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Post Situation X Defensive Tactics For Dummies

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posted on Apr, 21 2007 @ 02:02 PM
Well, theLibra asked me to put up a quick diatribe about defensive tactics. Well, here it is. this isn't about what weapon is the best, which gun you should get- it's up to you to get a weapon you're comfortable with. If a hunting rifle is good for you, go for it. The World Wars were fought with bolt actions. If a horseshoe on a rope is your weapon of choice, go nuts. Be aware of your weapon's limitations, and the legality of it in your jurisdiction. Remember- a weapon that gets confiscated and you two years less a day in the pen isn't a damn bit of good on Judgment Day. As a prelude, I will recommend that you have at least one weapon, preferably with a good blade and a sidearm as backup.

Kit 101

For Americans, you really don't have much of an excuse not to have a primary weapon, a sidearm, a good knife, and lots of practice.

However, for those in jurisdictions with strict gun control laws, you might be a little stuck as far as defense is concerned. In the place of firearms, common choices are wood axes, baseball bats, shovels and other miscellaneous bludgeons All the below still applies,however. Good luck.

In addition to personal kit, all members should have at least a small personal first aid kit, easily accessible by first aiders. Two compression bandages per person, at least, in addition to small stuff like band aids. Canteens and camelbacks get bonus points, because fighting is thirsty work. Latex gloves in exterior pockets are also advised, since you don't know what's out there. Blood-borne diseases, dog's a nasty world out there. Why should everyone have first aid supplies on them? well, if you get capped, someone like me is going to come up, pull them out of your webbing, and patch you up as best as possible with YOUR supplies. So make sure they're near the outside.


What this thread IS about is the method in which these devices are applied in order to ensure your safety and the safety of others. There are two basic schools of thought on the subject, not neccesarily exclusive to one another. Both follow natural patterns. Some survivalists advocate a stealthy approach to defence- hope the Bad Guys pass you by, hiding, and generally not attracting attention to yourself in oder to get by. The other school doesn't bother with that- big teeth, big spines. Their objective is of course to make themselves as inhumanly unattractive prey as possible. There are mediums in between- wearing CADPAT in the woods gives you some degree of cam and helps you avoid attention, but the AR15 in your hands might make the Eaters armed with shovels think twice about jumping you.

In either case, this isn't a solo undertaking. Know what a single sentry is? Bait. A single sentry or stray soldier is a freebie. The bare minimum 'safe' number of people in a group is two, and that's dire-straights type situations only. Optimally, survivalists operate in groups between eight to twelve, and no larger. Too many folks attracts attention, too few leaves you vulnerable. For sentry, two is a good number, three is better, four better yet. In a platoon-sized group (Lord forbid you acquire one) a whole section should be on guard every time you stop, bare minimum. For those of you who are lost, this is the unit system conventionally used henceforth: a fireteam is two people, a section eight to twelve, platoon thirty six to fifty. All persons in your group should be paired off, with someone to look after them, into fireteams. A buddy looking out for you doubles your efficiency in the field, trust me.

Some things your group must have to make it at least a properly prickly proposition are a leader, a chain of command, and a medic. Nothing makes a hastily cobbled together group huddle up and cringe like a well disciplined, well armed team working all in unison for a common cause. Discipline is key. After that, you need at least one trained first aider every four people, if at all possible as many first-aiders or paramedics as you can lay your gloves on. People WILL get hurt- slips, falls, cuts, burns, stab wounds, everything. Count on it. Your task, as defenders, is to keep as many people in the fight as possible, under a well-disciplined leader with a clear chain of command. Everyone doing what they want or think is best is a recipe for disaster.

So I've talked about small issues and basics, but you're saying 'this isn't real-world! This is just basic advice for newbies!'. You'd be surprised how often people ignore this as fantasy. I'm talking optimum situations, of course, and when the SHTF, well, you won't have this. You'll have to aim for it.Hell, prepare, how's that for an idea? a group, set an RV, and hope for the best. Good luck, troops.

