The Lucifer Conspiracy

what is the name of your God?

Sun Matrix,

I have seen you ask this question to many people on various threads.
It seems to me either you know the answer to this question and are trying to bait people into giving a false answer or you truly want to know, which is it?
What it boils down to is there is truly only one God (Supreme Being).
God (Supreme Being) may have been called different names or been given different descriptions over time with different religions but ultimately how could one argue the existence of or more than one God (Supreme Being)?
The word God (Supreme Being) itself means only one thing:

the supernatural being conceived as the perfect and omnipotent and omniscient originator and ruler of the universe

So how could there be more than one God (Supreme Being)? If you argue any differently then its an argument about religion or different sects of religion and which belief of religion you believe is more correct than another. So ultimately the argument is not about God (Supreme Being) its about religion. And I believe once you realize this you won't be asking the question "what is the name of your god?"
When in fact you should be asking what is your religious belief?

wordnet.princeton.edu...

Originally posted by etshrtslr




So ultimately the argument is not about God (Supreme Being) its about religion. And I believe once you realize this you won't be asking the question "what is the name of your god?"
When in fact you should be asking what is your religious belief?

Ok..............ask himl what his religious belief is and you will get a bunch of smoke and mirrors. Something along the line of I believe that Jesus is the Son of God.

Which god is the question. Notice he can't seem to answer. If you think there is only one god you are sadly mistaken.

There is so much you don't see. Why 1000 year day of the Lord..............WHAT LORD. Why spirit, blood and water. Does the age of Aquarius ring any bells.

Wolf in sheeps clothes, nothing more, and without power except to deceive.

Hi etshrtslr, Sun:

Etshrtslr >> I have seen you ask this question to many people on various threads. It seems to me either you know the answer to this question and are trying to bait people into giving a false answer or you truly want to know, which is it?

Sun > Which god is the question. Notice he can't seem to answer. If you think there is only one god you are sadly mistaken.

First of all, Sun has a great deal of difficulty staying focused on the Thread Starter’s Topic. We should be writing about and respecting Annie’s Lucifer Topic, even if we are to make comments on her poorly defined thesis. You have been witnessing Sun Matrix’s version of being a troll on someone else’s thread with this ridiculous question, as he tries to flame another member into deviating from the topic to write on his. However, over a period of time he will also be revealed to everybody as an IDOLATER himself, which is intimated in his statement above “If you think there is only one god you are sadly mistaken.” Sun has every sign of being deceived by the “Deity Of Christ” Conspiracy where the “Son of God” (John 1:34) is fashioned into a molten calf of IDOLATRY to replace “His God and Father” (Rev. 1:6). How do we know for certain that Sun Matrix’s statement above is certainly FALSE?? What does Scripture say [my notes]?

“There is one body [Christ’s body = 1Cor. 12:27] and one Spirit [Holy Spirit = Eph. 1:13+14], just as also you were called in one hope [of glory = Col. 1:27] of your calling; one Lord [Jesus Christ = Rom. 10:9], one faith [of Jesus = Rom. 3:26], one baptism [into Christ = 1Cor. 12:13], one God and Father [Only True God = John 17:3] of all who is over all and through all and in all.” Ephesians 4:4-6.

Scripture teaches there is “one God and Father of all who is over all and through all and in all.” THAT is the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ who raised Him from the dead (Rom. 10:9). The equation that teaches Christ’s “Only True God” doctrine AND allows us to stay near Annie’s Topic looks like this:



On the top right hand side you see the three witnesses of “The Almighty” from Revelation 1:8 in a “three are into the one” (1John 5:8) “Man.” Directly under Him in the “Realm of the Word” you can see the Father (spirit), Son (blood) and Holy Spirit (water) also in a ‘three are into the one’ (1John 5:8) Heavenly “Man” (1Timothy 2:5). Note that God’s Son (Heavenly Man Christ Jesus) bears the “IMAGE of the Invisible God" (Col. 1:15) beyond the ‘Second Veil’ of Time and Space. Sun's Theology does not recognize the differences between God AND His Only Begotten Son (John 3:16) He has sent! His church dogma (which you are trying to characterize as his religion) teaches the Father, Son and Holy Spirit as “God,” when in truth those are the three witnesses of “The Logos” (The Word = John 1:1-3, 14). Therefore, the Father, Son and Holy Spirit (Matt. 28:19) are the three witnesses of “God’s Son” (Christ Jesus), while Sun Matrix is going to idolize Him as “God Himself.”

