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Russia Abolishing Elections, Abandoning Democracy

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posted on Mar, 7 2007 @ 02:28 PM

Russia Abolishing Elections, Abandoning Democracy

The president has abolished the election of regional governors. Parliament is now dominated by a pro-Putin majority that speeds through Kremlin-issued legislation, often too quickly for deputies even to read new bills...

...Now there's talk of canceling local elections, scheduled for later in March. Candidates already are being struck off ballots for what they say are technicalities.
(visit the link for the full news article)

Related News Links:
online.wsj .com

posted on Mar, 7 2007 @ 02:28 PM
This is not something to be ignored. As someone who grew up amidst the Cold War, the last thing we need is to watch idly by as echoes of the Sovient Union begin reforming into a new Putanism Tyrrany. I very strongly recommend that the reader take the time to listen to this series on the Resurgence of Russia, and this report in particular.

In a nutshell, Russia has gained considerable amounts of influence due to the number of resources it has for sale. This has lent them political muscle as well as the capitol neccessary to take on larger projects and lend legitimacy to Putin's regime.

What this means for the average American? It's hard to say. The last time this happened in Russia, it meant several decades with the looming threat of nuclear war, and an uber-fear of communism that pervaded every area of our nation. It meant that every day we teetered on the brink of mutual destruction of every living thing on the planet.

As one man from the rapidly centralizing government says "If given the choice between free soup and free speech, they're going to choose free soup, of course."

(note: I apologize for the lack of ATS thread-links, the search button appears to be broken)
(visit the link for the full news article)

posted on Mar, 7 2007 @ 03:03 PM
Wow. The re-emergence of the greatest threat to western civilization that ever existed is beginning to rise again, and the most it merits is 8 views. Probably 3 of them were mine.

That's... telling.

posted on Mar, 7 2007 @ 04:50 PM
I just found your story.

This is more than worrying.

Has anyone noticed how China seems to slowly slipping down the democratic path and Russia moving backwards? Putin is becoming more and more power hungry as each day goes on - which is something we need to watch. As someone living in Europe this is very bad because of the control Russia has on the Oil Industry and growing ties with Middle Eastern Nations who are sick of the U.K. and U.S.A. it is though they almost timed it perfectly.

It does go towards my idea that hte Iraq war and information provided by the Russian Government was to cripple the U.S.A. and to force them into a long drawn out war so Russia can push for top dog. With the China-Russia Alliance this could also be very bad for Nations such as Japan and Taiwan who are prime-threats for China (and in some sectors of Russia, Japan is still seen as an enemy and with things such as Kuril islands possibly having Oil this could really change the shape of Asia).

Russia seems to have been playing rather the game and it looks like the USA might have fallen for it.

posted on Mar, 7 2007 @ 05:09 PM
The elections in Russia (and in most former soviet nations) are a farce and a setup, the counting rigged, there isn't any real democracy there at all. So they now have decided to save themselves the bother of pretending.

posted on Mar, 7 2007 @ 05:15 PM
Theres a reason for the Odium.


As China becomes a servicing nation (selling good and other industries all over the world - mostly to America) they generate massive amounts of wealth. But the state is not keeping all the money, no, workers wages are increasing at incredible rates, making the people wealthier. People with money expect certain privalages.. Democracy was given rise through the power of the middle class.. it is not surprising that the middle class is pushing for the same "right" in China.

Russia is a different story, most of the wealth generated is through oil, gas, little from industry and from weapon sales.

It is common that nations whos wealth is derived from a single industry are often welfare, socialistic style states. Norway may be the only country that is fully Democratic yet still very socialist, though they also have other industries. Iran, Iraq, Saudi Arabia, Venesualla, they have primarily a single industry.

It should be noted that non-democratic nations are not "bad" ... it depends on the government. No democratic nations have gone to war with eachother. That is true, but we have only been around some 200 years, there will be conflicts, and it will be democratic states against one another. If Putin where to reign as Czar Russia will prosper, theoretically, as a welfare state.. if Russia converts back to Communism "socialism" it will collapse once again.

