Why are the Freemasons attacked by Trolls

Sebatwerk:

First off, your comments have not addressed much of any of the raised concerns. However, it is hard to solve, since we are constrained by personal security and the problems of internet forums. Further, if there are more people who laugh at other people's expense in Masonary...

Originally posted by Guy Kawasaki
First off, your comments have not addressed much of any of the raised concerns. However, it is hard to solve, since we are constrained by personal security and the problems of internet forums.

Actually, you do a search for all the posts I've made in the past 4 months. You could find a BOOK'S WORTH of true and verifiable information regarding Freemasonry and my other claims. But this thread is about why masons are attacked by anti's, we are not talking about specific theories here.

Further, if there are more people who laugh at other people's expense in Masonary...

And I will say this again: You do not know me in person, so for you to criticize my personality like this is inherently beyond your ability.

Edit. Oops, that was suppsed to be a u2u.

[edit on 16-4-2005 by intrepid]

[edit on 16-4-2005 by intrepid]

Originally posted by All Seeing Eye
You say, venom? If anyone posts anything that dosnt flatter the brotherhood, you get buckets of "Venom" thrown on you. Say one disrespectful thing and bang, here comes the childish personal insults. It amazes me that a group of intellectuals can stoop so low.

Amazes me too. You'd think we LOVED to have LIES spread about us and that we'd just take those LIES in stride and not say anything about it.

Tell me All (non)seeing Eye, if you HATE Masonry (not MasonAry...there's no second "a" in it) so much, why do you have an Avatar of a famous MASON???? John Wayne, a 32nd Degree Mason and a Shriner....

Poor choice it seems.

Further, if there are more people who laugh at other people's expense in Masonary...

And I will say this again: You do not know me in person, so for you to criticize my personality like this is inherently beyond your ability.


Now you get sensitive about others commenting on your personality? You dont know me but you felt it was proper and correct to call me childish names. I never once attacked your personality nor do I care to. I smell hypocracy, should we attribute that to your personallity, or your freemason education?

Originally posted by intrepid

Originally posted by All Seeing Eye
Sorry, the identity of these people will remain with me. In fact I dont care to know their names or write them down. The Identity's will go with me to the grave.

This is a fair statement. This info is private, very much like the Masonic rituals and handshakes, no?

Sure the info's private Intrepid. It's a lie. He can't name people who don't exist. That's simple enough to understand.

Sorry...but it's the truth.

Originally posted by All Seeing Eye
Now you get sensitive about others commenting on your personality? You dont know me but you felt it was proper and correct to call me childish names. I never once attacked your personality nor do I care to. I smell hypocracy, should we attribute that to your personallity, or your freemason education?

I called you a troll, which is someone who makes claims in order to get people riled up, and doesn't bother to back them up with evidence. That is all I ever called you. I never made any comments about your personality, only your posts.

And who's the hypocrite? You can't HELP but to take a shot at me regarding my affiliation with Freemasonry.


[edit on 16-4-2005 by sebatwerk]

ALL RIGHT, I've had enough of this pitiful bickering.

:bnghd:

Amazes me too. You'd think we LOVED to have LIES spread about us and that we'd just take those LIES in stride and not say anything about it.

Tell me All (non)seeing Eye, if you HATE Masonry (not MasonAry...there's no second "a" in it) so much, why do you have an Avatar of a famous MASON???? John Wayne, a 32nd Degree Mason and a Shriner....

Poor choice it seems.



It is very fitting to show a famous ACTOR, as that is exactly what most secret society members do for a living. They act as though they care for mankind, but in reality are nothing more than a wolf in sheeps clothing.

True, why bother about lies, if that was all they were. Why waste the effort defending yourselves against fabrications?

And thank you for the correction ...... It is taken in the correct spirit

Originally posted by All Seeing Eye
True, why bother about lies, if that was all they were. Why waste the effort defending yourselves against fabrications?

We bother with those lies because the fact that Freemasons have responded with silence in the past got us to where we are today. It's time to start taking a stand against the B.S. that's out there so that these dumb theories can end once and for all.

Originally posted by sebatwerk

Originally posted by All Seeing Eye
One subject that is well documented is the American Red Cross's "Blood Drive". Will freemasonry deny that they are the ones behind this travisty of the heart? A gift given freely is turned into a product to be soled to the public at an outragious profit? This gift of life can cost upwards of 150$ a unit. Why is it that all the middle men must make their profit. Why cant they give as freely as well?

