Zapruder frames show driver killed JFK

Originally posted by jblaze
Badge01

Your input is invaluable and I appreciate it but I have to say that your color analysis, although impressive, doesn't seem to be convincing enough for me.

I have a good deal of experience in the graphics field and images are easily manipulated(vice versa).

I am not saying that I am 100% sure of my interpretation of the events that transpired that day but you must look at the whole picture and from an objective point of view, from all angles, including the people that planned and carried this out.

The driver was THE fail safe, the limo was passing the point where anyone else was "stationed". JFK was still alive at that point and as the last link it was up to him.

No matter how anyone can mess with the footage, it's all about timing. I'd love to know what the odds are of the driver coincidentally turning around with what appears to be a gun, at the same time JFK's head explodes.

Hi,

Thanks. Please note I did not 'manipulate' that image to show the colors are similar to skin and dark, but sun-highlighted hair. You or anyone can select the same frame from the site and pull it into Windows and sample the color and look at the color panel. Just use the numbers you see, or use my numbers, whatever.

It may be that the conspirators manipulated the Z-fim during processing. Notice the high black bar obscuring the side of the limo. That is NOT due to Z's camera panning up. It IS due to something put in front of there during the processing. No 'proof' as in the name of the person who did it, just strong suspicion and something that should not be there. It is definitely not the side window ledge of the limo. This bar appears a few frames back just as the limo passes a curbside streetlamp pole and continues for several frames then disappears.

I do believe the driver was complicit, and slowed the car to give the storm drain shooter the last shot, over or through the windshield (I favor just over the top of the windshield from the front).

Did you know there was a 'dent' in the inside metal framing of the windshield just above the driver's mirror, as though a shot from the back missed and hit the windshield's metal strip?

I believe that bullet bounced into the car and is one reason the SS flushed out the car with buckets of water at Parkland and cleaned it out further later. Supposedly a bullet fragment was found in the limo after it had been loaded into the plane to fly back to Bethesda with JFK's body. But this fragment was never analyzed (properly) and was lost (I think).

The SS 'claim' it was done because they didn't want to inflict emotional damage on the public who might see it. What a CROCK! Haha.

There were a lot of 'metal fragments' in JFK's head if you accept one of the more telling x-rays. This suggests a 'frangible' bullet. I believe the Storm Drain bullet was a 'frangible' round. It hit at almost the same time as a metal jacketed hit from behind, or a milli-second later. The head went forward, but to such a small degree that you have take a blow up of the frames and a straight edge and mark the parts of the head against the background image of the parts of the car frame to see it, usually.

But we can not be sure of what we're seeing - the Z-film itself is suspect.

Did you know Life magazine reversed the frams of the crucial film when they published it? They were alerted to this by Mark Lane and others, but not sure the printed a correction, at least no right away.

Read what Bertrand Russell had to say about the assassination. (Search 'Bertrand Russell, JFK assassination)

Thanks again for your imput.

Incidently you said you were 4 years old at the time of the incident. I was about 12. Very traumatic. We were told in Science class. We went home shocked and many of the kids crying.

[edit on 10-3-2007 by Badge01]

Quite interesting indeed. But if you will carefully notice in the films, none has talked about the spray coming up from down behind the seat in front of Miss Kenedy; a blast from behind the seat (satual charge, directed one) at the very moment of the last shot to his head. The car was disassembled afterwards and put back together. Years later it was President Ford that was almost killed in the same car in a collision!

Read the David Beter Letters. Or rather don't, they will curl the hair on the back of your head. I have been studying since I was 13 years old and I am almost 54 now. If you don't realize it's a religious war, you will never understand this killing. I won't bring up religion in general, because it would not be appropiate to this blog here. Happy hunting!

This is an interesting video, I think it may be the same Zapruder one but zoomed in or something? Anyway it might make things clearer to look at -

www.youtube.com...

Originally posted by Rheem21
Quite interesting indeed. But if you will carefully notice in the films, none has talked about the spray coming up from down behind the seat in front of Miss Kenedy; a blast from behind the seat (satual charge, directed one) at the very moment of the last shot to his head. The car was disassembled afterwards and put back together. Years later it was President Ford that was almost killed in the same car in a collision!

Read the David Beter Letters. Or rather don't, they will curl the hair on the back of your head. I have been studying since I was 13 years old and I am almost 54 now. If you don't realize it's a religious war, you will never understand this killing. I won't bring up religion in general, because it would not be appropiate to this blog here. Happy hunting!

Thanks, Rheem. I am about the same age as you and I've been studying it on and off since 1968 when I first had access to a large University's library.

I'll look for the David Beter Letters.

Think of the assassination as a large volcanoe. Now consider that we are only seeing the very TIP of the top of the volcanoe (like the tip if the iceberg).

There are a LOT of events leading up to it. Though most A-buffs realize it they -tend- to think of it as an inverted triangle and look at the expanding influences from it. Of course you must look at it -both- ways. Shaped like this:
X

The event happened at the crosshairs (heh), or the nexus.