Annie sits in another position of focusing her dogma on the left hand side of the diagram (equation), as God’s Word and Satan’s word (Heavenly man antichrist) appear together like Jacob and Esau sharing the same womb. Some ATS members are being baptized into Christ (Gal. 3:27) through obedience to what Paul calls “my gospel” (Rom. 2:16, 16:25), while a larger proportion are taking part in the “mystery of iniquity” (2Thes. 2:7) to be baptized into the left side of this diagram. The difference is that Annie is baptized into Lucifer’s son (Heavenly man antichrist) and very much in love with the idea, while Sun Matrix is over there through receiving the “deluding influence” (2Thes. 2:11). Therefore, when Annie looks up she sees her god Lucifer, but Sun Matrix is wearing those dark shaded sunglasses (2Cor. 4:3-4 = blinds minds of unbelieving) that transform his god into an image of “His God and Father.” Obedience to Paul’s “word of the cross” (1Cor. 1:18) gospel message baptizes you into the right hand side of the diagram (sealed IN Him = Eph. 1:13+14; IN Christ Jesus = Eph. 2:6), while rejecting God’s offer and accepting all forms of a ‘false gospel’ finds you baptized into the left hand unholy body of sin. Sun Matrix’s assertion is rebuked by Paul in this teaching:

“For there is one God[God To Come+God Who Is+God Who Was], and one Mediator* also between God AND men, the man [F+S+HS] Christ Jesus [Son of God]. . .”. 1Timothy 2:5.

The Greek term “Mesites*” (#3316) forbids the “one Mediator” (Christ Jesus) to be transported into the “one God” position of “His God and Father” (Rev. 1:6) OR into the ‘men’ position. www.blueletterbible.org...
--------
1) one who intervenes between two, either in order to make or restore peace and friendship, or form a compact, or for ratifying a covenant

2) a medium of communication, arbitrator
--------

This explains why all of my diagrams show “Christ Jesus” (F+S+HS) standing “Between God (GTC, GWI, GWW) and men (spirit, soul, body).” Since Sun is teaching more than one God, then he can explain to our readers exactly what that means (Heh). Personally I do not have one reason for believing he can write two intelligent paragraphs together on any of these Bible topics. We should expect him to troll himself out from under that rock and yell “Yea, but what is your God’s name?!” Heh . . . What does Christ call His God?

“Jesus said to them, "If God were your Father, you would love Me, for I proceeded forth and have come FROM GOD, for I have not even come on My own initiative, but HE sent Me.” John 8:42.

If Jesus Christ calls Him “God,” then how are we wrong for also calling “His God and Father” by the same exact name?? The right answer is that “God” is the God of our Lord Jesus Christ = PERIOD! After all, the Son’s name is bound up in His ‘relationship’ with the same God who sent Him AND the same God who raised Him from the dead! That is why He is called the “Son OF GOD” (John 1:34). Those believing in multiple gods are truly serving the “god of this world” (2Cor. 4:3-4) through his various disguises (angel of light = 2Cor. 11:14).

GL getting something intelligent out of Sun,

Terral

Hi Terral,

The fact that I see right through your smoke and mirrors seems to trouble you as well it should.

All this tooting of your horn and graphs and Bible verses and you still can't name your God.

So when your 1000 year Day of the Lord (Water) AGE OF AQUARIUS arives will you be raptured with those that believe that Jesus is God in the flesh, or will you be on earth serving a god you seem to have trouble naming?

Originally posted by Terral
Sun Matrix Should Quote Other Members And Debate OR Just Read The Thread

I beg to differ, dear Terral....


This one IS my thread and I say that Sun can post as he desires to. Or not.



[edit on 10/7/2006 by queenannie38]

Originally posted by Terral
First of all, Sun has a great deal of difficulty staying focused on the Thread Starter’s Topic. We should be writing about and respecting Annie’s Lucifer Topic, even if we are to make comments on her poorly defined thesis.

Although I do appreciate your respect, Terral - I know you are new here so I'll let you in on a little secret. My threads wander as they may. I don't mind. Freedom of speech and an open mind are my motivations as far as the experiences I hope to share with anyone who joins me in a discussion.

