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A question for the faithful

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posted on May, 25 2023 @ 06:01 PM
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Before anyone goes off the deep end and thinks I'm making fun of or casting doubt on religion, I'm not.
It's a legitimate question.

2000 years ago and even before that, God spoke to people, they did what he said and no one thought twice.
Abraham was going to kill his son because God wanted to test him and he was going to do it.
The books of the Bible were written by people who spoke to God, wrote it down and folks believe it.

For a long time now, if someone claims "God told me to do it" they lock them up and give them medicine because they're deemed insane. For those of you who are deeply religious, if you heard a voice in your head telling you to sacrifice one of your kids or something equally questionable, would you do it ?
Or would you seek medical help ?

Also, why would you believe someone who wrote down what they believed God said to them and not some random person off the street ?



posted on May, 25 2023 @ 06:12 PM
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a reply to: DAVID64

God didn't just tell people stuff back in the Bible. He backed up what he said with powerful works, wonders, miracles, and prophecy that has come true 100% of the time.

There are prophecies you can verify there is no way Bible writers could have invented that have come to pass. For example the prophet Isaiah, foretold by name Cyrus over 200 years before he was born, Jehovah stating through the prophet that he was the one that would liberate his people from Babylon:

"This is what Jehovah says to his anointed one, to Cyrus,
Whose right hand I have taken hold of
To subdue nations before him,
To disarm kings,
To open before him the double doors,
So that the gates will not be shut:
“Before you I will go,
And the hills I will level.
The copper doors I will break in pieces,
And the iron bars I will cut down.
I will give you the treasures in the darkness
And the hidden treasures in the concealed places,
So that you may know that I am Jehovah,
The God of Israel, who is calling you by your name.
"
-Isaiah 45:1-3.

It seems that Cyrus the Great was shown this prophecy foretelling exactly how he would conquer Babylon by the Jews for he himself wrote:

This is what King Cyrus of Persia says, ‘Jehovah the God of the heavens has given me all the kingdoms of the earth, and he has commissioned me to build him a house in Jerusalem, which is in Judah. Whoever there is among you of all his people, may his God be with him, and let him go up to Jerusalem, which is in Judah, and rebuild the house of Jehovah the God of Israel—he is the true God—whose house was in Jerusalem."-Ezra 1:2-3.

Jehovah had Isaiah and Jeremiah prophecy that Babylon would be overthrown and that it would become a heap of ruins never to be inhabited again, this is when it was the world power. Babylon was still inhabited when Jesus came to earth, and even during the ministry of the apostles. But by the 3rd century C. E., over 500 years after the prophecy was given, Babylon was a heap of ruins. And has not been inhabited down to this day.

Through Daniel Jehovah prophesied that Alexander the Great would stand up as the next world power. And he foretold that he would be broken and his progeny would not gain his rulership, rather it would be divided among four of his generals. This was foretold hundreds of years before it happened:

The two-horned ram that you saw stands for the kings of Meʹdi·a and Persia. The hairy male goat stands for the king of Greece; and the great horn that was between its eyes stands for the first king. As for the horn that was broken, so that four stood up instead of it, there are four kingdoms from his nation that will stand up, but not with his power."-Daniel 8:20-22.

We could do this all day. You are never taught this. But the Bible talks about real events and real people. And foretells things before they come to pass and then they come to pass all the time.

There are a lot lot more reasons that there is no way the Bible is not divine origin. Perhaps when I have more time I can share more with you if you are interested. The more you know the more you will be convinced of the divine authorship of the Bible. Which will give you confidence in what is says is unfolding today, and what will happen tomorrow. Which also sets you free. For it gives hope of everlasting life to everyone who wishes to grab hold of it.

ETA:

A video on reasonable proof of divine authorship of the Bible:
How We Can Be Sure the Bible is True
edit on 25-5-2023 by randomuser because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 25 2023 @ 06:14 PM
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Ok first off the jury is still out on the god existence thing for me and yeah I'm naturally defiant and in rebel club, and if a godly voice spoke to me (which would in all honestly creep me out) and told me to kill my child my first reaction would be to tell it to F*ck off and secondly ask why, if they were really a god, would they demand such a horrible deed. When it comes to my kids, I'm a ferocious lioness, no matter who is barking an order.
edit on 25-5-2023 by CthulhuMythos because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 25 2023 @ 07:35 PM
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originally posted by: DAVID64

Also, why would you believe someone who wrote down what they believed God said to them and not some random person off the street ?