More to come.


posted on Apr, 24 2007 @ 08:23 AM
Hmm, nobody has replied yet. Well just to let you know, I'm eagerly awaiting the next post
. Particularly some defensive tactics that these organized groups can use.

posted on Apr, 27 2007 @ 10:39 PM
Defensive Movement 101

Firstly, movement across hostile terrain (which is the assumption at any given time) requires a lot of care. The first thing to do is observe the ground if at all possible; signs of battle, wounded animals, or dead persons are generally signs which should be avoided. As well, should you come across pathways that locals avoid for no given reason, or well-used paths that are overgrown or show lack of egress for no visible reason, avoid them as well. There may be snipers, unexploded ordnance, or mines in these areas. Don't laugh, there's always a reason perfectly good paths aren't used.

Secondly, track discipline must be maintained. Walk single file, or in ack-ack formation (alternating single files of ten on either side of the path) in order to disguise the numbers of your party. While moving as above, make sure to leave three rifle lengths between members of your party. This is done to prevent mass casualties from explosions or automatic gunfire. May not always be effective, but better than being shoulder to shoulder.

The order of march should be as such: trooper, 2IC, trooper, trooper, trooper, IC, trooper. Feel free to add in another fireteam of crunchies in front or middle if available. If you're moving with non combatants such as walking wounded, children, or the elderly, put them in the middle of a section in the place of troopers. The center of a section is usually the safest place to be against amateur attackers- the front or rear will take the most hits, and people without weapons are usually low priorities in a firefight.

If or when you hear gunshots, there's five things everyone should do immediately: dash, down, double tap, crawl, communicate. You hear the gunshots, the first thing you do is run three steps. Then, you go prone. If you know where the fire came from, take two shots at the attackers, give them something to think about. either way, you'll crawl away from where you fired from, or to a place where you CAN see where the fire came from. Then, if it hasn't been done already, tell everyone else where the fire is coming from. Simple, eh?

You may come across an open obstacle as well, such as a highway or road, which you may need to cross in order to reach your destination. Three things you need to consider- one, ditches are famously great ambush points. Two, open roads you can be engaged at long distances without the ability to return effective countersniper fire. Three, roads are prone to being blocked or guarded by others, such as emergency forces hellbent on relieving you of your freedom or brigands. This makes road travel singularly dangerous in event of Situation X. I've made a thread entitled Highways of Death which feature other possible and equally unpleasant possibilities. Every road crossed will be dangerous, and there is as such a method to cross that while risky, is less so. Firstly, all your crunchies and their dependents should line the near ditch in the prone position. In a single rank, face the direction of your objective. At either end, you will have one fireteam of troopers, as per standard movement drill. If you're only one section strong, do this instead with just one fireteam instead of two. At a given signal, the selected persons at the end of the line will dash across, keeping as low and fast as possible to a piece of cover (hopefully the other ditch) as selected by the IC. If nothing happens on the way across, wait thirty seconds for the scouts you sent to make sure there are no unpleasant surprises. If there are, then it is your discretion as to the course of action- back them up, or hope they make it back. Either way, you're in it deep. Should nothing happen, in a single rank again, the remainder of the group will charge across at best speed while again keeping low.

As such, it is best to avoid trouble while moving. If the generic Bad Guys do spot you, hopefully your suitably intimidating looks will cause them to think twice about attacking you. If not...well, good luck. Fugees are usually considered easy pickings, so my final piece of advice is to NOT disguise yourself as one.

More to follow.


posted on Apr, 28 2007 @ 03:19 AM
Can't wait to read more, very interesting, will come of use if and when Sit X comes around.

I do qeustion, New Zealand has large spans of country, would they be safe to travel through? they're open etc.. I wouldn't think so myself?

posted on Apr, 28 2007 @ 07:40 AM
If you can, stick to the woods. As for the openness of the country, it's mostly a serious threat because of long-distance rifle fire. As well, there is the concern of being spotted to contend with. I don't know about the gun laws in your country, nor where you'd go since it's such a small country. Remember, in most places there's only one large animal left in abundance for consumption, and it only has two legs.


posted on Apr, 28 2007 @ 12:23 PM

Originally posted by DeusEx

If or when you hear gunshots, there's five things everyone should do immediately: dash, down, double tap, crawl, communicate. You hear the gunshots, the first thing you do is run three steps. Then, you go prone. If you know where the fire came from, take two shots at the attackers, give them something to think about. either way, you'll crawl away from where you fired from, or to a place where you CAN see where the fire came from. Then, if it hasn't been done already, tell everyone else where the fire is coming from. Simple, eh?


