Israel threatens to make new borders

Prime Minister Ariel Sharon
Office of the Prime Minister
19 12 03/Erev Chanukah/Shabbat 5764

Dear Prime Minister Sharon:


You don't know me. I am 23 years old, a member of the IDF Paratroop unit No. ***which just spent two days and two nights in Schechem. As you know from the report of our Defense Minister Mofaz, our units engaged terrorists in the Casbah area of Schechem successfully in erasing these terrorists from further life to cause death to the Jews of Israel.

I did not sleep both nights as we continued going house to house,at times via the walls between the houses, in order to find, arrest, and kill the terrorists. We found one terrorist who was fully 'dressed' in his bomb belt along with his suicide note and video. This terrorist was planning to blow himself up in Hadera yesterday according to my commander. We were able to blow him up first. I know you are very familiar with the turf in Schechem as I have read books on your heroism and military actions over your 50 years of service to our country.

I have one more month left in my IDF service. The years combined in the IDF together with my Hesder yeshiva learning years have given me the opportunity to serve G-d and my nation. As I arrived home today for Chanukah and 36 hours of rest and relaxation here in Migron, I am reading today's papers that describe your intent to destroy Jewish homes and transfer Jews out of their home and land here.

I have spent the last few years going from the Beit Midrash where I am able to learn Tanach and Gemora to my IDF Paratroop unit. I have fought in Jenin after Passover 2002, I have been the recipient of shelling from terrorists near Kfar Darom in the Gaza area. I am now 'fresh' from the front line this week in Schechem.

I am trying to prepare my little menorah, oil, and wicks for tonight's first candle to commemorate Chanukah's miracles and our victory over the enemies and Hellenists amongst us. My mother will light the Shabbat candles a few minutes after my father and I and my 4siblings light our Chanuka menorah tonight.

We are going to the synagogue, past the health care center, near the kindergartens and homes which Defense Minister Mofaz signed off permits for all of these places in Migron. I am sure that you have seen his approvals which are reprinted in today's HATZOFEH and other newspapers. My cousin, David, is a member of the Magavnikim unit of the Israeli Police. Tonight he and his family are joining us in Migron for Shabbat Chanukah.

Mr. Prime Minister, on Sunday morning, I will return to my IDF unit in Schechem, searching for more Chanukah enemies in the Casbah, risking my life for the lives of others whom we don't want to be blown up by terrorists in restaurants, malls, and busses. My cousin, David, has been 'training' for the removal of Jews from their homes. He tells me that in the next few weeks, his unit and other IDF units will be entering Jewish homes to take Jews out of their homes in Israel. David's mother and my father are siblings.

David could be assigned to Migron after Chanukah to join the orders to remove Jews from their homes. David could be assigned to move out our neighbors or his uncle and aunt, my parents. I will be in Schecem removing terrorists from their holes and homes, looking for bombs and bullets. You, Mr. Prime Minister, for whatever reasons from the USA or other minority members of your government will be overseeing removal and transfer of Jews while I, as your soldier of the IDF will be chasing terrorists.

As soon as I hear that Migron, my home, will be the target of your Jew transfer, I will leave my unit in Schechem which I know will get me jail time, and head to Migron. I will not use my hands or feet to touch one fellow soldier or policeman. My rabbanim at the hesder yeshiva have already warned us that we cannot lift a hand to a fellow Jewish soldier. I will join thousands of other Jews to block peacefully and according to law, the removal of my parents and siblings from our home in Migron.

I may 'face' my cousin face to face when you give the order to his unit to remove me and my family. Mr. Sharon, I would like you to witness the transfer of Jews, first cousins, and uncles and aunts as David approaches my home. David will be ordered to take Jews out of their homes in my town of Migron, from the same home which David and his family and mine will share Chanukah divrei Torah tonight.

