Did Russia deployed thermobaric missile in Belgorod to repel an attack by insurgents

The fact that partisans are still hitting Belgorod, exposes the earlier lies from Russia that they had been completely eliminated. Sure they are nothing but nuisance raids right now but it speaks volumes about the lack of a secure border, and FWIW it's an excellent tactic against a larger force, don't commit to huge battles, instead a bunch of little ones, probe for weaknesses to exploit.

www.businessinsider.nl... ntel-says/

Activity in Belgoraod the last 24 hours

Russia deployed at least one thermobaric missile launcher on its own territory to push back partisan attacks, the UK Ministry of Defence said in an intelligence update on Friday.

According to the UK MOD, Russia's defense ministry said in a recent press release that it had deployed attack helicopters and the TOS-1A heavy thermobaric rocket launcher to repel attacks in Belgorod
The UK ministry said this shows Russia has "resorted to deploying the full range of military firepower on its own territory" in response to recent attacks by partisan groups.

The TOS-1A heavy thermobaric rocket launcher, which is mounted on top of tanks and can launch rockets up to two miles, Forbes reported. Thermobaric weapons are also known as vacuum bombs, and can have devastating effects on large areas, which are hit by huge blast waves.

It is not clear if Russia actually used the weapon in Belgorod.

Russia has previously deployed thermobaric rocket launchers in Ukraine, according to Ukrainian officials, who shared footage of their forces destroying one.

Russia reported shelling in Belgorod this week, and said it repelled an attempted incursion on Thursday. It blamed Ukraine, which has denied responsibility for previous attacks. No one has directly taken responsibility so far.

An extensive article about Bahkmut and the last 30 days from strategypage.com,

www.strategypage.com...

The war in Ukraine is not popular inside Russia and that has made it difficult for the military to recruit new troops to fight in Ukraine. Russia conscripts a quarter million young Russian men each year for one year of conscript service. The law stipulates that conscripts cannot be sent to a combat zone outside Russia. Putin tried to get around this by declaring Ukraine was actually part of Russia and Russian troops were there to put down an insurrection. Most conscripts and especially their parents, did not go along with this. This forced the government to spend a lot more money to get more nominally volunteers (contract soldiers) by forcing men with military service or and many with none to be “mobilized” into the military as highly paid contract soldiers. This worked initially until reports of the high casualty rates of contract soldiers in Ukraine became widely known. This led to more illegal schemes to obtain “volunteers”. This included forcing or deceiving conscripts into signing contracts to serve longer as contract soldiers. The war-related sanctions on Russia had caused an economic recession and good civilian jobs were hard to find.

Pay for contract soldiers was completive with similar jobs and that was not a bad deal when there was not a war going on in Ukraine. So far this year, Russia has recruited nearly 200,000 contract soldiers. Most of these have no training and this means a few months, or at least weeks, of training is needed to make these men useful, rather than an obstacle, in combat. Wagner Group is not restricted in how it recruits and it was able to recruit many convicts from prison. The deal was that if they survived their six month contract they would be free to leave and would also get a pardon and not return to prison. The Defense Ministry later tried this but had little success as Wagner Group had few restrictions on how it handled convict contract soldiers. If any of these men disobeyed orders or faltered in combat, they could be killed on the spot.

Wagner Force is the only military organization in Russian that is allowed to use this older but now officially forbidden, leadership style. It’s common knowledge that Wager Group operates this way and anyone joining knows it. Some Russians have called for the military to adopt the old-school disciplinary procedures, Most Russians do not want that, or the Wagner Group, the war in Ukraine or Vladimir Putin. This has led to more popular opposition to the war and Putin and more of the opposition are resorting to violence because nothing else seems to work. Putin stays in power by dealing with the opposition. That comes at a visible cost.

Many Russians are getting out of Russia to avoid military service or unemployment or simply because of Putin’s autocratic rules. Putin’s response was to declare it illegal to leave Russia without official permission. Many are leaving despite the restrictions; via whatever way they can come up with. Putin always admired the Soviet Union and now he is turning Russia back into a totalitarian police state. Those who back Putin believe Russia will eventually prevail in Ukraine, even if it takes decades. Most Russians, Ukrainians and NATO members disagree and now consider Russia a threat to everyone.

www.strategypage.com...

