Is there a correlation between UFO/ET debunkers and Global Warming debunkers?

It seems that those acquaintances of mine who do not believe in the existence of UFO's/ET's also do not believe that our planet is in the mist of a Global Warming.

If you ask why they do not believe in any of this stuff, they say it's all hogwash and that there is no proof to back any of these 'conjectures' up.

Yet, interestingly enough, when I asked if they believe that there is a God, I've found that most are occasional church goers.

I found this surprising because even though they believe in God/religion -- something that does not lend itself to immediate hard-core proof, they apparently pick and choose whatever else they believe in regardless if something is in fact backed up by ample evidence that lend proof to their existence. In this case, UFO's/ET's and Global Warming.

So why the discrepancy?

I see a lot of these same type of illogical discrepancies right here on this board all the time where there are many of those who do believe that UFO's are from other 'world's' -- where many of them also think the Roswell case is one of the best ones out there, yet when pressed if they believe in ET's or not, they seem to laugh and scoff that there are such things -- especially when people start up threads as to the existence of several kinds of ET's that are supposedly visiting us. It's in threads like these where you see these same people go into attack mode and do everything in their power to debunk the existence of ET's, let alone various 'kinds' of them.

These same people also go into 'debunk mode' when presented with UFO photographs or video's showing odd shaped UFO's that fall outside of those more common shaped UFO's e.g. saucers, triangles, orbs.... So once again, we are seeing a picking and choosing of what they believe is real or not based on their preconceived notions on how things should be and not how things actually are -- as seen in some photo's and video's. In fact in those cases, they conveniently determine that those images of those anomalous objects are fake, CGI, blimps, weather balloons or whatever -- even when such objects don't even remotely resemble any of those objects. Amazing.

I don't know, all of this is just so perplexing to me and I'm still trying to understand where some of these people are coming from. In my mind, you can't believe that UFO's are from other worlds other than our own and then NOT BELIEVE IN ET'S.

Just like when it doesn't make sense when some people believe in God and some kind of religion -- things that are not backed up by hard-core proof yet on the other hand, these same people do not believe that UFO's/ET's and Global Warming are real phenomena's and/or events regardless that there's ample information out there that shows the contrary.

At any rate, this all boils down to one thing. If a UFO were to land on the White House lawn where ET's would then present themselves to us and ask someone to "TAKE ME TO YOUR LEADER" --you can bet your boots that if that leader were George W. Bush, the news of this 'landing' would never see the light of day. Lol, think about that one!








[edit on 6-4-2007 by Palasheea]

I believe in UFOs. I however do not buy alot of the propoganda associated with global warming, although I do not deny there is definity climate change going on. I am Pagan in religous beliefs.

Christians usually are against the idea of UFOs because they usually believe that earth is the only living planet God created, and that because their religon is the only truth, there simply cannot be anything like UFOs.

Christians also tend to be less concerned about the environment, depending on their denomination. Many do not see it as a concern, that either it is man's right to do whatever they want to nature because God put them in charge. Or they see environmental disaster as proof of the end times, and believe its a good thing meaning Jesus is coming.

Of course, there are numerous Christians that accept the possibility of ET life, and who do feel the environment is important, and alot of skeptics who debunk or disbelieve in either are agnostic or athiest.

Thanks for your comments! I'm sure there are some exaggerations out there having to do with Global Warming but if you live up north, like I do, where it's very apparent that our summer's here have dramatically gotten hotter as each year goes by, I'm absolutely certain the Global Warming is fact and not fiction.

Also, I just wanted to add that non-denominational Christians of the Fundamental/Evangelistic kind, absolutely DO BELIEVE that there are UFO's and ET's out there but they believe that they are 'of the devil'. I know this because I'm surrounded by fundamentalists and you should see how they go to great lengths to prove that their beliefs on this are the only true ones where they back everything up with biblical scripture that's been taken out of context, twisted, distorted and slanted to support their beliefs on this.

[edit on 6-4-2007 by Palasheea]

I don't see a correlation between UFO and Global Warming debunkers.

