Is Chavez trying to start a Civil War here in America

Chavez is trying to start a civil war in the United States!!! Get real. The guy made a speech that was filled with rhetoric and hyperbole. Gee, that doesn't happen every day in politics! And he made it from the lecturn of the UN, which is designated INTERNATIONAL soil, not American soil.

NO This speech was made in a church in a Harlem, New York where he was trying to gathering alot of support. As well as on the streets to the reporters. At least read the next time.

Nothing on here is false its all reliable news sources and from his own mouth.

The Chinese are invading us!

Never said that it was WHY or How did they get here without it being reported.

What I see from -YOU The Iconoclast- is every thing I say you insult me. Which are against ATS Rules.

[edit on 23-9-2006 by Shar]

Originally posted by Shar
NO This speech was made in a church in a Harlem, New York where he was trying to gathering alot of support. As well as on the streets to the reporters. At least read the next time.

So how do you think they feel over in London, Paris, Brussells etc. when Bush comes a knocking with another one of his oh-so-predictable war on terror speeches? They absolutely hate him and the fact that he's trying to scare the rest of the world, not just us Americans, into believing in something evil disguised as THE 'fight for liberty' and the third world war. What goes around comes around.

Hes not there talking about their own country and their own leaders. Hes talking to their governments. With their Governments not against them. Not in a church going off on their leaders. I'm here in MY COUNTRY AMERICA and Proud of it. Dosnt Matter if we like our current President or not. This is the way its been for well over 200 years. All through HISTORY we have Presidents that people dont like. Generally republicans dont like democrats and vice versa. Therefore theres always bad mouthing each other. This should not include another President from another country going into a church in Harlem, New York running his mouth against our Government.

He's just trying to get support from Americans he knows can't stand the Bush administration. He's harmless, at least to the US if not his own country.

Antipathy for Bush goes well beyond the traditional party line issues - the man lied to get us into a war, and is maybe the most polarizing figure in American politics in a century or more. THe fact that he's taking advantage of these divisions doesn't mean he created them, or that he can effect them much one way or another.

Originally posted by Shar
Except, President Bush didnt go into his country preaching to his people against their leader. Soul purpose to stir up trouble and Chavez knew that.

What I said was in response to the first part of you post that I quoted, where you said that "This is truly none of his affair whether our Pres. resigns".
Chavez has the same right of saying this as Bush as the right of saying that the president of X should resign.

Thats his words cnn quoted all day yesterday that Chavez said that the Europeans stole this land and therefore were terriosts. Hinting at the native americans to rise up against us and take their land back. The same as the Mexican Americas cause they too feel this was their land.

Did he really said that Bush was responsible for the killing of the indians?

You said

No, Bush had absolutely nothing to do with the indians. This was a century ago. He wasnt even alive yet. So once again Chavez is running his mouth where it dosnt belong.

To me, that looks like you are commenting a statement from Chavez where he said that it was Bush's fault.

And it was more than a century ago, it started in the 15th century.

Which is what I'm saying hes trying to become a leader and start something that dosnt need to be. Or he can give his leadership to someone he knows will be strong enough voice to take it over for him in his absence.

Anyone, who starts a revolt want support from other countries and hes letting these people think they have his support.

Why do you say that, have you ever started a revolt?

In Portugal I witnessed a revolution followed by two failed revolutions, and many people considered that it all could end in a civil war.

The people responsible for the revolution (and I know personally one of them) did not needed or asked for external support from any country or organisation.

One of revolution attempts is supposed to have foreign support, but only at a distance.

And you are ignoring the second part of what I said, why do your fellow citizens (I assume you are a US citizen) that are against Bush need support from a far away, small country to revolt against their own? Do you think that your fellow citizens are such cowards that, altough they consider that their president is a criminal and should be enprisoned, they are incapable of taking action in their own hands to try to correct what they think are wrong?

Noone is worring or panic. Seeing things and talking about it and gathering information is far from panic. Governments everywhere gathering information and stay on top of things. This dosnt mean they push the button because of what they heard. It just means they like to be informed.

I just said this because I have seen in other threads and in this one that you appear too much worried in gathering information to support the idea that the United States are under a present and grave danger of being attacked from within or from without their borders, and are not paying the same kind of attention to all the other signs of what is happening in the world.


PS: you should not used the "external" tag to post quotes from other members, use the "quote" tag.

Originally posted by SharI'm here in MY COUNTRY AMERICA

Just a little correction, your country is called the United States of America, America is the name of the continent where you can find many other countries, including Venezuela.

Originally posted by Shar
Therefore theres always bad mouthing each other. This should not include another President from another country going into a church in Harlem, New York running his mouth against our Government.

What you don't understand, much like our dear president, is that not everyone falls into the 1 or 2, A or B, Democrat or Republican categorization... in fact, I'd be willing to bet a good many ATS American posters consider themselves neither Democrat nor Republican.

I aslo disagree with you in that I think Chavez can say whatever he wants and I will laugh every time I see him bad-mouthing Bush. I don't believe there's any law saying he's can't do it... just because it hurts your feelings or interferes with your 'patriotic duty' to lick Bush's shoes because he is infallible or because "he's our leader" and "our leader in a time of war" or some nonsense like that... I'm sorry if I'm not so easily tricked into being loyal to someone who has basically sold this country to the corporations and condemned thousands of American soldiers to their deaths over a war built on lies and deception.

