It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.

Please white-list or disable in your ad-blocking tool.

Thank you.


Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.


The Case for Roswell: Part III (Section C)

page: 1
<<   2 >>

log in


posted on Apr, 7 2005 @ 12:15 PM

The Timeline of Events
Section C

Part I can be seen here:
Part II can be seen here:
Part III, Section A can be seen here:
Part III, Section B can be seen here:

Again, fair warning that this is going to be a long read…but I wanted to be very thorough. I’d highly recommend reading the first parts before going on, as there is no recapping here…
This section covers July 6th. I apologize for how long it’s been since continuing, but simply couldn’t be helped.

Sunday, July 6, 1947

Brazel gets up early, completes his chores, and then drives into Roswell, about seventy-five miles away He stops at the office of Sheriff George A. Wilcox. Contrary to published reports, Wilcox is excited about the find and suggests the military at the Roswell Army Air Field be notified.

At 11:30 A.M. Dennis finally locates his friend, the nurse, who agrees to meet him for lunch. He drives out to the base to meet her at the officers' club. (From his affidavit…I’ll do this (repost portions) as we get to the events as they occur in such affidavits) [Note, in section C, I had mistakenly included this part as well not just the 5th, but couldn’t edit it afterwards due to time lapsed.]

(10) The next day [Sunday, July 6th], I tried to call the nurse to see what was going on. About 11:00 AM, she called the funeral home and said, "I need to talk to you." We agreed to meet at the officers club. She was very upset. She said, "Before I talk to you, you have to give me a sacred oath that you will never mention my name, because I could get into a lot of trouble." I agreed. [Later said to be identified as Naomi Self, but this seems impossible to verify with military records…not surprising as many 1947 records from Roswell were destroyed, or reported as destroyed, but we’ll go into that later…]

(11) She said she had gone to get supplies in a room where two doctors were performing a preliminary autopsy. The doctors said they needed her to take notes during the procedure. She said she had never smelled anything so horrible in her life, and the sight was the most gruesome she had ever seen. She said, "This was something no one has ever seen." As she spoke, I was concerned that she might go into shock.

(12) She drew me a diagram of the bodies, including an arm with a hand that had only four fingers; the doctors noted that on the end of the fingers were little pads resembling suction cups. She said the head was disproportionately large for the body; the eyes were deeply set; the skulls were flexible; the nose was concave with only two orifices; the mouth was a fine slit, and the doctors said there was heavy cartilage instead of teeth. The ears were only small orifices with flaps. They had no hair, and the skin was black--perhaps due to exposure in the sun. She gave me the drawings.

[EDIT: Drawing included with Dennis' affidavit by artist Walter Henn, based on Dennis' recollections of drawings originally made by the alleged Roswell nurse.]

(13) There were three bodies; two were very mangled and dismembered, as if destroyed by predators; one was fairly intact. They were three-and-a-half to four feet tall. She told me the doctors said: "This isn't anything we've ever see before; there's nothing in the medical textbooks like this." She said she and the doctors became ill. They had to turn off the air conditioning and were afraid the smell would go through the hospital. They had to move the operation to an airplane hangar. I drove her back to the officers' barracks.

This nurse’s name has been a source of scorn for both skeptics and researchers alike. It was finally stated that the nurse’s name was Naomi Maria Self, but records cannot confirm this name as being genuine. Dennis himself has claimed that name was a false one, given to protect her identity. While this of course is a point of contention, it should be noted that any townsperson interviewed at the time held Glenn Dennis as an honest and honorable man, above reproach. Many of Dennis’ details can be corroborated with other witness interviews (and all of this before the books were written, so individual witnesses would not have known others’ accounts), so I tend to agree with the townspeople’s assessment of Glenn Dennis.

Continuing with the timeline, while waiting for the military officers to arrive, Sheriff Wilcox dispatches two of his deputies to the ranch. They have only the directions given by Brazel, but both men are familiar with the territory; and Wilcox believes they will be able to find the debris field.

