When does a number become so large it's infinite?

The answer is never.
The following, I believe, proves God's existance and His law.
What is a greater number? 1 or 4?
One would be inclined to say 4, right?
But let's look at it this way. If you had 1 machine, that was put together with 4 parts, then the 1 becomes greater than 4.
Same concept in teamwork. A group comes together for the purpose of 1.
Now, where did math come from?
The earliest example I can find (and please correct me if I'm wrong) is in the bible. It explain how Noah was 600 years old and 50 years later he was 650. There. God gave us the concept of math, and time in one swoop.
Now, since infinity does not exist, what is God's number.
God=1.
You=1, you are created in the image of God
Anything less than 1 (except fractions of 1)=0. 0=nothing.
So 1-1 does not equal 0. 1-1=1. 0 doesn't exist.
Binary. 1=on, 0=off. Now, if you turn on a light, the light is on, right? Does it matter how long it's on to consider it on. No, the lights is either on or off. Now if you turn the light off, does the light not exist. No, it's just not lit.
So if your 99 years old and you have a birthday, you are 100 yrs old but you are STILL, 1
There are 250,000,000 people in the US.
IF 250,000,000=1, there would be nothing greater.
So no matter how great one thinks they are, they still equal 1.
Let's get back to the lightbulb. When you turn it off, where does the light go? It still exists, just in different form. So you see, when you die, you still exist, only in different form.
We are all like parts to a machine. When all the parts work together, the machine works beautifully. When we don't work together, the machine breaks down.
I put forth that science, math and faith are all ONE.

Hi stompk,

I've ready your post three times and find it very difficult to understand. Let me highlight some things that perhaps you can clarify:

1. What does it mean to ask what is a greater number? On what basis would we judge "greatness". The numbers 1 and 4, independant of any relation of measure, are relatively meaningless.

2. Your analogy of 4 parts making 1 machine is somewhat unclear, but if I interpret you right, what you are saying is that on one hand we can interpret the numbers 1 and 4 to be measuring discrete things, e.g. 4 apples are more than 1 apple. However, we can also say that, for example 4 cylanders make up 1 engine, and hence the 1 engine is "greater". (Perhaps because the 1 engine is functional?) In anycase, all that has happened here is to equivocate the meanings of the terms 1 and 4 between the two sets of examples. I'm not sure where that gets us.

3. Aspects of mathematics have been discovered all over the world by most of the world's developed cultures. It certainly isn't an invention of the writers of the Bible. Here's a good link to learn more:

www-groups.dcs.st-and.ac.uk...

4. Why doesn't infinity exist? What do you mean be infinity? This has been a pivotal concept in philosophy, theology and mathematics for centuries. Take a look at this discussion of the topic:

en.wikipedia.org...

5. Why would God = 1? What does that mean?

6. Um, how do you get that 1-1=1? And what do you mean be 0 (zero)? Zero in mathematics and logic can mean a lot of different things. It can mean the abscence of something measurable, (Zero apples on the table), or it can mean a null in certain cases (I don't live in an apartment, so I put nothing(zero) down in the Apartment field of a loan application.)

Another good article on the concept of zero:

en.wikipedia.org...

I have to admit your forays into physics and birthdates are a bit mysterious.

You seem very eager in your discussions. If you would like to read a more "sublime" account of how science, math, and faith all come together, run out today and check out a copy of Spinoza's ethics. This link takes you to an old 19th century translation of his work. I personally recommend the Edwin Curley translation press.princeton.edu.... He also has a good introduction to Spinoza called Behind the Geometric Method

Spinoza is very difficult, but very rewarding as well.

Best,
Toromos

This was a vision that came to me this morning in another thread, so I started a new thread and continued the vision.
Humor me.
If 1 apple is a snack, 4 apples are a meal. 4 indivuals come together to make a greater whole. Does that mean that 1 apple is less valuable that the 4 apples together. No, because without the one, there would be none.
Infinity is a concept that we don't understand. But since we don't like to admit that there are things that we don't understand, we call infinity a truth, even though we can't prove it. Why?
God = 1 because He says so. In the bible He says He is the One God.
If I am to believe this, then he is not infinite, but 1.
I have to go. I'll continue later...

stompk your viewpoint is only limited and once you are enlightened/realized you too can be at 1....

[edit on 20-4-2007 by thirty3]

Originally posted by stompk
The answer is never.
The following, I believe, proves God's existance and His law.

Well, then I guess Issac Newton kicks God's butt, because he was able to encapsulate and manipulate infinities using Calculus. Like to know more? Visit your local high school or college!

I hope I can break this down into something everyone can understand here. infinity is not a tangible number, its an word used to describe the furtherest point of your mental parameters mathematically. You can't add, subtract, or divide infinitey.

lol, when you make statements like that! seriosly, how about 0=infinity?
there is a a total gap between the finite and the infinite , be careful! no number no matter how large will ever equal the infinite. Infinite is not a number - it is a con-cept. Larger minds than yours have gone completely over the bend trying to figure this out, be careful! ugh! I have a headache!

Originally posted by Saq Madiq

Originally posted by zysin5
I hope I can break this down into something everyone can understand here. infinity is not a tangible number, its an word used to describe the furtherest point of your mental parameters mathematically. You can't add, subtract, or divide infinitey.

"Furtherest"? WTF?? Are you some kind of illiterate mental midget or something? Buy a damned dictionary, you cretin!

yeah sometimes sarcasim can be hard to express in such a serious debate about counting to infinity. Mostly saying infinity is the furtherest.. like saying as a child infinity + 1 and so forth

π

I like pie!


yup yup

The answer to your question is elementary....
NEVER.......

