unknown hieroglyphic.�

And, of course, there are no pictures of this unknown hieroglyphic, or of the four-foot-tall weenies who were supposed to have written them, or any discussion at all on the methodology that Dr. Dumalatcher used.

�The writing was so small he had to use a magnifying glass to see it clearly. But the stones were old�.�

Think about it. If these little guys had the technology to fly a spaceship around and make exactly precise writings that are almost microscopic is size � why wouldn�t they have inscribed them on glass or metal? Using stone to write on, especially if you�re a high-tech culture, makes no sense at all.

�Eventually, he began to make progress. A word emerged. Then another. A phrase became understandable, then an entire sentence. He had broken the code�.�

But there�s no discussion whatsoever about the code, or how he broke it or if the language was diagrammatic or positional or any of those things. Hmmmm.

�Dr. Tsum Um Nui's findings were eventually published, however�.�

And how convenient! They �forgot� to tell us where it was published.

�In either case, his translation and his theory were met with ridicule by the archaeology establishment.�

A-HA! If the �archaeology establishment� ridiculed it, that means it was actually published in an archaeology journal, right?

Well, which one? When? Which Issue?

�In 1968, the Dropa stones came to the attention of W. Saitsew, a Russian scientist who re-published the findings of Tsum Um Nui�.�

And the name of the journals which he �re-published� them in? Hmmm! It seems that the author �forgot� to tell us that, too! And, by the way, �Saitsew� is certainly not a Russian name.

��and conducted tests on the disks that revealed some very peculiar properties. Physically, the granite stones contained high concentrations of cobalt and other metals - a very hard stone indeed that would have made it difficult for the primitive people to carve the lettering, especially with such minute characters. When testing a disk with an oscillograph, a surprising oscillation rhythm was recorded as if, the scientists said, they had once been electrically charged or had functioned as electrical conductors.�

Rubbish �science�. Granite doesn�t have high concentration of cobalt or any other metals. If you go to www.granite-sandstone.com... , you can see the makeup, as shown below.

Granite is primarily composed of feldspar, quartz along with various other minerals in varying percentage, which are stated as follows:
Nominal chemical composition of various oxides
Silica(SiO2) ---------------------- 70-77%
Alumina(Al2O3) ----------------- 11- 14%
Potassium Oxide(P2O5) -------- 3 � 5%
Soda(Na2O) ---------------------- 3 � 5%
Lime -------------------------------- 1%
Iron(Fe2O3) ----------------------- 1-2%
Iron(FeO) -------------------------- 1 � 3%
Magnesia(Mg0) ------------------ 0.5 � 1%
Titina ------------------------------- Less than 1%(.38%)
Water(H2O) ---------------------- 0.03%

Note that the iron, magnesia, alumina, etc, are NOT metals, but OXIDES.

And there is no test to determine if something had once been electrically charged or used as an electrical conductor by measuring its vibration. Vibration frequency is a function of makeup and size.

�Whatever their true nature, origin, or meaning, the Dropa stones present an intriguing puzzle for archaeologists and anthropologists.�

Actually the only �puzzle� is why someone would put together such a clumsy hoax.

Think about it. If these little guys had the technology to fly a spaceship around and make exactly precise writings that are almost microscopic is size � why wouldn�t they have inscribed them on glass or metal? Using stone to write on, especially if you�re a high-tech culture, makes no sense at all.

You have to have an imagination, I suppose. Imagine that they were stranded on a distant planet with limited resources, and it's not that far of a stretch.

Rubbish �science�. Granite doesn�t have high concentration of cobalt or any other metals.

Man, you really have no imagination. If they had the technology to carve microscopic sentences, they probably had the power to alter the substance too. Not saying that I believe this, but you obviously are one of those who look only for reasons not to believe. They said it revealed very peculiar properties, not that all granite has those properties.

Sure, it may be a tough one to believe, but I hate people who go out of their way to be pig headed about possibilities.