Almost everyone understands that global warming and cooling happens. The disagreement seems to be what effect modern mankind is playing here in the early part of the warming period we're now experiencing.

Most people feel that there is intelligent life beyond Earth, but I've never seen a scientific poll stating what percentage of the population believes that intelligent life is visiting the Earth on an ongoing basis.

There are believers and debunkers spread over the spectrum between these two issues. Personally, I believe that Intelligent life is out there, but not convinced that it's interacting with Earth's biosphere at this time. Global Warming-Cooling will happen many times over Earth's life regardless of what we do or don't do. The big question is, what percentage of the global temperature increase over the past 100 years are we responsible for? This caclulation is more complicated than mankind is capable of solving right now. Check out this website if you want your head to spin without having a drink. en.wikipedia.org...
-cwm

I lvie in southern England. Last year's summer was like the tropics. So yeah, i definitely believe there is some climate change going on.

What I don't believe is all the politically motivated crap thats blowing it out of proportion or claiming humans are the sole cause. the Earth has gone through drastic climate changes since it first had an atmosphere. No car driving humans were around during the end of the last ice age, when the global ice sheet melted so fast, that the English Channel was created in only 50 years. Before that, britain was part of mainland Europe.

There is also major global warming being documented all over the solar system. This leads me to believe that the current climate change is most likely solar driven. there are documented periods in written human history where the sun's activity has directly caused major cooling and warming. During Roman times Britain was warm enough that vineyards were grown up near Hadrian's wall. Yet amazingly, there was not massive environmental destruction, and Britain is still above sea level. back in the 1970's, the world's top scientists were talking about global cooling and an ice age that was gonna wipe us all out. They cant even make up their mind how we are all gonna die!

No, I believe the current global warming scare is basically fear mongering nonsense that is mostly politically motivated. Scientists are just as political as the rest of us, and many do have agendas.

This however does not mean I don't care about our environment. I think we should find new fuels and cut down emissions from cars, but for different reasons. Cars create smog, which is bad for living creatures breathing it. I also want to see us get off middle eastern oil dependance. but as far as environmental fears, climate change is not one of them. I think the real environmental concerns should be reckless deforestation, pollution of water, genetic engineering plants and animals, overuse of toxic crap in farming, inefficient and wasteful farming, large amounts of toxic disposable garbage used in everyday life, and poaching and destruction of wild animals for money or pleasure.

But global warming a great threat? No. Nature changes climate at a whim too. Its all scare mongering.

I find more evidence of UFOs and alien abductions than I find in the doomsday portents of the enviro-commies who are telling us were all gonna die in 50 years.

Thanks carewemust... I'll read that article.
Also, not that I'm drawing any conclusions here, but I am seeing that correlation that I mentioned here in your own viewpoints on ET's (if they are visiting us or not) and if Global Warming ( in it's popular most well-known usage -- as defined by those who are mostly crediting man as the chief culprit of this 'process'). Granted that each are unrelated, from the information you've shared with us here:
ET's are visiting us - neg.
Global Warming is man-made - neg.
Hence are supporting my contention that there are correlations between each of these unrelated phenomena's in that many who do not believe that ET's are visiting us ALSO do not believe that Global Warming is man-made.

Originally posted by Skadi_the_Evil_Elf
I lvie in southern England. Last year's summer was like the tropics. So yeah, i definitely believe there is some climate change going on.

What I don't believe is all the politically motivated crap thats blowing it out of proportion or claiming humans are the sole cause. the Earth has gone through drastic climate changes since it first had an atmosphere. No car driving humans were around during the end of the last ice age, when the global ice sheet melted so fast, that the English Channel was created in only 50 years. Before that, britain was part of mainland Europe.

There is also major global warming being documented all over the solar system. This leads me to believe that the current climate change is most likely solar driven. there are documented periods in written human history where the sun's activity has directly caused major cooling and warming. During Roman times Britain was warm enough that vineyards were grown up near Hadrian's wall. Yet amazingly, there was not massive environmental destruction, and Britain is still above sea level. back in the 1970's, the world's top scientists were talking about global cooling and an ice age that was gonna wipe us all out. They cant even make up their mind how we are all gonna die!