The Russian Stealth Cruise Missile


June 2, 2023: One of the most frequently used Russian missiles in Ukraine is the Kh-101. This missile is a stealthy version of the non-stealthy Kh-555, which is an upgraded version of the Kh-55 which entered service in the early 1980s as a Russian version of the American Tomahawk. The KH-101 was part of the Russian post-Cold War catch-up (to the Americans) effort. The Kh-101 was first noted hanging from a Tu95 heavy bomber. The Kh-101 was in development for nearly two decades, but most work was halted in the 1990s because of money shortages. In 2002, there were indications that work had resumed on the Kh-101.

Eventually, Tu-160 and Tu-95MS heavy bombers were equipped to carry a dozen Kh-555 cruise missiles each. These missiles are upgrades (longer range) of the Cold War era Kh-55 nuclear cruise missile. The Kh-555 is 20 feet long, weighs 1.5 tons and has a range of 3,000 kilometers. An 800 pound conventional warhead appears to be a cluster bomb type (carrying bomblets). The missile uses inertial and satellite supplied guidance, and can hit within 100 meters of its aiming point. Russia said it would use these missiles to attack terrorist bases in foreign countries. This it did, frequently, after Russian entered the war in Syria during 2015. The Kh-55, Kh-555 and Kh-101 were all used in Syria. A few times Russian launched these missiles from Russian air bases and used their long range to fly over Iran and Iraq to targets in Syria.

The Kh-101 had a new shape, and a radar absorbing skin, to make it more difficult for radar to detect. Otherwise, the Kh-101 appears to have the same weight, range and payload of the Kh-55. The Kh-101 wasn't meant to replace Kh-555 missiles, but complement them, at least until the Kh-555s were too old to maintain, and had to be retired. That's a process that took over a decade to happen

I'm to the point of not believing anything, from any source, concerning the situation in Ukraine.

Every Senator and congressman in my state voted for biden's new budget, bankrupting this nation, spending billions on a war we have no business even being involved in, we instigated in the first place and my senator proudly supports. Sons of bitc**s

I'm also to the point of not caring if a thermobaric missile was dropped on the US Capitol building. Trump wanted to get rid of the deep state and that would be an excellent means to getting it done.


Right now, go ahead and drop a 2nd one on the White House as well.

Russia needs to deploy there version of the M.O.A.B onto Ukraine's most strategic catalyst point at this time.
let's just get this over with already.
Then maybe we can get-down to all the financial gains the American Congress and other so called rep's officially used their positions for i'll gotten gains.

a reply to: putnam6

So Russia's army is virtually incompetent and arguably weakened by corruption. Their latest "unstoppable" missile can apparently be shot down by a 30yr old (albeit updated) defense system. The air defense for their capital city is a joke.

And now home-grown insurgents are taking potshots at Russia's infrastructure.


Potemkin would be shaking his head in disgust.

Many Russians are getting out of Russia to avoid military service or unemployment or simply because of Putin’s autocratic rules. Putin’s response was to declare it illegal to leave Russia without official permission. Many are leaving despite the restrictions; via whatever way they can come up with. Putin always admired the Soviet Union and now he is turning Russia back into a totalitarian police state. Those who back Putin believe Russia will eventually prevail in Ukraine, even if it takes decades. Most Russians, Ukrainians and NATO members disagree and now consider Russia a threat to everyone.

Proof?

There’s a massive mostly Ethnic Russian population in Crimea and in East Ukraine that says otherwise.

Who have been constantly subjected to vicious brutality and bombardment from the Ukrainian Nazi regime with their Nazi “AZOV” national guard.

If you look inside Pro Zelensky threads on social sites everywhere, (including here) you’ll see remarks saying “ethnic Russians there need to be kicked out!!!!”

Also, it’s not shocking there’s a random Joe in Russia that’s not exactly excited to go to war.

Not everyone likes to go to war obviously. So, I’m not sure how this can be spinned lol. In fact, it’s just desperation and an embarrassing attempt to fall back to only pointing at Putin.

originally posted by: [post=27024788]Imhere

Also, it’s not shocking there’s a random Joe in Russia that’s not exactly excited to go to war.

Not everyone likes to go to war obviously. So, I’m not sure how this can be spinned lol. In fact, it’s just desperation and an embarrassing attempt to fall back to only pointing at Putin.

Ummm...


"War"?


I thought Russia was conducting just a "Special Military Operation" in Ukraine, not a "War" ?