[edit on 14-12-2004 by Damned]

Interesting story,

I watched the program on Dropa Stones on the History Channel last night.

Never heard of them before this program.

What really got my interest was when they spun the disk and they produced a electronic field.

The problem is China being a closed country that surpresses information like this, we will never know the truth as long as Communism is in charge of China.

Damned says:

"You have to have an imagination, I suppose. ... Man, you really have no imagination."

Sorry, Damned. I'm an engineer, I try to deal in common sense and evidence, not imagination. I think you'd really have to have an imagination to believe this particular myth.

"...pig headed about possibilities..."

There's a big difference between being "pig-headed" and recognizing a hoax which was made up by someone who simply doesn't understand how geology works, or how the Chinese and Russian names work, and makes up university departments departments that don't exist, and Tibetan tribes which don't exists and doesn't understand how language translation works -- and then tells one clumsy lie after another.

I mean, if this guy had managed to work his way through high-school physics and geology and actually read a little bit of history, his hoax -- while still being rubbish -- might've at least been kind of interesting.

Sorry, bud. If it's important to you, you may certainly believe anything you like, but I'm in denying ignorance mode today.

[edit on 14-12-2004 by Off_The_Street]

Originally posted by Off_The_Street
�In 1968, the Dropa stones came to the attention of W. Saitsew, a Russian scientist who re-published the findings of Tsum Um Nui�.�

And the name of the journals which he �re-published� them in? Hmmm! It seems that the author �forgot� to tell us that, too! And, by the way, �Saitsew� is certainly not a Russian name.

Maybe it was an attempt to link it with Zaitsev so that everyone would see it "sounded" Russian... And W. and Vassili...

Then again all Russian sounds alike in my ears, so it wouldnt matter

[edit on 14-12-2004 by merka]

SIRR1 says:

"The problem is China being a closed country that surpresses information like this, we will never know the truth as long as Communism is in charge of China."

But the hoax said that both the "Chinese scientist" and the "Russian scientist" did publish that stuff.

So where're those journals?

Someone has already done some research here:

ufos.about.com...

He tried to find the original source of the story.

He tried to find any legitimate reference to any of the people named in the articles. He could not.

I wouldn't dismiss this case yet. Yes, it is hard finding the evidence, but that is also because it's 70 years old and there is a claimed Chinese government cover-up. Apparently there is some truth to this case. It is not an internet legend, that's for sure.

Hopefully, someone can verify or falsify the following:

Russian philologist Dr. Viatcheslav Zaitsev in 1968 published the extracts from the stone-plate story in the Sputnik Magazine.

In 1974, an Austrian engineer, Ernst Wegerer, photograpghed the dropa disks in the Banpo Museum at Xian and photographed them.

The supposed disks that were photographed are:





In 1978 a writer David Agamon wrote a book called "Sungods in exile" written as a documentary on the expeditions of 1947 by a British scientist called Karyl Robins who visisted the Bayan-Kara-Ula mountains regions and found a dwarfish people there called the "Dropa" or "Dzopa"

This existence of a dwarfish race of people was corroborrated in November 1995 by AP(Associated press) where the tallest was 3 feet 10 in and the smallest 2 feet 1 inches. Scientists believe this to be part of their DNA.

The Chinese authorities have claimed, what they call "the village of the dwarfs" actually exists, and a strange tribe of people live there, but the region is not open to foreingers.

Apparently, there also exists Chinese pyramids in the region, an entire city of them.

Well at least one aspect of this story seems confirmed, that there do indeed exist a people called the DROPA that are a strange race of dwarf beings.

As regards to the mysterious Chi Pu Tei, the german author and researcher, Hartwig Hausdorf, has the following to say:

There was much criticism on Tsu Um Nui's person. Skeptics said, that the name of the Professor does not exist in Chinese language, neither in Mandarin nor in Canton Chinese. But in my book "Satelliten der Gotter" (Satellites of the Gods), co-authored by Peter Krass, we could point out from where the name was originating. A friend's wife, born in Singapore and speaking fluently Japanese, told us, that Tsum Um Nui is a former Japanese name, but adapted to Chinese language. Now think about German immigrants in America: Their former names was Herr Schmid now their name is adapted to Mr. Smith. Consequently Japan was the right place for the Professor to retire from his enervating defeat in China.

