Different Lodges in Masonry

Thank you all for your replies and interest in this topic, especially Masonic Light.

I now understand (as much as a layman can) hoe the different Lodges operate and think.

Also, this whole new world order thing, now that I've been talking to Masons, makes me feel safer that Masons are freinds helping humanity grow to a higher conciouness in full. And that the New World Order is actually that of Democracy itself.

My grandfather said the most secret societies (since before the egyptians) were created by the intellectuals who were in the minority and who opposed the teachings of the current church/religion of that time period. It was to transfer sacred knowledge (that the majority church would have back then and now tried to destroy), and also help promote future knowledge.

I now believe that in their earliest attempts, the Masons and other secret societies similar, were for the good of humanity!

But (now here's my next question), are there need for them anymore? I mean, sure they're nice fraternities that still share valuable knowledge and teach great points of philosophy, but the Church is no longer out to squash liberal thinkers anymore.

Although, I suppose that in due time, our civilization is doomed to another tyrranical rule of some sort, and these knowledges (of which I have no idea what they are) need to be preserved for as long as possible.

Conclusion: Masons are good for society (excpet of course if an individual person who happens to be a Mason is out for personal profit, which I hope is rare/non-existant).

Thank you all again for clearing that up for me!

editing for spelling.

[edit on 3/7/2006 by Arcane Demesne]

Although I agree that Masonic Light has been most helpfull I have to say that you are very easily won over.

Then again, aren't we all?

lifttheveil

Well, Masonic Light has a very level, rational and informative tone to his posts. He certainly comes across as a lot more plausible than some of the ranting paranoiacs we get around here.

But then... maybe that's just part of his guise as a demon-worshipping megalomaniac trying to dominate the world!!!

Originally posted by lifttheveil
Although I agree that Masonic Light has been most helpfull I have to say that you are very easily won over.

Then again, aren't we all?

lifttheveil

Originally posted by Roark
Well, Masonic Light has a very level, rational and informative tone to his posts. He certainly comes across as a lot more plausible than some of the ranting paranoiacs we get around here.

But then... maybe that's just part of his guise as a demon-worshipping megalomaniac trying to dominate the world!!!

haha, you guys.

I only mentioned him by name because he seemed to know the most. And since I wasn't looking for facts, (becasue there are none, unless you're in the brotherhood) I'm very grateful that he gave me some great responses, and kept a level head (which I very much appreciate on these forums).

I did start to buy into the whole, OMG, the Masons/Illuminati are gonna take over! But now talking to some people on these forums, as well as my grandfather, I see that it is impossible (for Masons as a wholoe at least). Too many lodges have too many different ideas.

Now, for instance, if the Westminster lodge in britain alone were into this, or the OTO, then I could see how it might be possible, but definitly not plausible! That's what my original post was getting at, just confirming that each lodge has a variation of their motherlodge, which in turn is different than other mother lodges. So I don't see any grand scheme in the works here.

Finally a rational person willing to listen to what we have to say on occasion. I and I'm sure the rest of the ATS Masons, really appreciate that.

Originally posted by Baphomet79
Finally a rational person willing to listen to what we have to say on occasion. I and I'm sure the rest of the ATS Masons, really appreciate that.

thank you!
I try to use mathematical rationality rather than being thick-headed with a host of superstitions.



On a side not, my grandfather relieved to me even the 'magic word/symbol' when he reached the 32nd degree. So I can safely say that unless my grandfather is a great story teller (well, he is a great story teller, but that's besides the point :lol, there is nothing to fear of Masons. In fact, they have done a wonderful job through history keeping the very exquisite progress of human civilization alive even through the darkest times.

Hmm, I've been out of this discussion a long time and have only just returned to ATS after a break, basically where the owner looked set to discharge me but that's another story
You see I have a genuine interest in this and the first thing that strikes me is that we have a contributor calling himself Baphomet79
Now I can understand that many masonry and illuminati symbols have twin meanings dependant on how you want to view them
The one controlling, exploitive and self aggrandizing, and the other a simple explanation of the hidden knowledge of how life works

Take the All-Seeing Eye for example.
On the conspiracy side we see this not only on the aprons but everywhere
It can be taken to represent the whole surveillance and monitoring system, Total information Awareness, the whole control grid within the hierarchically organised pyramidal state
We can also view the symbol as the ajna, the brow, the third eye, the intuitive perception that sees beneath the veil of constructed reality as to how things really are. As one's own personal awakening and ability to perform deeply within the group or mass consciousness

There is much unexplained symbolism and I go back to the contributor calling himself Baphomet
Now we know this guy.
He is the inverted pentagram, the Goat of Mendes, the Eliphas Levi figure pointing 2 figures to heaven on the one hand and the two fingers to hell on the other. Reiterated in the nearly nude statue of Washington

To get me restarted on this subject perhaps someone would care to reveal the true meaning of the Baphomet character beyond the Hollywood demon characteristics, which are obvious

Sorry if this has been gone over repeatedly, but I need a kick-start back in here

[edit on 7-3-2006 by dh]

I suggest that you simply run a quick search on the name, dude. We had a really comprehensive post by someone recently (within the last week), which outlined Baphomet and his history quite well. In fact, there's a whole thread on the topic.

