Thoughts on the Apocalypse. People will refuse to repent - mass formation psychosis.

a reply to: midicon

You can pity those of us with faith all you want, but it should be self-evident when you look around at society that when man is his own master, he does nothing but unspeakable evil thinking it good.

a reply to: midicon

I will have faith.

If you're right, my faith costs me nothing. I am simply wrong. If I am right, then it means everything, and you? Well ... that's between you and whatever comes next.

However, it's not my place to change your mind. My personal experiences won't mean anything to you.

a reply to: ketsuko

Pity was a poor choice of word. I used it probably because it was used in the comment I was replying to.

Man is his own master but he is a slave to his desires for the most part. Faith can move mountains but what we place our faith in can be good or bad.

Your explanation for how it happens is as good as any.

If they could convince the entire world that everyone was falling over dead from a plague, then it is much easier to convince them of upside down morality which has much less evident effects especially if all of society (or most of it) is following that ethos.

And when the time comes and God starts acting, the mind will effectively be closed on many. They will continue to scream for proof or maintain that God is evil which I think far more likely because God does not immediately prostrate Himself before them in their sin and give them everything they desire including surcease from their torment. Ironically, I am betting a good chunk of that torment will be self-imposed or imposed by others around them as well as it often is today.

"Make my life perfect!" Stop being an evil git and stop living among other evil gits. It's your own selfishness and miserable mindsets that create half your problem.

a reply to: ketsuko

If there is God, like you believe then I have nothing to fear. I am very kind out here in the 3d world.

originally posted by: midicon
a reply to: ketsuko

If there is God, like you believe then I have nothing to fear. I am very kind out here in the 3d world.

Part of the requirement is belief. You don't buy your way by works alone.

Now is there a mystery at work here? I can't say; it's above my paygrade, but the sheep will know their sheperd.

originally posted by: Peeple
a reply to: midicon

To me it's just logical, nothing in this universe just vanishes, if it does it vaporizes, changing it's form and substance, and rides on the burst of energy wave that gave birth to it.
The question is: do you believe your mind exists beyond your body?
Another chicken or egg problem: does your mind allow this clump of sqishy matter to live, or does your mind emerge from sqishy matter?

I don't know if my mind exists beyond my body. If it does I see no evidence of it. I think our identification with our inner dialogue gives rise to the feeling that we are somehow not the thing giving rise to the chat.

originally posted by: ketsuko

originally posted by: midicon
a reply to: ketsuko

If there is God, like you believe then I have nothing to fear. I am very kind out here in the 3d world.

Part of the requirement is belief. You don't buy your way by works alone.

Now is there a mystery at work here? I can't say; it's above my paygrade, but the sheep will know their sheperd.

I'm not buying anything, that would be a fool's game, self evidently so.

a reply to: Antimony

Yes, thank for clarifying my position. I don't go to church but I do have faith in a creator and redeemer. How we act in the everyday world is the truest expression of anyone's faith. I try to be empathetic and encouraging and live by example. I am far happier with myself than I was as a younger man without faith. That person was far too angry and self-destructive. So whatever it is I believe I am sure it is beneficial. Maybe that can help someone else find a rock to stand on which is why I try to relate my own experience. Formal religion? Few churches remain authentic sadly but that is not to deny their historical role that brought sweeping changes to European society. There are always abuses and excesses that can be trotted out but there were practical benefits often ignored; the rise in literacy, a moral code that built trust among community members and even advances in science (Galileo made his discoveries using a telescope given him by a Cardinal). Science and religion were not in opposition until very recently.

a reply to: midicon

Because it is one of those things: the closer you look the more 'diverse' the scenery gets.
The ultimate rabbit hole: the own mind.

Even if I would assume cells + electric current = mind that'd still leave me with lots of questions. What are the boundries in the micro and macro?
Because it seems obvious mind requires 'living matter'. What is the hallmark of life? Does life always imply mind?
Could it not be possible life is 'acting out of the recorded information' an organism has? Life & mind are the processing of that information.
But Information can be stored in many ways. And all of it needs a mind to process it.
Something that would appear supernatural at first, but is really just a taste of what the universe is.
There's a lot of recorded information in every atom, every photon, sound wave, etc. But it's a symphony not immediately playing for us, we're more like 3. violin in the 5. trench.