Interesting take on reaction to effective enemy fire. British doctorine is a bit more aggressive We call it RTR. Upon coming under fire, we immediately

1. Return fire with 2 rounds in the geneal direction of the enemy. This means in the first second after coming under fire, up to 16 rounds will be fired back towards the enemy (when using an 8 man section).

2. Take cover. This is often broken town into Dash-Down-Crawl-Observe-Sights

3. Return Accurate fire. Change position every shot or two. Move into extended line. Fire control orders as appropriate to indicate enemy positions.

After this the section will act as the situation dictates (fire & manouevre into a decent position, Left/Right flank atack, Firebase etc...).

Good to hear other takes on this. Cheers.

posted on Apr, 28 2007 @ 01:34 PM
Yeah, I sorta half assed the RTR, mostly because they don't have the GRIT or a proper Mcpl or any idea how to do a section attack.

How were you taught to do Aussie Peelbacks? I've learned about four ways. Feel like taking that section, Paddy?


posted on Apr, 28 2007 @ 02:56 PM

Originally posted by DeusEx

How were you taught to do Aussie Peelbacks? I've learned about four ways. Feel like taking that section, Paddy?


What are they? Do they have another name? I'll be happy to spread the knowledge (OPSEC permitting) once I've ID'd the move.

posted on Apr, 28 2007 @ 03:00 PM
Basic fighting withdrawls. I've never heard another term for it, it;s how we were taught to break contact. Break contact drill, then.


posted on Apr, 28 2007 @ 03:16 PM

Originally posted by DeusEx
Basic fighting withdrawls. I've never heard another term for it, it;s how we were taught to break contact. Break contact drill, then.

Gotcha. Right here goes. Assume you're in staggered file. Close contact front.

First bloke goes onto one knee and puts down mass fire. Automatic is best. Combined with UGL bomb is better.

When he's out of ammo, he jumps up, turns around and sprints down the inside of the section, joining at the back of the section. Other variations may include 2 people at a time firing and moving.

Meanwhile his battle buddy has taken over his fire. The rest of the section are putting down rapid semi auto fire to suppress. This move carries on until the section are in position to reorg.

Pros - loads of firepower onto the enemy. Easily controlled movements.

Cons - Slow to move. Heavy on ammo. Big possibility of friendly fire hits on runners.

posted on Apr, 28 2007 @ 03:30 PM
Wow, you guys don't spread out to staggered line facing the enemy? That is a recipe for disaster. We learned way different. For us, spread out as if to being section attack, and the ends go automatic, peel off, while the middle provides cover. repeat, falling back into position, as the people already in the back take careful aimed shots to bolster the guys going full auto on the fallback.

But this thread isn't about advanced infantry tactics, it's about the basics. getting civvies out of harm's way and such. Anything else they should know, Paddy? next weekend I'll post defensive layup.


posted on Apr, 28 2007 @ 04:19 PM
Oops, I should have stated that I was talking about track drills. I thought that I made it clear when I said we were in staggered file. Sorry! The drill is WAY different when you're in open country, and different again in woods/forests. For a start in the open there is no way we'd be in file of any sort. We'd probably be in arrow head or the like. Our break contact drill would be much the same as yours, but we do it as follows -

Contact front

Full section puts down loads of fire. Loads of smoke.

Section breaks down into pairs.

Individual fire and manouvere backwards.

Reorg where possible. Reassess and attack (probably along flanks, but depending on geography) using QBOs.

Hope this clarifies things. All pretty basic but really slick when done properly (as these things should be). I'll chuck a few basic posts up tomorrow. Good thread mate.

posted on Apr, 28 2007 @ 05:33 PM
Excellent thread so far.

Sorry if this is a dumb question, but can you please define "ICs" and "crunchies"? I don't mean to criticize, but I'm sure many other civilians like myself would appreciate if you can try to limit the military jargon so we can have a better understanding of what you mean
. You did a good job of explaining "ack-ack formation" and most other things to the average joe, but there are still some terms that are a bit unclear to someone without any military background like myself. It is supposed to be "For dummies", after all

All of this has really peaked my interest in combat tactics. I think I'll go search the internet for some army manuals. Seems like it would be pretty fun to practice these tactics with a group as well (unarmed obviously, but it would still probably freak out people in the area, seeing 20 people running across the road while keeping low as their team is pretending to cover them
) There is nothing illegal about practicing that kind of stuff in public, is there?