You have been witnessing Sun Matrix’s version of being a troll on someone else’s thread with this ridiculous question, as he tries to flame another member into deviating from the topic to write on his.

Well, if Sun is a troll then I guess I am a she-goat gruff. And looking within a person's heart is always more indicative of their trollish-ness, IMO.

However, over a period of time he will also be revealed to everybody as an IDOLATER himself, which is intimated in his statement above “If you think there is only one god you are sadly mistaken.”

You are ALL idolaters. Defining God as any certain or particular entity, energy, or vibration is idolatry. Trying to rule over even your own belief system is IDOLATRY.

There is but ONE GOD. Yes. There are gods, also. There are princes, magistrates, judges, messengers, and eunuchs. There are also tax-collectors and executioners in the Royal Kingdom of HEAVEN and EARTH.

BUT please KNOW this, also:

O Israel your God is ONE.

There is none other and all source is the ONE God who is the GOD of ALL!

How do we know for certain that Sun Matrix’s statement above is certainly FALSE??

Same way as yours – they are coming from something other than UNITY.

Echad.

Scripture teaches there is “one God and Father of all who is over all and through all and in all.”

Now, really! How can ‘scripture’ teach? How can written words act as mentor and guide? That’s just like making a god out of a log. Making a prophet out of the pulp that is left over.

The teacher is also part of the ONE. And the ONE is ALIVE and goes where it wills – and no man can decide or detect it’s path.

[IMG]

I must be honest, Terral – your images BORE me to tears. They also hurt my eyes. :shk: Do you draw them or borrow them? And if borrowed, then WHO the heck draws such things, pray tell?

Annie sits in another position of focusing her dogma on the left hand side of the diagram (equation), as God’s Word and Satan’s word (Heavenly man antichrist) appear together like Jacob and Esau sharing the same womb.

Terral, you know not where I sit. I understand that even if you don't.

And I have no DOGMA. I presented some teaching. It can be taken and considered, or not. When, how, or even if – I know not (God knows). I’m serving the feast, not forcing down anyone’s throat. There is plenty for all and none are forced to eat. Perhaps you’d like your feet washed instead? I’d be honored to do so, if you permit me!

GL getting something intelligent out of Sun,

Terral

Who cares about intelligence?
Love is all I seek out of anyone! And I seek to give it in every way I am allowed.

And so to you, too, Terral – my love and God’s love and peace as well!

Originally posted by Sun Matrix
So when your 1000 year Day of the Lord (Water) AGE OF AQUARIUS arives will you be raptured with those that believe that Jesus is God in the flesh, or will you be on earth serving a god you seem to have trouble naming?

Just FYI, Sun - an 'age' is 2100 years as we count them on the combined lunar/solar calendar!

And they do tend to overlap somewhat, as far as perceived manifestations among men...

1968-1969 - that was actually when we entered the Age of Aquarius. The Fifth Dimension sang that song not only because they wanted to - nothing happens by chance. NOTHING.

Whatsoever.

GOD controls all events and gives signs that go unnoticed except to those who they are sent to inform.

Right now - this moment in time - signs and wonders are EVERYWHERE!

My head is reeling with all the light shining about the Glory which is approaching fast, in the clouds.

sun matrix and terral going at it again....beware sun guy...u might get owned again.

My reading finds her thesis poorly defined, most ridiculous and totally absurd!

This isn’t a term paper for the last semester of my Master’s course of study, Terral – it is a discussion forum, remember? Thesis statements are overdressed for such shin-digs.

So, she is sick of this ‘Lucifer Conspiracy’ that she never defines, then switches gears to address the reader by informing him this “Lucifer” is truly the “one they love!”

You know, I’m right here – no need to speak of me in the third person. Your arrogancy astounds me.
My point, in this thread is this, plain and simple:
There is no being in God’s realm which God named ‘Lucifer.’ Jerome chose that word as a translation for a word he obviously couldn’t make heads nor tails of (considering it is the only place mentioned and only once as a proper name in all the forms of the root verb.)
THEREFORE – no specific satan of the angelic order is named ‘Lucifer.’ Lucifer is an invalid and misleading non-inspired name which has hindered true understanding of a lot of things every since the dark ages went from black to grey.

