You are not supposed to work every minute of your shift

My thinking is completely different. As far back as I can remember I worked on various family members farms or helped my Great Gran with his store. The work ethic instilled was "work". Period. I got my 1st real job at 12.5 years old and there was never even a question of how much time was put into it. If I got paid for 8, 10, 12 or 15 hours then by God they were getting that many hours work. Anything less I felt was theft on my part and sinful.

I suppose it comes down to work ethics and morals.

a reply to: Moon68

Think of it that way. What you are paid for is not time, but performance. Nobody cares how much time you put in, the only that matters is what you deliver. The goal is to deliver the maximum amount throughout the working hours. Working every minute is not smart, as the last hours of the day, you will be tired and your speed drops drastically. A healthy balance between rest and work will the deliver the maximum results.

I remember, when I was younger I did a one-day work bite of helping carry construction materials to fifth floor. I did a break every 30-40 minutes, while others worked continously. During the first hours, I was behind, but by the end of the day, I had made the most trips upstairs. While the performance of other employees dropped drastically during the last hours, I was able to manage constant speed throughout the day without being slower during the last hours and in the end delivered the most.

Of course, it requires strong self-awareness, understanding of when to pause, but in the end the results speak for themselves.

a reply to: Cabin

But, if you are getting paid to work an 8 hour day and you only work for 6-7 of those hours, due to breaks and whatnot, would that not be stealing from the company?

Where I work, no matter how much you actually work during the day you get paid for the time you are here, not the other way around. But that is mainly the difference between hourly and salary pay. Hourly has to work every hour they are supposed to to get the same pay that the salary guy gets paid, no matter how long they are there as long as they get the work done.

I have never worked a salary based job in my life and I wouldn't want to. Yeah, sometimes you get to work as little as possibly if you still get the work done for the day and leave after 3 hours, but then another day you could be there for 12 hours and still only get paid the base of "8 hours" of work.

If I had an employee that was taking a 5-10 minute smoke break every hour, they would get fired. I'm not paying you to be here for 8-10 hours for you to only get 6-8 hours of work done because you want a smoke. My other employee who doesn't smoke, does not get those breaks, how is that fair to him?

originally posted by: Cabin
a reply to: Moon68

Think of it that way. What you are paid for is not time, but performance. Nobody cares how much time you put in, the only that matters is what you deliver. The goal is to deliver the maximum amount throughout the working hours. Working every minute is not smart, as the last hours of the day, you will be tired and your speed drops drastically. A healthy balance between rest and work will the deliver the maximum results.

I remember, when I was younger I did a one-day work bite of helping carry construction materials to fifth floor. I did a break every 30-40 minutes, while others worked continously. During the first hours, I was behind, but by the end of the day, I had made the most trips upstairs. While the performance of other employees dropped drastically during the last hours, I was able to manage constant speed throughout the day without being slower during the last hours and in the end delivered the most.

Of course, it requires strong self-awareness, understanding of when to pause, but in the end the results speak for themselves.

Once again I find myself at odds with your view. You are actually exchanging your time, knowledge and skills for money. Are there times one might need to stop and let their eyes rest a moment? Sure. I worked for several years over a microscope and had to stop for 20-30 seconds every hour or so to give my eyes a break. My point is that, at the end of the day, if you haven't delivered at least 8 hours worth of work but get paid for it, that's the same as stealing in my book.

How on earth can you get anything done, if you are taking a break every 20 minutes??
No, I don't believe that. I work for hours, then take a short break to have coffee or small lunch. Anything heavy makes me tired.
And I won't take a break until I get certain things done, then I feel ok with it.

originally posted by: Moon68

originally posted by: Cabin
a reply to: Moon68

Think of it that way. What you are paid for is not time, but performance. Nobody cares how much time you put in, the only that matters is what you deliver. The goal is to deliver the maximum amount throughout the working hours. Working every minute is not smart, as the last hours of the day, you will be tired and your speed drops drastically. A healthy balance between rest and work will the deliver the maximum results.

I remember, when I was younger I did a one-day work bite of helping carry construction materials to fifth floor. I did a break every 30-40 minutes, while others worked continously. During the first hours, I was behind, but by the end of the day, I had made the most trips upstairs. While the performance of other employees dropped drastically during the last hours, I was able to manage constant speed throughout the day without being slower during the last hours and in the end delivered the most.

Of course, it requires strong self-awareness, understanding of when to pause, but in the end the results speak for themselves.

Once again I find myself at odds with your view. You are actually exchanging your time, knowledge and skills for money. Are there times one might need to stop and let their eyes rest a moment? Sure. I worked for several years over a microscope and had to stop for 20-30 seconds every hour or so to give my eyes a break. My point is that, at the end of the day, if you haven't delivered at least 8 hours worth of work but get paid for it, that's the same as stealing in my book.

Absolutely - I would get the union payrolls done, along with all the deductions, and only then take a break.
Otherwise, my concentration would be broken.
But I've worked in various offices, and even as an office temp for a short time, and it's amazing how some bs their way through the day!

a reply to: Cabin

What you are paid for is not time, but performance. Nobody cares how much time you put in, the only that matters is what you deliver.