The records in the Bible were deeply prophetic of the coming of Jesus Christ, and therefore it validated that the Being that orchestrated the collection of the Bible was in fact the timeless Alpha-Omega God. This was shown by the ability to foreshadow events that were hundreds or even thousands of years to come.

prophecies that predicted Jesus

I believe many people to this day are communicating with God, so long as they aren't being misled by their own vices. False prophecy is often associated with your own lust/greed/whatever getting in the way. You hear what you want to hear rather than what God is actually telling you.


originally posted by: CthulhuMythos
told me to kill my child my first reaction would be to tell it to F*ck off and secondly ask why


Because it was foreshadowing to the inevitable sacrifice God would make with his firstborn son. It was prophecy at its finest, archetypes manifesting on the material plane. These archetypes are deeper than the matter that represents them.
edit on 25-5-2023 by cooperton because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 25 2023 @ 07:48 PM
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a reply to: DAVID64
Abraham knew that God does not lie. Abraham knew his son would live on even if God had to bring him back to life. Have you forgotten the promise God made to Abraham pertaining to his and Saras son? The kid was already a miracle......



posted on May, 25 2023 @ 08:32 PM
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a reply to: CthulhuMythos

For me, the God I know would never ask that of me, so I guess I’d be seeing a doctor. I have no doubt that God asked Abraham to kill his son as a test of faith, but if he really wanted him to actually do it, why did he stay his hand at the last moment? I see this as the most severe test of faith there ever was. Why it had to be so harsh I don’t know.

Many people think that they know the mind of God. They can’t possibly, that’s just vanity. We were made in his image, that doesn’t mean he thinks exactly like we do, it means we look like him. To go a bit further, there are no limitations on my God. He can change his mind about anything at anytime. After all, how can you pose limits of any sort on the supreme being? That’s just wrong, and arrogant.

All Judaic religions see the Bible a bit differently. For the Jew, they do not accept Christ as their messiah. Their focus is on the Old Testament and still wait for their messiah. (except for the messianic Jew who accept Christ). For the
Jehovah Witness, the focus is on Jehovah and the Old Testament, with a nod to Christ. To the Catholic/Christian, the focus is on the Trinity of, Father, Son, and Holy Ghost/Spirit. The Muslim claim they have the same God, Allah, and that Christ was a subordinate prophet to Mohammad.

To CthulhuMythos: the fact that you say “The jury is still out”, in my mind tells me that you are still searching, and questioning. That’s great! Never stop. Keep an open mind and the answers you are looking for will come to you. If you want to have a relationship with God, ask him to reveal himself to you. If your sincere, he will make himself known.

For the record, I started life as a Roman Catholic, but now reject the Roman part of that religion. So I guess you can just call me a Christian.



posted on May, 25 2023 @ 08:45 PM
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A question for the faithful



I also have a question....

I've always wondered that when God anoints someone does that give them special religious dispensation that normal humans don't have?

And what is the criteria to qualify for an anointlment.


religionnews.com...
edit on 25-5-2023 by olaru12 because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 25 2023 @ 09:24 PM
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I'll add - Why test his faith if he already knows he will do it?

There are instance in the bible where God asks questions and I don't understand why. Why would an omnipotent, all knowing deity ask questions?

I'm sure it's something I'm missing that I just simply haven't realized. I say this because, the people who wrote these words down in those times would understand that questioning seems to be a contradiction, unless they understood something as well.

It doesn't seem like a retort or a derogatory statement. I can't picture God asking someone, "Why are you being such an ass!?".


If indeed God doesn't know the hearts of man as it says otherwhere in the bible (also another reason I think I'm missing something) then I would have to go with the ancient alien theory and I really hate that concept.



posted on May, 25 2023 @ 09:25 PM
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originally posted by: olaru12


A question for the faithful



I also have a question....

I've always wondered that when God anoints someone does that give them special religious dispensation that normal humans don't have?

And what is the criteria to qualify for an anointlment.


religionnews.com...


Im over here laughing. Did you actually just make this about Donald Trump? God made use of Trump pertaining to Jerusalem. I highly doubt either he or Joe walk with Christ.

God says " my sheep hear my voice and they obey".



posted on May, 25 2023 @ 09:34 PM
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originally posted by: Timber13
I'll add - Why test his faith if he already knows he will do it?


