British Politics in Turmoil - Time for an Election ?

a reply to: gortex

Things may change way before Guy Fawkes night...

www.theguardian.com...

A group of senior MPs will meet on Monday to discuss the prime minister’s future, with some wanting her to resign within days and others saying she is now “in office but not in control”. Some are threatening to publicly call on Truss to stand down after the implosion of her tax-cutting programme.

Another MP said it “would be grotesque” to allow Truss to endure another appearance at prime minister’s questions in the Commons on Wednesday after a series of humiliating U-turns, the sacking of ally Kwasi Kwarteng and the abandonment of her economic prospectus.

Between 15 and 20 former ministers and other senior MPs have been invited to a “dinner of grown-ups”, convened by leading supporters of Rishi Sunak, to plan how and when to remove Truss and install Sunak and fellow leadership contender Penny Mordaunt as a unity pairing.

I suspect she's on the way to being brûlé!

a reply to: Encia22

“dinner of grown-ups”


It was an historically bad move electing truss the Tory faithful messed up bad in the face of the evidence that this would happen , the Nation must decide who leads this time.

In removing Johnson they destroyed their party , not sure if that's irony or tragedy.

If Truss is forced to resign, which she should - hell, it was one of the most ridiculous decisions ever known to even contemplate appointing her - then there can be no defence at all for not calling a General Election.
Not doing so would surely show just what an absolute joke our party political system is and how unfit-for-purpose it is.

I know lifelong and die hard Tory supporters who are saying enough is enough and that its time for a change.

originally posted by: gortex
a reply to: Encia22

“dinner of grown-ups”

Precisely, that's what prompted me to say brûlé... she's the main course.

originally posted by: Freeborn
If Truss is forced to resign, which she should - hell, it was one of the most ridiculous decisions ever known to even contemplate appointing her

Could she end up setting a new record for the shortest premiership?

en.wikipedia.org...

The shortest period in office is more confused, depending on the criteria. The shortest ever period was only two days, a record held by Lord Bath, from 10 to 12 February 1746, who was asked to form a government but was unable to find more than one person who would agree to serve in his cabinet. A satirist of the time wrote: "the minister to the astonishment of all wise men never transacted one rash thing; and, what is more marvellous, left as much money in the Treasury as he found in it." James Waldegrave, 2nd Earl Waldegrave was a prime minister for four days, from 8 to 12 June 1757. However, since neither of these Earls actually formed an effective government, there are other contenders for the record of shortest term of office among those who actually governed the country.

In November 1834, the Duke of Wellington declined to become Prime Minister in favour of Sir Robert Peel but formed a 'caretaker' administration for 25 days (17 November 1834 – 9 December 1834) while Peel returned from Europe. However, as a caretaker administration this might not necessarily be considered a term of office in its own right.

Therefore, of those with clear and effective terms, the prime minister with the shortest single one was Lord Rockingham, whose second term lasted 96 days from 27 March 1782 until his death on 1 July 1782. However, combined with his first term (13 July 1765 – 30 July 1766) his total time in office was 1 year and 113 days, which exceeds the total periods of several other prime ministers. (The Duke of Wellington had also served as Prime Minister between 1828 and 1830.)

Consequently, the prime minister with the total shortest period in office was George Canning, whose sole term lasted 119 days from 12 April 1827 until his death on 8 August 1827.

a reply to: Encia22

Just a few days ago I posted in another thread that I thought there was a real chance she will have the shortest tenure as Prime Minister in history.

Truss was a disastrous choice as PM, it was doomed to failure.

But it has revealed for everyone to see just how unfit-for-purpose our party political system is - it needs urgent and radical reform.
That a tiny minority of wealthy and self-serving Tory Party members can be in a position to impose such a person on the country is ridicu;ous.
But all we do is moan and then forget - smoking bay whingers - and do nothing.
We should demand change.

We need someone with a grand vision and long term plan to address all the UK's issues in a structured and cohesive manner, from the bottom up.
A modern day Attlee.

But in the absence of such a person I honestly think its time for a national government; time for people to put party politics and dreams of personal self-aggrandisement and glory aside and do what is best for this country and put the cares, concerns and well being of British people first and before those of big business and profit.

a reply to: Freeborn

A national government might not be a bad idea with the noises coming out of Scotland, get some actual devolution of economic autonomy on the go instead of the mario carts levelling up the Tories had on show. It's not like any of their ideas were ever original anyways ya know?

You guys are right, Truss never had a mandate, a GE is in order if they replace her and she was never up for the job. They had a week to whisper while parliament was closed... Stinks to high heaven doesn't it. I'm not keen on Labour either.

The Labour party sense a General Election is in the air.


The sooner the better.

Bye bye Chuckles !

a reply to: RAY1990

I don't trust Labour anymore; they took their core, traditional vote for granted then completely deserted and abandoned them.
Under Starmer they have some decent policies that I tend to agree with but they still pander far too much to special interest groups, the self-righteous, arrogant London based champagne socialist types and the woke agenda in general.

This country is crying out for someone to stand up and represent the ordinary, everyday Joe's who feel completely abandoned and ignored.
If anyone attempted to stand on a platform that put THEIR interests first above those of big business, wealthy elites, special interest groups, minority causes etc they would win in absolute landslide victory.

But as no-one seems to have the balls, sense of conviction or vision to do so I feel a National Government would be the best option for the UK at present.
Its time to set a side petty differences, out-dated and disproven political ideology, engrained party affiliation that serves no purpose and has no benefit and concentrate on doing what is right for the UK - the whole of the UK.

a reply to: Freeborn

A push for green energy could be a win/win for most which is probably the path labour would follow. That's huge investment across the board and would create loads of jobs, loads of loans... You get the picture. Probably about 5x the pricetag of what it would've been 4 years ago too.

