Progressive Deception

originally posted by: namehere

wake up, both parties sold out to banks and corporations many years ago and all that wealth we've generated never went to us the American people, its all went to the pockets of corporations, banks and politicians. honestly if it wasn't for china the global economy would've collapsed in the 90's because the actions of American corporations, banks and politicians.

I read that book too, and it was actually in to 50s/60s... If it wasn't for capitalism China would still have 800 million in poverty. You bring up an interesting point in what America was doing in the 50 and 60s in other countries China is doing today.

DB

originally posted by: SecrettoSociety

I absolutely disagree with your tax ideas of today , because they are wrong.
Mitt Romney payed 14% in taxes last year .
Trump payed 16% in taxes etc etc .

So then change the way we do taxes. Have everyone pay 8% no matter what. I have asked time and time again, what is the cost to be an American. It seems for 50% of the country it is free, or they actually make money off the Government, but for Trump when they pulled one of his tax years he paid 37 million, and people like you scream its only 16%.

As to corporate tax, America is basically dead average, but when you push 5 to 9% state level corporate tax too, we are actually very high. Big Companies don't automatically pay zero or low taxes because they are big. A company like Amazon has basically had zero net profit for 20 years, this year they are pushing 348 million in net profit on 75 billion in sales. They do things like sell items with a loss to the tune of like 10 billion and other things to push their corporate taxes low. I'm not saying Amazon is good or bad, but they have a business model that allows them to take advantage.

a reply to: Xtrozero

We have the corporate tax argument over and over, and the very same people who don't like it when corporations take advantage of every available means of keeping their taxes low likely do the very same thing on their own taxes and think nothing of it.

originally posted by: ketsuko

We have the corporate tax argument over and over, and the very same people who don't like it when corporations take advantage of every available means of keeping their taxes low likely do the very same thing on their own taxes and think nothing of it.

I suggest they go into TurboTax and claim ZERO deductions, and then say...well I'm still not paying my share and write a check too to the IRS.

One interesting point is if the US pushes corporate taxes up then corporates leave and open their headquarters in Irland or other tax friendly countries.

a reply to: Xtrozero

It's not like there hasn't been a massive demonstration of what happens in hostile tax climates in states like California with companies packing up and leaving left and right.

It's almost like they're convinced companies might jump to another state but wouldn't dare leave the US or something.

originally posted by: tanstaafl

originally posted by: SecrettoSociety
a reply to: Blaine91555
I believe that racism is natural to animals & social Democracy is the only way to level it .

So you're in favor of laws to prevent rabbits from being racist against penguins?

Most blacks don’t want to live with whites .

So you're in favor of forcing Blacks to 'live with Whites'? What about forcing Whites to live with Blacks?

Also, I presume that you mean you want to force Blacks and Whites to live with each other in the same houses, not separate houses, because, you know, them living in separate houses is obviously racist, so needs to be socially Democratized.

We are all racist .

There obviously are still a few racists around, but they are few and far between. That said, we are all discriminatory in our beliefs, preferences and actions. That is called reality, and no amount of your insane 'social Democracy' can alter reality.

Your words are racist by nature. What you type & what you think are very different & I would put money on that fact .,

originally posted by: Ahabstar
a reply to: SecrettoSociety

Tax corporations 10,000%. Know who pays that tax? The consumer. So, if no one buys the product because it can’t compete, the corporation goes broke. People lose jobs and another over taxed company takes the hit because poor people don’t buy things unless they have to buy it, like food. And if they can’t afford food? You need more taxes to buy it for them.

By raising taxes on domestic production you effectively placed a tariff on yourself while encouraging imports. Weakening your economy and strengthening a country that might want to go to war with you one day. You are paying the enemy for the bullets used to eventually shoot you. Brilliant.

Meanwhile a thriving black market exists on circumvention items that zero tax is collected upon rather than a reasonable tax. Case in point, is there a medical or even recreational state that doesn’t have street level dealers to avoid the higher dispensary prices? Now what if that was coffee or syrup (Canada actually has a regulatory agency to control the price and supply of maple syrup)?