My 2 cents

originally posted by: ElGoobero
a reply to: FlyInTheOintment

outstanding job OP. today's society seems determined to be as anti-Christian as possible. the Bible warns of people who will not only do immoral acts, but encourage and celebrate others in doing so.

Isaiah 5:20 projects people who will call good evil, and vice versa. we see those all around us, not just on the fringe, but in positions of power, educators and media and many holding political office.

I fear that the world, not least the USA, is very close to judgment.

Probably 99.9% of the "Christians" I find on the internet are anti-Christ, total hypocrites who do not live by the doctrine. Specially those who speak of the "judgement day".

originally posted by: ltrz2025

originally posted by: ElGoobero
a reply to: FlyInTheOintment

outstanding job OP. today's society seems determined to be as anti-Christian as possible. the Bible warns of people who will not only do immoral acts, but encourage and celebrate others in doing so.

Isaiah 5:20 projects people who will call good evil, and vice versa. we see those all around us, not just on the fringe, but in positions of power, educators and media and many holding political office.

I fear that the world, not least the USA, is very close to judgment.

Probably 99.9% of the "Christians" I find on the internet are anti-Christ, total hypocrites who do not live by the doctrine. Specially those who speak of the "judgement day".

Judgment day is in the Bible. How can we not speak of it?

a reply to: Peeple

Thanks for the thoughtful reply.

It is a rabbit hole and all the side burrows lead to paradox,

originally posted by: ElGoobero

originally posted by: ltrz2025

originally posted by: ElGoobero
a reply to: FlyInTheOintment

outstanding job OP. today's society seems determined to be as anti-Christian as possible. the Bible warns of people who will not only do immoral acts, but encourage and celebrate others in doing so.

Isaiah 5:20 projects people who will call good evil, and vice versa. we see those all around us, not just on the fringe, but in positions of power, educators and media and many holding political office.

I fear that the world, not least the USA, is very close to judgment.

Probably 99.9% of the "Christians" I find on the internet are anti-Christ, total hypocrites who do not live by the doctrine. Specially those who speak of the "judgement day".

Judgment day is in the Bible. How can we not speak of it?

Jesus commanded: "Therefore do not worry about tomorrow, for tomorrow will worry about itself. Each day has enough trouble of its own," (Matthew 6:34).

originally posted by: ltrz2025

originally posted by: ElGoobero

originally posted by: ltrz2025

originally posted by: ElGoobero
a reply to: FlyInTheOintment

outstanding job OP. today's society seems determined to be as anti-Christian as possible. the Bible warns of people who will not only do immoral acts, but encourage and celebrate others in doing so.

Isaiah 5:20 projects people who will call good evil, and vice versa. we see those all around us, not just on the fringe, but in positions of power, educators and media and many holding political office.

I fear that the world, not least the USA, is very close to judgment.

Probably 99.9% of the "Christians" I find on the internet are anti-Christ, total hypocrites who do not live by the doctrine. Specially those who speak of the "judgement day".

Judgment day is in the Bible. How can we not speak of it?

Jesus commanded: "Therefore do not worry about tomorrow, for tomorrow will worry about itself. Each day has enough trouble of its own," (Matthew 6:34).

Jesus also told the parable of the wise and foolish virgins.

That scripture does not pertain to the topic but these do:

Matthew 24
24 Jesus left the temple and was walking away when his disciples came up to him to call his attention to its buildings. 2 “Do you see all these things?” he asked. “Truly I tell you, not one stone here will be left on another; every one will be thrown down.”

3 As Jesus was sitting on the Mount of Olives, the disciples came to him privately. “Tell us,” they said, “when will this happen, and what will be the sign of your coming and of the end of the age?”

4 Jesus answered: “Watch out that no one deceives you. 5 For many will come in my name, claiming, ‘I am the Messiah,’ and will deceive many. 6 You will hear of wars and rumors of wars, but see to it that you are not alarmed. Such things must happen, but the end is still to come. 7 Nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom. There will be famines and earthquakes in various places. 8 All these are the beginning of birth pains.

9 “Then you will be handed over to be persecuted and put to death, and you will be hated by all nations because of me. 10 At that time many will turn away from the faith and will betray and hate each other, 11 and many false prophets will appear and deceive many people. 12 Because of the increase of wickedness, the love of most will grow cold, 13 but the one who stands firm to the end will be saved. 14 And this gospel of the kingdom will be preached in the whole world as a testimony to all nations, and then the end will come.

