POLITICS: Mexican President Vows to Block The U.S. From Building Wall at The Border.

I agree that this is great news. Canada also. I dont see this as a prevention of immigrant labor (as bush has too much interest in preserving that) But a neccessary step to pevent terrorists from entering the country.

The mexicans can say what they want, it will happen, and they can do nothing about it, except follow the laws regarding guest workers (what is so hard about that?)
So maybe they have to walk across a border crossing instead of empty ground? so what? It isn't like we are going to prevent any from coming in... just unregistered ones... (why wouldn't they get registered?)

Then tax the workers, to help cover the costs of supporting a welfare system for immigrants.

Vicente is just trying to be popular, he knows he has no choice. In the end, it will be mexican military that will disperse any protests along the border.

Unless of course, they want to meet our needs by allowing US troops to close Mexicos borders, to prevent terrorists from entering either country.

I am all for this idea, I think the US could implement such a project in under a year, these criminal illegal aliens are a disease on our culture and social well being, we need do this and I am advocating those leaders by my voice in letters to see to it.
As for Mr Fox, we are not impressed by a nation whose main source of income seems to be from illegal sources ie illegal aliens who enter the USA and steal jobs. Mexico has no military power or other factor to be of any real threat to us, they are weak and maybe we shouls take over their nation and properly administer government of them.
In a relative issue, I wish to recomend the other measure be supported that would make it a felony for illegals to enter illegally and otherwise impose prison and identification to see they are not permitted visas in any further date, also this would allow us to take childeren born to illegals in America from them and raise them in proper American community while sending the criminal mothers to prison or back to Mexico. It is that we are far to soft to allow them to get welfare in America to support these childeren they have here, we should seriously set an example to them, have an American child and you loose your child and he is raised American and you are imprisoned and or exported and never see him/her again.

The wall is already being built, go to Imperial Beach CA then head south to the border, you can see it for yourself... I did. Not that I think it's going to have much effect. Nor would militarizing the border - it's a big piece of territory, and machine gunning people who are mostly just harmless poor people looking for work is morally abhorrent to most people, most people outside the right-wing nutosphere anyway.

If you want to stem the tide of illegal immigration, start prosecuting businesses that hire illegal immigrants. Enforce the existing labor laws and the problem will go away. Of course this isn't going to happen, as the Republicans will continue to grovel before business's demand for cheap labor, and the Democrats don't want to confront the issue either for fear of offending traditionally Democratic voting blocs...

As for terrorists, has it occurred to anyone that the terrorists who managed to attack us so far entered the country perfectly legally?

[edit on 12/29/05 by xmotex]

So what let Mexico cry. The U.S needs to protected it's people, If it involves building a wall to keep out terrorist - so be it, it will also save the U.S a lot of money - our debt keeps growing every year anyway.

The Mexican President calls this a civil rights issue. We are not banning Mexicans here. Mexicans can come here legeilly just have to pay a little taxes so Americans don't have to pay for the them to live here.
I don't think the International community is going to do much anyways.
This wall will be Built.

omfg a wall. That is getting reeeeeeeeaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaallllllllllllllyyyyyyyyy old. I mean wond it just have the same problems as other walls in history. Too many holes. A better Idea would be making the fence electric.
And they get unlimited tries at getting across because they just take you back to tiajuana

Fox has been very slow to do anything to help address this border problem. So, his opinion accounts for nothing, imo.

Set a date to break ground on the new wall, and tell him that is his deadline to do something about his people crossing over. Then start building from the east and the west at the same time.

Use the military to help patrol the border in the meantime. They were very successful in October, in NM., and can definitely help.

If you build it, they will stay away.

Walls/fences work. The Berlin Wall worked and so does the one Israel has recently built. China's Great Wall worked pretty good too. Sure some people will get across now and then but 99% of the time they work.

Prosecuting businesses does not stop illegals from coming over and commiting crimes or using our social services. Terrorists won't be deterred either since I doubt they will be applying for a job.

Mexico and it's people need to discipline themselves...they work hard and do some extremely difficult jobs. They are not lazy, but they need to work smarter not harder. They are always behind the curve, always trying to make it week to week and not planning for a future. I don't see Mexicans as being any less than me, my best friends are Hispanic as was my ex-girlfriend (who had a great family). Mexico has a great climate, beaches, mountains, culture, and people and they piss it away year after year with macho talk and whining. They should stop striving to be like the US but maybe take a look at the success Chile has. Sure they should learn English and embrace the global business arena, but don't copy the US...become something that works for your people.