In fact, hasn't Putin had folks arrested for calling the actions in Ukraine a "war"?

Im at the point where Im not discussing the diplomatic geopolitical aspects in this thread. My thoughts on that are well documented here on ATS. Im looking at the more the actual military aspects of the Special Military Operation in Ukraine, we can discuss the numbers and such, but somebody shelled the piss out of Bakhmut? Somebody is popping off mortar rounds in Belgorod? are they not? Got to ask if you are getting shot at does it make a difference to that individual in the crosshairs, who started it?

I can completely be skeptical of all the leaders, politicians, and MSM on the causes, reasons, and claims from all sides. While still having an interest in the military aspects. It's like with the Kinzhal, this has been hyped for years and by all accounts not performing up to expectations. However, FWIW the only reason the Patriot Missile Batteries seem to be holding up is Ukraine using its missiles at an incredibly high and likely unsustainable rate. It's as simple as that, whichever side runs out first loses.

Not only that, but trying to peg the actual troop losses, on both sides, hearing totals over 350,000 . Honestly have heard Ukraine lost over 200,000 they can't survive long if thats 1/2 to 3/4s true. They just won't have enough personnel if Russia just remains persistent. Thats the reality, and that's without the political narratives.

originally posted by: Mantiss2021

originally posted by: [post=27024788]Imhere

Also, it’s not shocking there’s a random Joe in Russia that’s not exactly excited to go to war.

Not everyone likes to go to war obviously. So, I’m not sure how this can be spinned lol. In fact, it’s just desperation and an embarrassing attempt to fall back to only pointing at Putin.

Ummm...


"War"?


I thought Russia was conducting just a "Special Military Operation" in Ukraine, not a "War ?


In fact, hasn't Putin had folks arrested for calling the actions in Ukraine a "war"?

Correct. My mistake. It’s currently a Special Military Operation. Russia hasn’t declared a full out war on Ukraine, yet.

Although theres an uptick lately in Russias missile strikes etc and seems like it’s escalating further to another stage in the operation. Where as there’s people that have been harping that Russia has ran out of missiles months ago.

I meant as in going in combat in any shape or form.

originally posted by: putnam6
Im at the point where Im not discussing the diplomatic geopolitical aspects in this thread. My thoughts on that are well documented here on ATS. Im looking at the more the actual military aspects of the Special Military Operation in Ukraine, we can discuss the numbers and such, but somebody shelled the piss out of Bakhmut? Somebody is popping off mortar rounds in Belgorod? are they not? Got to ask if you are getting shot at does it make a difference to that individual in the crosshairs, who started it?

I can completely be skeptical of all the leaders, politicians, and MSM on the causes, reasons, and claims from all sides. While still having an interest in the military aspects. It's like with the Kinzhal, this has been hyped for years and by all accounts not performing up to expectations. However, FWIW the only reason the Patriot Missile Batteries seem to be holding up is Ukraine using its missiles at an incredibly high and likely unsustainable rate. It's as simple as that, whichever side runs out first loses.

Not only that, but trying to peg the actual troop losses, on both sides, hearing totals over 350,000 . Honestly have heard Ukraine lost over 200,000 they can't survive long if thats 1/2 to 3/4s true. They just won't have enough personnel if Russia just remains persistent. Thats the reality, and that's without the political narratives.

Putnam, I can respect some of your views on the situation. But disagree when in reference to Kinzhal not performing to expectations.

You mentioned Ukraine is using the Patriot missile system at an incredibly high and likely unsustainable rate. And as we know it’s not cheap.

So, if it takes a very expensive missile barrage to take down a Kinzhal, how is it not performing to expectations?

If anything, it sounds like it’s performing extremely well. With the added depletion in the Patriot missile system/AD etc.

The Kinzhal is a beast, period.

And if you saw the videos in the past weeks, there were some massive hits that looked like a tactical nuke strike.

Even, let’s say theres a satellite weapon like “Rods of God” in space, there’s a counter. Although, it most likely would need to be advanced and a very expensive one.

Reminds me when Trump haters were making fun of Trump when he signed into law and officially created the “Space Force” thinking it was imaginary and stupid.

a reply to: putnam6

From TheDrive/TheWarzone :

Reported by the Russian MoD :

“Three attacks by Ukrainian terrorist formations were repelled by the selfless actions of Russian servicemen,” the MoD claimed. “Helicopters of the Western Military District carried out 11 strikes on the enemy. Rocket and artillery forces carried out 77 firing missions, and two heavy flamethrowers launched two strikes.”

