Do you "Hate" the United States?

This is a ridiculous question if you're an American.

All Americans love their country with passion. This latest Anti-American crap is something the rabids came up with to justify a bogus war. Who coined it first? Bush? Hannity? Limbaugh? Because i'd be willing to bet my limbs it was one of those three.

As far as foreigners, they do not hate Americans- they hate the American government.

Originally posted by dgtempe
All Americans love their country with passion.

I would agree with that.

People who do not support their government, can love their country as much as anyone. Seems it recent years people who have spoke against Bush, War on Terrorism, etc., are considered to be Anti-American. This message seems to be growing larger, and possibly at some point supporting these will be what is considered to be anti-American.

Why should either be considered?

Isn't America the land of the free? Two opininions should be welcomed.

People who do not support the War, need to support the troops. These kids are putting their lives on the line for a cause, regardless of how just it is. Not supporting the war is no measure of your patriotism. However, not supporting the troops who are giving up their lives is unpatriotic.

As Grady said, he had been ridiculed for taking part in the Vietnam war. If that is not the ultimate slap in the face, I'm not sure what is.

Originally posted by benevolent tyrant

Originally posted by dgtempe
I love America- land of the free...May we all continue to be "free"...

I would gladly fight for our freedom, if necessary. I would not fight just on the whim of some president who happens to be a warmonger, however.

BTW, are we protected from North Korea, or are we still placing all our focus on the Middle East?

What would you say if the U.S. attacked North Korea? I have heard this particular piece of rhetoric a bit too often as of late. I am sure that you yourself have read questions on this very site asking why did the U.S. attack Iraq when North Korea is a real threat.

But, because President George Bush attacked Iraq, instead of North Korea, this makes him a "warmonger"?

dgtempe, I love reading your posts. You often make wonderful posts that are insightful and poignant. However your irrational hatred for George Bush has, perhaps, clouded your judgement.

George Bush did not order U.S. troops into Iraq on a whim. Nor did he do so without the full consent of Congress. There were plenty of key Democrats who took the same stance against Saddam Hussein and his regime;

George Bush vs Bill Clinton, Republicans vs Democrats or the hypocrisy of ideological adherence


If George Bush is the "devil" then so are many of the key Democrats who voted for the war right along side Bush's Satanic minions -- the Republicans.

dgtempe, I'm not defending George Bush and I'm not attacking the Democrats, I'm simply calling a spade a spade. Clinton was certainly no better or worse than Bush except for the fact that he has what Bush could never have -- an undeniable sense of charisma.

As for attacking North Korea, or, rather, why the U.S. doesn't attack North Korea, it's very simple. The North Koreans never needed or depended upon nukes to keep the U.S. from invading they had another deterrent -- artillery. I know it sounds silly to think that an "outdated" artillery piece could be considered a deterrence but when you consider that North Korea has over 13,000 artillery guns placed in hardened bunkers all within range of Seoul, South Korea's capital deterrence takes on a more conventional but effective face.

Artillery

North Korea has an estimated 13,000 artillery sites stationed in secure bunkers, many of which are aimed at targets in and around the South Korean capital, Seoul. Such a large collection of artillery could potentially drop 300,000 shells per hour on the city.
Indeed, the presence of such a large force is seen by many as a significant threat. However, due to the fact that U.S. officials believe every fourth round has a chemical tip, the artillery arm of the DPRK military could inflict a considerable amount of casualties upon the population of South Korea. militaryhistory.about.com...

When one considers that Seoul, South Korea is the fifth largest city in the world with a population of over ten million people, conventional weapons massed in concentrated fire could easily be considered a WMD.

Another reason why the U.S. doesn't attack North Korea is simple, militarily, strategically and politically, this would be far more difficult for the U.S. to do. But I am sure that if North Korea rattles it's sabres and fires off a few more nukes while the Great Leader pompously threatens the U.S. and allies in the region, I am sure that Bush or his Democrat successor will definitely attack.

