Families of Flight 800 victims file suit.

Its pretty hard for several different people to all say they saw something like a missle contrail.

Then ontop of the strangeness of the event. Then the actions of the FBI going after people really hard. Theres video evidence backing these observations from witnesses.

It would be very unusual for all those coincidences to occur and it just be coincidences. It has the hallmarks of people lying and ....the governments have a reputation of doing that because....they do secret things and even by trying to tell people, thats considered worse than the secret thing they're doing......

Thats not normal and normal people dont think like "the government".

Here is part of the story of a coast guard pilot, Major Fred Meyer, who was flying exercises on and around the island when 800 went down. Interestingly, this guy flew combat rescue in VietNam, so he knows what it looks like when an aircraft is hit with military ordnance.

So let's switch to the next slide... This is a drawing that I made. I did this drawing for Dave Hendrix - well over a year ago - he is a reporter for the Riverside, California Press Enterprise - I'll tell you about that later - As I looked out of the front of the aircraft scanning for the Cessna, I saw a streak of light - right there (points to diagram) - moving very rapidly from my left-center farther to my left. It was red-orange in color - it resembled the path of a shooting star that you would see at night. You just go out on a clear night - put your head back and if you're patient enough you are going to see meteors coming through the atmosphere - shooting stars. They move very rapidly - they leave a trail of light. That's exactly what it looked like except it was red-orange in color and I saw it in broad daylight and one does not see shooting stars in broad daylight. There was a break - where it stopped - and then for an instant I saw nothing - and then suddenly right there I saw an explosion - high velocity explosion - military ordnance! - looked like flak in the sky - and I've seen a lot of flak - ours and theirs. It was military ordnance! A second and a half to two seconds later - farther to the left but down - I saw a flash once again - high velocity explosion - brilliant white light - like the old fashioned flashbulbs that we used to get one picture out of it and then it was gone - brilliant white light. A second and a half to two seconds after that - farther to the left but even lower - I saw, but I'm not certain, either one or two nearly concentric detonations - da da (sic) - and from those detonations emanated this huge, slowly forming, low velocity explosion fireball. See this circle out here (indicating to diagram) - that's the size of the fireball. As we were flying over about my 2 o'clock position - the north west - the sun - the lower limb of the sun was just on the horizon. And if at that time I had held my hand out in front of me, I believe that the sun would have appeared to me at that point to have been about 4 fingers in diameter. If I turned to my 10 o'clock position to this fireball which was formed - it was 16 fingers in diameter. It was four times the size of the setting sun at that time. Of course it was much closer but it was huge - it filled the sky.

At that moment my co-pilot was the first to speak and he said - he's an experienced officer - coast guard helicopter pilot - former army helicopter pilot - now flies with the US Customs Office and is a weekend warrior with the Air Guard as I was - he said: "Is that pyro?". I said "No pyro I've ever seen, let's go take a look". I had never seen the aircraft - let me make that point. Also, let me make the point that when you fly a helicopter and you want to hear anytime past 25 years of age, you wear earplugs stuffed in your ears and you put the helmet sound suppressors over the top of them to protect your hearing. We hear nothing in that aircraft but the intercom and the radios. So I never heard any explosion or any noises associated with what I saw in the sky - totally silent.

Nvm

originally posted by: Bluntone22
Why would the navy test new anti aircraft missile systems in crowded commercial airspace?

Well now a new theory is needed to match the facts we think we know.


New theory

They had to kill someone on flight 800 (who was on that list that needed killing by the CIA with FBI playing wingman in the coverup?).

This story about an accident is a cover for the murder of a citizen.

Just a theory but the facts are strange, and it will have to be for a strange reason since the lie was so big.

originally posted by: Zaphod58
a reply to: MaxxAction

And yet, eyewitnesses have been insanely wrong at multiple crashes.

But rarely is it multiple locations that people see the same thing are they all wrong, and we all know that.

Play stupid games, and win stupid prizes applies to this incident.

I thought about how whiney the Iranians were for flying an airplane thru a war zone in a time of conflict they are instigating. They were probably victims given as martyrs for their family's sake that the Mullahs wouldn't stone them.


