How to end it?

ATS is a gathering point for many varied opinions, and there are many skilled writers that frequent ATS. I would like any help available to focus on ideas to end the conflict in Iraq.
Pressure on politicians is the recourse we have as American citizens;I think it would be more benificial to lobby our leaders with a plan than just with "bring our troops home".
So I ask you to give a plan;all ideas help.

The First part is accepting it was a mistake....

The second is figuring out a way to get 'someone' into Iraq, that the Iraqi's trust... to help rebuild the devestation caused....funded by the US, UK and Australia.

If you wake up in the morning to running sewage in your street, your house half destroyed, your work place demolished... no money, no food and a family to feed.. your more inclined to take up arms and fight, or break the law.

If you have a job to go to, if your living conditions are 'acceptable' your more likely to work, provide for your family and go on living life the way its meant to be.


[edit on 21-2-2007 by Agit8dChop]

Why? So the US and Australia can surrender in Iraq as britain has? To tell you the truth I wouldnt be surprised if their surrender wasnt fueled by a desire to not have to flip part of the reconstruction bill. kinda like 3 friends at a party and one just went to the bathroom and climbed through the window.

"Bring the troops home" IS the only plan. Plans to "stabilize" Iraq like this sham surge are just that, a sham. The Iraqis will never support the government that the US installed because it's perceived as a puppet, making it impossible for the US to "phase out" the occupation by slowly drawing down.
Cleaning up sewage doesn't accomplish anything, and there can never be any 'reconstruction' while the fighting continues to wreck the place. It's been 4 years and the US has accomplished absolutly nothing and the Iraqi forces as weaker as ever. The latest troop surge sham has already failed with continued bombings in Baghdad and continued attacks and high casualties on US forces.

XPhil,

Of course,

people would rather turn on their friends... and make them 'foot' the bill,
instaed of coming to the realisation that them, and the world were TRICKED into this war, and it has created a major catastrophe.

British forces compared the US are MINIMAL!
Australian forces are barely EXISTENT.

You have over 140,000 troops there, its the US's curropt mistake, so they should DEAL WITH IT!

But I love the way, theyre immediately surrending in your mind...

Thats a respectable allie for ya!

[edit on 21-2-2007 by Agit8dChop]

Originally posted by corruptioninvestigator
The Iraqis will never support the government that the US installed because it's perceived as a puppet, making it impossible for the US to "phase out" the occupation by slowly drawing down.

exactly

the people dont see the government as being a government for the people.
The police who are RUN by the government ARENT out to protect the citizens...

they view them as colaboraters... this is why the iraqi women killed those police and are being hung...


if you dare mess with the 'curropt authority' that fooled the americans.. you will be punished.

1. Enter into a massive regional diplomatic effort with all factions with assistance from the UN.

2. A speedy troop withdrawal to Baghdad, then out of country.

3. Indict Bush and his cronies for war crimes.

4. Draft a resolution in congress apologizing to all nations of the world for our illegal actions in Iraq.

5. Provide compensation, rehabilitation, education, and job training for veterans and their families of the Iraq conflict, specifically those families of deceased service members or service members who have been physically disabled.

6. Continue military operations against Islamic radicalism from the front in Afghanistan.

7. Monitor, by every means available to us, the actions of Iran in the turmoil that follows our departure. Build a case against them based on solid, real evidence and intervene only if our nation is truly threatened by the resulting dominant power in the region.

8. Resolve as a nation to enter into only just wars, the definitive litmus test being whether or not an immanent threat to our country exists.


For the chickenhawks who view this as a “cut and run” maneuver: In the regional conflict that follows you will still get to enjoy your nightly body counts on FOX when the various factions in the area spend their own resources annihilating themselves. In the meantime we can rebuild our military and give our troops much needed break.

Originally posted by Agit8dChop

Originally posted by corruptioninvestigator
The Iraqis will never support the government that the US installed because it's perceived as a puppet, making it impossible for the US to "phase out" the occupation by slowly drawing down.

exactly

the people dont see the government as being a government for the people.
The police who are RUN by the government ARENT out to protect the citizens...

they view them as colaboraters... this is why the iraqi women killed those police and are being hung...


if you dare mess with the 'curropt authority' that fooled the americans.. you will be punished.

