Why I still enjoy 'engaging' the Bushites!

SHADENFREUDE IS A BEE-U-TEE-FUL THING!!!



[edit on 11-10-2005 by Bout Time]

Those are all true? Wow. Look at siggy for explanation of this.

Yep. We support Bush because we're blind.

Never gets old, does it? I wish I could say what I wanted to say to you. Especially you, Full Metal for your signature (I assume that "offending" is what you were going for?) but I don't think that it was be within the Terms and Conditions.

By the way, your picture's not working for me. I'd love to see it though.

[edit on 16-10-2005 by Herman]

I'm a conservative who not only doesn't support Bush, but also supports impeaching him.

C'mon, Bushbots--do you guys REALLY like seeing people get tortured? Bush has threatened to veto anti-torture legislation!

Do you guys REALLY want to support a CULTIST? Think Skull and Bones.

Do you guys REALLY think Bush is a conservative? He's not pro-life. He's not anti-homosexuality (in fact it's been hinted that he's bisexual). Look at the debt that's skyrocketing and still going up.

If you call yourself a conservative and support this guy, you're not asleep--you're in a COMA!

I don't like Bush all that much. I'm not really a conservative, but then I'm not really a liberal either.

But people like Full Metal, with their rampant and baseless accusations that make blanket assumptions about half of the American people, upset me quite badly.

You want my opinion on politics? You want to bring platitudes into it? Fine:

You should all be ashamed of yourselves. You're buying wholeheartedly into a system designed with no end in mind except polarizing the people, keeping you squabbling amongst yourselves while the individuals in power strip away your personal and economic freedoms one piece at a time. Neither of the major parties have your best interests at heart, and they have become almost impossible to support in and of themselves, but still you persist in adhering to their corrupt and manipulative dogma simply because you hate the other side.

THE REAL ENEMY IS NOT THE REPUBLICANS. IT IS NOT THE DEMOCRATS.

IT IS THE GOVERNMENT. IT CONTROLS YOU UTTERLY, AND YOU MAKE YOURSELVES ITS SLAVES WITH SEEMINGLY JOYFUL ABANDON.


Stop with the insults. Stop associating with one side just because you don't like the other.

Wake up and smell the coffee-- America has gone to hell, and blaming it on Bush is EXACTLY WHAT THE PEOPLE WHO HOLD THE REAL POWER WANT YOU TO DO.

You can't fight the system if you play by the rules it has invented.




There. I've said my piece... now I can sleep at night again.

I hope this pissed you off enough to make you think about it, at least.

Originally posted by Amethyst
If you call yourself a conservative and support this guy, you're not asleep--you're in a COMA!

www.freerepublic.com...

Originally posted by Herman

Originally posted by Amethyst
If you call yourself a conservative and support this guy, you're not asleep--you're in a COMA!

www.freerepublic.com...

Hey that's great Herman. If you exclude the negative comments, you have almost 1,000 posts there by an indignant group of Freepers that are convinced empty first 100 day achievements are still incredible accomplishments 5 years later.

~Changed the tone in the White House, restoring HONOR and DIGNITY to the presidency.

~Has reintroduced the mention of God and faith into public discourse.

~Handled himself with enormous courage, dignity, grace, determination, and leadership...

Which they kind of are... You know. For a retarded person.

Oh, and that anyone that doesn't like Bush on "Free" Republic must either be a RINO or a stealth operative for Pat Buchanon. Riiiiiiiight.

I like the angry letter to those liberals at FOXNEWS the most; trying to get them to stop reporting on vocal conservative frustration with their lame duck [P]resident!

Dear Liberal Filter:

This is the small, noisy extremist fringe, a corrolary to
the Kucinich folks in the Democrat Party.

To pretend that these folks represent anything unusual is
for FoxNews to be used by their spinmeisters to manufacture
a story that benefits their fundraising and that feeds the
Democrat hate-machine.

These are the folks who supported Pat Buchanan's ranting
attacks on former President Bush and the GOP, and of ex-NH
US Senator Bob Smith's self-righteous departure from the
GOP and his Quioxic run for the Presidency.

