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Aliens and UFOs; My Views

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posted on Jun, 8 2007 @ 05:49 PM
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So as I look at the UFO and alien phenomena, and read people's accounts of their experiences, I am usually struck by the lack of uniformity in the details of many of the stories. Some maintain that the aliens they allegedly encounter are benevolent, others that they are aggressive. Do they live in the sea? Or the backside of the moon? It appears to me that there is a marked lack of conformity when experiencers relate their stories. There isn't a total lack of conformity...but it becomes evident in the small stuff....actions, appearances, motives, etc. I think the lack of conformity is important in this field.

A normal human, free of mental or physical illness or damage, "groups" perceptions in a totally automatic way. If I see a small object, relatively close by and moving two opposing appendages in an up-and-down fashion while navigating across the sky, I immediately group the object in "bird". If I'm normal I can't help it....it just happens without conscious thought. I may be able to more closely examine the object and sharpen my perception by moving it to "large", then "aquatic", then "shore", then "heron", and finally "Great Blue". Of course, the example is dependent on a person's knowledge of what a Great Blue heron looks like. But the process is true of every single thing perceived by a normal human mind.

So what happens when the normal human mind directly experiences something outside of its frame of reference? It struggles, because it absolutely must group the experience into some kind of understandable world. It might do fine with the big concepts; alive, sentient, etc. But then, as the mind attempts to fine-tune its perceptions, it may falter to find appropriate "groups" and simply use what is most available or strongest. It may choose a group or concept that has been experienced, read in a book, or may even choose some kind of unrealized fear, in order to do what it absolutely must; attempt to make sense of the world. How many of us have had very fleeting experiences, only to fail to register them because the mind had no time or need to frame them? Hmmm..a flickering shadow, briefly in our peripheral vision.... or no recollection of some event in time.....

My theory leads me to think that the phenomena will never be wholly understood. Because it is so far beyond our ability to categorize it, that it remains hopelessly befuddling. I think something is occurring that is so alien....Heh, I can't even express how misunderstood it is.

Uh oh....some events have a high level of agreement and recollection. Roswell, Battle of LA, Rendlesham....all with a large amount of corroborating stories. How is this?

I believe in a collective consciousness. Heck, people seem to learn how to drive vehicles faster nowadays. Does that stuff become instinctive? I believe a large group of people experiencing an occurrence of an alien type can construct a "group" world. This may occur via some mechanism as yet unknown. Clearly, no person wants to be the outsider, and will often agree with the group only to not make waves.

Why are these things and events so alien? Despite its complexity and enormity, the universe is actually a rather uniform place. Galaxies, solar systems, moons, planets, asteroids, etc....found all over the place. I can't think of a thing that we can point at and ask "what the hell is that?"

These alien events occur due to dimensional rifts.

What we percieve as aliens and UFOs are objects, creatures,...whatever, that exist in the same space as us, and from time to time, slip into our existence. Possibly intentionally, most often unintentionally.

They are a naturally occurring phenomena, that have been experienced as fairies, gnomes, succubus, incubus, demons, greys, nordics, etc....

[edit on 8-6-2007 by MrPenny]

[edit on 8-6-2007 by MrPenny]

[edit on 8-6-2007 by MrPenny]



posted on Jun, 8 2007 @ 07:59 PM
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I think your viewpoint is an interesting one shared with some other people who have studied this stuff far longer than I have. Your point of view, that these phenomena are something very hard for us to tangibly understand, and that as a result we tend to create more tangible but fundamentally flawed mythologies, is one shared by some other paranormal investigators. I tend to agree with this as well.

I think your thoughts about how the human mind tries to categorize are spot on. I believe there was one story where a cop insisted he saw an overturned car until it flew away. If this story is true, then in that cop's mind, up until it took off, to his mind, that thing WAS an overturned car. It only failed to categorize when it was blatantly not acting like a car.... A Fascinating element of psychology if it is a true story.