I know that you have pressure from the world to give it all back and give in to terrorists. It makes me wonder why I am chasing, killing, and arresting terrorists in Schechem last week and again on Sunday. David and I and our parents will light a Chanukah candle tonight on a day filled with rain, storms, thunder and lightning in Jerusalem and Migron. The 134 of us here in Migron will sing Ma OzTzur and add "Al Hanisim" to our prayers starting tonight in the synagogue, next to the health center, next to the kindergarten building. By the way, Defense Minister Mofaz' approvals were blown up in large print and are posted everywhere here.

I am sure you are busy after last night's speech and preparing your Chanukah parties with your sons. I appreciate the time if you read my letter. You will probably see my face when David, my cousin, will carry me away with the other family members per your dream of transferring Jews out of their homes in Israel. You may even see some tears on David's face that might mix with my tears and add to the 'raindrops' of cries on this Chanukah in Migron.


Chanukah Sameach,
Moshe______
IDF Paratrooper No. ****

For the Israelis, removing Jews from their homes is a big deal, a major concession for peace.

What concessions have the Palestinian-Arabs made? How is it that the critics of Israel don't even acknowlege that concessions are being made?

Originally posted by Djarums
Ocelot, i respect your opinions and your right to post them but i believe out of consideration to other members 1) it would be nice to stick to the topic at hand, and 2) if you would like to - as you state - provide reading for us, make your own new thread about it as it had nothing to do with the border issue. I simply can not see what on earth your links to those stories has to do with the current border conflicts other than to apparently make Israel look evil. You have no point. Everyone else stuck to the topic. The next time someone else posts about Mexico I'll be sure to post all of my mexican food recipes because apparently if the topic contains the word "Mexico" anything would be fair game right?

[Edited on 12-19-2003 by Djarums]

The posting of those stories was to make a point. That while many people seem to want to blame the Palestinians for all thats wrong in the middle east, they need to see the the Israeli government and more importantly the MOSSAD have a history creating Terror and blaming it on arabs just to further their agenda. Just as the Bush administration used 9/11 to further their agenda of conquest in the middle east. Its the same concept. If you have a problem with the links then I urge all of you to read up on the MOSSAD and see what these people have done since the agency was created. Read up on their history. They are just as bad and corrupt as the CIA.

While I know that both Arabs and Israelis are to blame for the current situation, look at it this way. One side has the latest in modern weaponry including Nuclear and Chemical weapons provided by the United Staes Government. The Other has to fight back with whatever they have at their dissposal which is not much really. Crude home made bombs, AK's, Grenades and maybe a couple of other stuff.

The Cycle always goes round and round. An Arab who probably had his child killed by one of the IDF incurssions into the west bank in search of "terrorists" wants revenge and blows himself up along with 10 other people at a cafe. In retaliation the IDF goes into a town with soldiers/tanks and demolishes the whole place to the ground killing a couple hundred people and driving a couple thousand from their homes. Not exactly a fair fight is it. Just who is opressing who here? Think about it. Anyways Im tired of typing so that'll be it for me and this topic.

Adios.



[Edited on 20-12-2003 by Ocelot]

[Edited on 20-12-2003 by Ocelot]

Originally posted by Ocelot
The posting of those stories was to make a point. That while many people seem to want to blame the Palestinians for all thats wrong in the middle east, they need to see the the Israeli government and more importantly the MOSSAD have a history creating Terror and blaming it on arabs just to further their agenda.

Except that the only one of your posts that demonstrated that was one from 50 years ago.

Originally posted by Ocelot
While I know that both Arabs and Israelis are to blame for the current situation, look at it this way. One side has the latest in modern weaponry including Nuclear and Chemical weapons provided by the United Staes Government. The Other has to fight back with whatever they have at their dissposal which is not much really. Crude home made bombs, AK's, Grenades and maybe a couple of other stuff.

If we look at it that way, then we conclude that anyone involved in any conflict that is better armed than their opponent is wrong. That�s absurd.