I know that I digress from the main topic of this thread but hatred or President Bush is certainly an aspect that should be explored. Perhaps the thread should have been titled "Do you hate President George Bush"? It certainly seems like this collective hatred for Bush is due to the war on Iraq. Yet is this a rational hatred? Would we have hated Clinton had he attacked? Or, in keeping with the theme of the thread, would the United States and Americans be hated if this had been Clinton's war or Kerry's?




[edit on 10/12/2006 by benevolent tyrant]

Right on with the democrat part. And for arrogant self centered, ungraitful countries you forgot to mention france. I'm part French but they are astounding. They hate Americans even though we have saved their butts in 2 world wars. I really can't think of anything good they have done except help us in the American Revoloution.

Originally posted by spinstopshere
And for arrogant self centered, ungraitful countries you forgot to mention france.

I understand there are French people who may carry them charachteristics. But isn't it hypocritical to talk down to a country in that manner, simply because they may do the same to you?

If I say those arrogant, ignorant and self centered French are completely ungraitful for their actions and their distaste for America. How does that make you any better?

Ignorance is ignorance, and we are all guilty of it at one time or another. Sometimes we need to take a look at ourselves before juding others.

-------------------

Allow me to edit this before I even reread it, spinstopshere, in no way, shame, or form am I directing these comments towards you. I have quoted one of your posts, but please do not take this as a direct shot towards yourself.

This is meant to the general public, not towards you. (That is if you took it personal) If not, disregard this last section.





[edit on 13-10-2006 by chissler]

What an absurd thread. I love my country, its the current administration and their arrogant and reckless behavior on the world stage that I despise.

Originally posted by chissler
Ignorance is ignorance, and we are all guilty of it at one time or another.

Hear! Hear! Truer words never spoken...There's no single human being who can know everything & be any kind of real masterful expert, because no matter how much you do know (even in a single subject) there will always be more that you don't know.

What some people fail to realize is that you should also be aware of where your own knowledge stops & where your own ignorance begins...That's a pretty fine line to be walking, but exercising your intellect can gradually move that line back a bit.

I don't think that this observation is unique:
"Everybody's ignorant, just in different subjects."--Will Rogers
Also, Socrates wasn't any real genius in his own right, even though it's likely he studied various sciences & philosophies. His greatest contribution to rational thought lies in being (arguably) the world's greatest skeptic! Since he could lead anyone into self-contradiction, he proved that nobody can really know anything with absolute certainty. But since Socrates himself knew that he didn't really know anything, that was a bit of knowledge he had that most people didn't possess...Therefore, that's what made him smarter than anyone else!

I think what the politicians' greaest ignorance is that they seem to equate "leadership" with "rulership", which could be a symptom of "greed-induced" blindness.

The problem with "ignorance" is that, with only a text-based medium to go with in website forums, only a person's intellect can really be perceived by the viewer. I can still claim to be guilty of displaying ignorance, at least occasionally.

[edit on 14-10-2006 by MidnightDStroyer]

Originally posted by grover
What an absurd thread. I love my country, its the current administration and their arrogant and reckless behavior on the world stage that I despise.

Absurd? Is it absurd because you live in the U.S. and have not been exposed to what can only be described as anti American sentiment and hatred? Trust me, there are people who, for a variety of reasons, hate the U.S. and Americans. Why? Well, I'm sure that they hate the U.S. and Americans because of the policies of the Bush Administration but, at the same time, it is quite possible that long-seated resentments have simply been allowed to surface because we might be in a period of time where it is simply fashionable to hate the U.S.

I am starting to believe that the hatred of George Bush is also irrational. Disagree with a man. Disagree with a man's politics. But is it rational to hate someone for doing, more or less, exactly what a Democrat -- say, John Kerry -- would have done in Iraq?

External Source

"I will be voting to give the President of the United States the authority to use force-- if necessary -- to disarm Saddam Hussein because I believe that a deadly arsenal of weapons of mass destruction in his hands is a real and grave threat to our security." Sen. John F. Kerry (D, MA), Oct. 9, 2002. www.snopes.com...