TheWarzone

We have seen how effective these thermobaric missiles are on buildings and fortified positions.

I see the logic behind Russia using one or two missiles to soften up enemy positions before moving in ground units.

a reply to: LittleJake

They didn't blow up the kremlin. This is more like using a thermobaric missile on some city in Texas, not the white house.

originally posted by: Imhere

originally posted by: putnam6
Im at the point where Im not discussing the diplomatic geopolitical aspects in this thread. My thoughts on that are well documented here on ATS. Im looking at the more the actual military aspects of the Special Military Operation in Ukraine, we can discuss the numbers and such, but somebody shelled the piss out of Bakhmut? Somebody is popping off mortar rounds in Belgorod? are they not? Got to ask if you are getting shot at does it make a difference to that individual in the crosshairs, who started it?

I can completely be skeptical of all the leaders, politicians, and MSM on the causes, reasons, and claims from all sides. While still having an interest in the military aspects. It's like with the Kinzhal, this has been hyped for years and by all accounts not performing up to expectations. However, FWIW the only reason the Patriot Missile Batteries seem to be holding up is Ukraine using its missiles at an incredibly high and likely unsustainable rate. It's as simple as that, whichever side runs out first loses.

Not only that, but trying to peg the actual troop losses, on both sides, hearing totals over 350,000 . Honestly have heard Ukraine lost over 200,000 they can't survive long if thats 1/2 to 3/4s true. They just won't have enough personnel if Russia just remains persistent. Thats the reality, and that's without the political narratives.

Putnam, I can respect some of your views on the situation. But disagree when in reference to Kinzhal not performing to expectations.

You mentioned Ukraine is using the Patriot missile system at an incredibly high and likely unsustainable rate. And as we know it’s not cheap.

So, if it takes a very expensive missile barrage to take down a Kinzhal, how is it not performing to expectations?

If anything, it sounds like it’s performing extremely well. With the added depletion in the Patriot missile system/AD etc.

The Kinzhal is a beast, period.

And if you saw the videos in the past weeks, there were some massive hits that looked like a tactical nuke strike.

Even, let’s say theres a satellite weapon like “Rods of God” in space, there’s a counter. Although, it most likely would need to be advanced and a very expensive one.

Reminds me when Trump haters were making fun of Trump when he signed into law and officially created the “Space Force” thinking it was imaginary and stupid.

All Im suggesting is the hype around the Kinzhal, a single Kinzhal was supposedly unstoppable. was it not? Now we are hearing if a single one is used in an area with a PMB it can be neutralized, apparently other systems have had success as well. However, when used with a barrage of cruise missiles, it's more effective.No more, no less. Battlefield tactics

That wasn't the Russian hype though and the story of 3 Russian hypersonic missile scientists being arrested is certainly circumstantial evidence that all isn't peachy keen in regard to its usage, capabilities, and availability.

Considering we get very little from Russia, it's all educated speculation at best, but plenty of evidence the Kinzhal lowers its speed at the crucial end phase and can get tracked and hit

www.rferl.org...

novayagazeta.eu...

Challenging the Patriot
As for the Kinzhal missile strike on the Patriot system near Kyiv, the two sides present different versions of events. Ukraine claims that the Patriot struck six Kinzhal missiles and sustained minor damage. Russia claims that it had fired fewer Kinzhals and incapacitated the Patriot. Western experts estimate that Russia has very few Kinzhal missiles — no more than 50. Thus it would be irrational to launch six of them simultaneously just to see how the Patriot would fare against them.

MIM-104 Patriot. Photo: EPA / FILIP SINGER.
MIM-104 Patriot. Photo: EPA / FILIP SINGER.

Hitting a Patriot with so-called hypersonic Kinzhal missiles is not that easy. They only fly at a hypersonic speed of 10M at altitudes over 40 km. Once the missile drops to an altitude of 20 km, it becomes supersonic — no more than 4M, which is a regular target for the Patriot. Moreover, the Patriot can launch up to six missiles simultaneously. If one of them misses, another missile can be launched. The minimum launch time is three seconds. Keep in mind that it is quite easy for any SAM to shoot down a missile heading straight for it; it is much harder to hit lateral targets.