No, I believe the current global warming scare is basically fear mongering nonsense that is mostly politically motivated. Scientists are just as political as the rest of us, and many do have agendas.

This however does not mean I don't care about our environment. I think we should find new fuels and cut down emissions from cars, but for different reasons. Cars create smog, which is bad for living creatures breathing it. I also want to see us get off middle eastern oil dependance. but as far as environmental fears, climate change is not one of them. I think the real environmental concerns should be reckless deforestation, pollution of water, genetic engineering plants and animals, overuse of toxic crap in farming, inefficient and wasteful farming, large amounts of toxic disposable garbage used in everyday life, and poaching and destruction of wild animals for money or pleasure.

But global warming a great threat? No. Nature changes climate at a whim too. Its all scare mongering.

I find more evidence of UFOs and alien abductions than I find in the doomsday portents of the enviro-commies who are telling us were all gonna die in 50 years.

You sure have this all thought out and I'm really impressed by the information you've shared with us here. I will take time to research on some of your points which I'm sure are valid. It's an interesting topic and there are so many different opinions on it, it's enough, just like carewemust said, to make your head spin out to the cosmos!

But having said this, I nevertheless do see some discrepancies and contradictions in some of the things you are saying but I'm just out the door now and when I get back in a half hour or so, I'll read everything over and point out those contradictions that I'm seeing here.

Thanks once again for your comments and talk later!

[edit on 6-4-2007 by Palasheea]

Ill be here waiting then!

Hi I'm back.

Well, in keeping the main thought on what this topic is about. It appears that in your case:
ET's visiting our planet -- positive
Global Warming (as it's understood in it's most well-known usage) -- neg.

Lol, so you are one of those individuals who fall outside of my small informal sample.


Anyway, it's already known that in the past, it was only those renegade scientists who were focusing on Global Warming where it was known that most scientists, since they work either for major corporations or universities (of which all depend on funds from major corporations to finance their research), backed off from supporting those Global Warming theories so as not to jeopardize their jobs and/or incur the wrath of the hand that feeds them.

At any rate, could you list some of the 'political' reasons why so many esteemed scientists out there are agreeing with the premise that humans are the main culprit of Global Warming?



[edit on 6-4-2007 by Palasheea]

Sure.

First of all, the cooperations aren't the only ones with special interests. Scientists back then werent pretending global warming didn't exist; they simply believed they had evidence the planet was cooling.

have you ever seen the documentary, the Great Global Warming Swindle? they aired it on BBC, which surprised me, as the BBC tends to be one of the media outlets promoting global warming hysteria. Anyways, it was great.


The Great Global Warming Swindle

One of the guys they interview was one of the original founders of Greenpeace. He stated that one of the big motivational factors behind all the global warming hype was anti-Western/anti-Capitalist agendas, especially anti-American ones. The whole global warming thing took off shortly after the fall of communism. basically, the Western Doctrine was proven superior to the Marxist one Thus, all these former Marxist/capitalist sympathizers lsot their big arguement, and saw the fall of what they considered the only future for civilization. many then infiltrated the environmental movement and begin moving on with new ways to attack "Western Imperialism" since no one was buying the Marxist Utopia crap anymore.

Greed isn't the only agenda that motivates dishonest political tactics. the so called "environmentalists" and "leftists" are just as dogged, crooked, self serving, and corrupt as "the Man". they are capable of political corruption, payoffs, blackmail, ect.

I saw this film and all it really did was confirm both my scientific and political suspicons on the true nature of the global warming doom-monger crowd.

Here is the video

Google Video Link

Thanks for the info... will view that video now to see where you are coming from.

Hope you find it inforitive. In the end, you must make your own descisions. But this program does give an opposing arguement against.