15 “So when you see standing in the holy place ‘the abomination that causes desolation,’[a] spoken of through the prophet Daniel—let the reader understand— 16 then let those who are in Judea flee to the mountains. 17 Let no one on the housetop go down to take anything out of the house. 18 Let no one in the field go back to get their cloak. 19 How dreadful it will be in those days for pregnant women and nursing mothers! 20 Pray that your flight will not take place in winter or on the Sabbath. 21 For then there will be great distress, unequaled from the beginning of the world until now—and never to be equaled again.

22 “If those days had not been cut short, no one would survive, but for the sake of the elect those days will be shortened. 23 At that time if anyone says to you, ‘Look, here is the Messiah!’ or, ‘There he is!’ do not believe it. 24 For false messiahs and false prophets will appear and perform great signs and wonders to deceive, if possible, even the elect. 25 See, I have told you ahead of time.

26 “So if anyone tells you, ‘There he is, out in the wilderness,’ do not go out; or, ‘Here he is, in the inner rooms,’ do not believe it. 27 For as lightning that comes from the east is visible even in the west, so will be the coming of the Son of Man. 28 Wherever there is a carcass, there the vultures will gather.

29 “Immediately after the distress of those days

“‘the sun will be darkened,
and the moon will not give its light;
the stars will fall from the sky,
and the heavenly bodies will be shaken.’

30 “Then will appear the sign of the Son of Man in heaven. And then all the peoples of the earth[c] will mourn when they see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of heaven, with power and great glory.[d] 31 And he will send his angels with a loud trumpet call, and they will gather his elect from the four winds, from one end of the heavens to the other.

32 “Now learn this lesson from the fig tree: As soon as its twigs get tender and its leaves come out, you know that summer is near. 33 Even so, when you see all these things, you know that it[e] is near, right at the door. 34 Truly I tell you, this generation will certainly not pass away until all these things have happened. 35 Heaven and earth will pass away, but my words will never pass away.

The Day and Hour Unknown
36 “But about that day or hour no one knows, not even the angels in heaven, nor the Son,[f] but only the Father. 37 As it was in the days of Noah, so it will be at the coming of the Son of Man. 38 For in the days before the flood, people were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, up to the day Noah entered the ark; 39 and they knew nothing about what would happen until the flood came and took them all away. That is how it will be at the coming of the Son of Man. 40 Two men will be in the field; one will be taken and the other left. 41 Two women will be grinding with a hand mill; one will be taken and the other left.

42 “Therefore keep watch, because you do not know on what day your Lord will come. 43 But understand this: If the owner of the house had known at what time of night the thief was coming, he would have kept watch and would not have let his house be broken into. 44 So you also must be ready, because the Son of Man will come at an hour when you do not expect him.

45 “Who then is the faithful and wise servant, whom the master has put in charge of the servants in his household to give them their food at the proper time? 46 It will be good for that servant whose master finds him doing so when he returns. 47 Truly I tell you, he will put him in charge of all his possessions. 48 But suppose that servant is wicked and says to himself, ‘My master is staying away a long time,’ 49 and he then begins to beat his fellow servants and to eat and drink with drunkards. 50 The master of that servant will come on a day when he does not expect him and at an hour he is not aware of. 51 He will cut him to pieces and assign him a place with the hypocrites, where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.

a reply to: ltrz2025

"For they deliberately ignore this fact, that long ago there were heavens and an earth standing firmly out of water and in the midst of water by the word of God; and that by those means the world of that time suffered destruction when it was flooded with water. But by the same word the heavens and the earth that now exist are reserved for fire and are being kept until the day of judgment and of destruction of the ungodly people."-2 Peter 3:5-7.

originally posted by: ElGoobero

originally posted by: ltrz2025

originally posted by: ElGoobero
a reply to: FlyInTheOintment

outstanding job OP. today's society seems determined to be as anti-Christian as possible. the Bible warns of people who will not only do immoral acts, but encourage and celebrate others in doing so.

Isaiah 5:20 projects people who will call good evil, and vice versa. we see those all around us, not just on the fringe, but in positions of power, educators and media and many holding political office.

I fear that the world, not least the USA, is very close to judgment.

Probably 99.9% of the "Christians" I find on the internet are anti-Christ, total hypocrites who do not live by the doctrine. Specially those who speak of the "judgement day".