[edit on 28-4-2007 by Yarcofin]

posted on Apr, 28 2007 @ 06:30 PM
IC=in charge. The leader. The boss. The master. the Sandwich Man.
2IC= second in command.

Crunchie is an affectionate term for soldier, particularly infantry. Thanks for the heads-up- remind me and Paddy when we get all cryptic and use acronyms and slang. And yes, it's fine to run around in formation in relish all weekend. We call them paintballers.


posted on Apr, 28 2007 @ 08:16 PM

If you can, stick to the woods. As for the openness of the country, it's mostly a serious threat because of long-distance rifle fire. As well, there is the concern of being spotted to contend with. I don't know about the gun laws in your country, nor where you'd go since it's such a small country. Remember, in most places there's only one large animal left in abundance for consumption, and it only has two legs.

The thing with New Zealand is that, Yes, it is a small coutnry, but we have alot of rural land, were I live I can basically just run across 2 km of country trerrain and over a road and i'm in the hills.

I am not sure about our Gunlaws, need a fire arms license etc..

The majority of our "Woods" are mainly in the hills, New Zealand is a very unique country to live in I must say. New Zealand has tropical like rain forest, woodlands, a desert, snowy and Mountainous terrain, long stretches of beach and country side all within about 30-40km of each other.

posted on Apr, 29 2007 @ 07:22 AM
River crossing for 30 odd blokes. Lots of this is taken from british jungle techniques, so excuse me if I branch off into army speak. For this routine the team is broken into 3 teams.These are near bank, ciVVies and far bank. Routine is as follows


This drill applies to take Individual and Planned River Crossing, River Crossing - Pairs and 4/6 Man Raft. There are six stages:

a. Recce.

b. Preparation of kit.

c. Observation.

d. Final approach and crossing.

e. Exit and clearing bank.

f. Move out.

The Recce. The patrol commander should have done his map recce and selected possible crossing points. A 2-man recce will go forward; this normally consists of the patrol commander and lead scout. Points to look for on the recce are:

a. Checking for enemy sign or movement.

b. The best crossing point, it is essential that the patrol is able to get out on the far bank.

c. To find a good covered approach to the crossing point.

Preparation of kit. Depending on the situation, this may be done at the same time as the recce.

a. All kit should be placed inside the waterproof bags inside the bergen. Inflate lilo, empty water bottles. Weak swimmers can place a lilo under their shirts.

b. Radios, medical packs and other essential kit should be water-proofed and put in a day sack ready to be attached on top of the raft or bergen.

c. Para cord prepared on weapons.

d. Karabiners attached to bergen (rucksack) frames.

e. Poles cut for raft assembly (remember noise and sign must be to a minimum) if using the raft method.

Observation. Once the kit has been prepared, the patrol will move to a location closer to the crossing point where the area can be observed and the raft assembled if required.

Final approach and crossing. Move tactically forward to the crossing point, after a final briefing from the commander, making sure that everyone knows what job he is doing and what his position is. He will also give the ERV for the far bank.

The crossing (Pairs method). The following drill must be observed:

a. The near bank section cover 2 patrol members as they enter the water, cross to the other side, exit and take up fire positions using good cover. They will have a strong line that they will secure to a tree on the far bank.

b. The civvies will now cross, while secured to the line using carbiners (if available) or loop lines. Once they are across, the near bank section follows, with the last man being pulled across on the rope. This secures the rope for later use.

c. During the crossing observe both banks up and down river.

d. Enter and exit the water quickly and quietly, leaving no sign.

e. Keep together.

f. Listen for patrol craft.

g. Weapons are tied to bergens by quick release knots.

h. Do not splash the water.

The crossing (Raft method).

a. One man acts as sentry, one man slides into the water, but not too far; he checks up and down and across the river and then gives the all clear.

b. The others guide the rafts into the water, all have eye to eye contact. The raft, half in, half out, if the current is fast.

c. Weapons are tied to raft by quick release knots.

d. The Sentry covers up the sign as he moves into the water, he then ties his weapon on to the raft.

e. When the commander has seen that everyone is ready, he will then give the go ahead to cross the river.

f. Swim across without splashing and watching all round.

