Visited by the devil?

I believe the devil is an entity made up of all the evil in the world.

I've seen devil spelled d'evil, which would mean the evil.

According to Job in the bible, Satan had to ask God to inflict
tribulations on Job, therefore one must concur that God is boss
over evil.

Does that mean God allows evil to happen to us. I believe yes.
I believe, if one angers God, he will put us on a path of destruction.
If bad things happen in your life, look at what would anger God.

It's usually something that is doing harm to oneself, or others, that
sets us on that path.

reply to post by MajorMalfunction


MajorMalfunction wrote: "There is literally no evidence whatsoever for the existence of anything or anyone called the devil. It's all just stuff to keep people on the straight and narrow, instead of allowing them to be moral all on their own."


I have to disagree, and my experience will tell why.

When I was a teenager, I was lying in bed one night with my head facing away from the window.

Out of nowhere, I got the intense feeling that "something" had come to the window and was trying to communicate with me. At first, it tried telling me it was an "alien", and when I didn't believe that story, its whole demeanor changed. It suddenly became so hateful and evil that I knew if I turned to look at it that it would kill me. All I could do was silently pray and it eventually went away.

I have never been prone to nightmares, nor do I have any form of mental illness. I also do not suffer from "sleep paralysis" as the theory goes.

This thing was an external, malevolent intelligence of some kind. Don't call it the "Devil" if you don't want to.

But no matter what you call it, I have known since that night that we share this planet with beings that are completely reprobate and unredeemably malicious.

No amount of convincing will make me believe this incident was my "imagination."


[edit on 9/21/07 by Zane Zackerly]

reply to post by Zane Zackerly

Do you live in Georgia???

reply to post by Stockburn



Stockburn wrote: "I even have gone as far as taping, trying to summon a demon, albeit I am far from a conjurer. . My open challenge has still proved fruitless. Show me the proof. Nobody seems to take it for what "it" is. Fakery, and a lack of belief in oneself. Ponder this my friend, why is 80% of the world, believers in reilgion? Brain wash or mass delusion, control of the masses in a time where we didn't know S, or perhaps the best one yet, weak minded? ? Perhaps believing in the the only thing that is comfortable [god] as opposed to croaking and either A, rotting in the ground, or B, burning by fire with only ash to be used in some form. "

With all due respect to you and your opinion, they have no need to appear and perform for you because you already belong to them in body and spirit.

Originally posted by Clearskies
reply to post by Zane Zackerly

 

Do you live in Georgia???

No, New Mexico.

reply to post by Zane Zackerly


Just making sure you weren't my husband's nephew..
Sorry for being nosey!
After I became a christian, when I went to bed, one night and started to read my bible "something' started knocking on the window behind my head. I looked. Nothing there. I felt an evil presence as well, Many other times I felt or knew that the devil was hindering my new development as a christian.
The bible says(not word for word) Submit yourselves therefore unto God, resist the devil, and he will flee from you.
I won't get into the times I saw the devil Before I was a christian. I talked about those on other threads.

[edit on 21-9-2007 by Clearskies]

reply to post by Zane Zackerly


What you describe is a subjective experience.

Science deals with objective evidence.

Something can seem extremely real, but without it being verified, tested and replicated in a lab, it is only a subjective experience and not proof of anything at all.

Jhill, I just would like to point one thing out:

One of us in this thread is telling you to explore and question and follow your own heart. Others in this thread are telling you not to stray from your faith and that they'll pray for you.

Which person or persons is attempting to control you and shore up superstition, and which person or persons is attempting to encourage you to think for yourself?

That should be all the answers you need.

Think for yourself. Examine your faith. if your faith can't stand up to scrutiny, then it is not true faith. If you have real faith, it doesn't matter if you question it.

and if you question it and find it lacking, that is also up to you, and nobody else's business.

I promise you this: I won't pray for you, but I do hope you find the answers you're seeking and come to peace with yourself and your beliefs, whatever they may end up being.

Good luck to you, my young friend!

Originally posted by MajorMalfunction
reply to post by Zane Zackerly

 

What you describe is a subjective experience.

Science deals with objective evidence.

Something can seem extremely real, but without it being verified, tested and replicated in a lab, it is only a subjective experience and not proof of anything at all.

Your point is well taken, and 99.99% of the time I might agree with you.

But as they say, "Until it's happened to you, you won't believe it."

I hope you never experience true evil as I have.

reply to post by saint4God


I agree. No one can accurately believe you when they have not seen it firsthand. I can't say, I don't believe in aliens for the fact alone I have not experienced an encounter. But, I won't say I don't believe you, if you tell me you had an experience. (In no way flaming anyone for saying that, that's just my opinion.)

Just like on the news how can one claim to be a terriost expert, when they have not been a terriost firsthand to know what really goes on through the mind of said person. Yea, you can study and follow a group, but how can one accurately know what it's like unless you have been one.

reply to post by JimmyBlonde


Actually, where I used to live, I got on an elevator maybe once in my lifetime, there were just no elevators.

Also, I have stated that I am religious, but at times question religion.

