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'No war in Europe,' leaders of Germany, France & Poland meet on Russia-Ukraine crisis

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posted on Feb, 9 2022 @ 11:25 AM
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originally posted by: Enduro
Joe can’t handle his own border . Millions of illegals already invaded USA , why would any other country take advice from him?



but France and Germany have the same immigration idealism. They have inspired the American left with this BS. Germany has wind turbines - we want them too. They are closing their nuclear power plants. We will too. They are playing the good and bad cop. Putin has to know they are all the same globalist idiotic fakes. He's a douchebag too tho. The diplomatic BS they have cooked with Chinese commies reads even more ridiculous



posted on Feb, 9 2022 @ 11:48 AM
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a reply to: putnam6

IMHO it can be subscribed to Trumps presidency. Both positive and negative. For one, PC wasn't that rampant but he eroded some no-go's away in foreign politics and my impression is, that adds to the boldness of the current administration, because it's actually a welcomed gift he left them.

They pointed the finger at him for acting out so often, now they lowered the bar and consciously or subconsciously behave similar but the media is on their side.

One thing has to be said clearly:

Since I follow German - US relationships -after 9/11 I grew into teenage age and was more invested into foreign politics and in general-, I have never seen such a bold and open move trying to further US agenda on Germany's cost.

I mean, for everyone involved just a little bit with the pipeline even if just following news, it is clear what the current US administration is trying to do here. It's an open "# you, vassal". And it does not even make any sense, the sanctions through the pipeline shutdown.

If it would even make a little sense I could see it is in real interest of the US but this is just political muscle play and pranking Russia but on cost of Germany / Europe. No conscience left about that and not even veiled speak. It's a open secret what the US admin is doing here.

Personal opinion:
Whenever I speak about countries it's mostly about governments that are mostly temporary (hopefully). I very much like the US and I would not inform myself so much and would not be invested here, if I would not have a heart for the US, the mindset and even considered taking steps towards settling over in a few years, after some visits and of course being top fit in all the laws and English language.

So don't take it personal, this isn't your country vs mine, I just call out the blatant middle finger your government gave Germany / Europe recently.



posted on Feb, 9 2022 @ 12:35 PM
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originally posted by: ThatDamnDuckAgain
I just would not have thought it does not even take 24h to prove you wrong.


Really? Guess you missed Putin basically saying everything Macron claims was wrong.


After meeting with Putin in Moscow on Monday, Macron traveled to Kyiv to meet with Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky. At a press conference in the Ukrainian capital on Tuesday, Macron said Putin told him that he "won't be initiating an escalation."

"I think it is important," Macron added.

But Kremlin spokesperson Dmitry Peskov in a phone call with reporters on Tuesday rejected the notion that Putin made any such pledges. "This is wrong in its essence. Moscow and Paris couldn't do any deals. It's simply impossible," Peskov said, per The Guardian.

"France is a leading country in the EU, France is a member of NATO, but Paris is not the leader there. In this bloc, a very different country is in charge," Peskov added. "So what deals can we talk about?"

Zelensky on Tuesday also expressed skepticism about Russia making verbal commitments to de-escalate.


Being that France, according to Putin, 'is not in charge' and another country is, who do you think he's referring to?



edit on 9-2-2022 by AugustusMasonicus because: dey terk er election



posted on Feb, 9 2022 @ 12:46 PM
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a reply to: AugustusMasonicus
France? Now you mix Germany / Scholz with France / Macron or what is your argument here?

What is your point? What of it or whatever you read into that now, the "politico speak" you yourself called it....

You can come back to me when Northstream2 is prevented from going online as a sanction to hurt Russia.

Before then, own up to it, you were simply wrong. Stop being so obtuse about it, you are not dumb, so don't act like it.



edit on 9.2.2022 by ThatDamnDuckAgain because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 9 2022 @ 12:50 PM
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originally posted by: AugustusMasonicus

originally posted by: ThatDamnDuckAgain
I just would not have thought it does not even take 24h to prove you wrong.


Really? Guess you missed Putin basically saying everything Macron claims was wrong.


After meeting with Putin in Moscow on Monday, Macron traveled to Kyiv to meet with Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky. At a press conference in the Ukrainian capital on Tuesday, Macron said Putin told him that he "won't be initiating an escalation."

"I think it is important," Macron added.

But Kremlin spokesperson Dmitry Peskov in a phone call with reporters on Tuesday rejected the notion that Putin made any such pledges. "This is wrong in its essence. Moscow and Paris couldn't do any deals. It's simply impossible," Peskov said, per The Guardian.

"France is a leading country in the EU, France is a member of NATO, but Paris is not the leader there. In this bloc, a very different country is in charge," Peskov added. "So what deals can we talk about?"

Zelensky on Tuesday also expressed skepticism about Russia making verbal commitments to de-escalate.


Being that France, according to Putin, 'is not in charge' and another country is, who do you think he's referring to?