The Kinzhal is a stealth missile, but the Patriot radar can detect it at a distance of 70-90 km. If it detects a mass Kinzhal attack, the radar will simply shut down and have the system move away.

Since the Kinzhal heads towards its target at quite a steep angle, it is possible that the wreckage of the downed missile fell onto the Patriot. Incapacitating its radar will cause the Patriot to fail completely, but it is not too difficult to repair a radar hit by shrapnel: any element can be delivered by aircraft.

a reply to: putnam6

Bring on the next Russian revolution is my feelings on the matter if it's the only way to get rid of Putin and his ilk

As to the use of thermobaric missiles on his own people.

Methinks that won't have the desired effect he wishes.

And all it will serve to achieve is the unite even more of the poor sods in anger against him.

As always freedom to Ukraine and down with Putin and his piss-poor invasion of his peaceful neighbor.

originally posted by: Imhere

Many Russians are getting out of Russia to avoid military service or unemployment or simply because of Putin’s autocratic rules. Putin’s response was to declare it illegal to leave Russia without official permission. Many are leaving despite the restrictions; via whatever way they can come up with. Putin always admired the Soviet Union and now he is turning Russia back into a totalitarian police state. Those who back Putin believe Russia will eventually prevail in Ukraine, even if it takes decades. Most Russians, Ukrainians and NATO members disagree and now consider Russia a threat to everyone.

Proof?

There’s a massive mostly Ethnic Russian population in Crimea and in East Ukraine that says otherwise.

Who have been constantly subjected to vicious brutality and bombardment from the Ukrainian Nazi regime with their Nazi “AZOV” national guard.

If you look inside Pro Zelensky threads on social sites everywhere, (including here) you’ll see remarks saying “ethnic Russians there need to be kicked out!!!!”

Also, it’s not shocking there’s a random Joe in Russia that’s not exactly excited to go to war.

Not everyone likes to go to war obviously. So, I’m not sure how this can be spinned lol. In fact, it’s just desperation and an embarrassing attempt to fall back to only pointing at Putin.

Proof? Respectfully if you have another more credible source please share it, I love reading all aspects, opinions, and sides to a situation, and then drawing my own conclusions


All we can go on from Russia is mostly speculation, while Ukraine and the West spin the stories too, but there certainly is more coverage and opinion thus all the links and articles.

As for that particular small sample of source material, you've pulled from two fairly extensive articles and websites. But are you suggesting the below paragraphs are completely false? Respectfully how is it that Russia with its huge army and low casualty rate still has to conscript such huge numbers of civilians to fill thier ranks?

I respect your opinion and would like to read more from the sources you have used to form, said opinion.

www.strategypage.com...

Russia conscripts a quarter million young Russian men each year for one year of conscript service. The law stipulates that conscripts cannot be sent to a combat zone outside Russia. Putin tried to get around this by declaring Ukraine was actually part of Russia and that Russian troops were there to put down an insurrection.

So far this year, Russia has recruited nearly 200,000 contract soldiers. Most of these have no training and this means a few months, or at least weeks, of training is needed to make these men useful, rather than an obstacle, in combat. Wagner Group is not restricted in how it recruits and it was able to recruit many convicts from prison. The deal was that if they survived their six month contract they would be free to leave and would also get a pardon and not return to prison. The Defense Ministry later tried this but had little success as Wagner Group had few restrictions on how it handled convict contract soldiers. If any of these men disobeyed orders or faltered in combat, they could be killed on the spot.

it's a nondescript low profile site, that just so happens to have an author and editor whose previous books have a wealth of information and knowledge presented in a style I enjoy and seems more direct information and less opinions than other Western sources

en.wikipedia.org...

here's an interesting Russian positive slant article if that helps you feel better...not to mention, nothing yet has occurred that changes my stance in a war of attrition eventually Russia will wear down Ukraine

english.nv.ua...

Despite having spent over a thousand long-range missiles of various types to bombard Ukraine over the course of the war, Russia still has more than enough to continue attempting to strike targets all across the country, military expert Mykhailo Zhirokhov said in an interview with NV on May 24.

The cruise missiles that Russians are using to attack Ukraine, namely the Kh-55, Kh-555, and Kh-22, are all Soviet-era munitions, no longer in production, asserts Mykhailo Zhirokhov, a military expert and aviation history researcher.

"Currently, they [Russians] have mass production of the Kh-101/Kh-102, Kalibr [cruise missiles], and that’s basically it," said Zhirokhov.

