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A Short Lecture on Islam or Jesus

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posted on Jun, 17 2006 @ 06:57 PM
A letter I recived that I thought I would share will eveybody hear.

Subject: Allah or Jesus

The Muslim religion is the fastest growing religion per capita in the United States, especially in the minority races!

Allah or Jesus? by Rick Mathes

Last month I attended my annual training session that's required for maintaining my state prison security clearance.

During the training session there was a presentation by three speakers representing the Roman Catholic, Protestant and Muslim faiths, who explained each of their beliefs.

I was particularly interested in what the Islamic Imam had to say.

The Imam gave a great presentation of the basics of Islam complete with a video. After the presentations, time was provided for questions and answers.

When it was my turn, I directed my question to the Imam and asked: "Please, correct me if I'm wrong, but I understand that most Imams and clerics of Islam have declared a holy jihad [Holy war] against the infidels of the world. And, that by killing an infidel, which is a command to all Muslims, they are assured of a place in heaven. If that's the case, can you give me the definition of an infidel?"

There was no disagreement with my statements and without hesitation, he replied, "Non-believers!"

I responded, "So, let me make sure I have this straight. All followers of Allah have been commanded to kill everyone who is not of your faith so they can go to Heaven. Is that correct?"

The expression on his face changed from one of authority and command to that of a little boy who had just gotten caught with his hand in the cookie jar.

He sheepishly replied, "Yes."

I then stated, "Well, sir, I have a real problem trying to imagine Pope John Paul commanding all Catholics to kill those of your faith or Dr. Stanley ordering Protestants to do the same in order to go to Heaven!"

The Imam was speechless.

I continued, "I also have a problem with being your friend when you and your brother clerics are telling your followers to kill me. Let me ask you a question. Would you rather have your Allah who tells you to kill me in order to go to Heaven or my Jesus who tells me to love you because I am going to Heaven and He wants you to be with me?"

You could have heard a pin drop as the Imam hung his head in shame.

Needless to say, the organizers and/or promoters of the "Diversification" training seminar were not happy with Rick's way of dealing with the Islamic Imam and exposing the truth about the Muslim's beliefs.

I think everyone in the U.S. should be required to read this, but with the liberal justice system, liberal media, and the ACLU, there is no way this will be widely publicized.

Please pass this on to all your e-mail contacts. This is a true story and the author, Rick Mathes, is a well-known leader in prison ministry

posted on Jun, 18 2006 @ 04:27 AM
I remember this! I got this email years ago! I hate to break it to you, RedGolem, but that email is not the truth. It might have actually happened, but I can't imagine any Imam worth his salt saying those things (mostly because they're false).

First off, most imams and clerics of Islam (I don't think Islam has clerics, though. Cleric implies an organised hierarchal structure. Islam is more like: "There is God, then there is everybody else". Being an Imam doesn't give you extra points.) haven't declared "war against the infidels of this world".

Next off, "holy jihad" doesn't mean "holy war". It means "struggling in the way of God". This could be through studying, through learning, through travelling, and yes, even through fighting. Anyhow, the term "holy jihad" is somewhat of a tautology, considering that jihad already implies holiness.

Third point, all muslims have not been commanded to killing "infidels". Sure, there are passages in the Quran that tell muslims to kill infidels during war (and even then, not go overboard with bloodlust), however, in other times, killing anyone is a humongous sin.

I'm sure this Rick fellow is a nice guy, but this article of his is not really cemented in truth. The guy who was speaking was not an Imam, he was an inmate who was called up when no Imam could be found. Also, the inmate was probably not very well versed in Islam (or was unable to convey what he wanted to say), because there were several questions that he could not answer (I think that is the part Mathes referred to as "hanging his head in shame").

You know what I did with this email when I got it? Same I do with all these "chain letter" things. Deleted it.

[edit on 18-6-2006 by babloyi]

posted on Jun, 18 2006 @ 04:38 AM
Thanks for the info. That is why I posted it hear, to find out what other people know about it. And the more info the better!

posted on Jun, 18 2006 @ 04:42 AM
Truth be told, but still... a lot of christians believe non-christians go to hell. So I dunno, seems like a double-edged sword which I much rather stay away from =]

posted on Jun, 18 2006 @ 08:16 AM

Originally posted by laiguana
Truth be told, but still... a lot of christians believe non-christians go to hell. So I dunno, seems like a double-edged sword which I much rather stay away from =]

Yes, some Christians think that way; tho, these days church doesnt kill any longer for such reasons. Some muslins actually kill for that. Different stuff.

posted on Jun, 18 2006 @ 06:01 PM
Generally speaking all monotheal religens state that non belivers go to hell. That is a big reason why I usually try to stay out of descushens on that topic. And as such monotheal religens have an insultive term for non belivers. That is just beliefs, I got no problem with that. What I do have a problem with is when you try to make those beliefs or spiritual practices, the law of the state. That is when people could be killed by the state, or even the lynch mob, because of ones beliefs.