To make an analogy, the United States may have been wrong in invading Iraq. However, if we were wrong, the reason is not because our military is superior to theirs.

Originally posted by Ocelot
The Cycle always goes round and round. An Arab who probably had his child killed by one of the IDF incurssions into the west bank in search of "terrorists" wants revenge and blows himself up along with 10 other people at a cafe�

There is no doubt that the conflict itself is one motivation for becoming a suicide terrorist, however it is a logical fallacy to assume that it is the only motivator. Other factors include the Palestinian-Authorities open public support for suicide-terror including direct payments to terrorist organizations, open public support for suicide-terror from their religious leaders, an intensive propaganda campaign that includes anti-Israeli propaganda in their public schools, the naming of streets and public buildings after suicide-terrorists (including hospitals), television and radio commercials, and the printing of suicide-bomber trading cards, and the refusal of the Palestinian-Authority to arrest terrorists despite treaty obligations to do so.

The IDF going after terrorists is not �retaliation� any more than a police officer arresting a criminal is.

The most important thing in that speech was Sharon, for the first time, acknowledge the two state solution. Up until now he was saying things like end terror then we'll talk. I think this marks a historic event. I don't know how far this is going to take them, but to Bush's credit he used his pull and the threat of sanctions to get Sharon on his team. He's getting things done on the Israeli side that will jump start the roadmap.

I saw the speech on C-span. He also said that the temporary borders were just for sercurity but not the final lines that will separate the two states. The wall shouldn't be there but it's understandable for the time being. After this historic speech where Sharon basically acknowledged their right to exist free of Israeli control and oppression--the terror groups announce that they will not concede. If the Israeli's hold their ground on this pretty soon the Palestinians will see that the terror groups are just as responsible for their misery as is the IDF. This is a hopeful occurrance, years of war makes a population cold on both sides. But, I can only see this speech as a step in the right direction.

A Bush victory.

I hope nobody is missing the major point here that Israel was not supposed to build those settlements there and did so in the first place.

Thus, Israel made an illegal move to their advantage and now they are acting like they are giving something up? How can this be?

If I steal from someone and then keep it then later the court says I have to give it back and I do, how does that make me a hero?

Just asking?

I have never condoned the suicide bombings by the Palestinians either btw.

That�s a good question, TheNeo, I�ll attempt to answer it for you.

That the settlements are illegal is a charge often made by critics of Israel, but the truth of that charge is questionable under international law.

History:

Israel�s Eastern border has never been defined under international law. The �Green Line� which is most often thought of as the border represents the land that was under the control of Israeli troops when the 1949 Armistice agreement was signed. That agreement specifically left the final borders undetermined. At that time, the Gaza Strip, a tiny piece of land in the southwest tip of Israel was left under Egyptian control, and the West Bank, a region of land on the western bank of the Jordan River, was left under Jordanian control.

Israel captured these lands, and other lands, in the six-day war in 1967. The other lands, the Golan Heights and the Sinai Peninsula have since been returned under negotiated peace agreements, but Egypt and Jordan have released their claims to the Western Bank and the Gaza Strip. Also, the West Bank and the Gaza Strip were among the lands granted to Israel by the League of Nations.

The charge that the settlements are illegal comes from a portion of the Geneva conventions that say you can�t colonize land occupied in war. The arguments that the settlements are not illegal are twofold: 1) Since the League of Nations mandated these lands to Israel (or the future Jewish state) it can be argued that these lands belonged to Israel all along, and they were not occupied in 1967 but liberated. 2) A land can�t be occupied unless another sovereign nation claims them. Since Jordan and Egypt both released their claims, they are not occupied.

Realistically, even international law has to bend to facts on the ground. Right now those facts are that there are several million people there that are not citizens of any country, and who have been rejected by their Arabic brethren. They have no place to be except where they are right now. One rational solution is a two-state solution, where the land they�re sitting on can be made into a second Palestinian-Arab state, but that can�t happen until their leaders give up violence against Israel.