Source: www.inquiring-mines.com...

[edit on 14-12-2004 by Indigo_Child]

"quote: There was much criticism on Tsu Um Nui's person. Skeptics said, that the name of the Professor does not exist in Chinese language, neither in Mandarin nor in Canton Chinese. But in my book "Satelliten der Gotter" (Satellites of the Gods), co-authored by Peter Krass, we could point out from where the name was originating. A friend's wife, born in Singapore and speaking fluently Japanese, told us, that Tsum Um Nui is a former Japanese name, but adapted to Chinese language. Now think about German immigrants in America: Their former names was Herr Schmid now their name is adapted to Mr. Smith. Consequently Japan was the right place for the Professor to retire from his enervating defeat in China."

No. There aren't any hiragana or katakana characters in Japanese that ends in a consonant; they all end in vowels. Not only that, but there are no Japanese charcters that have the "ui" dipthong. for what it's worth, the word "nui" means "big" in Hawaiian, but that's about it.

Changing any Japanese surname I can think of into "tsum um nui" makes as much linguistic sense as a German named "Schmidt" anglicizing his name to "Papatheodorocopoulos" or "Danielowicz".

"O what a tangled web we weave / When first we practice to deceive."

The History Channel Program last night on the Dropa stones, if I heard them right said the Chinese Scientists report was from the late 1950's and the Soviet Scientists report was from the 1970's.

That make the Chinese reprot 40 years old and the Soviet report 25 years old.

This is very dated material and the way it looks its being surpressed by these 2 governments China and the former Soviet Union.

Still a good story, I would love to hear or see current info on this topic.

Changing any Japanese surname I can think of into "tsum um nui" makes as much linguistic sense as a German named "Schmidt" anglicizing his name to "Papatheodorocopoulos" or "Danielowicz".

He said it was adapated from a Japanese name into Chinese. I wouldn't know the difference, as I do not know any Japanese or Chinese.

yesterday on history channel they had a special on the dropa stones it seems real...but theres no concrete proof. theres pics and # but no physical proof..supossedly the chinese government is hidnt the dropa stones..every monday night a 8:00 on history channle watch the show called ufo files..its like a documentary done on all the conciparies we talk about.

Originally posted by Off_The_Street
Damned says:

"You have to have an imagination, I suppose. ... Man, you really have no imagination."
Sorry, Damned. I'm an engineer, I try to deal in common sense and evidence, not imagination. I think you'd really have to have an imagination to believe this particular myth.

I don't guess you'll ever make a very good inventor, then.

Sorry, bud. If it's important to you, you may certainly believe anything you like, but I'm in denying ignorance mode today.

What makes you such an expert on Chinese departments and language? BTW, since you're an engineer who deals with fact and real physics, what it your opinion on the Pentagon crash? Do you feel that the wings could have broken the laws of physics so completely?
I've also done my share of engineering, and also inventing. When dealing with beings of advanced technology, from another world, you'd be wise to keep an open mind. I don't see that in you. I see the same denial in you as I see in HowardRoark about the flight 77 crash, and the pseudophysics behind his theory.

It's not that it's important to me. I just hate seeing anti-logic in action. It reminds me of when I was a kid and I didn't want to put my socks on, so I whined and pretended I couldn't do it. This is the feeling I get from your logic. You seem to go out of your way to try not to think of all the possibilities. Either that, or you just don't have much imagination, as I've already mentioned.

Translations are a tricky thing. They get screwed up all the time, being converted to different languages. For example, there isn't a Russian translator on the web that's worth a crap.

[edit on 14-12-2004 by Damned]