This is not the rise of the Soviet Union .. it could be the rise of the Russian Empire / Kingdom, who knows.. but it isn't bad. Putin honestly has the best intentions in heart for HIS PEOPLE.... he should give a rats @!$ about anyone else...

If only our own government would stop worrying about other peoples feelings and focused on their people.

PS. Sorry for spelling mistakes in a hurry.

posted on Mar, 7 2007 @ 06:02 PM
IF this is true, Iran looks like a whole new ball game now.

posted on Mar, 7 2007 @ 06:20 PM
What? ....... what the heck does that have to do with ANYTHING AT ALL?

Doesn't even make sense.

posted on Mar, 7 2007 @ 06:26 PM

Originally posted by thelibra
Wow. The re-emergence of the greatest threat to western civilization that ever existed is beginning to rise again, and the most it merits is 8 views. Probably 3 of them were mine.

That's... telling.

calm down...

it'll take time

thanks for the story

posted on Mar, 7 2007 @ 07:42 PM

Originally posted by Rockpuck
What? ....... what the heck does that have to do with ANYTHING AT ALL?

Doesn't even make sense.

Well if your talking to me, being russia arming iran with surface to air, and all that gaff... seems if they are moving away from the democratic, western civilised manner... theyre arent going to really care at any international pressure on things such as, arming, or assisting.
If they happened to cancel elections, there not really thinking on the same terms as the US are they... and it will be a major step BACKWARDS into the cold war era days.. which if you remember, was the US v Russia.
And being The US is looking very hard at Iran, a russian ally 'in terms' then id say it will definately impact that somehow.

Hows about ya take a breathe before ya jump up n down scream'n like a girl?

[edit on 7-3-2007 by Agit8dChop]

posted on Mar, 7 2007 @ 10:19 PM

OMg.. let me sort through that complete bin of ... less then fine response.

According to you... Russia "going backwards" from "democracy" is going to make Russia sell crap to Iran? And that is going to ... affect us, the US, somehow because.... Russia sees them as an .. "ally" .. right..

America and Russia are not friends. They where not friends before WWII .. they where not friends after WWII .. they where not friends any time before the 20th century either, and they where not friends after the collapse of the Soviet Union.
What you saw was the Soviet Union weakened, financially, a mini revolution took place.. America then began a campaign of exploitation of the Russian resources. Meanwhile, still reaping the rewards of "assisting" in oil exploration and extraction, we go to say.. Lithuania and call their leader a dictator.. constantly tell Putin he needs to change to be er.. "Better" and um.. more "civilized" as you put it, you know, like Brits and Americans.

Further more you make the assumption that if Russia was "democratic" they would not be an "enemy" .. which is the most ignorant concept I have ever heard.

Why don't democratic nations fight one another?

Because America either built them, protect them, suppress them, or occupy them.

Does Putin taking control and becoming ... er... "uncivilized" mean that Putin will then hate America because he has power? ... More like America will hate Putin for taking control of resources that we at one point where supposed to be getting payments for. Putin does not fear America. He is converting oil and gas sales to the Rubble, to make it a tradable currency.. he has defied America in the UN repeatedly.. he has insulted the administration many time publicly.. what does America do? Can't invade them, so we go to former "allies" and insult them back. Go Cheney, be the big man!

Another thing to realize is Russia has NO allies. Not one. China? HA .. they do military exercises because they BOTH need to test their equipment, but in reality Russia think China is scum, and China thinks Russia scum. They never have been and never will be allies. Russia has the old soviet bloc, well.. what hasn't become "civilized" and converted to "western ways of life i.e. imported a McDonalds, but they are not allies, mere pawns.

Russia cares absolutely nothing about Iran. Iran buys their weapons, but so does everyone else. Even Israel uses Russian equipment, terrorist use their equipment, China, many European states, and given the chance Americans have been known to abandon M16's for Ak47's .. Russia would love to provoke America into a war.. a proxy war, and care little when Iranians are mowed down. Russia was selling Iraq night vision equipment in the weeks before the Iraq war... did Russia invade because they couldn't sell goggles anymore? No... because they still buy them..