"They are also planning to launch mass production of the Kh-50 Orion cruise missile."

As for the stock of Soviet-made missiles, according to the expert, they are still quite large.

Read also: Ukraine needs at least 500 UK-made Storm Shadow missiles, military expert
"Remember, in 1999 alone, Ukraine transferred about 600 Kh-55 cruise missiles [as a gas debt payment] to the Russians," he emphasized.

He also mentioned that Russians are currently trying to independently manufacture Kh-55 missiles using components from decommissioned Soviet equipment. However, these are rather isolated cases and not mass production.

Meanwhile, after the collapse of the Soviet Union, Russians have been producing several dozen cruise missiles annually, and this production has become stable after 2008.

"Now they are working in three shifts, adapting electronics to Chinese components and increasing production," says Zhirokhov.

He adds that despite the problems with the production of the Kalibr missile, the Kh-101s are being assembled stably and in much larger quantities than they were before the full-scale invasion of Ukraine.

"Therefore, considering the already used cruise missiles, I would now talk about a total stock of about 1,500 missiles," the expert concludes, suggesting it is too early to say that the Russian army is nearing the depletion of its missile arsenal.

"Moreover, there is still an untouched reserve, perhaps 10-20% [of missiles], which the Russians keep in stockpiles in case of a conflict with NATO, which they constantly talk about," notes Zhirokhov.

originally posted by: LittleJake
I'm to the point of not believing anything, from any source, concerning the situation in Ukraine.

Yup. I had the same thoughts early on. every story was a lie, from both sides. So rather than spend all kinds of time trying to decipher who's telling the truth, I decided nobody would be able to, so I ignore the whole thing. Eventually folks will be tired of dying, tired of killing, and someone will claim "VICTORY!" standing on a mountain of bodies of surprisingly similar looking people.

Yeaaaaaa!!!!!! “Merica!” I concur whole heartedly a reply to: LittleJake

That’s what people in countries not named USA said about our dumb asses when we invaded Iraq and all those other middle eastern countries. We need to take out all those rotten Biden ilk in Washington. a reply to: andy06shake

a reply to: TacoLoco75

Im not from the USA TacoLoco75.

And i don't support any of the Gulf wars over imaginary weapons of mass destruction.

Nor the likes of whatever the feck Afghanistan amounted to.

As to the Biden nonsense, well not everything is about America or her politics mate, the world is a big place.

What do you mean by "take out" all the same, surely you are not supporting terrorist acts of depravity inside your own nation or the assassination of a POTUS?

a reply to: LittleJake

Every Senator and congressman in my state voted for biden's new budget, bankrupting this nation, spending billions on a war we have no business even being involved in, we instigated in the first place and my senator proudly supports

I'm also to the point of not caring if a thermobaric missile was dropped on the US Capitol building. Trump wanted to get rid of the deep state and that would be an excellent means to getting it done.

Trump had the record for most debt added in four years and was the first to provide lethal aid to Ukraine.

But neither Trump nor Biden signed the Budapest memorandum.

If you’re going to derail the thread, try to use talking points that make logical sense.

Back on topic, I think the use of semi unconventional arms on your own land is a good way to get more people to oppose you. Just goes to show the longer wars go on, the more unforeseen consequences happen.

originally posted by: CriticalStinker
a reply to: LittleJake

Every Senator and congressman in my state voted for biden's new budget, bankrupting this nation, spending billions on a war we have no business even being involved in, we instigated in the first place and my senator proudly supports

I'm also to the point of not caring if a thermobaric missile was dropped on the US Capitol building. Trump wanted to get rid of the deep state and that would be an excellent means to getting it done.

Trump had the record for most debt added in four years and was the first to provide lethal aid to Ukraine.

But neither Trump nor Biden signed the Budapest memorandum.

If you’re going to derail the thread, try to use talking points that make logical sense.

Back on topic, I think the use of semi unconventional arms on your own land is a good way to get more people to oppose you. Just goes to show the longer wars go on, the more unforeseen consequences happen.

Trump trump trump trump trump trump trump trump. You need to be committed. You severely suffer from TDS.
Seems everything you post is, Trump trump trump.

..the first to provide lethal aid to Ukraine.

I don't think so. My understanding is that he provided only non-lethal aid to Ukraine.

You need to back up that statement.