If you can quanitify the number you are adding to in the first place then it must be by definiton a finite number and adding an additional finite number to another finite number will give you....... you guessed it....... another finite number......

Mathematics (generally) deals with manipulation of finite quantities.

INFINITY is then more conceptual then practical....
And by definition adding or subtracting anything from it neither increases or deminishes it....... or probably even devides it for that matter (think about that!!!)............
So you can never make a finite quantity infinite simply by adding to it (another finite amount) ......
Because you would never have enough time to do so and i think if you stop and think about it for a second,,,, its not hard to see this....

So the only number you can add to a finite number to make it infinte is an infinite number!!!!!
I would argue that numbers are like obstractions which dont lend themselves to being considered in infinite terms.....

Man, I gotta object, or else Cantor was a total idiot. You can say that if you want....

en.wikipedia.org...

not only are there differnt KINDS of infinities but they certainly ARE subject to mathematical theories ( Godel not withstanding...oops)

1 is the only number.....
Math is only an avenue to the truth. The truth lies with 1. Those that understand this understand the universe. It is not ifinite. Zero's do not exist. 1+1 could equal 1,000,000 if we understood time. Don't underestimate your value.

What is the smallest thing? Ever?
And what makes up the smallest thing?

Can anyone say what the smallest thing is?

Wiki. Yes I have etc?

Where does it stop? Like space is it endless?

Infinite?

No wonder we only use 1-10% of our brains.

XxTOMxx

Originally posted by WhiteWash
π

I like pie!

yup yup

I am MENTAL! No really.

The drugs I've been on, and taking!

XXTOMxx

*shrug*
Maths deals with Infinity all the time. It's a well defined concept.

1 / 0 = ∞

God divided by Oblivion equals Infinity.
Whatever the heck that means.

∞ - 1 = ∞

Infinity minus God still equals Infinity.
So, remove God and nothing changes.

Emjoi, thanks for your post.
If you are 1
infinity-1=0 (to you)
We use infinity to explain a concept we don't understand, so that we don't look like we don't understand the concept. Why is that? Why not say, I don't know. I'd be glad to look into it, but for now I don't have that answer. That's the problem with too much education. One starts to think they have all the answers, or at least, starts to act like they have all the answers so that they don't look "uneducated".
We have strived for a long time to understand our purpose and existance through science, math and numbers, yet we still don't understand the simplest of numbers,
1

A number cannot be infinite by definition. Numbers are simply our way of defining what we observe to be separate objects. Everything in this universe is connected on a subatomic level, so not only are the two apples actually one, but they are also a part of you and me, and everything else in the universe.

[align=center][size=10]One[/align]

Originally posted by stompk
The answer is never.
The following, I believe, proves God's existance and His law.
What is a greater number? 1 or 4?
One would be inclined to say 4, right?
But let's look at it this way. If you had 1 machine, that was put together with 4 parts, then the 1 becomes greater than 4.
Same concept in teamwork. A group comes together for the purpose of 1.
Now, where did math come from?
The earliest example I can find (and please correct me if I'm wrong) is in the bible. It explain how Noah was 600 years old and 50 years later he was 650. There. God gave us the concept of math, and time in one swoop.
Now, since infinity does not exist, what is God's number.
God=1.
You=1, you are created in the image of God
Anything less than 1 (except fractions of 1)=0. 0=nothing.
So 1-1 does not equal 0. 1-1=1. 0 doesn't exist.
Binary. 1=on, 0=off. Now, if you turn on a light, the light is on, right? Does it matter how long it's on to consider it on. No, the lights is either on or off. Now if you turn the light off, does the light not exist. No, it's just not lit.
So if your 99 years old and you have a birthday, you are 100 yrs old but you are STILL, 1
There are 250,000,000 people in the US.
IF 250,000,000=1, there would be nothing greater.
So no matter how great one thinks they are, they still equal 1.
Let's get back to the lightbulb. When you turn it off, where does the light go? It still exists, just in different form. So you see, when you die, you still exist, only in different form.
We are all like parts to a machine. When all the parts work together, the machine works beautifully. When we don't work together, the machine breaks down.
I put forth that science, math and faith are all ONE.

LoL,

If infinity did exist (and it does) how many would there be?

Thats right, just one

Basically, "infinity" means without end. It is not a number, but it denotes more than any number you can think of. In most mathematical systems, the result of multiplying a number by a non-number (including infinity) is not defined. Thus, x+infinity, x*infinity, etc., are not defined or meaningful. (However, there are some strange and interesting systems called "advanced algebras" where you might define such a result. Sometimes it is useful to do so.
It is true that some infinities are larger than others. Consider first the set of all integers (the number 0 and all of the positive and negative whole numbers). Consider next the set of just the positive whole numbers. Both sets are infinitely large, but the set of positive numbers is clearly larger than the set that includes both positive and negative numbers. If you set aside zero, the set of + and - numbers is twice as big as the set of just positive numbers. For each one of the positive integers, there is both a positive and a negative number in the larger set. In fact, the set of just positive numbers is a subset of (contained completely within) the set of + and - numbers ... but they are both infinitely large.
When we count things, like say stars, we asign to each of them an integer (1,2,3,...), even though we will never be able to count them all. We call sets like this "countably infinite." By contrast, the set of all numbers, including fractions, is "uncountably infinite." Hence, there are small infinities and large infinities. They are large or small relative to each other, but all of them are still never ending.