It is possible that whatever it is is beyond our ability to individually comprehend, and that we may never get a handle on it. If there is a group consciousness (i have no opinion on this) then perhaps that is how we reach a consensus, but there is a danger that it is the easiest consensus, not the right answer.

Where we would part in our beliefs would be that I cannot rightly say what the nature of these phenomena is. I just don't have the personal experience to extrapolate.

Is there any event in your life, or somewhere, that leads you to believe in an extradimensional source for the phenomena?

[edit on 8-6-2007 by Ectoterrestrial]



posted on Jun, 9 2007 @ 12:20 PM
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Originally posted by Ectoterrestrial
Is there any event in your life, or somewhere, that leads you to believe in an extradimensional source for the phenomena?


Nothing in particular; but citing your earlier example, who's to say there are no "overturned vehicles" in my recollection? Or anyone's recollection for that matter? I mentioned earlier the "fleeting glimpses" that are so far outside of our frame of reference that the brain can't register them. It would be like they never occurred.

I'm sure these things occur however. I've seen bizarre lights and objects in the sky. I don't know what they were, but at this point, I don't think they came from other planets, solar systems, or galaxies.

I tend to agree with people who cite examples from very early history and art of visits by strange creatures and craft. Possibly thousands of years of history and not one single, concrete piece of evidence? No distinct footprints, scrap of material caught on a fence, nothing? How could these space craft be whizzing around our solar system and atmosphere without one amatuer astronomer crying "Eureka!" with one good indisputable photo? Ever? How can a phenomena with this longevity be so paradoxically fleeting?

These events "wink" into and out of our existence and perception. They are phenomena (I cannot type that word without stopping and going verryyy slllooowwwllyyy) that has some characteristic that allows them to manipulate dimensions and interact with ours.



posted on Jun, 9 2007 @ 01:15 PM
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It seems to me that the sheer number of sightings is a vote for the inter-dimensional theory. These guys need traffic cops so they don't hit each other! Many sightings also suggest the craft are oblivious to where they are. I remember one commercial pilot sighting where a huge cylinder went past the plane at a zillion miles an hour like a freight train going from a to b, puposeful straight line flight, not poking around or hazing the plane.

Also, for the sheer number of sightings, there is no infrastructure: no gas stations or potty stops. (Puhlease nobody tell me 'they don't use gasoline.') You'd think for the large presence there would have to be some sort of logistical and materiel support. To say well, they're underground or under the water is avoiding the issue. We don't know that.

There is that pesky speed of light limit. Perhaps the 'aliens' have found a way around it. That may very well be, but as of today the speed of light is something we 'think' is a constant. IF the inter-dimensional theory is true, that limitation is no longer an issue because 'they' aren't from 'outer space' anyway. It fits.

The High Strangeness Factor also points toward an interdimensional explanation. That includes popping in and out of existence. Maybe it is a [cloak][/cloak] issue, but it is also explained by the inter-dimensional theory as well. It fits. It also gets a lot weirder than this, but I will avoid going there for now.

the 'concern for the planet' observations, which actually started with Adamski, but have been a factor in nearly every contactee explanation since. The usual issue is nuclear explosions harming the planet. Why would they care about Earth? What if their planet is also Earth, at a different dimension, and nuclear explosions have a trans-dimensional quality to them that does hurt the other dimensions? It fits.

I know this is pure speculation, but this is a speculative thread. I have no physical explanation for how an inter-dimensional theory could be explained by science, but I do believe it will be--eventually. I have written on this subject and called it the Synthetic Paradigm which is too long to post here, but click on the link for the pdf file.



posted on Jun, 9 2007 @ 01:25 PM
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Great post.


I believe that "aliens" fly by us in plain sight all the time. I forget the name for it, but sometimes people can't see an object if they have never seen anything like it before.