I am a Christian and I can tell you that I have never encountered anything that would be considered evil, hocus pocus (as MM put it) or out of the realm of understanding.

I can also say that I became a Christian at the age of 16 but did not really start reading my Bible or practicing Christianity on a daily basis until I was around 35. I have an IQ of 136, I went to church from the age of 5 to 9 but didn't really pay attention. I was given the choice at 9 to continue or stop. I stopped.

So, as you can see, none of the stereotypes apply here. I also feel that the OP experienced nothing more than a bad dream associated with fear and death. By the way, I am not a Christian out of fear and find that it's mostly about love. No nonsense and just plain Bible teaching is best in my eyes.

MM, I'd venture to say that you jumped from lifestyle to lifestyle quickly and often, otherwise you wouldn't be making statements such as challenging satan to prove something to the people he wants to deceive. However, you have your beliefs and that is your right. I do respect everyones right to choose.

We are in a time of Grace which means very little interaction from God as he just sits back and watches until judgment day. This is not to say that prayers are not addressed but to give Grace you have to let go and let the kids run a little.

As always, this is JMO.

reply to post by runetang


I agree, but honestly, you tell me that never once you thought what if about religion?

I mean I truly believe in God, but, in my time I have come to question certain things. I don't go to church, but do I think going to church will get me to heaven alone, nope. I think if you know the word and abide by the word, you will get accepted to heaven.

Originally posted by MajorMalfunction
reply to post by Zane Zackerly

 

What you describe is a subjective experience.

Science deals with objective evidence.

Jhill, I just would like to point one thing out.

One of us in this thread is telling you to explore and question and follow your own heart. Others in this thread are telling you not to stray from your faith and that they'll pray for you.

Which person or persons is attempting to control you and shore up superstition, and which person or persons is attempting to encourage you to think for yourself?

I have to agree, you made an excellent point. Again, not trying to say oh MM is right, but she makes a valid point. She is giving me a different view at the situation. I wish my side could argue valid points and not just say read you bible, I'll pray for you. (Not to step on anyones toes, but I need hard arguments)

One thing I hate the most and I am a Christian is seeing signs on the side of the road such as:

God Loves You
Prepare To Meet God

What does that do to a non-believer, absolutely nothing. That just makes us sound like we are saying there are aliens to the general public. If we are going to spend the money on stuff like this, we should come 20x times harder. But, someone could argue the point of brand marketing; people will eventually want to look into God because they heard it so much. But, I would argue back, I have heard Bin Laden's name in the news so much, doesn't mean I want to go on a quest searching for him.

My point is that if we are trying to reach out to non-believers we need to stop saying Jesus died for you, sining is wrong, we need to enlighten those people with someone that will stick to their brains and they will thrive to learn about Jesus. But, I have not seen anything yet to date, that does just that.

Originally posted by jhill76

I agree. No one can accurately believe you when they have not seen it firsthand. I can't say, I don't believe in aliens for the fact alone I have not experienced an encounter. But, I won't say I don't believe you, if you tell me you had an experience. (In no way flaming anyone for saying that, that's just my opinion.)

Just like on the news how can one claim to be a terriost expert, when they have not been a terriost firsthand to know what really goes on through the mind of said person. Yea, you can study and follow a group, but how can one accurately know what it's like unless you have been one.

Hey jhill- two thoughts

Why does something evil HAVE to be the Devil? Couldn't it be something else? You, along with others here, may have been contacted by an entity from another dimension with malicious intentions. Something not of this world, or our plane of existance, but encounters of this kind don't have to be automatically chalked up to a visit by Lucifer. That's all I'm saying. . . It could have been a manifestation from the dark side of your own thoughts. It could have been something that you ate! LOL

A detective doesn't have to be a criminal to catch them. He/she only has to study & think like one. Virtually they become one, less execution of their own crimes. Same goes for the CSI vs the murderer, the psycologist vs the patient, and yes, even the terrorist expert vs the terrorist. If you're good at what you do in these fields, and many others, then you have virtually become your adversary. Just my opinion though-

I had a bad experience as a kid also, but for me personally, the jury is still out on what exactly happened. I don't know if it was the Devil's minions, trans-dimensional entities, a kid's wild imagination, or something that I ate!

I'm not going to get into it now, but if you like you can read about it here

I tend to agree with MM about a lot of this stuff. If you think about it objectively, there's usually a rational explanation. Especially things that happen in the dark! These ghost hunter shows with the infared light shining up through their face saying " Did you hear that? ". What a joke! A ghost, the Devil, etc., should be able to come right up to you in broad daylight & show itself/do it's bidding.

Not only when it's dark out & you're in your bed half asleep.

Thanx for sharing. Great topic!

2PacSade-

The ones who tell us what we know in our hearts to be true because they can't fit their venomous calipers around it and vehemently chide us are the ones I will pray for.

reply to post by Zane Zackerly


Makes me envious, if I would have turned to prayer immediatly my encounters might have ended as quick as yours, it took me longer to figure it out, but it was prayer and Jesus Christ that chased them off for me also

I find it funny that most atheist do not experience spiritual & supernatural things. It's ironic. Is that to show how powerful the mind is? Meaning, you can bring you beliefs to life somewhat?