Judgment day is in the Bible. How can we not speak of it?

Many people do not realize this. But Judgement day lasts 1,000 years.

originally posted by: ketsuko

originally posted by: ltrz2025

originally posted by: ElGoobero

originally posted by: ltrz2025

originally posted by: ElGoobero
a reply to: FlyInTheOintment

outstanding job OP. today's society seems determined to be as anti-Christian as possible. the Bible warns of people who will not only do immoral acts, but encourage and celebrate others in doing so.

Isaiah 5:20 projects people who will call good evil, and vice versa. we see those all around us, not just on the fringe, but in positions of power, educators and media and many holding political office.

I fear that the world, not least the USA, is very close to judgment.

Probably 99.9% of the "Christians" I find on the internet are anti-Christ, total hypocrites who do not live by the doctrine. Specially those who speak of the "judgement day".

Judgment day is in the Bible. How can we not speak of it?

Jesus commanded: "Therefore do not worry about tomorrow, for tomorrow will worry about itself. Each day has enough trouble of its own," (Matthew 6:34).

Jesus also told the parable of the wise and foolish virgins.

Tell you to get your sheit together and be responsible on a daily basis doesn't mean that you have to worry about the future or anything else like a maniac, which is what the "Christian" apostates obsessed with the Book of Revelations do.

Moreover, they use this book to go around judging everything that crosses their path. Everything they don't like is the "mark of the beast", or "the sign of the end of times", or "the work of the devil", etc.. There is always a new "mark of the beast", like a couple a year. And they engage in all this judgement when Jesus clearly orders them to NOT judge anything or anyone. Again, these "Christians" are apostates.

BTW, millions of Christians around the world consider the Book of Revelations a satanic invention, since the Jesus in that Book comes with a sword, is chopping heads and bashing babies against rocks, which is contradictory with the Jesus of the Gospels, who demands you to love your enemies.

originally posted by: ltrz2025

originally posted by: ketsuko

originally posted by: ltrz2025

originally posted by: ElGoobero

originally posted by: ltrz2025

originally posted by: ElGoobero
a reply to: FlyInTheOintment

outstanding job OP. today's society seems determined to be as anti-Christian as possible. the Bible warns of people who will not only do immoral acts, but encourage and celebrate others in doing so.

Isaiah 5:20 projects people who will call good evil, and vice versa. we see those all around us, not just on the fringe, but in positions of power, educators and media and many holding political office.

I fear that the world, not least the USA, is very close to judgment.

Probably 99.9% of the "Christians" I find on the internet are anti-Christ, total hypocrites who do not live by the doctrine. Specially those who speak of the "judgement day".

Judgment day is in the Bible. How can we not speak of it?

Jesus commanded: "Therefore do not worry about tomorrow, for tomorrow will worry about itself. Each day has enough trouble of its own," (Matthew 6:34).

Jesus also told the parable of the wise and foolish virgins.

Tell you to get your sheit together and be responsible on a daily basis doesn't mean that you have to worry about the future or anything else like a maniac, which is what the "Christians" obsessed with the Book of Revelations do. Moreover, they use this book to go around judging everything that crosses its paths, when Jesus clearly orders them to NOT judge anything or anyone. Again, these are apostates.

BTW, millions of Christians around the world consider the Book of Revelations a satanic invention, since the Jesus there is chopping heads and bashing babies against rocks, which is contradictory with the Jesus of the Gospels, who demands you to love your enemies.

The apostle Peter said that people purposefully ignore what happened in Noah's day when he destroyed that world by a deluge because of it's wickedness:

"For they deliberately ignore this fact, that long ago there were heavens and an earth standing firmly out of water and in the midst of water by the word of God; 6 and that by those means the world of that time suffered destruction when it was flooded with water. 7 But by the same word the heavens and the earth that now exist are reserved for fire and are being kept until the day of judgment and of destruction of the ungodly people."-2 Peter 3:5-7.

And Jesus said that just as the days of Noah were so the days of the son of man would be. Those days were filled with violence, sexual immorality, and spiritism. Just as it is today.

It isn't that Christians run around worrying about Revelation. In fact Jesus gave the revelation to John to give Christians hope. And says that anyone reading in it and observing its words are pronounced happy:

"Happy is the one who reads aloud and those who hear the words of this prophecy and who observe the things written in it, for the appointed time is near."-Revelation 1:3.