God didnt do it for himself. He did it for Abraham in part to show Abraham his faith was strong. Remember Abraham made some mistakes. Remember his wifes handmaiden? He wasnt supposed to have a child with her. His faith in God to give him a child at that age wasnt strong. Abraham was 86 years old when Ishmael was born (Genesis ch.16) and 100 years old when Isaac was born.

Another reason for God to do this test was to show what was planned for his own son, and how it felt. He foretold what would happen. So we and others would know the story of what happened and be able to discuss it like we are right now.



posted on May, 25 2023 @ 09:36 PM
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If you heard a voice in your head telling you to sacrifice one of your kids or something equally questionable, would you do it ?
Or would you seek medical help ?


Of cause not, I would question the voice, if you really be God, you would know the outcome before it unfolds. Thus no need for a test. Abraham offering his son Isaac as a sacrifice is just a fable demonstrating that unless we are prepared to die for God. We cannot truly live for God. The spiritual being paramount to all things material.
edit on 25-5-2023 by glend because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 25 2023 @ 10:05 PM
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Well.... To answer some questions here. According to the Bible and Jesus Christ in Matthew 25-14 to 25-30 the parable is that there was going to be a very long pause in God's plan here.

25-14
For the kingdom of heaven is as a man travelling into a far country, who called his own servants, and delivered unto them his goods.

So working out the details Matthew 24-14 states this.
And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come.

Christianity as Jesus Christ understood it was needed to get out to the entire world before the end times. That's the reason for the pause in God's plans. So I could elaborate further as how he did it but that's pretty much the answer. We're still in the pause. But it looks like the pause could end anytime now.



posted on May, 25 2023 @ 10:07 PM
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a reply to: DAVID64

Having had what I am pretty convinced was a brief brush with the divine, it wouldn't be just any voice in my head.



posted on May, 25 2023 @ 10:14 PM
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originally posted by: DAVID64
if you heard a voice in your head telling you to sacrifice one of your kids or something equally questionable, would you do it ?
Or would you seek medical help ?

Also, why would you believe someone who wrote down what they believed God said to them and not some random person off the street ?


If I heard a voice in my head telling me to do that...no I wouldn't do it. In the days of Abraham people lived under the Law, so sacrifice was already a part of their way of life at that time. But now it isn't and we live under the Age of Grace with Jesus being the only way to salvation and Heaven. The God I know from the Bible would not ask us to kill our child.

I believe the Bible and it's stories to be true, based on all of the prophecies in it that were predicted 2,000 years ago but yet we see it playing out in real time in our lives now. But if a random stranger said "God told me to do it" I wouldn't believe them because, as stated earlier...there are just some things God does not now ask of us, and murder is not one of them. Now days, for us, God asks us to stay separate from the world but yet "render unto Caesar what is Caesar's" (i.e. don't break laws).



posted on May, 25 2023 @ 10:30 PM
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a reply to: DAVID64

The books of the Bible were written centuries after the events happened, by man. What books were deemed 'Divine inspiration' and allowed for Christians to have has their religion were decided by man. Many legends far older than the Biblical writings include the same information.

It all boils down to a personal relationship with the Divine for me. I've had experiences that leave me with no doubt there is a Creator and our existence doesn't end with the death of our physical body, but as with everything I choose what I'm willing to believe.

I'm not sure anybody really understands God, and it seems a lot of information is missing/deleted in MHO.

edit on 40000001010America/Chicago311 by nugget1 because: sp



posted on May, 25 2023 @ 11:33 PM
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originally posted by: DAVID64
2000 years ago and even before that, God spoke to people, they did what he said and no one thought twice.
Abraham was going to kill his son because God wanted to test him and he was going to do it.

Tempted to offer a few links but, why?
Child sacrifice was common in the A&NE in Abrahams time
Abraham didnt sacrifice his child and after that, Israel, Judaism was one of the few if any cultures that didnt practice human sacrifice
Why not?
Because the precedent of sacrifice wasnt required by God


originally posted by: DAVID64

For a long time now, if someone claims "God told me to do it" they lock them up and give them medicine because they're deemed insane. For those of you who are deeply religious, if you heard a voice in your head telling you to sacrifice one of your kids or something equally questionable, would you do it ?

Christianity teaches Jesus was the completion, nothing more is required
Again, why when its not required


originally posted by: DAVID64
Also, why would you believe someone who wrote down what they believed God said to them and not some random person off the street ?