William Woody and his father try to drive out toward the area where they'd seen the object coming down, but the roads are blocked. The side roads off Highway 285, from Vaughn and to the west, are guarded by military police who allow no one to pass. (From his affidavit)

(8) My father knew the territory, all its roads, and many of the people very well, so two or three days later (definitely not the next day), he decided to look for the object. He took me with him in our old flatbed truck. We headed north through Roswell on U.S. 285. About 19 miles north of town, where the highway crosses the Macho Draw, we saw at least one uniformed soldier stationed beside the road. As we drove along, we saw more sentries and Army vehicles. They were stationed at all places -- ranch roads, crossroads, etc.--where there was access to leave the highway and drive east or west, and they were armed, some with rifles, others with sidearms. I do not remember seeing any military activity on the ranchland beyond the highway right of way.

(9) We stopped at one sentry post, and my father asked a soldier what was going on. The soldier, who's attitude was very nice, just said his orders were not to let anyone leave 285 and go into the countryside.

(10) As we drove north, we saw that the Corona road (State 247), which runs west from Highway 285, was blocked by soldiers. We went on as far as Ramon, about nine miles north of the 247 intersection. There were sentries there, too. At Ramon we turned around and head south and home.

(11) I remember my father saying he thought the Army was looking for something it had tracked on its way down. He may have gotten this from the soldier he spoke with during our drive up 285, but I am not sure.

The next events are pretty much reported accurately regardless of which timelines one references. This is corroborated in both interviews and affidavits from Marcel and other witnesses involved. Since we’re touching on Marcel again, I thought I’d show an evaluation of his performance by his superiors, a year after the Roswell incident. Since skeptics often portray Marcel as some kind of bungler, it simply isn’t supported by the evidence. He was considered an excellent officer.

One such timeline can be found here, though I’ve referenced many to verify and then corroborate with other sources, another timeline mentioned earlier in this series is the NICAP timeline (linked to earlier)

Colonel William Blanchard, commanding officer of the 509th Bomb Group, orders Jesse A. Marcel, the air intelligence officer, to investigate. Marcel immediately drives to the sheriff's office. Marcel interviews Brazel, examines the pieces of the material that Brazel brought in, and decides he had better visit the ranch to examine the field for himself.

Marcel, taking some of the debris with him, returns to the base and reports to Blanchard what he has seen. Blanchard, convinced that he is in possession of something highly unusual, perhaps Soviet, alerts the next higher headquarters. No one mentions any type of balloon.

Marcel returns to the sheriff's office with the senior counterintelligence agent assigned to the base, Captain Sheridan Cavitt. They escort Brazel back to his ranch and examine the debris field.

Acting on orders from Major General Clements McMullen, deputy commander of the Strategic Air Command, Blanchard obtains, from the sheriff's office, more of the debris. It is sealed in a courier pouch and loaded on an airplane to be flown on to the Fort Worth Army Air Field, where it is given to Colonel Thomas DuBose for transport on to Washington, D.C.

In some interviews Dubose also spoke of an earlier, highly secret shipment of debris ordered by Gen. McMullen (Deputy Commander of the Strategic Air Command) in Washington, to be sent by "colonel courier." According to Dubose, this debris traveled from Roswell to Fort Worth and was transferred to another plane, with the Fort Worth base commander, Col. Alvin Clark acting personally as the new courier, obviously attesting to the importance attached to this shipment. This was then flown to Washington and from there to the aeronautical labs at Wright Field for further analysis. (The story of this shipment is mentioned in Dubose's affidavit, but confused with the other events of July 8. In other interviews Dubose made it clear that this shipment took place several days before when he was first made aware of the discovery at Roswell.)

Dubose's story of this shipment is briefly alluded to in the Air Force report in their Attachment 32. But instead they attribute it to "crashed disc proponents" instead of one of their own generals.