Well FWIW that's just solid negotiating tactics but is Putin wrong? sounds to me like he is goading the US and Biden, not to mention the bonus of sowing distrust among the NATO members. I got nothing wrong with that, of course, I believe this is a European issue, not a US one. Especially if the leaders of 3 NATO nations of Europe decide to negotiate with Biden/US out of the loop.

I don't want Biden anywhere near this...let's see what Europe can do



posted on Feb, 9 2022 @ 12:51 PM
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originally posted by: ThatDamnDuckAgain
France? Now you mix Germany / Scholz with France / Macron or what is your argument here?


The three of them, Poland, France and Germany were in talks with Putin, did you not read the thread title or Original Post?

Putin basically said GFY and feels they don't have the authority to speak for NATO unless you think he meant Poland or Germany can speak for NATO while the French can't.


You can come back to me when Northstream2 is prevented from going online as a sanction to hurt Russia.


I never said it was going on or off, only that your politician did not definitively say it was off the table and that he was in complete agreement with the United States that it should remain as a negotiating tactic. Reading comprehension again. Seems like you enjoy making strawman arguments to battle with.



posted on Feb, 9 2022 @ 12:53 PM
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originally posted by: putnam6
Well FWIW that's just solid negotiating tactics but is Putin wrong?


I agree, it is and he isn't wrong. France isn't in charge. Poland isn't in charge. Germany isn't in charge.

He knows if he's going to get concessions it's coming from one place, the United States. I know some Europeans have a problem with that but TFB, that's the way the world works right now.



edit on 9-2-2022 by AugustusMasonicus because: dey terk er election



posted on Feb, 9 2022 @ 12:55 PM
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originally posted by: ThatDamnDuckAgain
a reply to: putnam6

IMHO it can be subscribed to Trumps presidency. Both positive and negative. For one, PC wasn't that rampant but he eroded some no-go's away in foreign politics and my impression is, that adds to the boldness of the current administration, because it's actually a welcomed gift he left them.

They pointed the finger at him for acting out so often, now they lowered the bar and consciously or subconsciously behave similar but the media is on their side.

One thing has to be said clearly:

Since I follow German - US relationships -after 9/11 I grew into teenage age and was more invested into foreign politics and in general-, I have never seen such a bold and open move trying to further US agenda on Germany's cost.

I mean, for everyone involved just a little bit with the pipeline even if just following news, it is clear what the current US administration is trying to do here. It's an open "# you, vassal". And it does not even make any sense, the sanctions through the pipeline shutdown.

If it would even make a little sense I could see it is in real interest of the US but this is just political muscle play and pranking Russia but on cost of Germany / Europe. No conscience left about that and not even veiled speak. It's a open secret what the US admin is doing here.

Personal opinion:
Whenever I speak about countries it's mostly about governments that are mostly temporary (hopefully). I very much like the US and I would not inform myself so much and would not be invested here, if I would not have a heart for the US, the mindset and even considered taking steps towards settling over in a few years, after some visits and of course being top fit in all the laws and English language.

So don't take it personal, this isn't your country vs mine, I just call out the blatant middle finger your government gave Germany / Europe recently.


No worries we are just discussing all of this, bottom line I agree this is a Europe issue, Id prefer all European diplomatic attempts be made till it's even brought to the US 's attention, we are a little bit handicapped at the moment.

FWIW Im thinking that's what Germany Poland and France figured out, basically we can handle this ourselves



posted on Feb, 9 2022 @ 01:08 PM
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a reply to: AugustusMasonicus
You can come back to me when Northstream2 is prevented from going online as a sanction to hurt Russia.

That was your argument and you are wrong, I told you you have no idea and you were smirk about it, tried to play semantics to somehow save face.

Don't try moving goal posts now because you had some time digging around in newspapers and think you found some weird angle to win this via semantics.



posted on Feb, 9 2022 @ 01:14 PM
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originally posted by: AugustusMasonicus

originally posted by: putnam6
Well FWIW that's just solid negotiating tactics but is Putin wrong?


I agree, it is and he isn't wrong. France isn't in charge. Poland isn't in charge. Germany isn't in charge.

He knows if he's going to get concessions it's coming from one place, the United States. I know some Europeans have a problem with that but TFB, that's the way the world works right now.




What concessions? did I miss it did Putin make a list of NATO concessions to keep the peace?

Honestly, I think perhaps the US in control could be the old paradigm, if that's the case it has its advantages too.

I mean if Europe doesn't want our involvement isn't that a good thing?



posted on Feb, 9 2022 @ 01:14 PM
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originally posted by: ThatDamnDuckAgain
You can come back to me when Northstream2 is prevented from going online as a sanction to hurt Russia.

That was your argument and you are wrong...


No, my comment was, and you can go back and pull it, that your politician did not say 'no', he said Germany and the United States were completely on the same page.



posted on Feb, 9 2022 @ 01:15 PM
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originally posted by: putnam6
What concessions? did I miss it did Putin make a list of NATO concessions to keep the peace?