Most of these grumbling-campaigns are sponsored and fed
by a Buchanan, Perot, or Smith whose ego compells them to
seek power no matter the cost to the GOP, the nation, or
the truth.

How about more attention to the flood of hate ads from
George Soros and his ethically-challenged cohorts on the
left. The Nazi-like propaganda method "tell a lie long
enough and loud enough and eventually people will believe
it" is too obvious to be ignored.

Why is it that the rich manipulators on the Democrat side
get a pass while anyone who gives more than a few hundred
dollars to the GOP is labeled an illegitimate interloper
and an evil special interest?

A little balance and more completely researched reporting,
please?

Signed,

[Well it's a posted chain letter, so who know's which one has the part of the communal brain used for writing original thoughts at the moment]

And they call this a conspiracy site?

I enjoyed that Herman. Thanks.

[edit on 16-10-2005 by RANT]

Wait til you finish college Hermy

Engage all you want. Maybe if your side engaged a little harder during the last two elections, you wouldn't still be crying that Bush is President.

Bush's approval ratings maybe at an all-time low. But not as low as Democrat leadership. His terrible ratings are still higher than the last 7 Presidents (Good ole Clinton is in that group).

www.wnd.com...

[edit on 16-10-2005 by Carseller4]

Originally posted by Carseller4
Engage all you want. Maybe if your side engaged a little harder during the last two elections, you wouldn't still be crying that Bush is President.

Only people I hear crying now are the one's that voted for him. Everyone else is laughing.

Bush's approval ratings maybe at an all-time low. But not as low as Democrat leadership. His terrible ratings are still higher than the last 7 Presidents (Good ole Clinton is in that group).

www.wnd.com...

This wouldn't be any fun at all without someone defending that moron.

I LOVE that article Carseller.

Bush's current approval rating is approaching Nixon numbers at 29% (according to the article you linked), so they EXCLUDE the current numbers from October 13th, then average ratings across 6 polls (like Fox) between October 2nd and 12th only to create an "average" in line with the real average lows of the last 7 President's and that's news right there. Except it's not. They exlude Bush's current lows. A good 10 points worth. And the bottom is still nowhere in sight.

But my favorite part has to be how your source shows Clinton is preserved for all time as more popular than Reagan and Kennedy is the most popular president polled while in office of all time.

Table 1. Presidential Approval Ratings, 1953-1999 (11)

President Average (%) High (%) Low (%)

Kennedy 70 83 56
Eisenhower 65 79 48
Bush 61 89 29
Johnson 55 79 35
Clinton 54 73 37
Reagan 53 65 35
Nixon 49 67 24
Ford 47 71 37
Carter 45 74 28

You were saying something about leadership? Popularity? Polls? Huh? What?

WorldNetDaily.

[edit on 16-10-2005 by RANT]

Originally posted by RANT
Only people I hear crying now are the one's that voted for him. Everyone else is laughing.

More like I'm crying because people just don't get it!

Know what, RANT, we both don't like Bush...but it's for different reasons. My reason is that Bush fakes it, pretends to be a Christian, and fools Christians. Of course my fellow Christians are at fault because they let themselves be led by the nose and don't bother to actually do their homework on this guy.

I was a major Bushbot back in '03. Then I read stuff about "The Bush Crime Family" and promptly looked for someone else to vote for in '04.

I wish the diehard Bushbots would awaken from their comas. Bush is systematically tearing this country apart. Him and Karl "Rasputin" Rove.

(note--no offense meant to ATS member Rasputin )

RANT,

I don't read free republic. I saw that list a while back, and found it interesting. You have to admit, it does give a lot of support to the fact that Bush IS a conservative. A lot of people get all hyped on the fact that Bush isn't the MOST conservative republican president we've ever had, and they try to turn it into something it's not.