After Marcel and Cavitt leave with Brazel, the two deputies return to say they did not find the debris field but observed a burned area in one of the pastures. There the sand has been turned to glass and blackened. It looks as if something circular has touched down.

At the Fort Worth Army Air Field, DuBose and Colonel Alan D. Clark, the base commander, meet the aircraft from Roswell. Clark receives the plastic bag with the debris and walks to the "command" B-26 to fly it to Washington, D.C., and General McMullen.

Because of the distance to the ranch over roads that are less than adequate, Brazel, Marcel, and Cavitt do not arrive until after dark. They stay at the "Hines" house (an old ranch house close to the debris field), eat cold beans, and wait for daylight. Marcel runs a Geiger counter over the large piece of wreckage Brazel has stored in the cattle shed. He detects no sign of radiation.

In the next day, Monday, July 7th, we’ll see the main recovery of the Brazel site, and even the first attempt of the press to break the story. Since we’ve already covered the debris, section D should also cover Tuesday the 8th, the day the story was released by the military and the press. Please be patient, I’ll try and have it for you soon!

Part III, Section D can be seen here:

[edit on 26-5-2005 by Gazrok]

posted on Apr, 7 2005 @ 01:47 PM
Nice work Gazrok. (I'll spare you the 'red flag' treatment or excessive posting comments.)

posted on Apr, 7 2005 @ 01:51 PM
All I can say is WOW! Great work. I don't have any real comments or questions because you pretty much covered them all. I look forward to Section D

posted on Apr, 7 2005 @ 02:13 PM

Nice work Gazrok. (I'll spare you the 'red flag' treatment or excessive posting comments.)

That's why I'm breaking it up, it was just too long with the next part also. Part D should be up next week and complete the timeline (barring a Part E for length). Then, Part IV will be kind of the aftermath of it all, things that happened connected to Roswell, how the story came out, etc.

posted on Apr, 7 2005 @ 05:34 PM
Hey Gazrok, this is probably not a nice thing to ask, despite all the rules, i'm asking it for a respect and rights purpose. So do you mind if I post your research in another forum? I'm portuguese, and I'll post it, if allowed, in a portuguese forum. I will certainly advise the forum members for the copyright and refer to you, but they won't make any trouble.
It's just 'cause they are not allowed to enter this forum, being not registered.
I just thought they might be interested, and I wouldn't do it without your permission. If you don't want to, very well, no hard feelings!

Oh, by the way: great work!!

posted on Apr, 7 2005 @ 07:54 PM
It is amazing to me that some people still don't believe that something other than weather balloons crashed at roswell.

posted on Apr, 8 2005 @ 11:32 AM

It's just 'cause they are not allowed to enter this forum, being not registered.

One need not register to VIEW this forum and it's threads (registration is required only to POST), so I guess I'm a bit confused about the request. If language is an issue, I'd suggest a good web-translator program. One can be found here:

I'd simply refer them here really.

[edit on 8-4-2005 by Gazrok]

posted on Apr, 8 2005 @ 12:03 PM
My mistake Gazrok.
But I really thought that no viewing was allowed to non-members.
I personally prefer this way, now that is explained I'll post the links.
Language is no barrier, so there's no problem.

posted on Apr, 8 2005 @ 12:31 PM
You're welcome...

BTW, that free translator link is one of the best I've found, so I highly recommend it to anyone for a variety of purposes...

posted on Apr, 8 2005 @ 05:43 PM
Gaz, W O W!!! Very interesting piece of work you put together! Ummmm, now I am feeling VERY silly about some of my recent posts.......

Glad YOU exist!!

Thanks for sharing.

posted on Apr, 8 2005 @ 06:17 PM
Thanks for putting so much effort in your threads, excellent work.