How did the heavy corporate tax of the 50s-80s & heavy tax of the wealthy create such a grand era that Trumpers want to return to in their MAGA cult conditioning ?
Capitalism/Consumerism is our enemy. It has created a throwaway society that spends money on useless junk from China .
When the middle class is NOT burdened with college debt , healthcare & health insurance, then they have more $$$ to stimulate the economy with

originally posted by: DBCowboy
a reply to: SecrettoSociety

I see threads like these occasionally and in my humble opinion, it is nothing more than a way to paint a favorable light on communism.

Nothing in your OP spoke of individual rights, the Constitution, or the freedoms to self-determine.

Im far far from communism & despise it .
Im 100% in favor of our Constitution & Bill of Rights , because they are the most equal & social decrees ever written. America has just not grown into them yet .
As long as corporations have the same rights as a citizen , there is no hope .
How is a Social Democracy even close to communism ?
Our founding fathers were extremely social in their shared burden & wealth system they created .
Problem is , corporations are more protected than us humans .

originally posted by: Blaine91555

originally posted by: SecrettoSociety

It is my observation/opinion that both parties are extremely racist , bigoted & white centric in their core foundations.

So you are basically saying that all White people are racist? Please explain why one form of hate is acceptable as opposed to another?

Then there are the Democrats who tax everyone into oblivion in order to pay for national healthcare & schooling . Yet what good are those if companies flee America for better tax havens...

...We need real organized labor in most work sectors, heavy tax on foreign sold goods , national healthcare, free basic college educations , affordable private insurance as supplemental & individual Federal retirements that follow the person .

All those things you want can only be funded if the middle class pays more in taxes. How can you be against high taxes and then want things that require raising taxes?

Does not calling oneself a "Social Democrat" mean that you are for a one-party state similar to say Cuba? Is Cuba the model you want to follow? Shared poverty and state controlled everything?

Im against high taxes & for fair taxes for all , including corporations. Our tax laws need to be 8 pages long with no loopholes for the wealthiest.

originally posted by: Xtrozero

originally posted by: SecrettoSociety

I absolutely disagree with your tax ideas of today , because they are wrong.
Mitt Romney payed 14% in taxes last year .
Trump payed 16% in taxes etc etc .

So then change the way we do taxes. Have everyone pay 8% no matter what. I have asked time and time again, what is the cost to be an American. It seems for 50% of the country it is free, or they actually make money off the Government, but for Trump when they pulled one of his tax years he paid 37 million, and people like you scream its only 16%.

As to corporate tax, America is basically dead average, but when you push 5 to 9% state level corporate tax too, we are actually very high. Big Companies don't automatically pay zero or low taxes because they are big. A company like Amazon has basically had zero net profit for 20 years, this year they are pushing 348 million in net profit on 75 billion in sales. They do things like sell items with a loss to the tune of like 10 billion and other things to push their corporate taxes low. I'm not saying Amazon is good or bad, but they have a business model that allows them to take advantage.

Every corporation sets up a business model based on criminal tax laws & codes they pay to have written into 12,000 page bills that get passed at midnight on Christmas Eve on Capital Hill .
37 million is 16% of what Trump makes .
My wife & I make 190 k a year combined. We pay 12% on 84,000 & 25% on 105,000 for a combined 37,000 in Federal taxes equalling 20% . Then there is State taxes . Combined we pay 30-38% in taxes .
Your pies are muddled up .

originally posted by: ketsuko
a reply to: Xtrozero

We have the corporate tax argument over and over, and the very same people who don't like it when corporations take advantage of every available means of keeping their taxes low likely do the very same thing on their own taxes and think nothing of it.

Corporate tax law has a million loopholes compared to individual tax laws . You really thought they are comparable ?

originally posted by: SecrettoSociety

37 million is 16% of what Trump makes .
My wife & I make 190 k a year combined. We pay 12% on 84,000 & 25% on 105,000 for a combined 37,000 in Federal taxes equalling 20% . Then there is State taxes . Combined we pay 30-38% in taxes .
Your pies are muddled up .