Just thinking aloud.

Thanks for the tip on Beter.

The Driver theory makes even more sense when you consider possibility that the custom limo was equipped with DUAL CONTROLS. Agent Kellerman (front passenger) seems very focused on the road, while Agent Greer (the driver) spends a lot of time turned around, looking directly at the president.

Watch it again and consider that possibility. Make more sense now?

Who is driving the car?

[edit on 10-3-2007 by Smack]

this is from the prologue of the warren commision report. it is the 'very first report of the assassination that the new york times gave to its readers'. there is no way in hell that the new york times would screw up on the specifics of the biggest event of the century. the fact that it is included in the warren commission report further adds to its acceptance by the officials of the day.

new york times
a death in dallas
by tom wicker


[snip]
.......and dr. kemp clark, cheif of neurosurgery at parkland hospital, gave more details.
mr. kennedy was hit by a bullet in the throat, just below the adam's apple, they said. this wound had the appearance of a bullet's entry.
mr. kennedy also had a massive, gaping wound in the back, and one on the right side of the head. however, doctors said it was impossible to determine immediately whether the wounds had been caused by one bullet or two.
[snip]

it is obvious to me that the kennedy was initially shot in the throat from the front. the entry wound under the adam's apple, and the 'gaping hole' in his back. this also indicates that the bullet was coming from above.
the shot that sprays his brains everywhere looks like it came from below. it certainly is not consistent with a shot from over his right shoulder. the spray would then be either forwards, or backwards, but not UPWARDS.

'tinfoil hat brigade'?
better than the MOLECH'S STINKING LIE BRIGADE.

[edit on 10-3-2007 by billybob]

After searching for beter video I found this website that does a good job of debunking the idea that the limo driver shot K ennedy. It breaks down all the frames in question, shows pictures of the limo and I think proves the limo driver didnt do it. Here's the link,
www.jfklancer.com...

Originally posted by u4itornot
After searching for beter video I found this website that does a good job of debunking the idea that the limo driver shot K ennedy. It breaks down all the frames in question, shows pictures of the limo and I think proves the limo driver didnt do it. Here's the link,
www.jfklancer.com...

Excellent and even shows me why several people are thinking about the driver.

What one seems to see as the driver's arm coming up is actually the window sill of the car, watch it focussing on the window ledge on the driver's side only and you'll see there's no 'arm coming up' there. Then focus on the driver and there's a bit of an optical illusion that makes it look like his arm coming up.

Good find, man.

I do believe that some people found some good links in this discussion. There is a lot of testimony that a gun went off nearby, and powder smelled at street level, and the association of smells and sounds at street level is intriguing.

Some people have even mentioned a theory that there was someone in the storm sewer at street level and some kind of specially made gun, firing up at JFK.

Years later, after the street was covered with a new asphalt a few times, and the drain opening was built up people thought it wasn't possible.

There was even a group that sent a man in to that street level sewer with a rifle and he tried to find a sight picture and said he couldn't quite do it. Nothing lined up that well top to bottom (couldn't shoot up over the edge of the limo in the current conditions).

He also said the sight picture appeared to him to be very quick even at 8mph so that he would have literally no time to react. Like trying to shoot someone as they moved past your mail slot in your house. Even if you were right there and they just walked normally, the opening would be too small to afford a few seconds of tracking.

The guy said it was not impossible, though; if you enlarged the hole, removed the asphalt, returned it to 1963 condition.

So, it is possible someone fired at street level. Remember there are some clues which seem to point towards various shooters missing, or even missing on purpose. It's credible that some shooters were not meaning to hit the target but just fire a decoy shot, though this is stretching it a bit (why not just use a firecracker and not get caught with a gun).

Thanks again for the link. JFKLancer is a well-known and respected site.

At some point the number of suspected assassins postulated just becomes absurd.

Just remember that human memory is a fragile and mutable thing. I do trust memories like the smell - as in the smell of gunpowder.

I also trust people who were combat vets who testified - they are cool under pressure and don't go into a startle state like normal witnesses.

Here is link to the audio analysis of the assassination:

www.courttv.com...

the audio evidence suggests 4 total shots were fired.

I have also seen the JFKLancer site.

Originally posted by jblaze
Here is link to the audio analysis of the assassination:

www.courttv.com...

the audio evidence suggests 4 total shots were fired.

I have also seen the JFKLancer site.

There is some evidence that many more than 4 shots were fired.

1.Shot that missed and chipped the curb, a piece of which hit James Teague's cheek

2.Shot in the front of JFK's neck

3.Shot to the back of JFK near the neck but below the throat.