That is the problem that I fear we have been seeing more of recently, and I dont really see it changeing in the near future.

posted on Jun, 19 2006 @ 01:23 AM

I then stated, "Well, sir, I have a real problem trying to imagine Pope John Paul commanding all Catholics to kill those of your faith or Dr. Stanley ordering Protestants to do the same in order to go to Heaven!"

The Imam was speechless.

The Imam was probably thinking, "Hasn't this guy ever heard of the crusades?"

I'd be speechless, too!

posted on Jun, 19 2006 @ 01:54 AM
The letter seems kinda fake, but even if it was real... so what?

All im seeing is some christian guy beeing ignorant and rude.

posted on Jun, 19 2006 @ 10:04 AM
I don't beleive that email for a moment.

Firstly, its essentially untrue, the muslim religion does not call on all muslims to kill non-believers, nor does it say that a person that does kill a non-beleiver goes straight to heaven. However, I don't doubt for a moment that there are errant islamic clerics out there that do beleive this, so thats ambivalent.

The letter has the characteristics of an urban myth. It deals with bogey men. It deals with threes. It has a "student" embarass the "teacher". It has specific names and superfluous details that seem designed to give it a sense of reality, but nothing essentially identifiable.

Lets say anyone of us here was this guy, and this stuff happened.

You write a letter, but don't even say who the muslim was? People pass it on, but don't tell anyone where it occured?

Its got just enough details to make it beleivable, but absolutely none that make it confirmable, and it essentially slanders and spreads paranoia about another ethnic class, presenting them as, not only evil, but sheepish cowards.

I'm going to vote
. Its a fraud.

posted on Jun, 19 2006 @ 10:08 AM
Well, props to bayloi for demonstrating that it was fake anti-muslim propaganda and finding the original source.

As far as monotheism, the RCC is part of the ecumenical movement, which recognizes that you don't need to be a christian to go to heaven.

Islam beleives the same thing, that you don't need to be a muslim to get into paradise. People who beleive in the message of god as related by the archangel Gabriel to the Prophet Mohammed, and follow the dictates of god from the Quran, they are 'justified' with god, in a sense, and they go into paradise directly. Those who are unbeleivers, they go into purgatory, where God administers divine justice, and, eventually, they are purified of their 'errors', and go to heaven. There is no hell in islam.

So far as I understand it.

posted on Jun, 19 2006 @ 10:16 AM
This was contained in a letter I recently wrote my sister.

Interesting reading- here’s just a sample: “In Islam, total obedience to
Allah is demanded, irrespective of rationality. Followers must unquestionably,
even be prepared to kill a human, to protect this Allah because a ‘human life
is meaningless’ [Ishaq: 676 – After killing the mother of five little sons,
Muhammad said, “as meaningless as two goats butting their heads”] Instead
humans are precious in Christianity and God calls us to value and respect human
life, as God loves every human being, irrespective of race, creed, colour,
nationality, etc.” This information caomes from

Seems to me that those who practice Islam are simply following in their leaders footsteps. This is generally speaking, only, not neccessarily applicable to individuals.

armchiar coach
amateur historian

posted on Jun, 19 2006 @ 02:38 PM

humans are precious in Christianity and God calls us to value and respect human

You mean like when he told the hebrews to kill everyone in a neigbhoring tribe? Or when he told abraham to offer his son as a sacrifice? Or like how, at armageddon, god is so very nice to all human life?

posted on Jun, 19 2006 @ 07:17 PM
I'm just glad I don't rely on some ancient fairytale as a guide.

posted on Jun, 19 2006 @ 07:25 PM
the bible is probably the most violent book that a child can pick up and read to their parent.

it's probably the only book with rape in it that a child can read to their parent

it's probably the most inconsistent book that a parent will recomend a child read

it's also the only socially acceptable book to read that can teach horrible intolerance

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