We've got 2 national minimum wages. Which I'm fairly sure is a direct result of gentrification but maybe that's too long of a word for me to understand.

I'll hope but I won't hold my breath!

a reply to: RAY1990

We need massive investment in our infrastructure and a complete restructuring of our energy needs and supplies.

Its not hard;
This is where we are.
This is where we want to be.
Now how do we get there?

Break it down into manageable chunks, assign someone responsible for each part whilst ensuring alignment with the overall goal; OGSM.

It really isn't hard.

ETA.
But we need to be looking at education, NHS, the Benefit System, devolution of powers to ALL the regions, smashing the glass ceiling, our electoral and parliamentary processes and procedures, etcetera etcetera.

How do they get rid of her? They currently dont have a method under their rules to challenge her. Enough of them could threaten to go with a vote of no confidence, but that’s turkeys voting for thanksgiving/xmas. She could remove whips, threaten to dissolve parliament and call a general election. But if she had that backbone she wouldn’t be in this mess now. Plus they know they’d get hammered in a general election and I wouldn’t trust the Labour Party to organise a birthday party, which is a shame because part of having an effective government is having an effective opposition.

I think they limp on until she resigns and then the ones that take over move us towards joining the EU again. With a worse deal than before but at least they have their scapegoat back they can blame for all the ills. Even with a Labour government we’d be looking for a way back in.

It’s quite incredible that a party with such a massive majority has struggled to do anything.

I do agree that the current political system is broken, I think it’s always been broken it’s just that most of us can see behind the curtain and realise they are all alike.

a reply to: Tortuga

How do they get rid of her?

If they want to they'll find a way.

I just don't understand how she can remain in her position after sacking her Chancellor for announcing policies that she wanted implementing.
All through the leadership campaign she quite clearly stated that was what she was going to do.
Kwasi did what he was told by Truss.....and she sacks him?
It defies logic and it defies reason.

The Tories have been in power for far too long now; they are beginning to think they can play their petty games of party politics free from judgement by the British people.
What we have at present is a mockery, the ultimate shaming of an unfit-for-purpose party political system.

I think they limp on until she resigns.....

The longer she stays on the more it devalues and discredits her, the position she currently holds and the system she allegedly leads.

....and then the ones that take over move us towards joining the EU again.

We are not going to rejoin the EU, people need to forget that fanciful notion and concentrate on moving forwards instead of looking backwards.

It’s quite incredible that a party with such a massive majority has struggled to do anything.

And with little to no recriminations really.
Another shocking indictment of our current inept system.

Its been one calamity after another for years now....for the sake of clarity we need another General Election and a clear commitment to action and not just the usual political rhetoric, spin and bluster with zero accountability whatsoever.

A vote for 'None of the Above' and/or a National Government are as far as I can tell the only credible options.

a reply to: Tortuga

How do they get rid of her? They currently dont have a method under their rules to challenge her.

They could do what they did to get rid of Boris Johnson , resignations and a visit from Graham Brady , Chairman of the 1922 Committee , to tell her the game is up.

No support equals no leadership.

She will get destroyed at Wednesdays Prime Ministers Questions , I'm not convinced she will make it to the end of the month now.

a reply to: gortex

She is in effect a lame duck Prime Minister.....for all intent and purposes Jeremy Hunt is running the show now, a man who neither the electorate or the governing Party elected.
As such the government has no credibility, integrity and possibly even validity.

a reply to: Freeborn

for all intent and purposes Jeremy Hunt is running the show now

Agreed , and as much as I dislike Hunt it is a relief that there's an adult in the house now.

Albeit a hologram.

Tory MP Crispin Blunt has become the first to openly call for Truss to go.

He said "the game is up" for Ms Truss after just six weeks as prime minister as he does not believe she can survive the current crisis, which has seen weeks of economic turmoil after the mini-budget.

"I think the game is up and it's now a question as to how the succession is managed," he told Channel 4's Andrew Neil Show.

Asked how the party will get rid of her, the MP, who is standing down at the next election, said: "If there is such a weight of opinion in the parliamentary party that we have to have a change, then it will be effected.

"Exactly how it is done and exactly under what mechanism... but it will happen."
news.sky.com...

Truss, Starmer, Hunt etc. etc. we can cry all we want, cry for a change of PM, change of government. BUT, BUT, all the while we're crying the whole country is not being run properly and efficiently and ALL this posturing is killing the country. Too much bluster and not enough action.

Interview with Crispin Blunt.

Former minister Crispin Blunt MP told Sky News it was “blindingly obvious” prime minister Liz Truss had to stand down following the disastrous mini-budget

He said many of his colleagues felt the same but were not willing to go public yet.

Mr Blunt said the public looked at Ms Truss with “a mixture of pity and contempt”.

Rishi Sunak was on obvious replacement, he added.

Following the interview, two more MPs came out against Truss.

The two adding their call to stand down are Tory MP Andrew Bridgen and Jamie Wallis MP.

Tomorrow should be interesting.

originally posted by: Freeborn
a reply to: Tortuga

We are not going to rejoin the EU, people need to forget that fanciful notion and concentrate on moving forwards instead of looking backwards.
.

You don’t need to convince me, but there are enough politicians who are itching to get back to that pile of #e and unfortunately I think they will move us back in. I hope it doesn’t happen.

Supporters believe the Prime Minister cannot be challenged due to party rules which mean there cannot be another leadership vote for another 12 months. But in a further blow, the treasurer of the powerful 1922 Committee of Tory backbenchers suggested a vote could still be held, if the committee's top table believed there was an overwhelming demand for one. He told the BBC: 'Of course we have the power to change the rules.'