Stop relying on the US and then bitching about it too. It's like a little teenager that back talks their parent but then wants money from them.

last time I checked the "great wall" of china did nothing against the mongols
and looking back on it yes it probably would work but its not worth the money were allready in debt as it is

But the Mexican president, alongside some other people, are calling this new plan "a violation of human rights."

Since when was illegal immigration a "human right"?

Did I miss a memo?

Apparently the Mexican presidente did.....

You know my view on this one.... I'm in favor of a double fence with land mines between the fences.... Much cheaper than a wall, and you can still see the scenery, plus it gives us something to with the stockpile.....and requires very little actual people patrolling. Just have sensors alert when a mine's been tripped, and go out for cleanup, or to make sure nobody's trying to circumvent....

Originally posted by Seekerof
[sarcasm]
Fox has nothing to worry about being the US cannot build a Mexican-US border wall without the help of illegal labor.
[/sarcasm]

Thanks seekerof. Made my day.

At any rate, despite Fox's own hypocrisy, the US does not need a wall, per se', the US simply needs to put the National Guard on the border. Nothing will be done though, for the US Senate and Congress will continue to turn a blind eye to this issue of illegal Mexican immigration/migrants.

Aye. There's the rub. And why is that do you think?

Walls do slow people down & no doubt will stop many workers from crossing the border.

A wall will not stop someone who wants to get to the other side bad enough, unless there are cameras & sensors both above & below. Then you need someone close enough to respond to those sensors. I really don't think we can afford that.

Just don't forget that wall becomes a barrier should you decide to leave as well if travel outside the US becomes suspended. Do you want to live in a cage? Are we so much better than Mexicans that only we deserve opportunities that still exist in the US?

The only good thing I can see by building a wall is - jobs. I can think of many better ways to employ people with something to takes us ahead instead of running in circles.

I go with the fence and landmines Idea

Why not build the wall from the Pacific Ocean to the Gulf of Mexico.

Then implement a new and improved Green Card System.

If a Mexican citizen wants to work in the US, then they must apply for a Green Card.

Have the Green Card application similar to the Gun card system here in the US.

Charge a fee for the Green Card Application $25.00 to $ 50.00, or something like that, but not free.

Make a 14 day wait mandatory while a back round check is done for criminal activities in both countries.

Any criminal felony activity found on the applicant would mean no Green Card !

This card would be their National ID for the duration of the work stay with a maximum time in the U.S. of 6 months.

If any criminal act is committed by the green card holder or immediate family member while they are in the U.S. it would mean deportation back to Mexico or where ever, no if ands or butts.

You commit a felony crime, your out of the green card system.

Tie this New Green Card system with the Social Security System and the IRS data bases for taxes and Social expenses related to the card holders stay.

Make the card holders pay into the IRS and SS funds, but at a reduced rate because of non citizen and temp status and enforce mandatory minimum wage to be paid to the Green Card Workers.

By closing the border with Mexico you reduce drug flow into the US.

By closing the Border with Mexico you reduce illegal entry into the US and secure the border against terrorism.

By closing the Border with Mexico and controlling the work force you raise additional tax dollars via the application process, the taxes paid into these accounts would kick additional funds into the IRS and Social Security account nationally and reduce the strain on the Baby Boomers.

By paying the Green Card Mexican workers the US minimum wage you will increase the workers weekly pay, which in turn they will be able to provide more to their families in Mexico, maybe move them out of poverty and inspire them to follow the right and legal way to work in the U.S.

Yes, prices would rise on food items across the board but only for the first few years then stabilize.

I am not sure how the program works on the US / Canadian border, but I am sure Canadians come into the US to work each day and we don’t have the crime and lawlessness on the Northern Border as the Southern Border.

I realize that the Mexicans provide cheep labor, but it’s coming at a price to the US and we as a Country should demand civil liberties for these people and they, the Mexican workers should obey and respect the rights of the Citizens of the US by applying for a Work Green Card Permit and following the laws of the United States.