The best evidence for this is with Christopher Columbus. When he came to the New World, the natives on one of the Carribean islands could not see his ships on the horizon. The ships were floating in plain view, but none of the natives had seen anything like a ship before. The had no knowledge of ships whatsoever. A shaman, while walking the beach, noticed ripples in the water. Being very wise, the shaman knew that something was causing the ripples, so he began to stare out to see. Day and night he stared, and eventually he began to see shapes. After a few days of staring, the shaman could now see the ships clearly. Because he knew something had to be there, he began to see it. After the shaman was fully convinced of what he saw, he told the rest of his people. They all could see the ships once he told them. Because the shaman was such a respected member of the tribe, the people believed what he said whole-heartedly.

I first learned of this true story from an awesome film called What the Bleep do we know.



posted on Jun, 9 2007 @ 01:35 PM
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Originally posted by Uplifted
I first learned of this true story from an awesome film called What the Bleep do we know.


I saw that, too. One wonders how the story got out and back to Europe. :-) The story has also been attributed to Charles Darwin and his voyage in the Beagle, and, I think, some others. However, even if apocyphal, it's still a great point. In "The Teachings of Don Juan," by Carlos Castaneda, he tells of similar situations where he was trying to resolve an object in the desert which turned from a sorcerer to a bush as he tried to slot it into the proper category.

[edit on 6/9/2007 by schuyler]



posted on Jun, 9 2007 @ 02:03 PM
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"Originally posted by Mr.Penny on 9-6-2007@12.20,
" I don't think they come from other Planets, Solar Systems, or even Galaxies".

What do you think they are and where do they come from?
Let me give you a copy of a text/transcript and then when you've read it I invite your comments/views.

People of the Planet Earth you have yet to realise that intelligent life is teeming virtually throughout the Universe in advanced civilisations and levels of developement that would completely defy description.
The countless Billions of Stars that appear in your Astronomers telescopes are only a fraction of the overall magnitude of Infinite Creation.
A Creation that had no beginning nor will there be an end as all Worlds, Stars and even Galaxies function in the orderly pattern of cyclic regeneration.




posted on Jun, 9 2007 @ 02:46 PM
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Originally posted by VISITING
What do you think they are and where do they come from?
Let me give you a copy of a text/transcript and then when you've read it I invite your comments/views.

People of the Planet Earth you have yet to realise that intelligent life is


I know I've seen that quote before. Since I don't care to play Stump the Chump I assume you will enlighten us should you care to continue with the discussion. I suspect you are saying that our visitors DO come from outer space, and what's all this inter-dimensional stuff have to do with it?

One thing to understand about the inter-dimensional theory is that it does not pretend to be inclusive. No one is claiming that it is the ONLY answer to the issues, just that it could explain some of the phenomena we have witnessed. If you ascribe to the nuts & bolts theory (The Star Trek Paradigm) that aliens fly all around the universe and visit us once in awhile, then that's certainly worth talking about and is probably the primary theory today, what most people can understand. If the speed of light gets in the way, well, we've got Warp drive, worm holes, and any number of other ways to 'explain' around the issue. The point is that you can still have Capt. Kirk and also the inter-dimensional theory. They can co-exist without issue.

The problem, though, is that the 'Klingons are not playing fair.' What I mean by that is that there are lots of phenomena that appear to contradict the nuts & bolts theory, that is, if you take the accounts as a whole at face value. The 'High Strangeness' factor of many encounters is one. Reports that aliens are extremely interested in spiritual issues is another. They think of bodies as containers for souls. Strieber (not my favorite truth teller, but oh, well) reports seeing 'dead' relatives interacting with aliens. The popping in and out of space/time thing. All these things need explaining, and the inter-dimensional theory is one idea of how to explain them.

What we are suggesting is that Reality (Capital 'R' Reality) is a lot like the three-dimensional world as described by Edwin Abbott in his novella "Flatland; a Romance of many Dimensions" published in 1884. To a two-dimensional person, three-dimensional interactions are very strange, indeed. Well, what if we are living in the equivalent of Flatland?