The bigger perception problem, is getting Sunnis, Shia, and Kurds to accept their respective representatives as legitimate. It's not so much that Iraqis don't accept the "government" as legitimate, as a distrust of the parties from the other sects, or feeling underrepresented. There was a higher turnout, percentage wise, at their elections, than in the US elections so it is hard to propogate the notion that the majority of Iraqis don't accept the legitimacy of the government.

How to end it: Exclude all neo-cons from political power for a while, until they are sanes. Then excuse for all the atrocities comitted, then help them rebuild, NOT build it for them, HELP them rebuilt and make their oil industry a great asset of their country.

The only reason we're in the region at all is because they have stuff we need and want and there is obcene amounts of money to be made. If not for that the Middle East would be suffering the same fate as Africa --- let them starve and die from epidemic disease. We'll just look the other way since they have nothing we want.

To solve the ME situation we need to marginalize our need for their resources and the inherent profitability. Eliminate or drastically reduce that need and the ME can be added to the same list as Darfur. Ugly but true. If anyone truly believes that our presence in the Middle East is based upon some altruistic caring for humanity you are absolutley daft. Look around the world. Look around the USA. With all the massive and indescribable suffering out there is it some coincidence that we only seem to show up when there's oil in the neighborhood?

I don't think the time is right yet to end the Iraq war. We need time to see how the Iran situation develops. Also, terrorists, car bombers e.g., are still too active in Iraq. Of course you could ask Blair, but he is making a mistake pulling his troops out.

Originally posted by jtma508
The only reason we're in the region at all is because they have stuff we need and want and there is obcene amounts of money to be made. If not for that the Middle East would be suffering the same fate as Africa --- let them starve and die from epidemic disease. We'll just look the other way since they have nothing we want.

To solve the ME situation we need to marginalize our need for their resources and the inherent profitability. Eliminate or drastically reduce that need and the ME can be added to the same list as Darfur. Ugly but true. If anyone truly believes that our presence in the Middle East is based upon some altruistic caring for humanity you are absolutley daft. Look around the world. Look around the USA. With all the massive and indescribable suffering out there is it some coincidence that we only seem to show up when there's oil in the neighborhood?

I agree that we need to marginalize our necessity to deal with the ME. The smaller the ME role in the world the better. Where we disagree is in the notion that defending one's strategic interests is somehow a bad thing(or to use terms thrown around here- nefarious, insidious, villainous, etc...). Additionally to say that one can't show altruism in the freeing of a people under a brutal despot, while also protecting one's interests, is in my estimation inaccurate. Why must it be one or the other, with the measure being solely that we have absolutely no interests in a particular region?

Put all of our currently designated resources into helping, protecting and arming the Kurds while the Sunni's and Shiite's continue to kill themselves. Then hand over the whole country to the only people there who seem capable of acting like human beings and rename it to Kurdikstan.

If the other idiots want to keep blowing themselves up then we'll cut it in half. Give the North to the Kurds and let the psychos in the South do whatever they please.

How about we just send all the whiny America hating liberals over there to run the place?

Stabilizing and instituting a new government and way of life takes years no matter where it happens. But, since this is not happening over night lets pull out and let the place degrade into an anarchy state where terrorists can have their way and cheer their victory over America. Why not destabilize the area further and allow Iran to install a sister monarchy? Why then they can blackmail us with the threat of installing nukes in both countries.

It's amazing how everyone seems to be an expert on Iraq.

Originally posted by jbondo
How about we just send all the whiny America hating liberals over there to run the place?

Stabilizing and instituting a new government and way of life takes years no matter where it happens. But, since this is not happening over night lets pull out and let the place degrade into an anarchy state where terrorists can have their way and cheer their victory over America. Why not destabilize the area further and allow Iran to install a sister monarchy? Why then they can blackmail us with the threat of installing nukes in both countries.