Why not just read from the Hebrew and stop the nonsense?

Do YOU understand Hebrew? Without a lexicon, that is?

And the nannie scholar wants you to be in love with the devil?! This OP is beyond the realm of preposterous!

I could CARE LESS who you are in love with, Terral – or anyone – for I know God’s will WILL be done and God loves everyone so I have no reason to fret.

So what? Aaron is the brother of Moses and Satan is going to be crushed under our feet.

You speak evil of dignities – do you not think Aaron is one of the Saints, now, with his brother and sister?

Heh . . . So, it doesn’t matter what is TRUE, huh??

Sure it does.

Terral – I am not such that you are able to recognize.

I have been judged, already – by the LORD GOD who judges the quick and the dead. My history is not similar to yours, it seems – I have known Yehoshua – in the flesh – long long ago….I stood before the cross on that wretched and dark day – LITERALLY.

Originally posted by Sun Matrix
Queeny, you got any of those axes and swords left, or have I dulled them all.

Dulled? My friend, you are hard as an adamantine stone - you are my sharpener, don't you know?

I wish someone would stop talking cryptically for a minute and say in layman's terms what they believe Lucifer to be. I understand Lucifer not being Satan, but who is he/she?

QueenAnnie, could you state simply who you believe Lucifer is and what purpose is served by him/her?

Originally posted by interestedalways
QueenAnnie, could you state simply who you believe Lucifer is and what purpose is served by him/her?

Okay - here goes (in the event you don't think I'm mad like a march hare and want to discuss this ?? way out stuff, we can do so - but first just the details)....

The name in Isaiah - Heylel (sometimes rendered elsewhere as Haliel and Heliel, etc) belongs to the Son of God (from the last age - not now) whose brethren had been involved in the things that 'corrupted the way' (meaning the DNA way - spirit meets creature = man) and making those they made much like mongrels (the reason for the stigma of sodomy which literally means sex with strange flesh - not homogenous flesh) into slaves.

The global cataclysm of around 10,500 BC resulted from these abominations - and the root cause was greed.

It has varieties in various cultures (not just a few).

God's first born beloved Son took it upon himself to descend into the mortal realm and rectify the situation that his brethren caused. NOT him - but He took the stripes for the others so that ALL would be saved and the Tree of Life restored to health and vitality.

The Tree of Life is DNA.

He was not cast down for the reason of being evil - he came to fix things - a noble thing not a capital crime.

And for the self-sacrificing act he did to save both his kindred as well as mankind (who started as the 'things' the slaves), The MOST High God restored His rank and honor and added much much more.

This is the essence of true agape love.

The same sort that the human life of same exemplified.

That is the WRONG in calling 'Lucifer' (by the wrong name) as the devil.

There is deception and vain-spirit beings, no doubt, which these labels arose as designations for.

But God's family (ALL of His family) is like God.

LOVE
MERCY
COMPASSION
PURE in HEART and INTENTION
ABLE to do ALL THINGS

From what I've learned, Satan is Lucifer inverted, or the Light(Lucifer) trapped within the confines of the "I".

The "I"(Satan-Lucifer) is not the I AM or the Ancient of Days(Christus-Lucifer).

However the "I" can only exist by borrowing(or stealing rather) Light from the I AM.

The "I" is of the Klipoth(Hell) which is the shadow of the Tree of Life.

The I AM is the Head of the Sephirothic Crown of the Tree of Life itself.

When we do away with the "I", Satan(Lucifer fallen) becomes Lucifer(The Brightest Angel in Heaven, Christ) again.




Regards

So a part of the I AM or Dharmakaya's Infinite Light(Lucifer) is trapped within our egos or I's.

When that Light(Lucifer) is set free from the "I"(Satan), it is then free to rejoin the Infinite Ocean of the Clear Light(the Dharmakaya which is of the AIN SOPH AUR).

I am a gnostic christian and my belief is that lucifer is humanity aka adam and eve. We were tricked by the snake (reptillians), to taste the flesh and we fell from heaven as a result. Since the lizard tricked us as agent of satan the same lizard did whatever possible to keep mankind imprisoned in the physical purgatory.