This thread, in particular, is discussing this dimensional theory. It is not claiming the other major theories are not correct, so it's not a matter of pitting one theory against another, or of defending one over the other. We're just discussing another 'dimension' of the issue. Savvy?



posted on Jun, 10 2007 @ 12:18 AM
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Originally posted by Uplifted
I believe that "aliens" fly by us in plain sight all the time. I forget the name for it, but sometimes people can't see an object if they have never seen anything like it before.


Quick observation.....how many times have we read "I didn't see anything when I was taking the pictures, but when I had them developed (or loaded to pc, whatever), I saw these things." The camera doesn't care what's in front of the lens. The camera doesn't need to make sense of what it "sees".



posted on Jun, 10 2007 @ 03:51 PM
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This is all interesting but as another poster here pointed out (more subtly) we do need to be careful about the veracity of some of these 'cultural blindness' stories.

For years, anthropologists ran around claiming some people saw less colors because they had less color words, lived without time because they had no Western time concept, etc. Most of that, in the end, turned out to be the dreams of the anthropologists. Not a reality that the 'endearing primitives' ever experienced. It was the last gasps of a kind of romantic paternalism about other cultures.

I just want to make sure we don't go down that path again, here. I think MrPenny's thoughts are more general and apply to all peoples pretty much universally. When we see something off the norm, we mis categorize.

After the event, I think some people kind of enter a rapture state. Others push it down out of their minds.

I'm reminded of the cop who followed a triangle around his area. After he saw it, he stayed up all night in the office filing a 'police report'. IN a way, his 'report' was no differnt than Ezekiel running around trying to explain to people what he saw in the desert. Only Ezekiel lived in an age of beasts and wheels, this cop lived in an age of airships and lights. So their categories carry different metaphors.

Anyways, I've said my piece. I don't want to derail this thread.

[edit on 10-6-2007 by Ectoterrestrial]

[edit on 10-6-2007 by Ectoterrestrial]



posted on Jun, 10 2007 @ 04:03 PM
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I think those theories and assumptions are even more fancy than those of 'believers.'
But thats just me. Sometimes, if something in the sky looks like a plane, it is a plane.



posted on Jun, 11 2007 @ 10:39 PM
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Originally posted by Unplugged
I think those theories and assumptions are even more fancy than those of 'believers.'
But thats just me. Sometimes, if something in the sky looks like a plane, it is a plane.


No doubt, its getting slappy now.
Wanted to beleave, but getting real weird now. Don't even download the you-tube ballon and kite jurk offs anymore, have to beleave whats the problem with us now.
So many can't understand the guilt the burden with such useless lives they live, there has to be more....with the billions of stars...sorry, but get a grip.
We are alone, too bad the answer doesn't come once inside the casket.



posted on Aug, 23 2008 @ 08:17 PM
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This was a brilliant hypothesis. I was able to take it to its logical conclusion. For me, the logical conclusion led me back to something that a very wise man and employee of NASA once told me - "our concept of god is nothing more than natural conformity to the laws of mathematics." It stands to reason that if the OP was possible that eventually we would get there ourselves and be responsible for the actions of other, lesser advanced society. They would view us as godly due to their lack of perception pertaining to our very nature. "no man may understand the nature of god." and all that jazz. However, this is impossible and if someone below the OP pointed this out, I apologize for the reprint. WW2 clinches it. When Germany is bombing London this would be causing deaths in other dimensions, probably being perceived as meteor impacts. The people manipulating the dimensions and influencing our actions would not allow this to happen - period. We would be under STRICT control by whom we would consider god. Nice story, though. It would make for a great read, and it did.

If I could star and flag it, I would. However, I don't have a membership here and I doubt I will be attaining one any time soon. haha. I would spend a great deal of my time in the political forums if I did and I would inevitably violate terms and conditions to the point that I would be outlawed on this site screaming obscenities at the people who have no clue whatsoever.

Off topic now but to justify that statement I must say that I believe that it is not only a right, but a DUTY to inform yourself and the current state of affairs in the world has led us to a point that we don't do this, NOR do we question authority as we should.



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