Jhill, it's not wrong to question your beliefs. I wish I had a simpler mind. One that wasn't so inquisitive. It would make my life more simple...and probably more happy. I am no athiest, but agnostic. I am also very opne minded. The reason I am agnostic, is because of things that have happened to me that I science cannot prove scientifically...yet, if at all.

I, like MM was a Christian, but I never felt like I deserted Christianity. More like Christianity deserted me...I grew out of religion so to speak. While I was mving orward...religion chose not to keep up. Religion is probably the most 1 dimensional creation created. I'm not saying to drop your beliefs, because honestly, I don't much care. What I will suggest to you is this...find your own beliefs. We all have different beliefs because we all have different expereiences and think differently. Some say...you'll never believe it until it happens to you...which is fine. So, you can't blame someone for not believing your beliefs especially when they have no reason to belive it. Find your own beliefs...and if things happen to change your very own beliefs, grow with them. Keep an open mind. And don't put anything past human behaviour, thought, actions and will. The world is a scary place.

Too smart to believe for long

jhill, I think you will probably agree with me when I say that a major reason why you are wary about questioning - or disengaging from - your faith is fear. 'Am I damning myself? Will I go to Hell? Will the Devil get me?'

I sympathize. In my teens I was both very religious and very frightened of damnation. I was also a martyr to obsessive-compulsive disorder (we called it 'obsessional neurosis' in those days), so for comfort I clung to my Christian belief with frantic tenacity. I was also very superstitious at the time, believing in ghosts, demons, black magic and - of course - Old Nick himself.

In my very late teens the OCD vanished. I began to relax, and started thinking about my long-held beliefs and trying to work out whether there was any real evidence for them, and if they made sense.

I concluded that they did not.

Like Major Malfunction, I next tried all kinds of belief systems on for size. The country I live in has a large Buddhist population, so I tried that among many others, and for a long time it seemed to make some sense to me. Unfortunately, you cannot be a Buddhist without believing in reincarnation (because the principle of karma plainly doesn't work in a single lifetime; we all know good people to whom bad things happen, and bad people who live lives of success, ease and pleasure). The need to import reincarnation into Buddhism to make it credible was the stumbling-block for me. Now I look on Buddhism more objectively and see that it is, in its effects, quite wicked - not as nakedly evil as religions like Islam and Christianity, perhaps, but just as inimical to life as they are.

Meanwhile, I was also receiving a good scientific education. Eventually, what I was learning in the lecture-hall seeped into the rest of my worldview and saved me from any further dabbling in mumbo-jumbo. I am, like MM, a scientific atheist. I will believe nothing without good, reliable evidence.

Now: speaking of evil, I live in a country where one encounters the real thing every day. We have a corrupt, tyrannical government, rampant and murderous racism, terrorism by the state and its opponents, a near-total breakdown of law and order, frequent political and criminal abductions and murders for which no-one is ever brought to justice, a huge child prostitution problem (the majority of customers being European tourists) and... well, the list goes on. So when I hear people getting all portentous and shuddery over their 'encounters with true evil' and it turns out to be just a feeling they had while trying to read their Bible or whatever, I just laugh. These people have no idea what evil is. Evil doesn't come with horns and a tail. Evil comes in only one shape, and that is the human shape. Only human beings and their institutions can ever be evil.

I can see you pulled this way and that by the various opinions expressed in this thread by different people. It must be quite uncomfortable, even unpleasant, to be jerked about like this. But I shouldn't worry; it is clear to me that you are far too intelligent and questioning to stay a believer for long. In a few years' time you'll have outgrown all this god-bothering nonsense and started to live life without fear.

Bon courage, mon ami, et bonne chance.

[edit on 6-1-2008 by Astyanax]

Originally posted by jhill76
Suddenly, I was outside of some elevators. The elevators were big and brownish in color. Next to me, a man walks up, a man with a vibrant, inviting demeanor to him. He asks, "Come with me, once the elevator reaches the bottom floor, there is no turning back."

I found this bit funny. The artist Prince actually addressed this very thing in his song "Let's Go Crazy", of the purple rain album. Prince sings about the devil trying to bring people down via an elevator.

Prince Sings:'when the devil trys to bring you down, go crazy and punch the highest floor.'

Originally posted by depth om
Jesus loves you, he will keep his promise jhill. If you believe he is the son of God... that he died for you, to cleanse your sin, you are granted the keys to the gates of life.

Open your Bible tonight, just open it and I promise you, the first scripture your eyes will see... it will be what you need.

I will pray for you.

Amen. As will I.

The thing to remember is that you're either for Christ or against Him. There's no middle ground. Christians are targeted by demons as are everyone else on the planet - they're either constantly trying to pull you away from truth or keep you away from truth. Break down your faith or keep your faith broken. And paranormal activity can happen to anyone regardless of their religious beliefs as well. Not everything in the spirit realm is bad and it's not all good either. The best thing to do is stay as close as possible to our Father in Heaven who will protect you when called upon.

[edit on 6-1-2008 by ReginaAdonnaAaron]