Surprisingly, many still do, look at all the different beliefs
My faith is in Jesus making up for my misunderstandings

Though, I think you are asking why I as a Christian, don't believe everything I hear
Because I believe the bible teaches a very simple and complete story that doesnt need any more detail or additions.
As Jesus said, "It is finished (completed)"



posted on May, 26 2023 @ 12:26 AM
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a reply to: DAVID64

Regarding the question about Abraham sacrificing his son and if I'd do it today; back in high school someone asked me that question. The point, clearly, was to "get me" either way. If I said "no," I was disobedient and faithless; if I said "yes," I was a dangerous religious fanatic.

The Bible is a big book with lots of interlocking pieces. Oversimplification is an error born of ignorance and arrogance. The King James 1611 translation has a word count of well over 750,000. It consists of over 60 separate books penned by many different people over a span of a few thousand years. It has more extant manuscripts than any other ancient literary work. It was composed in a culture and by people very different from us. One must seek to undersand it wihtin that context and as a whole. Your question (and I don't say this as an insult, simply as an observation), denudes ignorance of this fact.

First, you need to understand the cultural context in which this happened to Abraham. Abraham lived in a world where religous human sacrifice was a fairly common practice, so a "god" requiring a human blood sacrifice was not an unusual thing (sadly) in Abraham's world.

The test, then ,- i.e., the demand from Jehova for a human blood sacrifice - would not have seemed out of the ordinary to Abraham. It is clear that Jehova God never actually wanted a blood sacrifice. The intent was clearly to simply test the limits of Abraham's faith. So Abraham simply agreeing to the test is more indicative of his cultural context than anything else.

In this event of Abraham being willing to do this, a few things were made evident.

First, the depth and breadth of Abraham's faith was made evident. I'll get to that in a moment.

Second, it was made clear that Jehova God was different from the gods of the region in that this God actually did not require human blood sacrifices. Abraham told Issac that he was certain that God would supply the sacrifice, and God did.

Now, there's an old saying contrasting the books of the Old and New Covenant (Testament). It says:



The New in the Old is concealed.
The Old in the New is revealed.


The Old Covenant books hide for us in hints and shadows and types what is to come in the New Covenant (Testament). The New Covenant makes clear to us many things in the Old that may seem cloudy upon first examination. This bring us to what the New Covenant books have to say about Abraham and his act.

First, let's look at one of the most basic elements of Abraham's character, as noted in Genesis 15:6 and Romans 4:3 Romans 4:3. We are told at least twice that "Abraham believed God and it was credited to him as righteousness."

Romans 4:1-3 specifically says:


What then shall we say was gained by Abraham, our forefather according to the flesh? For if Abraham was justified by works, he has something to boast about, but not before God. For what does the Scripture say? “Abraham believed God, and it was counted to him as righteousness.”


Abraham's faith was radical, so much so that God credited Abraham's confidence in God's faithfulness as righteousness, even though Abraham in himself was not a particularly righteous person.

Hebrews 11:17-19 further tells us that:


By faith Abraham, when God tested him, offered Isaac as a sacrifice. He who had embraced the promises was about to sacrifice his one and only son, even though God had said to him, “It is through Isaac that your offspring will be reckoned.” Abraham reasoned that God could even raise the dead, and so in a manner of speaking he did receive Isaac back from death.


Here, we learn a couple of things. First, God seemed to be contradicting himself by asking for the death of the very son through whom He had promised a lineage. Abraham considered these two seemingly contradictory thing and decided that come what may, God was true and faithful to His word, so he even considered that God woulld bring Isaac back to life. That is a radical thought.

You must remember that at this point in history, humanity have fallen away from the True God and had, by and large, become ignorant of His character and nature, following instead evil, bloody demonic spirits that did demand human blood. This was at the beginning of what might be though of as a re-revelation of God's nature and character to humankind. Perhaps this test was a good way of underscoring that Jehova God did not want and firmly rejected the practice of human blood sacrifice as that is how the story ends. When God stayed Abraham's hand, he made it clear that He actually did not want a human blood sacrifice, and he never asked for anything like that again. Actually, He forbade it.

Deut. 18:10 --


There shall not be found among you anyone who burns his son or his daughter as an offering,[a] anyone who practices divination or tells fortunes or interprets omens, or a sorcerer...