I have always been skeptical of the global warming scare because of what I have learned about climate and earth's history. but watching this program, It was nice to know I wasn't stupid or alone in my conclusions.

It really is a new religon/political ideology that is not doing the environment any favors, thats for sure.

Hmmm, well let me watch the rest of this video on this. I was not prepared to debate if Global Warming is real or not because based on my own research on this, the information on it speaks for itself.

However, I'm also aware that there are militant extremists out there where enviromentalism is not only something that they focus on but that it's also like a religion to them. And like all fundamentalists of any belief system or point of view, you find a grossly distorted offshoot of whatever the original source of that information was or came from where it's ends up a dramatic departure from that original information source.

I think it's a mistake to brush off information about Global Warming just because there are some extreme factions out there who are misrepresenting those facts inherent in those theories posited by adherents (mainstream non-fanatical scientists) of the Global Warming view point.

But what ever the case maybe, I think when it comes to Global Warming and what most experts are now saying about it -- it's best to err on the side of caution and begin to consider that they in fact may be on the right track. If they are wrong, then so be it. But if they are right, at least we will have begun to do those things necessary to at least give us more time here on this planet. Right now, things are looking rather bleak no matter if we believe in Global Warming or not... hope I'm wrong about this but my gut feeling is that I'm not.

I disagree. It is not best to err on the side of caution to appease a bunch of ex-marxists, especially when their "solutions" will certainly keep the developing coutnries in the stone age.

And furthermore, the hard imperical evidence shows that the man-made global warming theory is based on shaky science, if any. the majority of "research" I have seen on man made climate change basically relies on computer models. The geo-records are more solid.

I strongly suggest watching the rest of the video. it is valid towards this discussion, as simply because a person does not buy into the man-made global warming crap, does not necessarily mean they are closed to other possibilities.

In my case, there is far stronger evidence against it than anything, and when I smell a political agenda buried in the guise of science, whether it be leftist or rightwing, I question not only its validity, but also the possible results of following false data.

You may be surprised to know that the Nazis were environmentalists. They called it the Volk. It was less a way of preserving the environment than meting out entitlement to it, according to race or class. True to the idea of women being closer to the earth it even extended to them. An SS officer was taught that he was part of a master race. There were even breeding programs set up wherein German women were bred to them to propagate their gene pool. Many of those children ended up in orphanages.

The oil companies started the Sierra club, so it's not that unusual for a misinformation program utilizing the appearance of collusion with supernatural to propragate environmentalism or oncoming catastrophe as part of the program to instill fear. Fear increases suggestibility and environmentalism can be used to curtail a citizens sense of entitlement to resource.

I have personally seen an intelligently designed object that could pass matter through matter, and unless someone on earth has designed such a thing, I have no doubt there are intelligent creatures utilizing advanced technology to keep an eye on earth. I wasn't alone but conversing with a friend when it flew through the closed window and wooden frame and hovered above us for an undetermined amount of time. It was a perfect sphere, metallic looking with a circumference of multi colored lights. A probe, one imagines. After it took us in for a bit, it left out the closed window. True to shock and the strange reactions associated with UFO's all we said was - "Oh, we've had company" and returned to our conversation as though nothing had happened. I've had many other unexplainable experiences, none of which are explained away easily, but I can say with some certainty, I have never been abused by Grays.

I have no doubt the environment is in trouble, and that cars are the single greatest contributor to CO2. Every year their number grows exponentially. I've not yet seen the movie, 'Who killed the electric car' about the mass disposal of a line of manufactured electric vehicles that were set to be marketed, but it's not hard to imagine it was done on behalf of a loose affiliation of millionaires whose lifestyle's depended on the sale of gasoline.

Facts present the inarguable global economic situation that has returned all industrial practices to a dark age of unregulated toxic waste.

What does need to be debunked is the amount of misinformation, or partial information and deluded hypocrisy that parades as enlightenment.


[edit on 6-4-2007 by clearwater]

Well this is all VERY interesting. I'm finding out new things here now that I didn't know before about the enviromentalist movement that certainly causes one to pause.