Oh yep Solve et Coagula
As above so below
Sorry I forgot
The two intercepting streams of energy creating the interference pattern we experience as reality
Further out-referenced into the geopolitical zone as Ordo ab Chao, Orobouros and the Hegelian dialectic
Thanks for that,?Howard?, I remember you warmly

[edit on 7-3-2006 by dh]

Ooh 2 comments in one day just my luck, read over that old thread and I found a good quote from it I liked summing up where I'm coming from regarding using the name Baphomet.

"So ... I guess anyone who thinks worshipping Baphomet is "evil" is a fool who was duped by a bunch of superstitious politically oriented Preists during the Crusades...who thought God caused lightning and rain at His will...and believed the Earth to be the center of the Universe. "

I am talking about it in the light that the Pope and French King used these trumped up charges to justify arresting, torturing, and executing the Knights Templar so they could have their debts to them relieved and seize the sizable assets of the Templars. Basically I am just trying to say a lot of silly things have been perpetrated for ulterior motives, think about something before you accept it or write it off.

Originally posted by Baphomet79
Ooh 2 comments in one day just my luck, read over that old thread and I found a good quote from it I liked summing up where I'm coming from regarding using the name Baphomet.

"So ... I guess anyone who thinks worshipping Baphomet is "evil" is a fool who was duped by a bunch of superstitious politically oriented Preists during the Crusades...who thought God caused lightning and rain at His will...and believed the Earth to be the center of the Universe. "

I am talking about it in the light that the Pope and French King used these trumped up charges to justify arresting, torturing, and executing the Knights Templar so they could have their debts to them relieved and seize the sizable assets of the Templars. Basically I am just trying to say a lot of silly things have been perpetrated for ulterior motives, think about something before you accept it or write it off.

Yes. So how did this band of renegades build up their wealth and have debts owed to them by the French king and the Pope such that they would seek to kill them and seize their assets
What are the financial mechanisms deployed?

Well, the Templars basically invented some aspects of the modern financial markets, like bonds and promissory notes. They were very inventive guys.

Wikipedia would be a more informed source than me, though...

Well unfortunately that's the problem with history of that nature, it's all speculative. We are getting a bit off topic, and if you want to open a new thread as I think its a fascinating topic, I'm sure others would like to discuss the source of the Templars immense wealth and land holdings as well. (There does not appear to be a thread about this yet.) Send me a U2U if you care to open one, if not I will do it, because now I'm curious

Hi lifttheveil

I notice you're from England

Originally posted by lifttheveil
I have only ever been in a masonic lodge twice, both briefly and both at The Stockport Lodge on the A6.

In that case I'll have to throw a little more 'illumination' on your questions about masonic heirarchy as the chart you posted doesn't really apply here in the UK. Have a look at an alternative here .

In the US after a freemason has completed his three degrees he has an option to follow two routes, either the York Rite or the Scottish Rite. It's the SR that has 33 degrees and it is that progression that has led to the misinterpretation of the degrees as being 'higher'. I understand that about half of all US Master Masons go on to become 32 degree Scottish Rite freemasons.

No such formality exists in England & Wales. After completing the first three degrees a freemason can chose a variety of routes - there are up to 10 different Orders, some of which progress from others but are not so formal as the US system. Many of these can be found in the York Rite in the US but need not necessarily be competed in any sequence, although we are all encouraged to join the Holy Royal Arch. In England & Wales the Scottish Rite is known as the Ancient & Accepted Rite, far fewer freemasons join it here and only a small fraction of them will get anywhere near the 32nd degree.

To regard a 32nd degree holder as superior or senior to a Craft mason is like comparing apples to oranges, and although it doesn't make sense in the US it makes even less sense here.

Sorry if I've confused you, but the structure of freemasonry is rather more complex than at first appears.

Yeah, money, debt and interest built out of fresh air
The financial scandal existant in the world today where every nation and most individuals are in hock to some financial institution and we just await the rug being pulled from under us
The Templars were some kind of usurers?

Sorry dude. I don't really know what you're getting at...