I believe I may have found the tree of knowledge!

A great book on this topic is "Food of the Gods" by Terence Mckenna. His theory is that the fruit that caused the awareness(ie guilt, shame, acknowledgement of sin) was the psychedelic mushroom. The apes that existed on the african savannas were not tree climbers. They roamed the plains and followed the grazing animals. The mushrooms grew in the dung left by these herds. Mushrooms of this sort actually affect dna and consciousness. The effect of this awareness led to the "DEATH" of the ego and exponential gaining of "KNOWLEDGE". Anyone who has ever done them can atest to this fact. If there are any Bill
Hicks fans out there you may have seen his standup on this topic

I like it when people try and think up new ideas, like this.

However, at the risk of breaking your admonition, "not to tell you how to interpret the Bible."
It is the tree of knowledge of "good and evil". Not knowledge. It is to know in the Biblical sense. "to become one with, to experience". God, only created good to start with. So the knowledge of "good and evil", was
to bring evil into the experience of man. That is what the curse was all about. God, "cursed the earth, for mans sake," He cursed it with evil. So man could know the difference. Because once he ate of the tree. Man begin to see, everything as good or evil. There was no evil. So man started to wrongly judge things as good or evil. Get the picture?

Originally posted by jimmyjackblack
Well he took the form of a serpent "the most subtle creature". Lilith is actually a Kabala idea, which is why I give it no credence. Angels are male (that is an unprovable fact lol), now if Angels are male, then why would "Satan" be a female known as Lilith and would take the form of a serpent?

Where did you find out that the serpent was an angel? The Good Book says it was a beast of the field, a serpent. However, all the beasts of the field were humans in Eden, 72 of them representing the 72 constellations of Heaven. The seven arch angels are the seven astrological planets visible to the naked eye, the hosts. God was the representative of the constellation I call the Father which has been fragmented into Draco these days, the Dragon. But Draco is only a part of the Father, namely his head, shoulders and right arm. To his right stands Adam, the constellation referred to as the Son of Man (Ursa Major). Serpens would be Lilith.

Your theory puts me in mind of a theory in the book "Ishmael" by Daniel Quinn. In this story the ape is trying to teach the man that "knowledge" was the forbidden fruit. Very thought provoking book. You will enjoy it.

Originally posted by Odessy
anyway, I do Like your idea, but I think the only flaw is that Adam and Eve were already human, even before they ate the fruit in the midst of the garden.
Its just too unlikely that by eating meat one generation turned from Neanderthals to Humans.

I agree, I believe it could have happened over millions of years. I mentioned that in my 3rd or 4th post

posted on 5-4-2008 @ 10:34 AM single this post 100 edit"quote"REPLY TO:


Is this story simply the account of that happening, and defining the moment where Humans made the seperation from animal conscienceness to a higher level of understanding or knowledge, packaged in a fun little story that would compartmentalize millions of years of evolution into one small period of time.

[edit on 6-4-2008 by kleverone]

reply to post by hexagram23


Hexagram, I watched the video you offered with the Rabbi and I couldn't see it all because it came across poorly on my pc, but what he seemed to be saying is that 1990 was actually the year of eating the fruit, and it implied the World Wide Web is in fact the knowledge we weren't to have.

If this was true how would it pertain to evil already being experienced by man?

It was an interesting post and video, though.

Lot's of people do seem to think that it was Sex which was forbidden.. If that were the case why would we be equiped to have sex? Maybe to have this experience in life and death, there is so much speculation, and like many biblical teachings, there just isn't enough information given for me to get a complete understanding,.

This has been a good thread and I enjoy all the input because I have put so many hours of thought into this without feeling like I have understanding.

Originally posted by Howie47
I like it when people try and think up new ideas, like this.

Thank you. I enjoy it as well.

However, at the risk of breaking your admonition, "not to tell you how to interpret the Bible."

Which was exactly my point. I don't need anyones interpretation because I do not believe that anyone has anymore authority than me to tell me what it mean. Unless they were there when it was written.

It is the tree of knowledge of "good and evil". Not knowledge. It is to know in the Biblical sense. "to become one with, to experience". God, only created good to start with. So the knowledge of "good and evil", was
to bring evil into the experience of man. That is what the curse was all about. God, "cursed the earth, for mans sake," He cursed it with evil. So man could know the difference.

I respect you opinion but I do not believe that to be true.

Because once he ate of the tree. Man begin to see, everything as good or evil. There was no evil. So man started to wrongly judge things as good or evil.

I disagree and take a less literal interpretaion of the story but I enjoy your version. Thanks for sharing.

reply to post by kleverone


lol,, there is and never was a garden of eden or adam or eve or any of those characters in the bible, the bible is an invention to tame the people, a compilation of lots of old stories usually passed mouth to mouth from probably well before the babylonians...

the history of the "one god" is egiptian, the big flood tale its sumerian and so on, the jews, as usual used what they could for self benefit.

This compilation that we call the bible and other crap like that, like the coran was useful at those times but now it only serves to divide the makind...

You can believe in whatever you want but if you look into this you will see too many similarities between the stories in the old testament and older myths.

The new testament its different in some aspects, it is the creation of a new religios based on an old one that was already estabilished and accepted by many people, then it was a matter of selecting the right texts and stories to give it some fantasy and credibility... but it has a lot of flaws...

reply to post by Neo Christian Mystic


I'm just telling you what I know from the bible, that other stuff I have no idea about, is it meantioned in Kabbalah or something? I've not read that.