Who would fly thru a WW2 theater during that conflict and expect no issues with the enemy? I sure wouldn't test fate like that, and not many would at all.

originally posted by: AndyFromMichigan

originally posted by: MaxxAction
a reply to: Degradation33

The problem isn't the accident, it's the cover up, and the implications thereof. If they will do this, is there anything they won't do?? Based on all that has taken place since WWII, I think the answer is no.

I don't know if you're old enough to remember an incident that happened back in 1988. A US navy warship shot down an Iranian airliner in the Persian Gulf. Somebody on the ship panicked and thought they were being attacked, and fired without taking any steps to verify what the aircraft was.

Shamefully, the US Navy tried to insist that the civilian airliner was somehow at fault, and the media carried water for them for months before the US government finally accepted responsibility for the incident.

a reply to: thethinkingman

Just the fact that the FBI took over the investigation should indicate something was very very wrong with this scenario. There has never been any air disaster in the modern history where the NTSB was pushed out of the lead on the investigation.

guess this pic was real...

originally posted by: Zaphod58
a reply to: M5xaz

So lawsuits aren't really evidence of something else.

The OP specifically said that the lawsuit was the result of information that was produced from FOIA efforts. There was no claim whatsoever that the lawsuit itself was evidence of anything other than a lawsuit was filed.

Yes. It was 'an accident', though it was not the U.S. Navy. This latest 'Wrongful death' lawsuit, against the entire U.S. Government it seems, has not listed Mr. Teele as 'testifying', though he has made 'statements' on some internet posts, not under oath. There is no evidence that any naval vessels were adjacent Long Island and in W-105 at 8:30 pm. Actually the opposite is the case. A Navy P-3 out of Brunswick NAS, was heading down south to work with subs, as routine. The P- 3 was looking for subs and having neared W-105, the P-3 notified the Air Traffic controller that Whiskey 105 was 'cold', so, they were requesting directions from ATC to head farther South, to continue. This is a part of Public records. The only U.S. Government ship in that area was the CGC ADAK. Had the warning area been 'hot', the ADAK would have known this. Soon after the crash of TWA, the P-3 heard about it. The P-3's Commanding Officer LT OTT, turned the P-3 around and headed back towards Long Island, asking for clearance, and asked if there was anything they could do. So, No. The Navy did not 'run'. Now the FAA contacted the Adak about the crash. They also gave the Adak the heading towards the crash area. Now had the navy been out there, the ADAK would have called for navy assistance. As well, the P-3 would have called any Navy ships, but this did not occur because no naval ships were out there. Teele (In his story) says that they (The USS CARR) were still in the area for some time, after the crash, doing drills, as if nothing happened, even after being aware that the ship they were with; The USS LEYTE GULF (according to Teele) was the ship that fired TWO missiles that 'shot down TWA 800'. (Teele's own words) Those Two missiles certainly had to go out of their way to 'miss' the towed target, and head off in an entirely different direction, Towards Long Island and lock on to a commercial Jets Transponder code. Where any navy ship would have been, in W-105; as Telle said, that TWA 'fit the drill' just could not be. Teele says both ships Identifies the target, confirmed the target, and then locked on, as the GULF fired. But Teele says TWA 'fit the profile' for a Low-Slow- Flier'? and 'coming towards us'. TWA was over 21 miles away, heading east, and was in Climb mode and about 15,000 feet at over 400 mph. How does that fit a low -slow- flier? Now the Radar Graph that has been used by some Indy Investigators claims that selected surface targets were a flotilla of naval vessels. Not so. The DOD and DON at the request of Congress and by way of the SECNAV provided the list of ships and subs and where they were at 8:30 pm. The CARR and GULF are not on that List. and non of the radar targets said to have been navy, have never been confirmed. For all of the commercial jets transiting the area, and for all of the private planes out there, and boaters, and commercial ships and fishing trawlers, Not a One reported seeing any Navy ships. Now we do know that missiles were used, and seen, but the question is, who's missiles? Let me leave this post with this. During [Ray Lahr's] Successful lawsuit against the NTSB and the CIA, the DIA, the MDA, the NSA were also questioned by way of the FOIA, as additional 'defendants' . Having been very exhaustive, Ray and his Attorney John Clarke had every court process review certain aspects of the case, and then finally the NSA replied: that though the NSA was observing TWA that night, they were doing so with a system that monitors Foreign weapons....
Therefore, the NSA could not provide any 'classified' parts... The NSA really did not have to say anything. But you cant Un-ring that Bell!