It's amazing how everyone seems to be an expert on Iraq.

Sunni states in the region would not allow - at least not without a fight - the imperialistic designs of Iran.

I'd say 2/3 of Americans now have a more realistic grasp of the situation in Iraq that does our president.

how can it be a mistake if the president went in there to line his own pockets and further capatize on the chance to get more power

people need to stop seeing presidents and such as loyal to certain nations of people, they are loyal to there blood family's and the elite multi national groups that they belong to, they are often disgusted by the poor and those that are sick ( or those that need help) just look at katrina among other things that are less in your face like the policy's they pass and so on

but anyway, ok so the president can say well it was a calculated risk that has not gone our way we have made some progress so it is not a loss but it is a moral win either/or it is a draw or whatever bull shananigans pleases the public

the war on terrorism is a perpetual war it is an effect of the way of living we have chosen (materialism without a balance is spiritualism)

until we change our ways of thinking about success=money and the amount of # you can buy then we will not change anything and to do that you need to replace those families (international banking families) that have been in power, and/or you need to hope there is some great power (now hold on before u label it) or energy that shapes the consciousness on this planet, and that it is changing and vibrating at higher frequency "transformation of consciousness) levels consisent with the emotions of love, and that this was able to be seen ( thru limited scopes of understanding) by past cultures who understood the way astronomy and its energetic effects on the vibrations or frequency effecting our way of life or consciusness on the earth) would effect us later in time when they forsaw these astronomical setups in place for our corner of the galaxy, and maybe some postulated that based on human nature there would be great wars fought in these times by the powerful to hold onto there rule out of desperation and that many would probably not survive this mess.



[edit on 21-2-2007 by cpdaman]

If you want to fix Iraq, read the History of Iraq first. Then we understand how idiotic it was for the US to depose Saddam. Saddam was a SOB, but it was his iron fisted oppression that held the varying factions together. Without that ruling influence, Iraq will splinter....

Forcing Democracy upon Iraq...was our leadership all drunk at the same time..? it will never happen. There are bloodfueds that extend for Generations, it is civil war in everything but name.

This is a classic example of people so smart that 2+2=5

1. We withdraw our troops like the Democrates want. A power vacume develops and the country turns on itself, Iran invades to stabilize the government, and wins easily. Iran widens its borders as it believes it was destined to do.

2. We stand and finish the rebuilding. It takes many years, two more presidents pass through before the only troops their are stationed their at Bush AFB. Eventually the dust settles, and we all go back to our lives

3. We stand and finish the rebuilding. It takes a few years. A new Republican is appointed by the elite to take the reigns of the United States. Troop build up is gradual in both the Bush AFB in Iraq, and the Omega Marine base in Afghanistan. From this they wait for any provication what so ever to pound Iran into submission. They also land troops in a blitzkreig that is reminisant of the 2nd Iraq war. The new Republican president is voted out after but we now have control of enough oil to drive prices down to .99 a gallon

[edit on 21-2-2007 by Royal76]

You cannot conquer a nation and reform its government with out a display of absolute control that will be undetered by any effort.

Carpet bomb the cities, kill thousands, put the state into a situation where they need us or they die.

Of course, that is harsh, but that is the only way nation building like this will work. Americans are weak and cannot handle the fact that someone might die in a war *gasps* its unheard of! .. people dieing in a war! no way! ..

The world will learn from our mistakes.. Politically correct wars will not work. You have to make it a real war if you want results.

Or, in a perhaps less homicidal policy, simply don't get involved in wars of choice in the first place.

There was never a compelling reason for the US to invade Iraq. Iraq was never a realistic threat to the US, or, after 1991, anyone else.

Unfortunately the mistake was made back in 2003.
Withdraw now, withdraw later - it doesn't really matter except in terms of saving the lives of US soldiers (a worthy goal in itself).

The die was cast when we invaded.
No matter what we do now the mistake has already been made.




[edit on 2/21/07 by xmotex]