Even though you don't have the title, your clearly the SME on the aliens and UFO forum. I'de give you a way above, but I guess you can't for Mods. Have you ever won an award before you were a mod?

posted on Apr, 9 2005 @ 03:27 PM

Even though you don't have the title, your clearly the SME on the aliens and UFO forum. I'de give you a way above, but I guess you can't for Mods. Have you ever won an award before you were a mod?

Thanks... Title or no, I hope anyone feels free to contact me on anything regarding the subject, just as you would an FSME... As for awards...yeah, I got a few, hehe...always nice to get recognition, but even without them, just happy to share putting 2 and 2 together....
(and nope, can't vote for mods, nor can we vote (might show favoritism)...we can't even applaud each other, hehe....)

posted on Apr, 13 2005 @ 12:29 PM
just thought i'd add this little piece of info i found on -- a reply to an inquiry letter regarding roswell...

the interesting sentence in the letter states:

"Thank you for your letter about UFOs and the July 1947 incident that happened in Roswell, New Mexico. After looking into this matter, I have found that the debris from that is still being analyzed and is not open to the public at this time."

posted on Apr, 13 2005 @ 01:54 PM
That's actually pretty funny. Of course, they could simply be talking about their "balloon" debris, but it's odd that neoprene, balsa wood, and tin foil would be kept out of the public eye, isn't it???

posted on Apr, 13 2005 @ 02:14 PM
exactly....and why would they have to "analyze" balsa wood, neoprene, and tin foil?

looking forward to your next section, gaz.

posted on Apr, 14 2005 @ 10:10 AM
As an aside, I saw an older (well, circa 1997 I think) UFO documentary the other night on one of the education channels. It was the one where they highlighted the Popular Mechanics article that claimed that the daily blotter for the base showed no unusual activity...
as if it would. Oddly though, it doesn't even show the flights that are FACTS reported by news and the military though either...

Anyhow, this documentary shows footage of them supposedly opening actual archive crates showing Mogul debris. What they DON'T mention in the doc though, is WHY the Mogul reflector shown does NOT have tape with little designs on it (largely used by skeptics to dismiss the heiroglyphs described by witnesses). It was plain tape.
No doubt, just as "dummy" as the blotter (which contradicts the military's own facts on what the activity was for that day...)

posted on Apr, 14 2005 @ 11:04 AM
oh, how i HATE that documentary...if i remember correctly, its the one where they find that "long-lost" triangular crate with the mogul debris in it. one of the many things that struck me as odd about it was how PRISTINE that "debris" was -- when looking at it, i kept thinking, "THIS is the 'crashed' material they found?"

posted on Apr, 14 2005 @ 11:46 AM
That's the one...

EDIT: Part III Section D, is now up!

[edit on 14-4-2005 by Gazrok]

posted on Apr, 15 2005 @ 04:50 PM
Was the name "Naomi Maria Self" given by Dennis to protect her identity? Because I remember a witness who also mentioned that he has heard before about a nurse named Naomi Self.

posted on Apr, 15 2005 @ 08:55 PM

Was the name "Naomi Maria Self" given by Dennis to protect her identity? Because I remember a witness who also mentioned that he has heard before about a nurse named Naomi Self.

You are correct. Not much to support it though (so it wasn't included), was a military enlisted man (he just remembered her last name was "Self", didn't know her first name as I recall). Wow, that's a pretty little known little tidbit, even with must have delved into this one a bit yourself...
I'll put it in my addendum thread.

Personnel records for the time are tricky. A fire years later in the records office (in CA I believe) destroyed quite a bit, even spawned a Project 1947 as I recall to try and get back some of the info. Dennis claims he gave the name to protect her identity though...and no records of a Naomi Self exist for the base. Then again, we already know that false explanations from the government are pretty much par for the course with Roswell and with UFOs in general, with admitted coverups already, and even lamer attempts at later coverups (i.e. such as dummies from High Dive, etc.)

new topics

top topics

<<   2 >>

log in