Once things stabilize on the Mexican Border with the reduction of crime, drugs and human smuggling then open you can open up the border, but not until some type of a working arrangement can be enforced.

We are all people, human beings, the Mexicans want and need to work and we need to hire these people, but it needs to be done with respect and trust on both sides.

GBA / Viva Mexico !

do these walls ever really solve anything? history repeats.

you build a wall, but you have not removed the source of the problem. it is like putting a band-aid on a severed arm stump. where there is a will, there is a way, and these immigrants NEED work, and NEED to feed their families. if the source of wealth is in the states, they will get across.

a wall would set up great new black markets, though. black markets are tax free!

[edit on 29-12-2005 by billybob]

People are going at the Southern immigration issue all the wrong way. Why would a mexican work for $1 an Hour when they can work 5-8 times that by crossing the border? Heck in some "Border towns" the hispanic population is so high you need to be bi-lingual to get jobs in the service industry. Places like wl-mart or McDonalds only allowing bi-linguals to work the registers or sales floor.

Not to metion the Food and corn bring shipped to mexico is cheaper then the crops made domestically in mexico which is driving out the small local farmers to "cross the border". In a sense AMerica has become the great welfare system to prob up the poor mexican economy. Of course Mexico doesn't want the wall. It boosts their economy to have people work there and move back.

I work with Hispanics, almsot all of them have illigal documents they got for maybe $100 or less. The Mexican governemnt is too corrupt and will not inform or help thier people apply for green cards. Not to metion Employers have no way of verifiying who they are hiring if they are illegal or not. How do you expect them to tell if the documents they give are forgieries? If you dont wnat illegals to work, make the employeers able to chekc themselves instead of having the Governemnt come in and threaten to fine the emploteer for hiring illegals, which only means the people working lose thier job only to be replaced by more illegals.

SIRR1 has the right idea. Building a wall is not going ot do a thing.. there are allready many elaborate tunnels underneath the ground that provide for drug trafficking, not to metion slave trade, or illegal border crossing. The southern border of the uS is so porus because no one has really bothered to make it secure and ignore the problem instead of addressing it becasue of the fact they would lose the hispanic vote they need so much to win election

Originally posted by outsider
Just don't forget that wall becomes a barrier should you decide to leave as well if travel outside the US becomes suspended.

It could be put to use in other ways if Fox decides to co-operate. For example, a hiking trail, bike path, or tourist attraction.

Are we so much better than Mexicans that only we deserve opportunities that still exist in the US?

I haven't heard anyone say that. We certainly have first dibs at the opportunities that exist here, though. Mexicans are welcome to compete for opportunities if they follow our immigration laws. Surely you must agree with that.

The wall is neccesary because both the illegals and their gov't refuse to follow our laws. I don't think you would hear the clamor for a wall if Fox sincerely tried to help the US. But he not only refuses to control his people, he helps them to break our laws. Thus, the need for the wall.

Originally posted by Muaddib
But the Mexican president, alongside some other people,
are calling this new plan "a violation of human rights."

I'm sure he is. A wall certainly screws up his plans to
send over the border all the illegals he possibly can.
Of course this isn't an issue of 'human rights'. It's an
issue of national security - OUR national security.
The wall is long overdue. LONG overdue!

building these walls may pervent some things to stop.but i see it will spark off other countries to wall there land off also.being that is not intended for the reasons of protection but fear.historically when you box yourshelf in with walls you will have no where to run when an attack or event of mass distaster arises.political front makes you look like china or russia.the great walls of doom i will call them.canada and mexico might as while block all there ports and seaways off also.with magnetic walls on the ocean floors and radar jamming gear.no point having norad anymore or freetrade and everything else the u.s take blindly.this is not what peaceful nations wanted as a future after fighting the second world war.history once again repeats itshelf and we take a back step in the progress.....

A wall to the south? How about we fix the holes in the fence first?

A wall to the north? Good luck cutting down all those privately owned trees.

I still say the best way to deal with living scum is lead posioning.

Originally posted by flukemolfear.

this is not what peaceful nations wanted as a future after fighting the second world war.history once again repeats itshelf and we take a back step in the progress.....

so you think the economic and criminal problems dont exist? better call reality and tell it that.

peaceful nations dont want to protect their sovergnity or defend from being exploited to boost their neighbors economy? or from their neighbor breaking their laws?