4a.Shot to JFK's head from the back, almost simultaneously with
4b.Shot to JFK's head from the front where all the Dallas doctors pointed (probaby from the storm drain up the hill near the bridge (not street level)

5a.Shot to Gov Connelly's back
5b.Shot to Gov Connelly's leg/wrist

6.Shot that dented the in-board side of the frame of the windshield, IOW from the rear. (a big round smooth dent, not a frag)

7.Shot that was a through-and through in the front windshield. Several folks on film testifying (incl man who was new window installer!)

8.Shot that missed and hit grassy area across from the Knoll (several people
photographed pointing to this spot in the grass)

That's potentially 10 or 11, and no less than 7 or 8.
.

[edit on 10-3-2007 by Badge01]

Originally posted by u4itornot
Look at frame 318 and look at the arm of the driver extended into the air
with a gun in his hand. It looks like he had just fired the shot as Kennedy
takes a shot at the eame time. I used a magnifying glass and it really does look like a gun in his hand.
www.assassinationresearch.com...

[edit on 9-3-2007 by u4itornot]

Seriously... seeing a stretched arm and a gun in that frame is severed reaching. The frame is so messed up by motion blur that you can imagine yourself anything you want.

Yes, the driver could be in on the whole conspiracy thing. But to me this looks like a "look at me, I made the discovery" thread... sry.

sorry, but i dont have the time or energy to go thru this whole thread, but is there a frame that shows something in the drivers hand... obviously the driver would turn around if jackie is screaming and there is mass panic... doesnt mean he shot him.. are there any frames that show a gun in his hand?!?! also, he could have shot through the seat if the seat was set up with very flimsy material. And if it was the driver who shot him im sure he had years and years of training and was the top sharpshooter they could find

once again, its 4am in the morning (damn this spring ahead, fall back) and i apologize for the posting spree!

I suppose there will never be any definitive proof of exactly what transpired that day.

There is certainly a lot of validity in many of the arguments and theories regarding the assassination and those involved.

We all have our own opinions, unfortunately we will never know for sure.

I remember reading somewhere that Jackie Kennedy had the truth of what happenned sealed until a certain year when all involved would certainly have passed before it could be released. Anyone else remember ever hearing that?

Ok folks. I looked the frames of the film.
Let me throw out my disclaimer.

This is based on the frames from this site www.assassinationresearch.com...
And what I say is in the context of the information I am looking at.

When I first saw the video of this. I thought it was a gun. That was a few weeks ago actually.

The driver would have had to use his left hand. (agreed?)

The "it looks like a gun" begins at Frame 304
At Frame 313 Kennedy's head ...erm explodes.
The drivers left hand is near the steering wheel. It's very clear and easy to point out.

If the Drivers left hand is not holding a gun while Kennedy has his brains turned into ...yeah. Then it wasn't the driver.
Also, for the driver to shoot someone with his left hand at that angle, his left arm needs to cross in front of his chest.

Which it does not.

According to those frames from the link above. This is debunked.
As for the what looks like a gun. It looks like just what people say it is. A reflection.

Just to prove I'm not an "agent" 9-11 was an inside job, the federal reserve is a private bank. I've read hundreds of pages of tax code and THERE IS NO LAW.
And I still think Kennedy was assassinated, just not from a gun by the driver. Not based on those frames.




[edit on 13-3-2007 by AwakeAndAllSeeing]

Originally posted by Badge01

It was William Cooper who first proposed this and he had a third or fourth generation copy of the film. .

I gave Bill Cooper that copy of "Dallas Revisted" and I got it from Lars Hansson who narrated the film for the guy who produced it. I can't remember that guys name, I think he lived in Santa Barbara. Lars came to me for money to research the project on whether or not Greer shot JFK.

I've spent a lot of time watching that film and researching the JFK assassination. I have all the books published on it.

If you want the bottom line, best researched, most comprehensive analysis of the JFK assassination including bottom line who did and why you need to read Final Judgment by Michael Collins Piper. It is long, 642 pages with a 6 page index.

I took my copy to my cabin in the mountains for 3 days to read it uninterrupted and undisturbed because I wanted to see if this really was the 'Final Judgement'. In my opinion Piper answers every single question of every single theory about the assassination I have ever heard. He does it thoroughly and logically. Who did it is intriguing. Pipers book was originally published in 1994 well before 911. But the conclusions will lead you right up to September 11, 2001 and who I think was ultimately responsible.



[edit on 13-3-2007 by johnlear]

I've read this entire thread, very interesting! So I'll try to find that book John and read it. Thanks for the great suggestion

Staafke

Does anyone know if there is a pristine, unedited, first generation copy of the Zapruder film? Film being the mutable medium that it is...

Originally posted by Smack
Does anyone know if there is a pristine, unedited, first generation copy of the Zapruder film? Film being the mutable medium that it is...

Someone probably lost it

Thanks for the input John, I would like to obtain a copy of that book.

I believe that JFK's assassination was just the beginning of a concerted effort to systematically subvert democratic rule, especially coming on the heels of DDE's famous military-industrial complex speech. I'm sure the "shadow government" was in place then but I think the assassination further consolidated their power.