The Big Why?

I find alot of posters grapling with the why question for conspiracy theories....

And wonder why for example would the powers that be, be so intent on going to so much trouble to do all these evil things and the one theory that I have come across that in broad strokes explains all other conspiracy theories is what David Ickie has proposed in his books and that is:

That is that the world is actually on the whole controlled and in broad strokes directed by a small elite group of super rich mafioso who are wholesale staging and manipulating world events in an attempt to realize an occult masterplan of unifying the world under the umbrella of one global orwellian police state.

And further to this that this process has in fact been going on, not for tens or hundreds of years but probably for thousands of years.

And that on the whole the common thread running through this group, back through thousands of years and hundreds of generations is a genetic weakness that renders them much more subseptible to psychic infestation from parasitic superphysical entities who are the puppetiers directing them to advance this cause.....

Their ultimate cause is to keep the whole of mankind ignorant and seperated from their own spiritual nature.
This in part has been achieved by placing lodges or churches on nearly all of the earth's Charkra points around the world and conducting Satanic Rituals on these power points consistently over the last few thousand years..... and by keeping the world divided into constantly waring factions on may fronts.
Religious, political, racial, financial ETC. ETC.... Pumping up the fear.... a toxic emotional vibration which throws up a smoke screen that is impervious to the finer energies emanating from the soul.

Effectively holding hostage the evolution of the whole planet and the entire human race so that the entities behind this deception (spiritual "Bottom Feeders" if you will) can feast on their harvest of human sorrow.

And this (as the king of all conspiracy theories goes diabolical agenda underpins almost every aspect of known history and even the formation of all aspects of society and all its institutions ETC.... So that this most carnal of influences is pushing humanity down a road of rampant materialism and moral de-basement.

And if this be the case then it also becomes quickly apparent that virtually the whole of recorded history broadly speaking is a sham.

So instead of considering..... (As you may for example):
How is it possible that a small group of individuals could co-opt the whole world and some how infiltrate every aspect of society and be the evil architects of everything that has gone wrong in history?

That question is then turned on its head when it is realized that (if this senerio is in fact true) that this evil network has been with-us from the beginning and infact has been the main driver of the evolution of human society over the past 2000 years and represents and in a way perhaps even embodies the negative pole of mans inate spiritual asperation.

And its ultimate goal is to snag mankind in a quogmyre of materialism long enough for technology to become apparent which can give birth to a super hi-tech "Matrix" style world from where mankind's spiritual evolution can be permently pinned down and from where all hope is dead.

Turning mankind into a spiritually rancid food source for what could only be compared by analogy to a race of spiritual cockroaches, parasitic scavengers who feed on the putrid psychic eminations of a race that has been totally and permanently debased.

Rosy Stuff........

What about the theory that power corrupts, and absolute power corrupts absolutely?

People have conspired in secret for power and wealth all throughout history.... so it makes logical sense that a group of people would eventually try to consolidate all the power and wealth in the whole world, and effectively rule the world.

Of course such a thing can't be accomplished through sheer military or economic might alone, so a lot of it would have to be accomplished by secrecy and infiltration.

And of course once such a group rises to power - they would take steps to protect their various interests and sources of power.... (hence the UFO secrecy, and the secrecy over zero-point energy etc)

A much simpler and more elegant explanation - and one which doesn't involve soul-sucking shadow demons from another dimension.... ;-)

Yes and no....
I do agree with you to a point and that is that greed is the prime motivator for most evil conspiracies that exist.

But on the other hand:
Alot of the exotic physics underpinning UFO technology boarder on meta physics and currently taboo areas in science where the exotic energies and dimensions associated with conciousness start to impinge on the accepted view of the universe.

And the current mental cravase between "pseudo religious meta science" and real world physics.... does not actually exist...

And the fact that most people harbor this assumption....
I.E. that ghosts, gnomes, farries, demons and gods are some how neatly compartmentalized and seperate from what they would assume to be a "valid" and logical extension of current physics as they understand it...... is irrelevant.

This Just illustrates the point that their current metal construct of the universe would love to convieniently ignor that which assults their current world view.
And that one of their assumtions is that it is logical to assume that an expanded perspective of the universe would most likely embody a neat expansion of current dogma.....

The fact that something is refered to as a "mind sucking demon" (or that you choose to use this term to denote it) does not make it less valid because this term can easily be used to evoke socially accepted cliches associated with old world propagadas and taboos on such topics......
I.E. because you can use a term to evoke an immage associated with socially accepted dogma on the whole programmed into the group mind of public by and large though subtle media propaganda.... IE.. like in the 50's with shows like "my favourite marsian","bewitched" and ETC ETc to program the public to equate E.T.s and other occult topics with commedy or alternatively make connections with make believe, fairy tale or horror to discredit these topics.