Do you have ANY EVIDENCE of what you claim above? If not, BE A MAN and admit that what you are saying is false.... YOU'RE FREAKIN NUTS DUDE!!!

Maybe you forgot this comment....................

Also it seems you have created a new meaning for the word "Troll"

Random House , Websters Collage dictionary defines Troll as

" Any of a race of supernatural beings hostile to humans, who live underground or in caves"

If you are fabricationg a new meaning for the word, please advise said dictionaries to add it to their collection

[edit on 16-4-2005 by All Seeing Eye]

Originally posted by All Seeing Eye

It is very fitting to show a famous ACTOR, as that is exactly what most secret society members do for a living. They act as though they care for mankind, but in reality are nothing more than a wolf in sheeps clothing.

Funny how you question the character of Masons who stand up for our Order and you make ad hominem attacks against Masons. Says a lot for your character...or lack thereof. Not meant as an insult...just something you should think about.

In another post you said "you don't know me personally" well..YOU don't know ME personally, but to spread lies about Masonry IS an attack on me. What did Masonry do to HURT you? Why are you so full of hatred for it? There must be a reason...and it's not some world conspiracy or the fact that people like John Wayne (upon whom be peace) were Masons. That makes no sense. I'm just curious.

True, why bother about lies, if that was all they were. Why waste the effort defending yourselves against fabrications?

Do YOU like to be lied about? What if I start a thread that lies about YOU? Would you defend yourself? You should.

And thank you for the correction ...... It is taken in the correct spirit

Thanks. It was meant in a good spirit. "Masonary" is a common mistake...sort of like the word Reality or Realator when it should be Realty or Realtor.

Originally posted by All Seeing Eye

Originally posted by sebatwerk

Originally posted by All Seeing Eye
One subject that is well documented is the American Red Cross's "Blood Drive". Will freemasonry deny that they are the ones behind this travisty of the heart? A gift given freely is turned into a product to be soled to the public at an outragious profit? This gift of life can cost upwards of 150$ a unit. Why is it that all the middle men must make their profit. Why cant they give as freely as well?

Do you have ANY EVIDENCE of what you claim above? If not, BE A MAN and admit that what you are saying is false.... YOU'RE FREAKIN NUTS DUDE!!!

Maybe you forgot this comment....................

You're right, I did forget about that comment. I'm sorry. What you claimed regarding masons kind of outraged me, so I posted that above. I don't take back asking you to be a man and stand up to your mistakes, but I do apologize for calling you "freaking nuts".

Also it seems you have created a new meaning for the word "Troll"
...
If you are fabricationg a new meaning for the word, please advise said dictionaries to add it to their collection

Funny. A "troll" is actually what many people in forums call people who do what you were doing. Never heard the saying? It's actually quite common, at least among users on ATS.

My fight isnt with freemasory Its with all secret societies. You dont seem to understand the damage that has, and is being done to humanity by these organisations. You cant have a secret society within a open society. Its like the proverbial bad apple in the barrel, sooner or later it will rot all the others, just ask Cardinal Law.

I dont hate freemasonry, I hate the oath to the death, a oath by design to hide the guilty. I hate when a group protects themselves at the expense of all others and then use charity to hide behind.

Masons? I dont hate, I have great sadness for them, for they know not what they are getting themselves into.

I spoke with one mason who told me he dosnt care about the corruption within the brotherhood, it wont matter in 200 years, he says. He truely couldnt care less for his children and grandchildren.

Well, I care! I care about what world we leave for the children of the furure. I care about this country and many others. In my opinion our only hope is to unite!!! And we cant do that with secret societies fragmenting the population. Can you understand ?

Originally posted by All Seeing Eye
My fight isnt with freemasory

Its with all secret societies. You dont seem to understand the damage that has, and is being done to humanity by these organisations. You cant have a secret society within a open society. Its like the proverbial bad apple in the barrel, sooner or later it will rot all the others, just ask Cardinal Law.

I dont hate freemasonry, I hate the oath to the death, a oath by design to hide the guilty. I hate when a group protects themselves at the expense of all others and then use charity to hide behind.

Masons? I dont hate, I have great sadness for them, for they know not what they are getting themselves into.

I spoke with one mason who told me he dosnt care about the corruption within the brotherhood, it wont matter in 200 years, he says. He truely couldnt care less for his children and grandchildren.