Bush is a conservative. I believe he's doing a pretty good job. He's not perfect, but he's the best we have. I don't really care what the polls say. I'm not going to let polls affect my decision. There are actually people who are turning against Bush specifically because of poll numbers. "Well, come on...you gotta admit... His numbers are so low, he's gotta be doing something wrong." It seems like it catches on like a virus. The whole if you can't beat 'em, you might as well join 'em mentality. Besides that, everything is extremely politicized. Did you notice that in those polls, democrats and republicans are always conveniently divided? They're all Americans, so why is it that on almost every issue involving Bush, the majority of the Republicans supported him and the majority of Democrats didn't? Side wars... Unfortunately, at this moment, the liberals are "winning this war." Unforunately, this war isn't about ideas or solutions, it's simply about propaganda.

By the way, who the Hell are they polling!? Why haven't I ever been polled? Why don't I have any friends that have been polled? Where are these polls being conducted!?

*EDIT* - I also thought I'd add that it's not just Bush that the people are fed up with. They're fed up with the other side as well. I think the American people are just becoming disgusted with politics and politicians in general. I might actually be starting to go that way myself...

[edit on 17-10-2005 by Herman]

Originally posted by Herman
RANT,

I don't read free republic............

Then you're quoting chapter, verse, tenor and hyperlink through pure syncronicity!?!

Can we get a "Mystical Science & Prophecy' forum dedicated to this boy STAT!!!???!?!

A leaders tribe is completely irrelevant to the qualatative performance in the role; get over it already - it's not the US vs. THEM or 'fair weather' Conservatives jumping ship....it's consistently bad performance and he's proven repeatedly that he is in way over his head ....those things are frome where folks ire is derived.

He's not perfect, but he's the best we have.

Who is "we"? Can't be talking about my former party. Can't be talking about our country.......so who is the "we"?
Things being "extremely politicized" are by design.....how else would they mobilize folks like you, Herman, unless they were? Would the average pre-vote age teen be surfing ATS & Free Republic or Rush online to get the 'dirt' on the 'tricks' and 'slander' the other side is pulling? Would they consistently appeal to nothing but emotion in framing every issue? Slightly less skillful ( and thus, spelled out for you) is Tom DeLay's framing of "persecution", as opposed to crimes....."partisan witchhunt" as opposed to simple discovery. Even the biggest Freeper can follow the obviouness of that mettalic chafe in the air.......pure 21st Century Republicanism at it's nadir.

Originally posted by Herman
There are actually people who are turning against Bush specifically because of poll numbers. "Well, come on...you gotta admit... His numbers are so low, he's gotta be doing something wrong."

Really? What percentage of people say that? I'd like to read that poll.

Besides that, everything is extremely politicized. Did you notice that in those polls, democrats and republicans are always conveniently divided? They're all Americans, so why is it that on almost every issue involving Bush, the majority of the Republicans supported him and the majority of Democrats didn't?

Odd isn't it? Though I understand Hitler was very popular among the Nazi Party too. Among the Jews? Not so much.

By the way, who the Hell are they polling!?

Thanks for asking. Representative populations to the stated sample (usually total US population) according to prefixes assigned to residential geographic areas with randomly generated digit dialing (to be fair and limit duplication from "listing") screening for representative populations of self identifying Independents, Republicans and Democrats (usually falling in that order). And as with most truly random sampling, representative demographics usually just happen to work out (race, age, gender, affiliation) but it can be screened and quota'ed if segment specific current events (like a Nascar race or Wednesday night choir practice) render unnatural skews.

Why haven't I ever been polled?

Odds are you never will be. The sweet science of statistics (and much confirmed experience) renders over sampling of any universe rather redundant rather quickly.

Why don't I have any friends that have been polled?

Odds are they never will be. There's almost 300 million Americans.

Where are these polls being conducted!?

All over the country, every day and night of every week. "Where" the call originates really doesn't matter, but some of the higher concentrations of phone banks happen to be in places like the Virginias, Ohio and Utah if that matters. And if anyone is ever undersampled, it's typical younger metropolitan types. In other words, liberals.

Responsible polling, like responsible media, is your buddy. Never more so than when it informs you you're a radical extremist holding opinions on the fringes of society. To your point, some people should give up. They're insane. They don't deserve a "fair & balanced" place in the discourse. Again, they're insane. The reason the Republican Party is so demoralized right now is what's known as reality. They never like polls. They like focus groups. That's a wedge strategy. It's anti-populist. They want to figure out how to sell that which America doesn't want to multiple groups wedged together (that typically hate each other) based on language and message alone. You were speaking of propaganda right? You're party is the master of it. "Clear Skies" and "Family Values?" Please.