Thanks for the info and will do my own research on this. -- not finished with that video yet but find some of what it's saying -- plausible.

Towards the end of the video they bring up one of your arguements, about playing it safe and following the man-made global warming rhetoric just to be safe.

The problem with this is of course places like Africa, rich in fossil fuels, are being hammered by western Environemtalists telling them not to develop their resources but rely on solar panels and such. The problem is, Africa is tired of beng third rate and wants to join the industrial world. They want to develop. they want good economies, they want to be able to live like the west does. they wanna see their kids grow up healthy. they want to have western life-expectancies.

This aint gonna happen running on wind and solar power. Its the condescending arrogance of western leftist/Envirnmentalists who seem to glamorize a peasant lifestyle that Africans themselves which to grow out of.

Another interesting tidbit: the first political backer of man-made global warming and its financer and champion in the west was Maggie Thatcher, the "evil" conservative coorporate lackey. Greenhouse gas global warming rhetoric was good fuel to push for nuclear power.

It is a great show. i am really surprised they showed it here in britain, as the british press daily hammers the gospel of man-made global warming with a parade of "experts" and deceptive footage and constantly preaches how its all our faults and we need to go back to stone-age technology to stop it.

I don't particularly think that there is.

So called 'UFO debunkers' tend to be more scientific, and therefore
are ore likely to believe in human influenced global warming.

I myself do not believe in 99% of alien & UFO stuff, but I do believe
that we are 70-90% responsible for the current global warming, and
that this cycle is worse, and will get even worse, than any natural cycle
in history.

I saw a UFO one night back in the 70s, so as far as I'm concerned, they exist.
Seeing is believing, I guess.

I've also researched climate change and it's been going on since man rode
donkeys and lived in huts.

The environmentalist movement has been going on as far as I can remember.
Except back in the 70s, environmentalists only wanted to educated individuals on how to care for the environment by not wasting water, recycling, wise use of electricity, going organic to lessen reliance on pesticides in the soil and air, eliminating plastic shopping bags etc.

It really was intelligent, well thought out ideas that every person could do on a daily basis to assist the environment.

The last 5 years, it has become a multi-billion dollar industry. And now the real agenda has accumulated into $$$$$ - they want us all to pay a global tax. A tax for air, if you will.
Like paying money is going to stop the ice caps from melting or stop tsunamis from happening. Or stop droughts.

I always knew that the issue would be hijacked sooner or later by big business and that the doom and gloom would start, to frighten us into parting with our money.

I would be a lot less cynical and a lot more supportive of the climate change "movement" if the bottomline wasn't $$$$. It wasn't in the 70s. It was an ideal that we all participated in by changing our lifestyles into a more eco-friendly existence.

I do my own eco-friendly practices on a daily basis and don't need to be part of a hysterical political movement to feel like I'm doing something. I already am.

So UFOs - Positive
the whacky climate change "movement" - Negative

Originally posted by iori_komei


I myself do not believe in 99% of alien & UFO stuff, but I do believe
that we are 70-90% responsible for the current global warming, and
that this cycle is worse, and will get even worse, than any natural cycle
in history.

Well naturally, you would, being a socialist.

Flighty, i totally agree with you. Environmentalism used to be really about concerned souls who wanted people to stop being so careless with water, trash, and chemicals. Remember in the 1980's we were all suppsoed to be burnt to crisps by 2005 from the collapse of the Ozone?

I would say its quite difficult to categorize people by certain beliefs in certain things. I think global warming and UFO studies have oen thing in common: rejection of evidence and serious, neutral study without the hysterics and pushing of certain beliefs.

I know a couple scientific people, mainly engineers, who do not discount the existance of UFOs totally, but instead wish to see serious, rational study devoted to the subject so they can make a descision based on stuff.

I once saw a UFO, but long before that I generally believed that UFO's could in theory be real, and that it was possible that aliens might be investigating the planet. After doing more study into the pro and against arguements as well as UFO cases, I believe the evidence is in favor.