Well, I care! I care about what world we leave for the children of the furure. I care about this country and many others. In my opinion our only hope is to unite!!! And we cant do that with secret societies fragmenting the population. Can you understand ?

But you're very mistaken. You are mistaken about the aims of Freemasonry and you are mistaken about what our oaths and rituals mean. First, it is not an oath to the death. The penalties are merely symbolic, and this is plainly stated to initiates BEFORE they take the oath. Initiates are also told that they are to only help a WORTHY brother mason. We are told to put the law of our country before anything else. A mason's BACKGROUND is checked before being admitted to the fraternity. No felons allowed. Can this really be that bad?

In my opinion, your beliefs stem from a lack of knowledge. What you think is the truth is simply not the case. I visited your website, and in two pages about Freemasonry, I saw VERY FEW things that were actually accurate and true. Most of it is very inaccurate and much information on your website has been warped and twisted to make masonry look bad.

You feel sorry for masons, but I feel sorry for you because you are the one basing all your thoughts and beliefs on heresay and assumption, not evidence and fact. If you ever care to clear up the misconceptions you have about the fraternity, I would be more than happy to help.

I am not bound by oath to protect any brothers who are doing wrongful things, and I am not bound by oath to lie about the true intentions about the fraternity. I can and will be COMPLETELY HONEST AND OPEN with you about everything regarding masonry, except our modes of recognition. That is the only thing I am bound by oath to keep secret.

Will you take me up on my offer?

Ummm I can't help but think that seeing this whole thread started as a thinly veiled hate thread against me then it should have at least been moved here.
Post MrNECROS hate mail here please

Good to see Brother Intrepid wandering aound in here adding to it as well.
Hey aren't you supposed to be a mod or something?

Originally posted by MrNECROS
Good to see Brother Intrepid wandering aound in here adding to it as well.
Hey aren't you supposed to be a mod or something?

Originally posted by intrepid
OK dude, what the hell do I have to do to PROVE that I'm not a Mason. Not that it's a bad thing, just isn't the truth.

Posted in another thread. Care to answer it?

Quote: "Secret Society members... They act as though they care for mankind, but in reality are nothing more than a wolf in sheep’s clothing."

Prove it! The above statement is a Perfect Example of why you are being called a Troll! How can you even say that all "Societies" are the same - even though there are really not many "Secrets" left! Do you really want to know all of the Secrets that a Mason *MIGHT* know - then go to a Library, Study up on as many Topics possible, Meditate Deeply & hope for Enlightenment!

Do you even realize how much Charitable Giving Masonic Organizations participate in? I would be *EMBARRESED* to have made a statement like the one above if I were you!

Quote: "Why bother about Lies, if that was all they were. Why waste the effort defending yourselves against fabrications?"

You got to be kidding Right? Granted ATS is not like the New York Times or the Washington Post - but what if you were a Member of a Particular Institution (like say your Country/State/Company/Local Church/Fraternity) & you constantly witnessed said Institution being Slandered in the Media! You KNOW that the Claims being made are False, Ridiculous, Easily Dis-Proven & you had the ability to Refute these claims in said Media - wouldn't you do the same? What if these False & Slanderous Claims were made against your Family & the People that you Love & Care for in said Media - wouldn't you get a Little Annoyed & Refute the Libel?


[edit on 16-4-2005 by Seraphim_Serpente]

It was answered thusly:

Originally posted by MrNECROS
Intrepid, you could always leave them (or can you?)

You *should* know the truth, what I think is largely irrelevant.
If you know yourself to be a coward, a liar and a Freemason then you have to live with that not me.
Proof is not required.

Are you trying to give me yet another warning for saying that I believe you are a Freemason?

Point is YOU CAN'T PROVE YOU'RE NOT, I have Gerard open a very thinly veiled hate thread against me and you don't reprimand him or any other Mason at all, you even participoate in it.

You behaviour is less than even.

Originally posted by All Seeing Eye
Can you understand ?

If you truly believe that, then I do understand.

But I've been a Mason for over 15 years (a VERY active one...and I don't just mean that I attend all the local Lodge meetings...I've traveled all over the country and outside the U.S. for Masonic meetings, been initiated into various branches of the Order) am aware of the things Masonry is accused of...and I don't find them to be true.

I hope you can understand that.