The virtual party known as Republicans has more meaningless and manufactured hot button single issue voters than one can possibly imagine. Guns, God or Gays? Take your pick, then make your stand for unrelated anti-you policy. But don't talk to me about a lack of "solutions" when you support that nonsense and the obviously unsustainable criminal enterprise known as the Republican Party, now under indictment.

Enjoy your future bankruptcy Young Republican. See you in line.

Herman, here's something you should read from IntellectualConservative.com. It's from a year ago but still pretty relevant IMO:

Why Christians Should Not Vote for George W. Bush

Bush is NOT a conservative. He SAYS he is. Sometimes people's words and actions don't match up.

Well then Herman now that you have your 4-7 hours of Bush Worship in let the rest talk.

Anyways...

"Polls say CLinton is Satan! He must be because the polls say so! WHat? This poll says Bush is a total ********? WORSHIP BUSH!!!!! They must be Evil Liberals who are gonna convert my babies! Worship Bush! I gotta go home early boss need to get an extra hour of Bush worshipping in today to make up for listening to someone other then GOP News."

Before any Bush Worshippers say "We don't worship Bush, we just spend 4-7 hours bowing down to our Bush Shrines praising his name while we remove that awful dead guy on a stick in Bush's House and replace it with our Golden Statue to Bush." Polls say this, but what was the margin of error? some are 3-5%, some are 5-10%.

[edit on 17-10-2005 by Full Metal]

Originally posted by RANT
Only people I hear crying now are the one's that voted for him.

We'd all be crying a lot harder if Kerry had won.

Given the two choices we had - Bush and Kerry - I'd still vote for Bush.
Mix it up a bit and put some different people in the race, and it would
have come out differently and I probably would have voted differently.

But a choice between Kerry and Bush ... it's definately BUSH.

I gotta know.....

Originally posted by FlyersFanWe'd all be crying a lot harder if Kerry had won.

But a choice between Kerry and Bush ... it's definately BUSH.

What's your single issue that lead you to that false and emotional decision?
Because there's no way to cook the books/numbers to have shown ANY improvement in any category after 4 years of his "leadership"!?

Originally posted by Bout Time

Originally posted by Herman
RANT,

I don't read free republic............

Then you're quoting chapter, verse, tenor and hyperlink through pure syncronicity!?!

dictionary.reference.com...

I guess my answer to your question is yes, I guess I am linking to them out of synchronicity. I don't generally read free republic, but I believe they had a point so I linked to them.

Who is "we"? Can't be talking about my former party. Can't be talking about our country.......so who is the "we"?

"We", as it were, is in reference to the United States of America. As it stands, most politicians in my mind aren't completely trustworthy people. They're politicians not only because of their ideas, but because of their ability to sell these ideas. They're good speakers, they're good looking, they have family ties, lots of money - it usually seems to be one of those options. But as far as the people we had to choose from in these last two elections, I believe that Bush is the best pick.

Things being "extremely politicized" are by design

Yeah, it's called the watchdog function.

.....how else would they mobilize folks like you, Herman, unless they were? Would the average pre-vote age teen be surfing ATS & Free Republic or Rush online to get the 'dirt' on the 'tricks' and 'slander' the other side is pulling? Would they consistently appeal to nothing but emotion in framing every issue? Slightly less skillful ( and thus, spelled out for you) is Tom DeLay's framing of "persecution", as opposed to crimes....."partisan witchhunt" as opposed to simple discovery. Even the biggest Freeper can follow the obviouness of that mettalic chafe in the air.......pure 21st Century Republicanism at it's nadir.

First off, I am not pre-voting age. But I can't say that I didn't expect my age to come into play here. After all, it is you that I'm debating with here. I have to hand it to you though, Bout Time, you've helped me in being able to take personal jabs that come up in the course of a debate, ignore them, and move on to what the topic was originally about.