Why to you think it is that THEY would have you believe that "the terminator" or "the preditor" or that "independence day" is plausable and that fairies are not????????????

THEY are trying to lead you down a path which prohibits knowlege of the energies that underpin life itself, our connection with it and through it our connection with the planet and being on many dimmensions of conciousness.

They are pushing a world view that denies areas of physics that boarder conciousness and life itself.....

But let me assure you the many alien races that visit our planet are not necessarily even from this space time continum and some are exactly what religous folk consider to be saints or gods.

Labels, words..........
Dont get too hung up on them.......

What you are describing is the same prophetic story of the fall of man and the spiritual battle that ensues although I like the wording of your version better.

Of course, there are only two possible outcomes to this conspiracy. Either we are doomed or something more powerful than the rulers of this world comes and wipes the slate clean again.

I am beginning to research and believe that some, if not all the fallen angels are here amongst us and are the ones actually doing the work of Lucifer in a physical manifestation. The reason I feel this way is that I see no reason why God or Satan would need spiritual beings to accomplish tasks. The spiritual realm does not need a labor force as anything is possible there. The physical realm is another matter. If Lucifer and his followers fell from heaven, then the only explanation I can think of is that they truly exist in the flesh here and now and are the ones controlling the agenda of the world.

I don't necessarily agree with you there....
Firstly I don't think it is necessary that an external force is required....
And even if this were the case I don't think it would necessarily be forth coming.

The reason I say this is because I believe there is probably hundreds of extraterestrial races that are aware of our existance and have been here regularly or on an ongoing basis for thousands and in cases probably millions of years (our time)....
And perhaps they have had some input but i dont think it is incumbent on them to decend from the clouds and save us from the # mess we got our selves into, and even though they may meddle in our affairs they are obviously.. now anyway not willing to impose the reality of their existence on our current world view.......

I believe this is due to the universal law of cause and effect (karma).
Its not that they carnt, just unwilling.... If they mess with our free will and or self determination then they are in fact putting forces into play that will inevitably result in the same happening to them...... this law is probably unavoidable even to them, and they are fully aware of it and they would probably even have psychic harware to monitor such things.

When you say god does not need a labour force.... i think you are wrong...
perhaps from our perspective it seems obsurd to think that the source of the universe would need intermediate mechinations in the scheme of creation...

But our universe is just the tip of the iceberg in a whole spectrum of engeries (universes or planes of existence) which extend from here to the source and climbing this ladder is called......... spiritual evolution..........

And it is naive to presume that nothing SHOULD need to exist between here and the ultimate source.
Its the same logic as the religious person who would say that life is only on the earth ETC and no-where else...Well that thought may a be nice frame for their current narrow world view but weather or not it in any way resembles the actual truth is another point entirely as the fact that we are unaware of these worlds does not negate their existance.

I think at the core of this debate is a difference in perspective and terms (mainly).
"Miller man" thinks it is slightly obsurd to be considering that a demonic force could be co-ordinating a social movement. Perhaps?
But a hundred years ago the same logic did not hold true when the first researcher proposed that some diseases were actually caused by invisible creatures inside our bodies...........

Invisible because they are so small...............far out idea.??????? NOw FACT.....

The same is true for your emotional states...... are you 100% sure that every thought that enters you head is your own??????

Some are scooped up from others.... some are the result of psychic currents enducing and effecting our moods to increase the likely hood of various types of thoughts.... some are probably due to infestation by negative entities in our auric fields.................
ETC ETC..........
This is a whole world we know vertually nothing of from a scientific viewpoint but those who have examined these worlds with their developed psychic senses have alot to say about it.

Perhaps the scientologists are not insane when they say that the average man has boogey men from the 25th dimension in his aura... blah blah blah....
Im not up on their theories but its just the terminology....
when science discovers these things they will give it a term you can relate to and you will then accept it when a little picture pops up on the monitor and the architecture of our subtle energy bodies becomes aparrent.....

It would not surprise me if my aura was infested with all manor of putrid "astral" intruders...... it would explain alot actually......

morphonius

I am not denying the possibility of psychic influence, or the existence of interdimensional beings or beings that exist perhaps in a different energy spectrum than our own. In fact I do believe that we are all connected to one another and to the rest of the universe telepathically.

The issue I have is when people start going overboard with it and saying that for example the shadow government are all possessed by Satan or otherwise being controlled by some alien or demonic force which we are helpless against. Like human beings aren't really capable of Evil, it's Satan and the Demons that make us evil....

On the flip side of the coin, I recently taught a friend of mine about the shadow government, and one of the first things she said was "Well don't worry, we don't have to do something about this, because God will make sure this information comes out."