Those that practive the luciferian faith are people that love life and existance and have decided to make the most of their time here but maybe do not forsee the selfish road they are on towards their hidden master satan. The lizard is a servant of satan and he will soon be revealed as our overseers for all to see with plain sight.

Originally posted by Tamahu
From what I've learned, Satan is Lucifer inverted, or the Light(Lucifer) trapped within the confines of the "I".

Please know, dear friend, that if I *sigh* as I renumerate these things it is not in anyway directed at you.

But at the misconceptions such as the one you mention.

#1 Satan is NOT a proper name - never has been - all such uses in that capacity are literary devices of the ancient era in which such works as the Book of Job were written.

The Hebrew word 'satan' is (properly) and was (traditionally until the advent of christianity) defined as:
* to be or act as an adversary, resist, oppose
* adversary (in general - personal or national)

It is rendered, in the Hebrew as:

שטן

Backwards, that is


נטש

And means:

to leave, permit, forsake, cast off or away, reject, suffer, join, spread out or abroad, be loosed, cease, abandon, quit, hang loose, cast down, make a raid, lie fallow, let fall, forgo, draw

However, this word is as widely used as it could be, it seems – I looked up each instance and it is very diverse.

So – considering the fact that satan is not a proper name (in Hebrew) and Lucifer is a latin word of much later birth…I’m going to throw that which you’ve heard, Tamahu, out of the game. Be sure and pass it on

The "I"(Satan-Lucifer) is not the I AM or the Ancient of Days(Christus-Lucifer).

This one mystifies me – what ‘I’ satan-lucifer? The I AM (who is not the Ancient of Days – El Elyon) is

היה אשר היה

And literally being I AM that I AM (or will become) – but there is no ‘I’ in Hebrew (as such) and the letter ayin ע means ‘eye/spiritual insight’ but is absent from all words mentioned so far.

However the "I" can only exist by borrowing(or stealing rather) Light from the I AM.

How can light be ‘stolen’ from God unless He wills it?

The "I" is of the Klipoth(Hell) which is the shadow of the Tree of Life.

That’s not one I’m familiar with.

The I AM is the Head of the Sephirothic Crown of the Tree of Life itself.

I thought that was Keter? כתר

When we do away with the "I", Satan(Lucifer fallen) becomes Lucifer(The Brightest Angel in Heaven, Christ) again.

Okay – I see where you are going with that…I didn’t at first.

But yet I truly fear that the mystical undertandings of the Sefirot are beyond the point at which my intended audience are probably willing to consider as even viable truth if even allowed as not some sort of condemned doctrine (or whatever).

You know, I hope, what I'm sayin'

Thank you for your input, Tamahu!

Queenie:

Tamahu Original >>From what I've learned, Satan is Lucifer inverted, or the Light (Lucifer) trapped within the confines of the "I".

Queenie >> Please know, dear friend, that if I *sigh* as I renumerate these things it is not in anyway directed at you. But at the misconceptions such as the one you mention.

LOL . . . Please forgive, but I had to run back inside after losing my lunch from reading Queenie’s reply the first time. What some people classify as scholarly work is truly amazing and a bit frightening to say the least. Satan is addressed by Christ in Matthew 4:10 and the Greek term of Scripture is “Satanas” (#4567 = www.blueletterbible.org... ) [my notes]

Strong’s Lexicon:
1) adversary (one who opposes another in purpose or act), the name given to
a) the prince of evil spirits, the inveterate adversary of
God and Christ
1) he incites apostasy from God and to sin
2) circumventing men by his wiles
3) the worshippers of idols are said to be under his control
4) by his demons he is able to take possession of men and inflict them with diseases
5) by God's assistance he is overcome
6) on Christ's return from heaven he will be bound with chains for a thousand years, but when the thousand years are finished he will walk the earth in yet greater power, but shortly after will be given over to eternal punishment
b) a Satan-like man

Paul warns "for some have already turned aside to follow Satan." 1Timothy 5:15.

Queenie >> #1 Satan is NOT a proper name - never has been - all such uses in that capacity are literary devices of the ancient era in which such works as the Book of Job were written.

Obviously Ms. Queenie is unaware that Satan (satan #7854 = www.blueletterbible.org... ) is also mentioned in 1Chronicals 21:1 and Zechariah 3:1+2. Strong’s Lexicon includes Satan’s name.