Exit & clearing the bank. On reaching the bank, one man unties his weapon, gets out and clears the immediate area. If all is OK, he will remain on Sentry. If the situation is not good, he can slip back into the water and then the patrol can move off down stream to another exit point. Once the Sentry gives the thumbs up, the remainder can manoeuvre the raft out and up the bank into cover. The last man will cover up any sign.

The Commander will rebrief the men who are quickly taking apart the raft if the situation has changed. Once the bergens are apart, the patrol will move out into all round defence, while the Commander takes the Sentry's bergen over to him and also rebriefs him if necessary. Check for any dropped articles - line etc.

Move out. As soon as the raft (if used) has been taken apart and each individual is ready with his bergen, the patrol will move out to a secure area to readjust kit and to hide the poles.


The following should be briefed in advance:

a. Who is cover praty/sentries.

b. ERV on both banks.

c. Actions on contact.

d. Wounded and injured men.


a. Remember the patrol commander must let everyone know who's doing what and where they are to go.

b. The recce is the most important part, you must be able to get out on the far bank.

c. The final approach must be tactical.

d. The raft must not come apart in mid stream.

e. All sign must be covered up.

f. Move away as quickly as possible.

If you can condition yourself at an early stage to cross water obstacles rather than look for the "easy way" you may be fairly sure of avoiding trouble. The man who decides to stay dry "just this once" will be the one wearing a third eye or being given special treatment by a hunter force or Interrrogation Centre.

[edit on 29-4-2007 by PaddyInf]

posted on Apr, 29 2007 @ 08:45 AM
The above is prettymuch the word-for-word way we were taught to do crossings. Things you may not know:

ERV= Emergency Rendezvous
recce= reconnaisance

Alright, prepping your kit for takes about ten minutes if you've packed properly. In any event, you should have dry sacks or garbage bags in every compartment of your ruck just to keep the surprise rainstorm or whatnot from making you into a shivering wreck because all your kit gets soaked. Once this is done, and the garbage bags tied off tight, get your bivy sacks. What? You've never heard of one, or don't own one? Bad! just walk into your local surplus store and get one on the cheap. Make sure it has no holes.

Alright, the fun part. Take your rucksack (or bergan, for my distant Commonwealth homeboys) in put it in there at the bottom. Now, take all the air out of the empty bits, and twist the top until it hits your ruck. Then, tie it off nice and secure. Voila. You're be surprised how buoyant the things are. Place it soft-part up in the water, your rifle or other weapon on top, and start kicking your legs. If you or a friend have a pool, try it in there.

Good work, Paddy. I wouldn't have thought of the water-obstacle crossing.


posted on Apr, 29 2007 @ 01:28 PM
Boys, just a reminder, recce tactics are still concidered Top Secret by our military and i assume by others too. So i advice that we shouldn't share exact routines for crossing roads etc. Loose lips sink ships and so on...

I could teach you effective routines for small unit clandestine ops in wooded terrain, but i won't put them out in public, because some day my life may depend on those (War).

On a general base for a 3-8 men section, unless you know that you are aproaching hostiles, use a file formation with 20-50m in between the troopers. It's 2-times faster than arrowhead or line. Plus it's the hardest to detect.

Ps.Speed kills in recon, pray for the Motorcycle scouts

posted on Apr, 29 2007 @ 01:45 PM
NW, as you can see all things posted so far are things that you learn in Movement 101 in basic. We're not teaching anything not already in survival manuals.

But, dude, wtf. Motorcycles?

Even we don't use them anymore.

As I've said, this is defensive tactics for civvies and militia numb from the shoulders up. nothing beyond the basics, so don't worry.Do you have anything to contribute as things pertain to arctic training?


posted on Apr, 29 2007 @ 03:29 PM
Well, as for winter ops, basics are to make false tracks every now and then try to conceal your real route by camoflaguing the tracks. This applies to both skis and foot trails. Thick bushes are a great place to make a hop from false track to your real direction. Be creative on the use of false tracks and read some indian stories...

General rule is to move in a very spread out formation if you wish to avoid detection and only tighten up if you need the firepower. Is you know what you are doing, It's your call to open fire, not the enemys.

Ps. Motorcycle and a grunt is a lesser loss than an APC and full squad. Not all of us are expecting satellite data or air support.

PPs. Kneel down when ever you stop in woods, most detections are made at above waist height.

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