America Introduced Terrorism

August is the month to remember victims of Hiroshima and Nagasaki when the 1st Terrorist act of modern definition was introduced by Americans and today atrocities continue with direct or indirect involvment and same kind of attacks with self created enemies killing the innocents. You both Americans authorities, who created, caused and promoted the suicide bombers and who got preyed to these conspiracies, killing themselves and the innocent people are responsible for destruction. The question is who is bigger evil. Decision is your.

That's an awfully loose (and convenient) definition of "terrorism" to use.

But even in doing so, are you ignoring the IRA here? Their fight (whether or not we agree with their reasoning) neither had nor has anything to do with the US, at all.

Or how about the Internal Macedonian Revolutionary Organization? Driven by Slavic nationalism, this group acquired a reputation for ferocious attacks, including the 1934 assassination of Alexander I of Yugoslavia during a state visit to France.

Perhaps the Fenians/IRA and the IMRO may be considered the prototype of all 'nationalist terrorism'...and neither had or have any link to Hiroshima and Nagasaki.

It's very convenient to pick and choose which parts of history support an argument; sorry, but your post seems to be doing nothing more than trying to incite a war of words with no aim other than to antagonize.

I agree with you my friend by condemning the terrorism of any kind at any place and by whomsoever. But, look at the number of innocent people killed in Hiroshima and Nagasaki at once in this act. Who is the bigger terrorist??

Perhaps it would help if you defined terrorism.

Generally academia sees a difference between an act of war, and an act of terrorism.

Sure, the definitions might not mean much when you get down to it....but if you're using such broad definitions as "body count", then we could successfully argue that it ALL started, in modern terms, with the Holocaust.

Hiroshima and Nagasaki don't even come close.

Act of war will be considered in battle field where two enemies stand face to face, not beyond the battle field smashing the innocents. Hope you are not justifying brutal killing of hundred of thousands of innocents people in few seconds.

No, I'm trying to ascertain why you're stuck on the premise that the US somehow started off even modern terrorism.

Somehow you've managed to ignore the Holocaust, and yet pinpoint two nuclear bombs....when both involved the deaths of countless innocents, both happened during war-time, and both were government-sanctioned.

By your definition, anything that doesn't happen on a battlefield is "terrorism"...and that's just a very inaccurate definition.

Oh wow, Ok im not even gona bother going into detail about how clueless and stupid the comparisons you just made were, im just gonna skip ahead to ignor

[edit on 12-8-2005 by C0le]

Blanket anti-Americanism.

There's nothing uniquely wrong with America. The only thing that comes close is the doctrine of American Exceptionalism that contributed to the bloody westward expansion into Indian territory. Of course, most other nations have had similar incidents in their past, they just don't have a name for it like we do. (Manifest Destiny)

Human beings all follow roughly the same set of behaviors. We're all capable of atrocities, and every nation has blood on its hands.

Regardless, my rant is over, it suffices to say that Americans were not the first terrorists. That distinction would likely go to the tribes that first brought siege against Jericho, or perhaps even the first monkey to threaten his neighbor into giving up some of his game, or a favorite concubine.

Terrorism is older than America..by several millenia.

Dropping bombs in wartime, while nasty, isnt terrorism, regardless of the target.

The first terrorists were probably guy fawkes and his band of merry Catholics. Though imm sure if the records were traced back far enough people trying to kill innocents to get their way can be found throughout history.

To be fair, Peace did refer specifically to modern terrorism which does somewhat exclude the earlier Guy Fawkes, Jericho, smallpox-laden-blankets and other events.

I just can't understand why, using Peace's own definition (which to me aren't acts of terror - they're acts of war, simply by definition - and though this shouldn't need to be spelled out, nobody is condoning the deaths of millions), we're to ignore the Holocaust but place blame on America.

That's the bit that's just illogical, to me.

what about jewish zionists bombing the king david hotel in 1946.. or the resistance the the birtish occupation of Egypt? For the UK these are the beginnings of terror against them.

Well, question is not the modern or ancient way of terrorizing people, question is Thousands of blamless civilians killed by an establishment that claims to be the champion against the terrorism, to me killing of innocents under any circumstances, in any era is an act of terrorism and it is done time to time. NO ONE CAN JUSTIFY THE KILLING OF INNOCENT PEOPLE. full stop.

Originally posted by Peace2005
. NO ONE CAN JUSTIFY THE KILLING OF INNOCENT PEOPLE. full stop.