Leviticus 18:21 --


You shall not give any of your children to offer them to Molech, and so profane the name of your God: I am the Lord.


So, in answer to your question regarding if someone told me that "god" told them to sacrifice their child or do anything else contrary to what is revealed to be proper and pleasing to God in scripture, I'd ahve a long talk with that person and likely suggest psychological help.

There are a few tests that biblically should be passed when a person in the context of the Christian faith feels that God is speaking to or leading them.

First, what they fell they are being led to must always fall in line with what is revealed in scripture. Clearly, human blood sacrifices are not in keeping with what is revealed to us in scripture. If someone says they think that God said to kill another human, I'd point out that this is not in keeping with the full revelation of who God is and what he demands of us.

Second, such a "leading" must be submitted to the witness and judgment of the body of Christ, the church. Other members of the local body to which one belongs are apt to judge whether the "leading" is in character with God's word as well as in character wtih the one who is sensing the leading. If the body of believers and its leaders can see, for example, that a person's level of maturity is deficient for a task that he feels God is leading him to do, they church may say, No, you are not apt for that and you should not do that.

Thrid, there is the test of practicality. While I do see that sometimes God leads his servants into steps that may seem impractical, this, also, should be submitted to the church.

These things may not make much sense to you as they must be undertaken in an ecclesiastical context and it seems like you may not be familiar with such a context, but this is a part of the reason that the church exists, that we take care of one another, support one another, and help to balance one another.
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edit on 2023 5 26 by incoserv because: formatting error.



posted on May, 26 2023 @ 12:31 AM
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a reply to: incoserv

As to ...why would you believe someone who wrote down what they believed God said to them and not some random person off the street?, I am assuming that you make reference to the Bible. My simple answer (and, again, I do not expect you to have any grasp on what I'm talking about here), is that there are centuries and millenia of history that back up the context, origin and effect of the Scriptures. I see reason in them beyond human invention or comprehension.

It is by faith that I accept the scriptures, and that faith is not of myself, but is a gift from God. That faith, however, is not blind. There are many things that I see in the world and in the very scripture itself that convince me.

Romans 1:20 --

For his invisible attributes, namely, his eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly perceived, ever since the creation of the world, in the things that have been made.


Psalm 19:1-4 --


The heavens declare the glory of God,
and the sky above proclaims his handiwork.
Day to day pours out speech,
and night to night reveals knowledge.
There is no speech, nor are there words,
whose voice is not heard.
Their voice goes out through all the earth,
and their words to the end of the world.



posted on May, 26 2023 @ 12:39 AM
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a reply to: Timber13
Hi,

You would be absolutely correct with what you’re saying here, if God were some static entity locked in a book at the creation of of man, only to spring forth at some undisclosed time. Maybe

You cannot limit a supreme being. Gods will is his own.

So, maybe before God creates man, he decides he really doesn’t like how we turn out. But when you add them up over time there are those that he deeply loves, the good ones. So being able to do anything, he decides to go ahead with our creation and forget. Not completely. He’s around for the start, and maybe pops in now and then to tweak something here and there and pick up his messages. Along the way, he gives us a book he divinely inspires to guide us until he returns.But he will return at the end, and he’s going to be pissed. Maybe he just doesn’t know it yet.

Maybe he asks questions because he wants answers directly from someone out of curiosity because he doesn’t know the answers to questions he made him self forget.

You cannot know the mind of God, it’s not possible. We can get some ideas by what he left for us here though. Also you have to at least give The Supreme Being God Almighty, the ability to change his mind about things if he wants to.

My post is so simplistic it’s kinda funny, but it makes the point. Nothing is impossible for God. And all the information you need, either you have been told in the Book, or you will be told directly by him. You are asking your questions to the wrong people, why not ask directly? It’s a free call, but it can be hard to get thru sometimes due to the extremely high demand lately. He will get back to you when he has time, the whole universe thing and all.

Oh, ancient aliens? Who created them? Think about it! Many on here like to make things so complicated, it’s Not.

God doesn’t have to think the way we do, that’s a limit.



posted on May, 26 2023 @ 01:08 AM
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a reply to: DAVID64

To continue the subject brought up in the first reply, prophecy > fulfilment, here's a summary of a number of prophecies in the Bible that have already been fulfilled, and some prophecies at the end of the documentary that are yet to be fulfilled (but some of the signs are already there, which I will get into with another video after this documentary):











 
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