1) adversary, one who withstands
a) adversary (in general - personal or national)
2) superhuman adversary
a) Satan (as noun pr)

The Lord is talking to Satan in Joe 2:6 and he is going “out from the presence of the Lord” in the very next verse. Her "Satan is NOT a proper name" statement above is just as WRONG as it can be. And to think she really believes nobody is talking to Satan anywhere in Scripture. Heh . . . That is funny.

Queenie >> The Hebrew word 'satan' is (properly) and was (traditionally until the advent of christianity) defined as:
* to be or act as an adversary, resist, oppose
* adversary (in general - personal or national)

LOL . . . Now THAT is even funnier. Do you really want to sit there and believe that Jews reading these OT books failed to realize that “Satan” is a proper name and God’s adversary??? Note that our resident scholar (Heh = even funnier still) failed to provide the third party reference to ‘her’ private definition above. She thinks pasting a few Hebrew letters of the alphabet means something . . . Who is talking in this conversation?

The LORD said to Satan, "From where do you come?" Then Satan answered the LORD and said, "From roaming about on the earth and walking around on it." Job 1:7.

Okay, Ms. Scholar, please identify the party answering the Lord in this verse, according to your personal definition. GL.

Queenie >> It is rendered, in the Hebrew as: שטן Backwards, that is נטש And means . . .

You have GOT to be kidding me – this MUST be some kind of a joke. Ms. Queenie is giving us definitions of three Hebrew letters spelled backwards – and like that means something??? OMG!! This is the part that really makes my stomach queasy. First off, Satan does not really exist (Heh), because her definition allows no such thing. How convenient. Then, if you take the name of her nonexistent devil and turn it around, you can tap into God’s Hidden Wisdom; because she has cracked the ‘read the letters backwards’ Bible Code! I would turn her on “Ignore,” but then our readers would be faced with her NONSENSE apart from someone coming behind and showing them something else. This stuff is ‘out there’ man – WAY out in the exosphere someplace . . .

Queenie >> However, this word is as widely used as it could be, it seems – I looked up each instance and it is very diverse.

LOL . . . Did you consult a Strong’s or Vines’ Dictionary of the Hebrew and Greek, or your Webster’s??

Queenie >> So – considering the fact that satan is not a proper name (in Hebrew) and Lucifer is a latin word of much later birth…I’m going to throw that which you’ve heard, Tamahu, out of the game. Be sure and pass it on

Heh . . . Queenie is going to toss your king off the table and yell “Checkmate” with her “Satan is not a proper name” NONSENSE, because it says so right there in her own personal Queenie’s Encyclopedia Of Biblical Nouns and Pronouns. I cannot stand it anymore – this is too much. Heh . . . GL.

In Christ Jesus,

Terral

Originally posted by Terral
What some people classify as scholarly work is truly amazing and a bit frightening to say the least. Satan is addressed by Christ in Matthew 4:10 and the Greek term of Scripture is “Satanas” (#4567 = www.blueletterbible.org... ) [my notes]

So it would seem, Terral that blueletterbible.org is your scholastic library? And that greek lexicons are the method for which you try to decipher the hard sayings in the ancient Hebrew scriptures?

DO you KNOW the Hebrew language, Terral? DO you?????

Obviously Ms. Queenie is unaware that Satan (satan #7854 = www.blueletterbible.org... ) is also mentioned in 1Chronicals 21:1 and Zechariah 3:1+2. Strong’s Lexicon includes Satan’s name.

NO duh, Terral! But I can see indoctrination and colored definitions a mile away! I refer to Strong's and BDB's a lot - and I really dig Hitchcock's, too.

HOWEVER I do not consider them authorities by any means - they, like all things, are subject to a scrutiny that doesn't depend upon any human doctrine - and the Hebrew language is the ROOT of the gospel.

Queenie >> It is rendered, in the Hebrew as: שטן Backwards, that is נטש And means . . .

You have GOT to be kidding me – this MUST be some kind of a joke. Ms. Queenie is giving us definitions of three Hebrew letters spelled backwards – and like that means something???

YES Terral - there ARE palindromes in the Hebrew, too! OMG as you say. And that just happened to be one: H7854 reverses to H5203 - so go find a barf bag (frab gab?) and then look it up. Or not.