As a Part of the FOIA, there are documents that were provided to Congress, by way of the SECNAV, and presented to Congress by then, [the] Department of Defense's General Counsel Judith A. Miller, and then Navy Information officer, Capt. Jack D. Punches, with the listing of all U.S NAVAL vessels, including submarines, that were operational at 8:30 pm that night. All naval vessels were well south of Long Island. There were no submarines in W-105. (This is a part of public record as provided by the FAA/ ATC at the time of the accident.)
There is no evidence that any naval vessels were adjacent Long Island and in W-105 at 8:30 pm. Actually the opposite is the case. A Navy P-3 out of Brunswick NAS, was heading down south to work with subs, as routine. The P- 3 was looking for subs and having neared W-105, the P-3 notified the Air Traffic controller that Whiskey 105 was 'cold', so, they were requesting directions from ATC to head farther South, to continue. (This is a part of Public records.) The only U.S. Government ship in that area was the CGC ADAK. Had the warning area been 'hot', the ADAK would have known this. Soon after the crash of TWA, the P-3 heard about it. The P-3's Commanding Officer LT OTT, turned the P-3 around and headed back towards Long Island, asking for clearance, and asked if there was anything they could do. So, No. The Navy did not 'run'. Now, the FAA contacted the Adak about the crash. They also gave the Adak the heading towards the crash area. Now had the navy been out there, the ADAK would have called for navy assistance. As well, the P-3 would have called any Navy ships, but this did not occur because no naval ships were out there. In this latest 'wrongful Death lawsuit, against the entire US government, it seems, such is based only upon the 'statements' made by the alleged 'whistle blower' William H. Teele, who claims there was a surface exercise. No submarines were in W-105, or firing weapons. This lawsuit can only 'properly' continue if the the whistle blower can provide bona-fides for the presence of the Navy in W-105. That is just a start.

Major Fred Meyers was Air National Guard.

So, having watched the video in 2023, it sounds like people are referring to THREE, not one, missiles. One that flew over, turned around, and hit the left wing that came from behind the houses, one that exploded on the right of the plane shot from the boat, and a third that was nearly vertical that separated the nose from the rest, leading to the explosion. i can understand 1 missile going astray (maybe) from a ship, but 3 before someone noticed??? The navy story doesn't make sense either. I think they were going to use this as a warm up for 9/11, a false flag that went wrong when too many saw what happened, over 200 people saying they saw three different missile. So they had to cover it all up fast.

originally posted by: Justoneman

originally posted by: Bluntone22
Why would the navy test new anti aircraft missile systems in crowded commercial airspace?

Well now a new theory is needed to match the facts we think we know.


New theory

They had to kill someone on flight 800 (who was on that list that needed killing by the CIA with FBI playing wingman in the coverup?).

This story about an accident is a cover for the murder of a citizen.

Just a theory but the facts are strange, and it will have to be for a strange reason since the lie was so big.

If we are gonna go that direction I have a candidate.... quite a few of the passengers were off duty TWA employees and then tourists and families. And then there's Charles H. Gray III...

Gray, Charles H. III, 47, president and chief operating officer of Midland Financial Group, Inc., of Little Rock, Ark. 

Here is the passenger list

www.washingtonpost.com...

Here's an archive link in case there's a paywall.

archive.is...

Disclaimer: i am not saying that my opinion is this was a targeted attack whatsoever. Just conspiracy theory talk.

The crash stopped the merger between Midland and Danielson Holding Corporation.

archive.is...