I said, "Great.... so we should just sit idly by and do nothing with this information, because God will save us all? Well, what if we don't have that much time left?"

There is most definitely a war going on here on earth, but it is not between God and Satan, or Angels and Demons.... rather it is a war between the darkness of secrecy and covert operations, and the light of truth and unity - and we are ALL in it. Do we sit by and wait while psychic celestial beings decide the outcome for us, or do we pick a side and fight?

I guess i can relate to what your saying and the war between your viewpoint and the one expounded in my opening post is on-going inside my head....

And the crutial issue I believe is continuity.....
Because after reading books the likes of david ikies.....
Even if one does not accept the conclusions he makes.....
it is apparent that secret societies and occult control of the world has been the norm since even before recorded history began.....

And that alot of the evil that is going on in the world is by grand design....
Which still leaves the question of continuity begging to be answered...
What is the connection between the members of the top echelons of these groups I.E. the hidden government of today versus one hundred years ago ETC.....
Is it just, OH daddy is supper rich and mega powerful and willing to kill anybody who gets in the way..... now im just going to hand all that over to my kids so the tradition can continue add infinitum???????

What makes you an insider or an outsider.......
And taking into account what ickie has to say in regard the elite's obsession from all time periods with pereserving bloodlines ETc... it does seem that there is some kind of connection between this type of queer behaviour and the NWO.

PErhaps an alien element is not out-of the question.

Does it seem plausable?? Or is it a purely human thing with these guys? ...
Maybee they actually feel they are actually working in "our" best interests.........? I dont know which is more scarey

to be honest the "evil" that happens has been happening for millions of years, at no time in the history of mankind has there ever been some sort of enlightend global prosperity, we by nature are "evil". And i add qoutation marks to them as evil much like good doesnt really exist, not in the sense of man made morality anyway.

The way i see it, its a pyramid, there must be more at the bottom to support the top, which must have less room otherwise it would collapse. It isnt some grand conspiracy to keep us all in tiny little boxes, its mercantilist capatilism and its why were not dying in the gutter at the age of 30 from wrotten teeth and the plague.

Having said this, either two things have happend. Firstly, this is the natural way our societys are to develop, the pyramid is the most structuraly secure model we can get, so we maybe programmd in some way to follow this natural law to ensure society is stable. Of course bad things are happening, but so what, thats just the way it goes.

OR

The societys that do infact contgroll our goverments understand what the Egyptians were trying to tell us, and have forced society into this apparently elitist model without the hand of nature, simply because it is infact a stable way to keep society running AND it helps them effectively maintane the power they crave and to ensure this model of society is maintaned in accordance with a pyramid, they must force is into wars, poverty and ignorance in order to support themselves. It is also heavily linkd to their beleife systems.

Given what i see in todays world id go with the later, however given the extent of war, poverty and ignorance and greed in the history of humanity, im not that inclined to beleive it, i beleive that it exists, but it has existed for millions of years. So to say this is all of a sudden just happend, is well, kinda unbeleiveable, unless of course Rothschilds Banking and little green men were already controling africa 4.5 million years ago.

my 2cents.


The only thing global elites have wanted since we placed ourselves into structures of order and class, is to sustain they oligarchic prowess through the ages.

Religion is just one of the many tools they use to keep themselves living in such opulance. I dont believe any leaders partake in "satanic" or occultic practises because they believe it will further their overall agenda. Religion enforces the status quo, and therefore is beneficial to their cause.

Besides, occultic practices are largely based on old pagan traditions, and are no more envoking evil entities (regardless of what you want to call them) than praying to the christain god.

Your very articulate with your views, its a good quality and i hope to see more posts by you.

Originally posted by Starvald
to be honest the "evil" that happens has been happening for millions of years, at no time in the history of mankind has there ever been some sort of enlightend global prosperity, we by nature are "evil". And i add qoutation marks to them as evil much like good doesnt really exist, not in the sense of man made morality anyway.

The way i see it, its a pyramid, there must be more at the bottom to support the top, which must have less room otherwise it would collapse. It isnt some grand conspiracy to keep us all in tiny little boxes, its mercantilist capatilism and its why were not dying in the gutter at the age of 30 from wrotten teeth and the plague.

So purposely starting wars and murdering people in cold blood isn't "evil", it's just business?? Holy smokes!

I dont personaly believe in good or evil as its based around some form of man made morality founded by religion in order to control a persons life with fear and hope.

Is it evil when animals kill each other en masse over hunting grounds effictively conducting a war against each other? or is it a matter of necessity dictated by the circumstance of their enviroment?