I have come to the conclusion that there is no difference between the Republican party and the Democratic party. They are one and the same. "Two sides on the same coin". Yet the hatred spawned toward George Bush is irrational when viewing quotes from Democratic leaders about weapons of mass destruction in Iraq. Both parties were in agreement. Yes, the U.S. made a mistake. Yes the U.S. is now stuck in a precarious position -- trying to restore order in a country that where law no longer is the rule. And simply packing up and moving out of Iraq is not an option. If the U.S. did move out, lock stock and barrel, there would be sectarian violence in Iraq at such a level that it would make ethnic cleansing in Bosnia seem like a "day at the park".

There is no question in my mind that there are people who hate the U.S. and they are not all foreigners. Some of the people who hate the U.S. live right in the United States. They hate what America stands for. They hate the fact that America is wealthy. They hate the fact that America is the lone superpower. They hate the U.S. because it is not the country that they want it to be.

From my perspective of an American living in Canada, I have been exposed to blind hatred of the U.S. and Americans. This development is a recent one. I've lived in Canada for over twenty years and I have never seen such vitriolic rhetoric before. This is new and I have to ask why? Why have George Bush's actions, his policies become synonymous with America and it's people? How is it that George Bush and the Republican party are alone to be blamed for a war which the Democrats called for themselves? There is something here that somehow does not make sense. How is it rational to hate George Bush, the Republicans and America for a war which was supported by John Kerry, Bill Clinton, the Democrats and many other countries as well?

Has the world been waiting all of this time for the U.S. to falter? Has the rest of the world been eagerly anticipating an American disaster that would cause it to become a global pariah?

Originally posted by benevolent tyrant
Why have George Bush's actions, his policies become synonymous with America and it's people? How is it that George Bush and the Republican party are alone to be blamed for a war which the Democrats called for themselves?

Could be this way because the real truth never seems to hit the major international media outlets...Such as the truth that the Voice of Americans does not always concur with the Government's Voice or its Actions.
For example, how many other nations see news like this coming out of the media? To be honest, this is the type of news that should be widespread in American media but I haven't seen it myself & I wonder how many Americans have seen it.

I'm a asian american and I actually love this country. People may say are country is currupt, but u know what 99% of other countries are more currupt. People in America including myself live good lives. I love my life in America and appreciate it, so people can bash on America all they want and the gov., but u know what? I don't have anything to complain about.

I think when people have too much freedom, they start to pick at every little thing someone does wrong. Some people have too much free time. Just look at it this way, would u rather live in a third world country or America? Some people don't appreciate the things they have until they don't have it.

And no we are not going to be slaves to the New World Order. I'm sick of hearing that.

Amfirst, understand that I'm not trying to put you down or anything like that...But I'd like to ask a few questions that might get you thinking. I don't really expect you to provide any answers here on a public forum.
How much of your life was lived in America? Are you a naturalized immigrant or were you born in the USA? If so, how many generations of your family have lived in the USA?

As I said, I don't require you to answer these questions, I'm just trying to get my point across: My family comes from Dutch & German roots, but have lived as Americans for 3 generations from my mother's side & I don't know how many from my father's side (My father served in WW II).
I've seen the changes in America over the past 3 generations or so, both through my family's eyes & my own: I've seen other changes by my studies in American history as well. I see that America is on the road to becoming a Third World Nation!
This Nation was founded on completely unique circumstances...The concept of Individual Freedom that was denied in nearly every single nation in the world & its history. America came from monarchial roots, but it was born with a freedom that no other nation had.
In my own lifetime, with my own eyes, I've seen how far America has fallen from where it was just during my parents' time. Okay, I admit it for the first time here in ATS! I'm "over the hill"...I'm in my forties! I've seen the Middle Class desintegrate before my very eyes, as my mother was forced to find employment merely to maintain our proverbial "Average Middle Class Family of Four" status (Yes, that is my background!). I've seen how we've come to depend on an economic system that represents debt instead of production. I've seen how corporate corruption in the government has gotten rid of a significant portion of our industrial jobs (by "outsourcing") which lowers our GNP & how our government allows a "civilian invasion" of illegal aliens across our borders to further depress Americans' ability to find & hold a job. I've seen how a corrupt government further enforces "Rule by the Elite" & supresses any attempt to hold them accountable for their actions, rather than practicing "leadership" under the strict guidelines of the Constitution that gave birth to this nation.