You're changing your argument.

Nobody has justified - or even tried to justify - the killing of innocents. Some people do accept that during times of war, it's inevitable.

But it's a huge leap to go from that premise, to "America started terrorism" - an allegation which you've so far been unable to support.

Peace2005:


I suggest you read a little hostory, wait, read ALOT of history. As its clear that you do not understand the words your speak. Hiroshima carried a terrible loss of Japanese life, but your comments are still without merrit. Read some history little kid, then maybe someday you will understand.


PS: Im taking Coles lead....Ignored.

Well, in support of my claim i can only say that kindly look at the cause of unrest and suicide bombing today, what is main demand from these bombers?, Withdraw troops form Afghanistan, Withdraw forces from Iraq, stop supporting Israel expansions. Everyone knows that most of the terror acts performed in recent times were in protest to US policies exploiting the Muslim world, so if suicide attacks given a name of terrorism, who created the situation like this?? I do not support and justify any kind of terrorism but just looking the cause and continuity of the same. Thats why I said they introduced the modern terrorism to today's world by droping 1st ever nuclear bomb on civilians delebrately, knowing very well how severely it will damage the humanity.

Originally posted by skippytjc
Peace2005:


I suggest you read a little hostory, wait, read ALOT of history. As its clear that you do not understand the words your speak. Hiroshima carried a terrible loss of Japanese life, but your comments are still without merrit. Read some history little kid, then maybe someday you will understand.


PS: Im taking Coles lead....Ignored.

I am satisfied with my knowledge, at the moment whatever I learned related to killing of civilians, whether in America, in Japan, UK, Iraq and elsewhere by whomesoever is AN ACT OF TERRORISM and do not support it. I do not need to look at the history to justy those killings.

Originally posted by Peace2005
Well, in support of my claim i can only say that kindly look at the cause of unrest and suicide bombing today, what is main demand from these bombers?, Withdraw troops form Afghanistan, Withdraw forces from Iraq, stop supporting Israel expansions.

And how does this tie in to Hiroshima exactly?

Thats why I said they introduced the modern terrorism to today's world by droping 1st ever nuclear bomb on civilians delebrately, knowing very well how severely it will damage the humanity.

Yes, it was known that dropping those bombs would cause untold tragedy.

But - and as a pacifist, it does pain me to say this - dropping those bombs probably actually saved many more lives than it destroyed. To take your own logic further, should we not therefore simply blame all of this terrorism on Germany, for initiating the events which led up to Hiroshima to begin with?

You've got to try and separate "acts of war" from terrorism - there truly isn't any comparison, and it's unfair to try and use them interchangeably.

And please, get past the assumption that because some of us are trying to explain a point of view, that we're somehow supporting the deaths of these victims. That's just a from-the-hip emotional response with no basis in reality.

Originally posted by skippytjc
Read some history little kid, then maybe someday you will understand.

I do't think comments like that are neccessary.

This thread illustrates a point. No one invented terrorism. Terrorism is merely the act of spreading fear. Just as 911 struck fear in our hearts, so did the shock and awe campaign in Iraq strike fear in the hearts of the people in Iraq. As did the Spanish Inquisition, the crusades and all the way back to T-Rex's running around and (presumably) scaring the *&^& out of anything that saw it.

Fear has alaways been a tool for destruction. It paralyzes enemies. It brings large groups of people to a concensus to follow leaders in return for "protection". .

Point being that America, while by no means innocent of terrorism, did not define the new era of terror. Its been the same game, just different players and tactics.

I am satisfied with my knowledge..

Then you are forever doomed to ignorance.

Never, ever, ever, under any circumstances, should one who seeks knowledge be satisfied with what he/she has found.

There is no destination attached to this particular journey.

Originally posted by TruthWithin
This thread illustrates a point. No one invented terrorism. Terrorism is merely the act of spreading fear.
...
Point being that America, while by no means innocent of terrorism, did not define the new era of terror. Its been the same game, just different players and tactics.

Exactly! Terrorism is not an invention of America. Ancient or modern. Small scale or large. Terrorism is a tool that has been used since the beginning of man. It's an invention of man.

And to make the claim that "America started it!" is a meaningless discussion point. I'm one of the first to agree that America has been engaged in terrorism, but pointing out that we started it in an effort to make us the bad guys or to make all terrorism that follows our just desserts, is (in my way of thinking, anyway) simply trying to put the blame on one party when there are many more involved.