Yes, he wanted assurances that Ukraine could never join NATO among others. He's posturing and I think he painted himself into a corner.



posted on Feb, 9 2022 @ 01:33 PM
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originally posted by: AugustusMasonicus

originally posted by: putnam6
What concessions? did I miss it did Putin make a list of NATO concessions to keep the peace?


Yes, he wanted assurances that Ukraine could never join NATO among others. He's posturing and I think he painted himself into a corner.


Okay, what's wrong with that, Ukraine will always have that rampant corruption aspect no matter who is in charge, it will take decades to burn out if ever.

it does bring up the broader point, isn't NATO fairly antiquated now, #2 does it really make a diff, if it's "free" corrupt possibly Nazi Ukraine or a Russian Ukraine? I don't even think Putin wants all of Ukraine or any of it for that matter. He just knows it's not stable now, and FWIW it's his country that has closer ethnic ties than any of the other countries involved.

Not saying we don't keep a close eye on it or anything but to go let's send troops and weapons immediately is a complete over-reaction


edit on 9-2-2022 by putnam6 because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 9 2022 @ 01:42 PM
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originally posted by: putnam6
Okay, what's wrong with that, Ukraine will always have that rampant corruption aspect no matter who is in charge, it will take decades to burn out if ever.


There's corruption with all NATO members, that really isn't a good metric for entry.


...it does bring up the broader point, isn't NATO fairly antiquated now, #2 does it really make a diff, if it's "free" corrupt possibly Nazi Ukraine or a Russian Ukraine? I don't even think Putin wants all of Ukraine or any of it for that matter. He just knows it's not stable now, and FWIW it's his country that has closer ethnic ties than any of the other countries involved.

Not saying we don't keep a close eye on it or anything but to go let's send troops and weapons immediately is a complete over-reaction


That's the same type of ambivalence that got us WW2, "It's just the German speaking part of the country, it's really no big deal". He's an authoritarian dictator and will only become more emboldened by acquiescing to his behavior and demands.




edit on 9-2-2022 by AugustusMasonicus because: dey terk er election



posted on Feb, 9 2022 @ 01:45 PM
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a reply to: putnam6
I haven't worked out where this meeting is taking place. Is it in Munich?



posted on Feb, 9 2022 @ 01:46 PM
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a reply to: AugustusMasonicus

And I said that's true he did not say "no" but at the same time they are not "completely on the same page". Newspaper disagree with you, local politicians are upset he did not take a clearer stance we are NOT on the same page, thus disagreeing with you again.

You kept playing semantics and tried to pound on this little detail being intentionally obtuse that you are still wrong. I gave the "he did not say no" to you from the beginning but you completely misinterpreted the situation, because you lack the insight locals have.

And besides that, all newspapers disagree with you on top of it. That's why I asked you if this is opposite day. You very clearly have no idea other than nitpicking on semantics.

Again: US and Germany are NOT on the same page, you can twist and bend like you want about it. Your personal impression is wrong. Stop trying to gaslight your way out of it by playing semantics, simply.



posted on Feb, 9 2022 @ 01:51 PM
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originally posted by: ThatDamnDuckAgain
And I said that's true he did not say "no" but at the same time they are not "completely on the same page".


Take it up with him, he said it and didn't offer any type of retraction.


Again: US and Germany are NOT on the same page...


Putin agrees, he doesn't want to deal with you, France or Poland, he wants to speak to who is running the bloc.



posted on Feb, 9 2022 @ 02:34 PM
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a reply to: putnam6

Yeah because the "peace in our times" phrase worked so well last time.

appeasement does not, and will never, work.



posted on Feb, 9 2022 @ 05:13 PM
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a reply to: putnam6



'No war in Europe'


Has anyone here actually seen the (surprisingly boring) movie called 'Wag the Dog'?

Every time people start questioning the government or wanting to retain their freedoms, the government makes something BIG happen, so the attention is diverted elsewhere.

They are introducing sneaky things under the table while the crowd looks elsewhere; the PTPB that controls the governments, is basically performing a sleight-of-hand after another, and people are not wising up.

Or are they?

These diversion tactics and techniques worked very well in the past, when people had basically only a few 'information sources', owned by the same people or at least people in cahoots with each other. When there's only one truth in the TV, and then something 'big happens', people forget the previous, 'smaller truth'.

However, we live in the age of informational freedom, where anyone can keep an eye on 200 different stories and events simultaneously thanks to the internet and the widespread, accepted constant information flow from sources too numerous to even list. People can now CHOOSE their information sources, they can keep track of multiple stories and how they evolve and develop, all on their own, without needing a newscaster to tell them what's going on in the world.

In the modern times, it almost seems like this kind of tactic shouldn't really work anymore.



posted on Feb, 9 2022 @ 06:10 PM
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originally posted by: Xcathdra
a reply to: putnam6

Yeah because the "peace in our times" phrase worked so well last time.

appeasement does not, and will never, work.



Yea this is exactly like Hitler and Neville Chamberlain when the UK as part of NATO and the superpowers had enough nukes to destroy the world 10 times over.



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