The bible says that the serpent is a beast of the field, not a spirit or an angel.

reply to post by hexagram23

According to the sages, man was initially vegetarian, this was true for Adam and his descendants according to the orthodox sources. Apparently mankind, according to the Hebrew Bible, began eating meat after the flood of Noach (Noah).

If this were true, then why did Abel 'offer up' unto the Lord, the best of his flock - meat, while Cain 'offered up' his best grains?

Were they told to just merely 'kill the animals for nothing'? Look, but don't taste?

I'm thinking there's much more going on than that.

The Lord gave them permission.

(Paraphrasing) "When the offering (meat) was burnt on the altar, the smells went up into heaven, and was a pleasing smell, unto the Lord."

****

Here's a strange thought folks...humans were meant to live forever, or an extremely long time.

Say perhaps there was a biological change (DNA degredation), that had occured when Adam/Eve bit into the forbidden fruit.

This fruit started doing a number on the human cells.

(Paraphrasing) The Lord said: "Eat of it, and you'll die." He was Totally correct.
Satan said: "You won't die" (not right away, but slowly and surely you will). He was essentially correct as well...but 1/2 truths.

Probably why we see the age variences from Genesis down throughout the Bible. Going from 900 years old, 800, and so forth, til we hit the magic number of 120 years being the supposed maximum that people can live to.

****

I'm also inclined to think that they ate fruit/vegetable matter and not meat.

(Paraphrasing) "Then Eve beheld the fruit, and saw that it was pleasing to the eye."

If we had to look at the innards of animals for the first time in our lives, would you think that they were pleasing to the eye?

I wouldn't thinks so either.

Just a thought.

~Ducky~




[edit on 6-4-2008 by TheDuckster]

Here is a link that says it a little better than I'm able to. I got a lot of heart knowledge, but my lack of memory results in terrible head knowledge.

[url=http://www.answersingenesis.org/creation/v13/i4/serpent.asp]>>LINK

OK, my first thought was 'this is another silly idea', but after reading your OP... I need to give this some thought. You make a decent case. Meat protein is supposed to be the key to our higher brain power among animal life.

Flagged, definitely. But I'm not giving up dead-cowburgers just yet.

TheRedneck

Religious doctrine and the divinely inspired book of tales is so full of contradictory information I don't know how any one can make an assertion to any of its meaning. Let alone follow scholars interpretation of the words of fools.

Now as for genesis, I see some writing there that could be made to sound plausible but the thing about adam and eve sounds a little fabricated. Point being when god told adam and eve not to touch or eat from the tree in the midst of the garden, could this be in the "mist" of the garden.

Than, if you have a mind that is not afraid of this god, you must question why it would place a tree of knowledge and a tree of longevity there in the midst/mist and tell the lovers not to touch or eat of it knowing the patriarch/matriarch would eat and as the LORD God said, Behold, the man is become as one of us, to know good and evil: and now, lest he put forth his hand, and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live for ever.

Thats like telling your children not to pick anything off the ground. Your kid will do it anyway when your not watching. So how could that become a sin and punishable when the less than Omnipotent god has to ask the dual.

Than the duo cover themselves with fig leaves and god clothes them with skins. The story is for the imagination to play on.

Sheep gives wool, hens give eggs and cows bring milk. You don't have to kill a cow to get the best from it...

I like burgers more than milk lol.
So I would have to kill a cow to get the best from it.
This is coming from a guy who was a vegitarian for 3 years (I was in the best shape of my life back then too).

Hehe. Good one. I tend to agree with you, but I still love milk, cheese, cakes, cream and all of the other delicious things you can make from milk and eggs and such. And living up North I kinda appreciate the sheep for it's wool. It would be dead cold without it...

Just a little side note as to the design of the human teeth. To me, it is obvious that the front teeth are designed to tear and rip food, meat, carrots, etc. and then the molars are designed to grind the food to place the food into an easier to digest form. I don't believe we are somewhere in between evolution where our front teeth are due to our becoming meat eaters and the back teeth have yet to evolve from our way back ancestors who were perhaps vegetarian. Also, it's interesting to note that in the Old Testament, that people lived hundreds of years, but immediately following the flood peoples' lives shortened to 120 years. What's up with that? Any theories?

[edit on 6-4-2008 by kyred]

Originally posted by jimmyjackblack
... I don't believe what the evolutionists may say about how eating meat makes the brain grow faster. It's probably one of those "global warming/global cooling/nothing's happening" things where everyone has "proof" of what they're saying. Always remember, just cause a scientist says something, doesn't make it true, if anything you should question it further.....

It's not a 'fabrication' of evolutionists, but basic biological chemistry....

kwashiorkor , protein deficiency disorder of children. It is prevalent in overpopulated parts of the world where the diet consists mainly of starchy vegetables...Such a diet, although adequate in calories, is deficient in certain amino acids, the constituents of proteins vital for growth

Dietitians study this deficiency disease along with scurvy and rickets, note the symptoms....( I've added some bolding to key parts)

manifestations of the disease are a swollen and severely bloated abdomen, resulting from decreased albumin in the blood, and various skin changes resulting in a reddish discoloration of the hair and skin in black African children. Other symptoms include severe diarrhea, enlarged fatty liver, atrophy of muscles and glands, mental apathy, and generally retarded development.

source:
www.encyclopedia.com...

I recall a program on the Discovery channel that credited sushi with being the food that gave early primates easy access to proteins.....the fish posed a low risk to the catcher and didn't require the ability to build a fire...

[edit on 6-4-2008 by frayed1]

Did you know that you can live for more than seven years drinking only beer? Danish scientists just figured this out. Lucky me, I have atleast seven years to go