At any rate, what is left for you and I to discuss? Nada.

Shalom

Queenie:

Queenie >> So it would seem, Terral that blueletterbible.org is your scholastic library? And that greek lexicons are the method for which you try to decipher the hard sayings in the ancient Hebrew scriptures?

The Greek Lexicons are the common third party reference through which the original Hebrew, Aramaic and Greek terms are defined in these debates. What is the matter? You found nothing errant in my post to “quote >>” and correct? Heh . . . Anyone with a lick of sense would be totally embarrassed sitting on your side of this debate, after making such ridiculous “Satan is NOT a proper name” claims. Turning the Hebrew letters backwards really took the cake . . .

Queenie >> DO you KNOW the Hebrew language, Terral? DO you?????

Apparently about 1000 times better and more accurately than you. Pull some more of those tricks out of your broom closet and we will see.

Terral Original >> Obviously Ms. Queenie is unaware that Satan (satan #7854 = www.blueletterbible.org... ) is also mentioned in 1Chronicals 21:1 and Zechariah 3:1+2. Strong’s Lexicon includes Satan’s name.

Queenie >> NO duh, Terral! But I can see indoctrination and colored definitions a mile away! I refer to Strong's and BDB's a lot - and I really dig Hitchcock's, too.

LOL. I can hardly wait to see your next Hebrew lesson and how you spell the words backwards to decode things. I do not believe you learned that at Seminary School.

Queenie >> HOWEVER I do not consider them authorities by any means - they, like all things, are subject to a scrutiny that doesn't depend upon any human doctrine - and the Hebrew language is the ROOT of the gospel.

Bullony. What does Paul teach?

“Now to Him who is able to establish you according to ‘my gospel’ and the preaching of Jesus Christ, according to the revelation of the mystery which has been KEPT SECRET for long ages past, but NOW is manifested . . .”. Romans 16:25+26a.

Paul wrote these words in about 60 AD or so. If Paul’s “my gospel” was “kept secret for long ages past,” but NOW is manifested, how can you ever hope to prove the Hebrew Language is the ROOT of the gospel? Your statement is more NONSENSE. How do we know for certain? The Greek term for ‘gospel’ is ‘euaggelion’ (#2098 = www.blueletterbible.org... ). What is the Hebrew term for “gospel?” Any guesses? Heh . . . Good Luck finding one, because NO Hebrew term is translated “gospel” in any Bible here to my knowledge. The Jews have no concept of anyone going to heaven through obedience to ANY GOSPEL MESSAGE at all. They look forward to being resurrected to be led into the land of Jacob (Eze. 37:11+12). Paul teaches that Israel stumbled over Christ like you are stumbling over the Hebrew, saying,

What shall we say then? That Gentiles, who did not pursue righteousness, attained righteousness, even the righteousness which is BY FAITH; but Israel, pursuing a law of righteousness, DID NOT arrive at that law. Why? Because they did not pursue it by faith, but as though it were by works. They stumbled over the stumbling stone . . .”. Romans 9:30-32.

And yet, our resident scholar believes Hebrew is the ROOT (heh) of the Gospel. Please forgive, but the farther you poke your chest out like a ‘know it all,’ the more you will be asked to suck it back in. Enough of the foolish statements and let’s try to adhere to the correct definitions derived from the Hebrew and Greek dictionaries. GL in the debates,

In Christ Jesus,

Terral

Terral-

With all due respect, "That which offends the ear will not easily gain admission to the mind." A quote from Quintilian, the Roman rhetorician which says better than I can what I'm trying to convey.

I can't figure out what your goal is. It can't be to convince anyone who doesn't already agree with you, and there's not much point in trying to convince the convinced.

I've seen you state more than once that you're writing for the readers, who can then judge who is correct. The topics you expound upon most eloquently, are difficult by any reasonable appraisal. But I'm one reader you're turning off by your continued combatative, and sometimes dismissive and insulting approach. And I doubt I'm the only one. You've succeeded in convincing me that you believe you're correct. I'm also convinced that you have no interest in an open minded discussion, but are at the ready to ridicule anyone who disagrees with your view.

I'm offering this as some feedback, which I fully expect you to dismiss completely, and that's ok with me. Then again, you could surprise me and modify your delivery. Either way, I hope you find what you're looking for.

Peace.