Democracy has absolutely nothing to do with this.. its about national interest. Had Britain different opinions on the war then America they wouldn't have supported it either... but the Euro was held back because of the war, and thus Britain benefits, that’s enough for them so they support it. France, Germany.. strong opponents. Why? Because they lost a lot of contracts from the oil... and they won't get them back either because America declared them VOID ... you honestly think France and Germany care about "civilians" ... I do believe 2 years ago the French president said to the international community that any "terrorist act against France on French soil" will be met with "a nuclear response" .. sounds like a lot of "civilians caring" .. like wise for Germany, they could give a crap about Iraqi's, they want the money. We want the money, Britain want the money, every one wants the money.. its about STRENGTH and the ability (and the balls) to do something about it. Russia has the strength to say NO and fuel the American casualties because we can't do a damn thing about it.. France did the same thing .. whined... said no... we laughed and boycotted them leading to economic "troubles" for them, they then backed off and shut their mouth like a good little boys should. 2 democratic "civilized" people.. America vrs France and we won because we COULD....

It does NOT matter what the form of government is - democracies tend to be weaker - its still "The man with the biggest stick wins" Russia happens to have a big stick, and can poke us from a distance. Sure is annoying, but what can we do? Boycott? They don't export.. to us.. do you see Europe boycotting Russia? HA .. sure.. and freeze in the winter because they have no gas, unless they want to pay very high prices from the ME if Russia cuts the supply.

Russia can't go to war.. they don't have that ability.. but they can't be invaded either.. and Putin won't be pushed around by outside bullies.. so we can't influence the people.. so Putin exports the war through other people.. in the next case it will be Iran.. after that God only knows who.. Russia needs to be respected, regardless if you think any form of government is "uncivilized" if it isn't democratic..

I see the return of the Russian Czar with Putin.. it won't be good for western interest.. it might be good for the people.. as long as they stay away from Communism.. an absolute monarchy is a powerful thing if a nation like Russia is behind it. Democracy is only 200 some years old ("western version of it") and has only proved that a free competing industry can produce war efficiently and profit from it.. but it is still young, Monarchy is tens of thousands years old in various forms, proved it's self well if led by a good leader. Don't generalize a nations strength or international stance based on the type of government or economical institutions they implement.. it always comes down to NECESSITIES and self interest, achieved through intimidation, exploitation, abuse, cruelty and war.

Mod Note: Trim Those Quotes - Please Review this link

[edit on 8-3-2007 by DontTreadOnMe]

posted on Mar, 7 2007 @ 10:26 PM
Jesus rockpuck.... what nerve has been hit?

I simply said, russia stopping elections if it is true they are going back to a cold war era type situation, it will effect how Iran plays the US.

I cant even be bothered reading your post...

my point is, if russia are banning elections and enforcing a rule.. then it is a STEP backwards.

posted on Mar, 7 2007 @ 10:29 PM

Democracy is NOT THE ONLY type of government, fully explained in my post lol...

My point in short is this:

Russia is still playing the cold war, but becase of certain monetary restraints can only do it from the side as of now.. but will still more then gladly use Iranians as a proxy against America.

A democratic Russia will be just as bad as a Monarch Russia (and a communist but I would hope they learned their lesson) .. democracy weakend Russia because of international exploitation.

posted on Mar, 7 2007 @ 10:54 PM
I dunno, they setup and profited from them oil fields pretty well.
And Russia held the 6 nations meeting, or global talks not long back... me thinks what was that called?

I think democractically, and financially russia was started to make headway and go forward..

but ill have to look into it.
works busy atn.

posted on Mar, 8 2007 @ 01:24 PM
But I've been saying that he's a old school Soviet who want to revitalize the old ways.

Democracy has been dead for a long time there.

I even hinted that he might be a power grubbing anti-christ who took pages from Hitler.

How many times do I have to say, hey look at this for you people to see it.

posted on Mar, 8 2007 @ 01:35 PM
Anti-Christ now eh? I suppose every world leader has been called the anti christ at some point..
Christians should learn to say:

"One day there will be an Anti-Christ and the world will end" and leave it at that without speculation as to who and when nor why it will happen or who it will be as Christians have been dead wrong since Christianity has been founded.