Originally posted by morphonius821

And that alot of the evil that is going on in the world is by grand design....
Which still leaves the question of continuity begging to be answered...
What is the connection between the members of the top echelons of these groups I.E. the hidden government of today versus one hundred years ago ETC.....
Is it just, OH daddy is supper rich and mega powerful and willing to kill anybody who gets in the way..... now im just going to hand all that over to my kids so the tradition can continue add infinitum???????

I think that's pretty much it. The elite likely would heavily indoctrinate their children from a very young age to think of themselves as superior, and of everyone else as "the sheeple". They would also likely test them regularly to ensure that they stay loyal to the elite's system of control, and not become sympathetic to the common man....

What makes you an insider or an outsider.......
And taking into account what ickie has to say in regard the elite's obsession from all time periods with pereserving bloodlines ETc... it does seem that there is some kind of connection between this type of queer behaviour and the NWO.

PErhaps an alien element is not out-of the question.

Well granted I haven't read all of Icke's material, primarily because I find the shapeshifting reptilian thing just too absurd... but my thinking is that, the elite would be motivated to set up arranged marriages with other elite families for two reasons: it further consolidates the power and influence of the two families, and again ensures the continuity of the system of control. (They would certainly NOT want little Timmy Rockefeller to fall in love with a common girl who would be compassionate towards the common people, and become a problem later.........)

Does it seem plausable?? Or is it a purely human thing with these guys? ...

Well, I think so.

I mean, if you were a shapeshifting reptilian, say George Bush or Dick Cheney or whatever.... don't you think you'd get sick of having to pose as a human nearly 24/7? Don't you think it would wear away at you and you'd start to long to be able to walk around in your natural form, without having to worry about there being pesky humans around to see?

Also, as I have said before - why bother ruling us covertly, when they could easily rule us OVERTLY? We have been completely helpless against them for thousands of years..... why not simply bomb all our infrastructure to smithereens and then subjugate us? In the same sort of way that we completely dominate and rule cows and pigs and chickens?

If you think about it..... the whole covert system of control is like a giant house of cards - one wrong move and the whole thing can come crashing down. If there really are a handful of shapeshifting reptilians ruling us all - they are in CONSTANT CONSTANT danger of being discovered!! If you were one of them, would you really want to live that way and take that risk?

So were we being controlld to be evil when we were hunter gatherers killing each other in the hundreds of thousands if not millions for dominance over hunting grounds and resources?

the NWO actually originated from Africa 4.5 million years ago aswell???

Originally posted by Starvald
I dont personaly believe in good or evil as its based around some form of man made morality founded by religion in order to control a persons life with fear and hope.

Is it evil when animals kill each other en masse over hunting grounds effictively conducting a war against each other? or is it a matter of necessity dictated by the circumstance of their enviroment?

Well... you have a point there.

I'll put it this way: if I told you to hand your son an assault rifle, and your daughter a grenade, and your nephew a tank, and your niece a nuke, and tell them to all go and play, and it's absolutely necessary to do this because it's good for business and profit and it maintains your control over them as a parent..... you'd be able to do it no problem right?

That's the level of atrocity and evil I'm talking about... not mere warring over food or hunting grounds or natural resources. And the shadow government are guilty of this sort of thing and much much worse....

I wouldnt call it evil, id say its criminaly stupid, but not an evil thing to do. I've found that in life i cant really take any sort of moral ground on anything as i am just guilty, we all are.

But i dunno, i generaly think as time goes on society is more complex and with that the more complex our circumstances are and as such complex necessities arise that may appear to be little more extreme than simply fighting over hunting gounds with sticks and stones, though fundamentaly it is the same idea what we are doing, constantly fighting over territory to protect the monopolys on resources. Sadly now however it is done with spy sattelites, 24 hour surveilance, clandestine billion dollar intel agencys, black op teams and high stratosphere bombers.

Originally posted by Starvald
I wouldnt call it evil, id say its criminaly stupid, but not an evil thing to do. I've found that in life i cant really take any sort of moral ground on anything as i am just guilty,

Or maybe just psychotic? ;-)

I mean if toying with people's lives isn't even Evil...... wow

Why is it evil though?

Exactly!

If you can't see or understand why such things are evil.... you are likely psychotic.

id just like an explination of why it is evil, you cant just say its evil because it is and thats that.

Evil doesn't need to be defined....
Because there is not one person on this planet the doesn't recognise it when its pointed at them.....
And if you are capable of putting yourself in somebody else's shoes... its not much of a stretch to see evils going on....

And playing groups of people against each other in staged exercises to excalate fear: ultimately leading to the expansion of mans grose attributes, the contraction of the soul and sending us into a downward spiral into kaos and mayhem......

That would translate.... roughly.... just roughly... in any man's language as perhaps just a little naughty... if not down right diabolical.