I love America...The ideals that gave birth to it, the concepts that made it grow strong & still guarantee the individual's freedom to make choices!
No, I don't hate America...I hate what's happening to it: The removal of choices & the supression of every other freedom that made USA great to begin with.

I have encountered a few people that appear to genuinely HATE the USA. However the majority (including myself), do not and adore this country very much...

Originally posted by grover
What an absurd thread. I love my country, its the current administration and their arrogant and reckless behavior on the world stage that I despise.

Is it just me or is that a complete contradiction? You love the country, administration and the arrogant and reckless behaviour on a world stage, that you despise?



Anyways, you not agreeing with somenthing does not make it absurd. This may not be a part of your life, but denying its existence is ignorant. Just because you do not deal with it on a daily basis, does not mean thousands of others do not.

Well, I don't "hate" the United States. I would presume that most folk in America are good eggs really. There is just one thing that some Americans do that bugs the hell out of me.

Screaming into your Xbox communicators will not make you go faster, shoot better, and constant cussing says more about your character then it does about the person you are attacking.

Anyway, that's just one and only thing that annoys me about some Americans. The government? Pick a reason, and it might be mildly justified. My reason for disliking the government is the fact that Bush can apparently speak in Spanish. That's just a big lie!

Originally posted by MacDonagh
Screaming into your Xbox communicators will not make you go faster, shoot better, and constant cussing says more about your character then it does about the person you are attacking.

I am positive that more than Americans are guilty of this infraction.

Probebly, but all I've ever heard are some Americans shouting and screaming at me, as I'm speaking from a personal point of view. It's not very nice getting shouted at. The majority of Xbox Live players are good people to play games and share a joke with, but some take their gaming very seriously.

I don't scream when I'm mad. I scream because I can and I love to hear my own annoying pitch being shot back from someone else's speakers

No, I don't hate the US. But I think like everything else, it's gotten messier with time. Some people in this country, love power and use it wrong, some people need power to have a life, some need to lose power so people can be on a level field. But when powerful(weither by fame, money, intelligence, heritage, or force) people have too much control like they do now by the internet, there are problems that were unforseen by the legislatures of the Founding Fathers days.

I don't "hate" any country, especially not this one. Russia seems a little too cold and barren for my taste though - but I've never been personally. I'd have to say the U.S. is the greatest nation on the face of the Earth. Of course that's probably because it's the only country I've set foot on, but still. Spectacular place, until you start getting into the urban areas. Then everything gets bland and life gets boring fast. Our government and entire political system, on the other hand, could stand for a reform, and thats putting it lightly.

No, I don't hate the United States.

They are easily one of my favourite countries, however I do not like Bush, American trends caught on in my country, and in nearly all movies theres an American flag being hoisted to the top of a flag.

I also hate it how SOME Americans think they're so much better than the rest of the world.

Other than them I absolutely love the United States.

Nope, not in the least. I mean I've lived here my entire life, if I hated it, I would have left long ago.

Having said that...there are aspects of America I could do without. The seemingly rampant sense of entitlement that portions of American society have, and this is irrespective of racial makeup. Simply because you breathe air doesn't entitle you to any special consideration...earn your way. (I suspect I'll hear about this)

The anti-American sentiments were around long, long before Bush II. He did nothing to create the sentiment, he may have in his own little way made it worse, but he certainly didn't create it.

My encounter with anti-americanism occured on a drive from Alaska to Seattle via the Alaskan-Canadian Highway (a very cool, in more ways than one, drive...I highly recommend it). Two freinds and I had stopped for gas in some little hamlet and were stretching and basically minding our own business, when we were accosted by two gentlemen who informed us that Americans were not welcome in BC. They didn't phrase it quite so politely... Truth to tell, I was rather shocked, because prior to that incident, I had been very impressed by how, well, nice everyone in Canada had been. This was in 1988. So its always been there, just certain events bring it to the surface...