Ok, so I make 50k more than you and my total tax was just under 20k ( a little over 8%)... Am I a bad man?


He still paid 37 million overall in one year. He also employs 22,000+ people. Why can't you be more like Trump? Move to a state with no taxes like what I did... BTW how much over all taxes does Trump pay...who knows

Just think if every worker paid 37 million in taxes for one year that would be 5,550 trillion, I think others need to step up or shut up... I'm not envious of the rich but that seems to be what drives much of this.

originally posted by: SecrettoSociety
a reply to: tanstaafl
Your words are racist by nature. What you type & what you think are very different & I would put money on that fact .,

I'm guessing you are either drunk or english isn't your first language, as you are talking nonsense.

a reply to: SecrettoSociety

It's the same idea.

If you don't want corporations to have any loopholes or breaks or any ways to skirt through paying their full percentage, then you shouldn't be taking advantage of any means of doing so for yourself, either.

So ... do you?

originally posted by: SecrettoSociety
Im against high taxes & for fair taxes for all , including corporations. Our tax laws need to be 8 pages long with no loopholes for the wealthiest.

And the US still brings in over 4 trillion each year in taxes, so maybe taxes isn't the right conversation here, but ya 30,000-page tax code and an additional 85,000-armed IRS agents is not the answer.

Corporate gross profits are about 12 trillion per year, 8% is about 1 trillion and about 400 billion in taxes were paid last year
Income is like 22 trillion 8% is about 1.8 trillion and about 1.1 trillion in taxes were paid last year

Maybe it is how much we spend though that is the issue...lol

a reply to: SecrettoSociety

Im a Social Democrat who finds little use for the Democrats or Republicans, and Im confused as to how the progressive politicians keep pushing for woke everything ?
I would be extremely surprised if 5% of Democrats believe any of the woke s#it they pander to in their bases .

Because while yes the majority of democrats don't believe in the "woke agenda"; they do "want" to believe in it. They simply hold their own desires higher than that of the "woke agenda".

So when it comes time to vote; or virtue signal they are all about the "woke" but when the police impact them directly the Democrats get all NIMBY.

a reply to: SecrettoSociety

You have so many wrong ideas in that post it's not worth trying to talk about it further.

I am not MAGA by the way or a Republican or Democrat. I want nothing to do with either party. What I am is intelligent enough not to parrot others and to base my views on reality, not partisan or ideological crap.

Thanks for the conversation.

a reply to: SecrettoSociety

There was this super secret conflict over in Europe in the late 1930’s to mid 1940’s that pretty much destroyed all manufacturing. US didn’t really get hit. And had both men and women as trained and experienced laborers. The US was producing for the world until they got back on their feet in the mid 1960’s.

But by then, we were already exporting jobs to Japan and South Korea in the late 1970’s. As well as Taiwan and China.

The US was a net exporter until all we could export was jobs. Even today, help telephone help centers are in India via VOIP.

China entering the African and Central/South America markets will hedge the US out of future exports.

originally posted by: dandandat2

a reply to: SecrettoSociety

Im a Social Democrat who finds little use for the Democrats or Republicans, and Im confused as to how the progressive politicians keep pushing for woke everything ?
I would be extremely surprised if 5% of Democrats believe any of the woke s#it they pander to in their bases .

Because while yes the majority of democrats don't believe in the "woke agenda"; they do "want" to believe in it. They simply hold their own desires higher than that of the "woke agenda".

So when it comes time to vote; or virtue signal they are all about the "woke" but when the police impact them directly the Democrats get all NIMBY.

I agree it is about votes & optics , but they never deliver , because they know it is lunacy.
Just like Biden drilling in Alaska now ?
The environmentalists should be marching on DC over Ohio & now oil drilling in Alaska ?
The Republicans never deliver to their base either.
It is good cop bad cop skit on all of us .
Why do people with brains vote for any of them ?
Do you not tire of the ineptitude of the Republicans & kooks in the Democrat’s ranks .
Then there are the kookiest like MTG & AOC .