Democracy was never fully established in Russia either, hard to break down what hardly had a footing. Democracy in many cases has been observed to hurt the people and the cultures especially more then their totalitarian counter parts. Obviously if it is a butchering crazy dictator any form of government is better, but if the status quo is working, change is not needed.

posted on Mar, 8 2007 @ 02:01 PM
I am now left wondering what we can do about it.

There appears to now be little doubt that Putinism, if left unchecked, will end up resulting in a very antagonistic world power with anti-western, anti-democratic views, with a large amount of fossil fuel resources they're willing to sell on the open market. to countries that desperately want them at below-market prices.

As America becomes less dependent on foreign energy sources, this will cause a glut of fossil fuel supplies in the market that, up until a couple of days ago, I'd just assume would be bought up by China. Yet recently they have become very conscientious of missing environmental and pollution goals of the first year of their 11 year plan, and have decided to redouble their efforts.

With China backing off the purchase of foreign fossil fuels in the future, and Americans and India looking to do the same, Russia's economic power is poised to shrink dramatically. Since Putin's power stems from the Russian economic powerhouse in the current market, that might end up being the end of Putanism. However, I don't know that it will happen quickly enough to outpace the loss of democracy.

Your thoughts?

posted on Mar, 8 2007 @ 02:15 PM
Ha! Where are those who laughed when people said the Cold War isnt over and Russia isnt free now?

Its obvious, out in the open, and youd have to be blind and deaf not to see it but I guarantee people will still deny Russias intent and still ignore things like Russians getting caught trying to sell nuclear material to Iran and Hugo Chavez being buddy buddy with these guys and Cuba hoarding biological weapons.

There isnt anyting funny about any of this. There isnt anything coincidental about this. And there certainly isnt anything that shuld make us feel good about this.

posted on Mar, 8 2007 @ 03:03 PM

Originally posted by thisguyrighthere
There isnt anyting funny about any of this. There isnt anything coincidental about this. And there certainly isnt anything that shuld make us feel good about this.

I couldn't agree more.

What I fear more than the cold war is the legitimacy to tyranny it would lend in the USA and the UK in the name of fighting it. The McCarthy hearings happened before my time, but were a very, very dark era in our country's history.

And if it could happen in more "noble times", when technology had just gotten around to giving us color television, imagine the scale to which "new McCarthy hearings" could be implemented now that we have legitimized domestic surveillance, detention camps, and suspension of liberties in the name of fighting terrorism.

I think Russia's situation and the obstacle they'll pose in the future is anything but laughable, but I shudder at the effects it will have within our own government in the name of fighting Putanism.

posted on Mar, 8 2007 @ 03:35 PM
The following is just a few thoughts I've had as I watch what's going on in the world:
Putin is using Iran as a pawn in his game to get Russia back to it's communist "superpower" status. I say this because of his unwillingness to really commit to helping us with the war on terror and all of his dealings with Iran. Not to mention his murderous ways to silence anybody who challenges him. He is not a friend of the US. North Korea is just a little lucky something that has happened along the way for him. Iran is his best chance to keep the US and it's allies at bay. He is making money from Iran, while furthering his agenda.
The US is it's own worst enemy. We can't even get together on keeping our country together. Our own government can't secure our borders! What the hell is that?! The political correctness movement is one of our biggest downfalls. (Let's not hurt anyody's feelings.) Thanks to the spineless conservative wimps that can't stand up to the overly liberal fringe left and their overbearing, unnecessary-entitlements-for-the-helpless-to-keep-control-over-the-masses-by-keeping-them-needy mentality. Lets not forget the Civil Liberties Union. We'll sue ourselves right out of our freedom. Nice. (I do love my country, and what it was supposed to stand for, but it's slipping away. That frustrates me.)
With all of this going on, and lots of other stuff I didn't even bring up, China is just sitting back and watching the fun. I mean, how long have they been around? It's not like they're falling by the wayside. Nor are they going out of their way to be overly helpful where it counts.
Sorry, kinda new to this. Don't how how to make this a link.

[edit on 3/8/2007 by bjshobbes]

mod edit, fixed link

[edit on 8-3-2007 by DontTreadOnMe]

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