Yeah, work situations vary, and the physical activity can vary.

As a supervisor, sometimes I would "disappear" for a few minutes. The simple act of walking elsewhere cleared my mind, but what took place besides that was the surprise purchase and delivery of hot food to employees in a different work center ... employees who very much had a job that didn't allow them to get away from their work for a few minutes.

Talk about an easy way to boost employee morale.

Cheers

Guess the OP has left the thread?

Been some very nice replies to his thread and I would love to hear their take on them.

a reply to: PorkChop96

I replied on page 2.

I see most of the people are focusing on the 20 minute breaks. I am sorry. I might have exaggerated a bit (even though sometimes I can do even do one even every 10 min, but generally more like 30 min - 1 hour) and the goal of this thread was different, to focus on the micromanagement.

Breaks in my case do not necessarily mean breaks. The fact that I am not in the computer and am smoking, just walking around (my goal is getting 1 million steps every month) or in the kitchen does not mean I am not working. My job responsibilities entail a large amount of decisions and it is important for me to weigh all the options. For example, when I am smoking (I am heavy smoker), my mind is still on the problems and solutions. Technically, I can focus a lot longer, although I start to get cravings relatively soon and my eyes also get tired from speed-reading. In addition, half of my time or even more goes to meetings.

I do not spend more than 8 hours in the office, although majority of my free time is hazy area between work and personal life. During evenings, I do research on latest technologies, trends and research papers. In addition, I read a lot on leadership, psychology and business. I really do want to get the best out of my team without overloading them. That is my main goal - ensure that everybody performs, while happy and not stressed. The job is my passion and that is the reason, I have been constantly promoted.

Do not always believe what you see. The fact that somebody is not in computer, does not necessarily mean they are not working. There is a saying here : measure seven times, cut once. That is one of the philosophies, I have tried to teach. Think hard on all the possibilities and then make a decision/solution.

a reply to: Cabin

I’ve been a manager for 17 years, your style sounds like you don’t want to work. Some of us have things to get done.

Smoke break every 20 minutes? Point proven. My union employees get 10 minutes every 2 hours and a meal break every 4, nobody complains and we kick butt.

a reply to: Cabin

I get that not being at your computer doesn't always mean you aren't working, in my line of work there might be days I only log in to clock on and off the job.

Over all, I do agree that putting that sort of software is a little much. I get trying to squeeze every possible penny out of your profits but at the same time, people get breaks, people need to use the bathroom, people walk around (There are days I do just to keep awake). The sad reality of it is, is that there are the few who ruin it for the majority. There are the people like you who go to work every day and work their a$$ off for the company and get nothing for it, then there are the ones who show up late on the regular, find any excuse not to work or exploit every loophole they can find to not have to work. And they are the ones who mess it up for everyone. Every company I have ever been with has those employees and some places can't afford to fire them, but at the same time some can't afford to keep them but put it on everyone else to make up for their laziness/incompetence.

a reply to: PorkChop96

To be honest, I have never worked (besides some one-two day work bites when I was younger) as non-manager, except for internships. As new team was being built, I was appointed as manager straight after intership, where I impressed. Neither have I worked an hourly wage job.

When it comes to way of working, the rules are a bit different on C-level. You are not paid for your time, but for the results you deliver. A large part of my salary is dependent on company performance. I have over 250 employees under me (7 directly) and my goal is to maximise their performance and create a relaxed environment to bring out the best in everybody. Deadlines might be strict, but they are manageable and generally we add significant buffer to cover potential shortcomings, which means nobody needs to do overtime. If they want to take break, I do not mind. The only thing that matters to me is results and the personal growth of employees.

When I was a mid-level manager, I noticed that having a 30 minute ping pong after each lunch significantly improved the team morale and increased the results. No project got delayed and the average sprint performance was over 90%. In addition, employee turnover was extremely low. During the first 3 years, nobody left and after that the only leavers went for leadership positions in other companies. For years, we were the top-performing team in the company and that is the reason, I have been constantly promoted.

It might seem as if I am lazy, but the truth is far from it. As I said, most of my free time goes to work related self improvement or research, including weekends. I am generally available in Slack between 5 AM and 9 PM with short delays and everybody knows it. Even when smoking, I think of work or reply in Slack. I have not taken vacation in 2 years (currently have 4 months of paid vacation left. At least, it will be paid out, if I ever decide to leave)

If you are a cigarette or e-cig/vape smoker, then you are privileged to having a lot of breaks.

a reply to: Cabin

I have worked in a place for 30 years. I can say absolutely that productivity is up from when I first started. Staffing is down and we get more done with fewer people but they still want more done. I look at my managers like they're cretins when I'm told to get done faster. I'm at company desired work levels. I've been sorely tempted to say " No. This is as fast as we can go and if you want us to go faster then you are out of line. " What can they say?

a reply to: scraedtosleep

But I guess have fun living your life giving up your time to make some rich guy richer.
Because none of us knows how much time we have on earth.

I worked hard and was self employed for years, now I am half self employed. I know what hard work is and it pays off, if you want to. Nobody forces him to take the job.

That's my personal stance though, you know, there are makers and those that lack the initiative to make something out of their life. I am a maker.