Charles H. Gray 3rd, president and chief operating officer of Midland; Danielson's president and chief executive, C. Kirk Rhein Jr., and William R. Story, president of Danielson's main operating insurance unit, all died aboard the Trans World Airlines Flight 800 last week.

They were bound for Paris for meetings with investors to rally support for an $85 million stock offering intended to help Danielson finance the Midland purchase.

a reply to: andy1972

Missiles don't "fly over and turn around". They don't have the energy or targeting systems to do that. They track a target by predicting where it will be and aiming at that point. They have a limited maneuverability capability, but not to do that. Eyewitness testimony in things like this are notorious for being incredibly wrong.

originally posted by: Zaphod58
a reply to: andy1972

Missiles don't "fly over and turn around". They don't have the energy or targeting systems to do that. They track a target by predicting where it will be and aiming at that point. They have a limited maneuverability capability, but not to do that. Eyewitness testimony in things like this are notorious for being incredibly wrong.

I think you'll find things like cruise missiles can turn corners as a car can....and SAM, which these probably were, are heat guided. What the witnesses saw were maybe various missiles at the same time giving the appearance that the missile had "turned around"

a reply to: andy1972

I believe you’ll find I know how missiles work. And a SAM that can reach that altitude is not a shoulder fired missile. Which means it comes from something big, like a ship based VLS, or a system rolled on to a ship, mounted on a truck. Those are radar guided, and while they can, and do turn, they don’t turn around and come back after missing a target. They generally will look for another target, and if they can’t find one they self destruct. There were a lot of other targets in that area, so the odds are that it would have locked on to one of them, and homed in on it.

If it was multiple missiles, it shows, again, that eyewitness testimony is unreliable. That’s something that has been shown far too many times in crash investigations. There was a crash in Russia where witnesses swore up and down that either the plane was on fire as it crashed, or as it started to go around it collided with a helicopter that flew mail into the area, and they both crashed. It turns out the pilot climbed into clouds, became disoriented and stalled the aircraft, and didn’t realize it until it was too late. The aircraft was intact at impact, not on fire, and no helicopter wreckage was ever found.

Been lots of people saying that for 25 years. It was obvious a ship-fired missile went up and then flight 800 exploded. We know who did it but need to learn why.

a reply to: Zaphod58

I have to agree with you Zap. I went to a seminar and the questions was asked "You are investigating the crash of an airplane. You have two witnesses. Witness1 has a private pilot's license and was a former military aircraft mechanic. Witness 2 is a waitress who knows nothing about aircraft. Who is the better witness?

All of us said Witness 1. We were told that we were wrong. Because Witness 1 has aviation experience, their testimony will be their interpretation of what they thought that they saw. This wouldn't be on purpose, the witness's experience and education would cause this automatically. Witness 2 will tell you what they did see.

If the Navy was doing a missile test, the missile wouldn't have a warhead. It would have punched a hole into the aircraft. The recovered wreckage showed that the damage came from inside the aircraft.

If it did have a warhead, it would be an annular one, that's standard on the Standard Missile. This is a bunch of Tungsten rods with their ends welded together. When it is detonated it throws a ring of fragments that tear into the target aircraft. There was no tear damage found, nor were there any tungsten fragments found.
en.wikipedia.org...

a reply to: JIMC5499

I followed this from the beginning and it always sounded like a missile to me. I'm generally not much of a conspiracy theorist because I have worked in national security and had knowledge of actual secrets. But the vast majority of what I was briefed on officially was stuff that I generally knew or had figure out beforehand or what was secret were the technical details. It is extremely hard to carryout a truly secret program or soccessfully engage in a coverup for a long period. Some of the most highly guarded programs like the National Reconnaissance Office were widely known of decades before they were offcially acknwledged to exist.

Any Navy operation would have had a range safety officer who would have never signed off on live fire anywhere close to the climbout path of thousands of aircraft departing New York's airports. To this day I do not rule out that flight 800 was brought down by a missile but if it was it was an accidental firing. I understand that is extremely unlikely but it is not impossible or unheard of.