Chavez told it like it is and the fact that he did it on American soil doesn't bother me at all.... in fact, I could not care less.

Originally posted by Shar

What I see from -YOU The Iconoclast- is every thing I say you insult me. Which are against ATS Rules.

[edit on 23-9-2006 by Shar]

I'm not insulting you, I'm picking your thinly structured posts to pieces. Dude, if you can't handle the criticism of your posts you shouldn't pick such controversial topics. You should alsp learn something about the topic you are trying to discuss and also double check the sources of the information you are posting. What you are doing is taking a subject, making a paranoid reactionary post about it, then cherry pick information that fits your agenda. I have yet to read a post from you that does not come across as trying to incite fear in people. A big part of ATS is analysis of the subject matter, and the expectation is that you have applied critical thought to your chosen subject matter before posting it, not after the fact and finding stuff to support your original post after the fact. If you had anything of value to defend your position you wouldn't be throwing ATS posting rules in my face about something that is not valid.

basically sold this country to the corporations and condemned thousands of American soldiers to their deaths over a war built on lies and deception

Well i see your point here. I had three family members in that war. However, I dont believe we should let another man condemn our country.



Everyone is getting off the subject. My question was IS Chavaz......?

Not did he succeed.

Dude,

Im not a Dude.

No you dont add. you always go into a different subject and degrade me.

He didn't condemn our country... he condemned Bush, which millions of Americans do on a daily basis.

Anyways, I apologize for getting off topic. The answer to your question is most definately no.

[edit on 23-9-2006 by firebat]

Originally posted by Shar
However, look on page one here. Iv posted where his people are tired of him and want him out also. Thats his local news source not ours.

You didn't post any Venezuelan news source, unless it was one of those you did not identify.

You posted links from CNN, Aljazeera, Yahoo, vcrisis (a personal site from a Venezuelan living in London).

If a civil war happens here, and I'm afraid it's a more realistic possibility than most people think, it wont be because of Chavez. It will be because of Bush and his fanatical supporters, who call anyone who doesn't support them or their overseas military adventures "anti-American" - given that some 60+% of the population is now against the Iraq War - apparently most Americans are "anti-American"

Originally posted by Shar

Its very disrespectful for a leader to come into a country and stir up trouble...

Chavez did NOT come into the US, he went to the UN.

BIG difference.

Unless you're saying the US owns the UN?!

Originally posted by xmotex
- apparently most Americans are "anti-American"

Seems to be going that away.

Originally posted by soficrow

Originally posted by Shar

Its very disrespectful for a leader to come into a country and stir up trouble...

Chavez did NOT come into the US, he went to the UN.

BIG difference.

Unless you're saying the US owns the UN?!

Um, MY Quotes Im refering too came not from the UN. But from a Church in Harlem, New York. As well as the streets to reporters.


The reason im asking is all the words which I quoted him saying on Page 1

First off, most of what Chavez says is TRUE! Bush truly is a dictator, as he usurped the elections twice, made a coup in 2001 to strenghten his power and lauch a War on Terror, and even proclaimed himself to be above the Law and the Constitution!

And as to wheter Chavez wants to create a civil war in the US, well... civil war is already there, just that there's still a lot of americans who are just too brainwashed by the mainstream media to see what's going on outside. The civil war has already begun, and it's the US government that started it...

[edit on 23/9/06 by Echtelion]

And as to wheter Chavez wants to create a civil war in the US, well... civil war is already there, just that there's still a lot of americans who are just too brainwashed by the mainstream media to see what's going on outside. The civil war has already begun, and it's the US government that started it...

[edit on 23/9/06 by Echtelion]

Please elaborate on the civil war already being here. What are you refering to exactly.

Got to go but will check back later.

Anti American my foot.

That old cliche may work amongst the Limbaugh listeners and all the rabid righties, but it doesnt cut it as far as i'm concerned.

If you truly love your country, you SEE what is wrong, then you bitch and bellyache till its rectified.

Enough with the stupid anti-american rants and bumper sticker talk and cliches.

It doesnt become us to be THAT stupid. Anyone who loves their country (as we all do) would do a good service to stop using that stupid made up by the right, anti-American crap.

Shar, since when does giving a lecture to anyone's interested, in a poor, Black NYC district that's always been a refuge for the segregated Black population in the US by the way, is "stirring trouble"? Ever heard of "free speech"? Remember, one of these values that Americans used to be so proud of for a long time?

As far as I know he did'nt called for a civil war, and not even for an overthrow of the government. He just suggested to Americans to remove that dictator from Washington!

Here's a better example of a foreign leader going in a country to stir up trouble: George W Bush making a visit to his troops in Iraq, and telling them to keep on killing people and to stay there for as long as all resistance will be annihilated... He actually did that a few years ago, and today Iraq is a terribly violent and chaotic country, this is the trouble that he stirred.



[edit on 23/9/06 by Echtelion]