How did Atta's passport actually survive?

BOEING 767-200 cockpit

I want to hear critical points to prove a collaborative theory on how Atta's passport was found a few blocks from the crash. . .

This has nothing to do with your point of view about anything else concerning 911. We all have an imagination, and we all know that if you can think of something, it is possible, no matter how plausible. . .

Griff made me really think about this topic with a recent post he made on my thread here;

www.abovetopsecret.com...

originally by Griff
Atta's passport. Show me conclusive evidence that a passport can fly out of a person's pocket, fly through a huge fire ball, out into the open air and land unscathed near the towers just so some yahoo can come along and pick it up. Also, why was this particular piece of paper so important for someone on that day to say "hey, this might be the guy responsible....I think I'll give it to a police officer"? I don't think I'd be thinking along those lines at that point in time myself.

BUT IT DID!

If everything we have been told about this artifact is indeed. . .fact.

Therefore I think we should be able to come up with a logical chain of events that explain how this actually occured. . .

There are a few criteria you must accept to participate;

1 You must accept the official explanation that Atta was indeed the hijacker & pilot of flight 11.

2 You must accept the official explanation that Atta's passport was legitimately found.

3 You must stick to this exact topic. This thread is not to argue your viewpoint on anything other than, "How could have Atta's passport survived & been found? ". No official story vs conspiracy comments are needed. Thanx. . .

Again, I have been researching this topic since Griff's post last week. I haven't found anything anywhere that officially explains the who, what, where, when, why, about Atta's passport. I have been trying to research similar crashes where belongings of the pilot(s) were found, but, as you all know, this scenario is a bit unprecedented.

This plane hit at over 500mph. Could the high velocity & the increased mass accrued have allowed anomalies to occur that would account for the passport surviving like it did, yet also allow for the incredible destruction caused by the impact?

That's where you come in. Please help me with this. I will complie our thoughts, along with my own & see what we come up with.

Again- This thread has a specific purpose. Please read & thank you for your input & cooperation-

spelling

[edit on 27-9-2006 by 2PacSade]

I don't see how a paper item that was presumably in the possession of a human being piloting the airplane which exploded into a ball of flames on impact incinerating everything inside the building, ultimately "melting the steel" to cause it to collapse, could somehow fly out of that inferno unscathed and be discovered later.
It seems all too convenient that this document miraculously survived.

This begs the logical question: Where are the other hijackers' & the passengers' personal effects and luggage? Nope. I don't think it's remotely possible.

The passport is made of adamantium.

I wonder who found the passport and if their name was ever released or if they were ever questioned following the finding. I always thought it was a bit of a miraculous feat that is survived everything as well relatively unscathed save for a bit of a scorch mark.


Pie

Originally posted by tazadar

The passport is made of adamantium.

en.wikipedia.org...

Hmmm, maybe they should start making the planes' black boxes out of this material...

* cough * Mossad plant. * cough *

Seriously here. If I recall I will have to find the source again, but supposedly it was a passport that Atta had reported stolen a few years before. Couple that with the group of Isreali nationals filming the towers from New Jersey that had ties to the Mossad and you have yet another bunch of unanswered 911 questions

If that was Atta'a passport is is really doubtfull it would have survived the resulting inferno and collapse.

Here is a link to the relevant page of 911myths.com.

It goes through many instances of unusual items surviving plane crashes and then quotes the 9/11 Commission report on how the passport was handed to a police officer by a helpful passer-by - a man in a suit. He is supposed to have picked it up from the debris that showered from the building.

Not exactly proof of anything, especially if the passport had indeed been stolen some time before.

Is is reasonable to expect the policeman to have at least taken the name of the person who handed in the passport?

In the unlikely event that the passport magically flew out of the explosion and landed in the street, the person who handed it in was certainly public-spirited to an extraordinary degree. There's a big fire and debris raining down from almost a thousand feet above, yet this person notices a passport and thinks, "ooh, I should hand that in to the police. What luck! There's an officer just there! I'll just hand it to him, it won't take a moment, and then it will find its way back to its rightful owner. That's my good deed for the day!"

I, on the other hand, would have been trying to get a safe distance away from a building from which people were jumping, and, er, "forget" all that civic-minded crap.

My passport didn't even survive my washer & dryer!

I am more amazed that the truth is so evident. (I will rephrase) The deception is so evident. People used to tell me that 9/11 would never be uncovered. I think that if that's to be true, we must be devolving as a race. "Only the strong will survive!"