I have not been "mobilized" by any sort of propaganda. I hold my beliefs because this is what I see as the truth. There's no family brainwashing going on in my household, nor are we ever forced to sit down and watch fox. Politically, my family is pretty diverse. Sometimes I can't get into your mindset BT. Is it really that hard for you to believe that some people hold beliefs other than yours, and that they're not the result of political or religious propaganda? I mean, I know it's hard concept to grasp, but damn...

Furthermore, you seem to be accusing me of relying on "nothing but emotion". That notion is absurd on so many levels that I don't even think I have time to get into it, so I'll just leave it at the usual "You don't know me, that's a hypocritical and immature assertion towards my character" that I usually have to resort to when debating with you about politics.

Really? What percentage of people say that? I'd like to read that poll.

Well, as would I if such a poll existed. Unfortunately, not everything can be accurately assessed through polling. Maybe I should start one up.

Odd isn't it? Though I understand Hitler was very popular among the Nazi Party too. Among the Jews? Not so much.

en.wikipedia.org...

Rant,

Due to your background in marketing, you obviously know more about polls than I. I'm not going to debate you about that. But that doesn't change the fact that I don't really care much for polls, for two major reasons.

Unless you actually conducted these polls yourself, you don't know all of the specifics. How these questions were worded, if they really did give an accurate representation.

Here's an example.

Poll guy "Sir, I would like to ask you a few questions regarding your opinion of the current administration. Would you say that you're overall happy with what they've done?"

Guy being polled "Well, am I completely happy? No, but I think that---"

Poll guy "Thank you for you input, good bye".

Second off, I've never been one to base my beliefs or opinions off of what the majority of the population believes. I could care less how many people support Bush and how many people don't. I know what I believe, and that shouldn't be affected by what other people believe.

Herman, here's something you should read from IntellectualConservative.com. It's from a year ago but still pretty relevant IMO:

Why Christians Should Not Vote for George W. Bush

Bush is NOT a conservative. He SAYS he is. Sometimes people's words and actions don't match up.

Seen it, considered it... Enough said.

Well then Herman now that you have your 4-7 hours of Bush Worship in let the rest talk.

You obviously don't know what you're talking about. You assume that I spend "4-7 hours" on "Bush Worship". What makes you think that? For your information, I don't really have a lot of time anymore, between work, school, and other things to spend much of it on "Bush worship". At night, I usually come to this site for updates, or turn on the news (Sometimes Fox, sometimes not Fox). I also really like Jon Stewart, and although it's a comedy show and everything, you can get some information out of him. He's also a really funny guy.

"Polls say CLinton is Satan! He must be because the polls say so! WHat? This poll says Bush is a total ********? WORSHIP BUSH!!!!! They must be Evil Liberals who are gonna convert my babies! Worship Bush! I gotta go home early boss need to get an extra hour of Bush worshipping in today to make up for listening to someone other then GOP News."

Before any Bush Worshippers say "We don't worship Bush, we just spend 4-7 hours bowing down to our Bush Shrines praising his name while we remove that awful dead guy on a stick in Bush's House and replace it with our Golden Statue to Bush." Polls say this, but what was the margin of error? some are 3-5%, some are 5-10%.

Wow, I really don't know what to make of this. Hey, what's that sound? It sounds a lot like your credibility flying out the window.

I'm sure you know the old saying goes. What was it? When you assume, you make an ass out of u and me?

DISCLAIMER - That will hopefully be the only time you ever see me substitute the word "You" for the letter "u".

...After all, it is you that I'm debating with.............

We've debated?

Is it really that hard for you to believe that some people hold beliefs other than yours...

At last, an appropriate classification on your positions....beliefs. Can't really be classified as anything else after the various topics have been weighed, investiated and the numbers tallied, no?
To that end, I am extremely tolerant of beliefs, just not when they're contrary to facts and they're still masqueraded as such upon rational minds.

......... you seem to be accusing me of relying on "nothing but emotion".

Not at all, reread what I wrote. Feeding tubes, fake terror threats, devil sex sodomites getting married, opinions changing with new data being decried, terror cells is every town, restricting pollution ruins our economic competitiveness, vote for us or die...........you really think they relied on the logical in anything they pushed?