AAC

Steel melted, 3k bodies disintergrate with nothing identifiable, all the concrete in the tower's turn to dust, building 7 collapses for no apparent reason, not a button on a phone survives intact but a passport does, miracles really do happen after all.
Well maybe you could start making body armour out of passports, or houses, or bridges its a new miracle material proven beyond the extreme to be able to resist anything up to a nuclear blast.

The passport's survival is certainly remarkable although the 911myths link above gives a number of other examples of flammable objects surviving so there does appear to be precedent for this. However, let's not get hung up on the cockpit, there is no reason to believe that Atta actually had the document on his person at the time, it could have been almost anywhere in the passenger cabin and inside a carry on bag which would have helped it survive.

I'm quite relaxed that a passport could survive but the coincidence that it was Atta's is startling, although not impossible.

Incidentally, I'm always concerned when something is described as being "unscathed" or "intact". Does anyone have any links to photos of the passport and was it damaged in any way at all?

[edit on 28-9-2006 by timeless test]

My point about providing the link to 9.11 myths is that, after all the whitewash is done, there's nothing to show that the passport was ever in the plane. If you can demonstrate that the passport was ever actually on the plane, please try to do so. I'm all ears.

Originally posted by rich23
If you can demonstrate that the passport was ever actually on the plane, please try to do so. I'm all ears.

Clearly I don't have the information to be able to do that - that's why I asked about pictures and damage to the passport. My point was simply that there is nothing impossible in a document surviving the crash.

How many people died in the towers? If every ID card survived from every person that died and they all landed in one pile on the street what would the odds be that you could even pick up this guys ID, much less that if they all survived then they would be spread out over a large area, and most of it buried.

This is just one of those obvious things that shows to me that it was all a set-up.

Originally posted by rich23
My point about providing the link to 9.11 myths is that, after all the whitewash is done, there's nothing to show that the passport was ever in the plane.

The passport was Suqami's, and the Terrorist Travel monograph from the 9/11 Commission said this:

Suqami, the only hijacker who did not have a state-issued
identification, used his Saudi passport as check-in identification for American Airlines Flight 11.

Obviously we could still say "they made that up" or "checking in doesn't mean he got on the plane" or "it might have been a different passport", but it does suggest there is at least some evidence that the person whose passport was discovered was on that flight.

More or less intact CDs were found after the Colombia space shuttle burnt up on re-entry .....

Items do miraculously survive such disasters.

Notwithstanding which, I do find this passport survival odd. But not as odd as the idea that a passport that shouldn't have survived the crash was planted there deliberately by conspirators. Unless it were planted by someone intent on whistleblowing?

^^

But that was expected.

After seeing the tragedy of the WTC2, who in their right mind would even gave thought about giving something to the authorities off the assumption that this piece could be vital. There were plenty of paper that were scattered when the buildings came down and not one time was someone able to indentify a WTC workers badge. I would think that the odds of finding would be greater than someone just randomly finding a passport and thinking that it was important while turning it in to authorities.

I must admit that I was unaware of the exhibition of items recovered from the WTC. This article discusses it and the very large quantity of personal items recovered.

More than 54,000 pieces of personal property, including rings, watches, wallets and ID cards, were found.

The survival of a hijacker's passport, (and it does appear that it was NOT Atta's), remains a remarkable coincidence but I would be interested to know how many other artifacts from the aircraft were found and how they were all collected before I condemned the finding of the passport as too suspicious.

Also, Ashmok, that is interesting corroboration that the passport was likely to have been on the plane.

Originally posted by timeless test
The passport's survival is certainly remarkable although the 911myths link above gives a number of other examples of flammable objects surviving so there does appear to be precedent for this. However, let's not get hung up on the cockpit, there is no reason to believe that Atta actually had the document on his person at the time, it could have been almost anywhere in the passenger cabin and inside a carry on bag which would have helped it survive.

I'm quite relaxed that a passport could survive but the coincidence that it was Atta's is startling, although not impossible.

Incidentally, I'm always concerned when something is described as being "unscathed" or "intact". Does anyone have any links to photos of the passport and was it damaged in any way at all?

[edit on 28-9-2006 by timeless test]

This is a good point. It could have still been in an overhead compartment, etc.

Not only did it SURVIVE but it was FOUND amongnst millions of lbs. of dust and debris UNDAMAGED and TURNED IN.

You can say that it could have survived and I would have to agree that there is some astronmically small chance of that happening but for it to be conveniently located amongst all of the debris and turned in?

Originally posted by Slap Nuts
but for it to be conveniently located amongst all of the debris and turned in?

That's why I referenced the exhibition data. 54,000 items of personal property were recovered. How where and when I don't know, or how many came from the plane but it's not as if this was the only item found.