A No Knock Warrant Resulted In A Man's Death

a reply to: frogs453

There are very rare cases where I could see no knock warrants being a positive tool for law enforcement. However, the negatives far outweigh the positives I am afraid. So what I would like to see is no knock warrants being abolished.

a reply to: frogs453

It appears to show them announcing themselves as they are charging in

That's not "charging in," that's using a key to quietly and stealthily enter a residence like burglars, waking a person sleeping on the couch, and killing him as he arouses from slumber.

a reply to: frogs453

depends what its for


if its for drugs, just grab them when they are out and about.

if its for guns, same thing getting them when they are driving

i could go on....


there is ZERO reason to do no knock warrants they are dangerous for all involved and have been shown to get botched all the time at the cost of innocent lives and police lives.


a perp in a car is likely separated from any major fire power an innocents.


use swat and undercovers to surround them and just stop them one way or the other. Also they know its the police.

i feel for this young man


i think police and their implyed immunity should be taken away and that when lawsuits happen it comes out of the police pension funds not tax payers cash, we didn't kill anyone the cops did so why do we have to pay.

also cities need ALL civilian review boards with ZERO connections to the police to review these shootings and body cam footage released immediately


lastly no police office should be hiring veterans right after they get home, trust me when i say its a dangerous mix.


they are still stuck in the them and us mentality.


citizens as a whole are not the bad guys and should not be treated as such.

a reply to: noscopebacon

That is similar to the argument surrounding the Waco Branch Davidian fiasco.

The local Sheriff made the argument that the feds could have arrested David Koresh any Saturday morning because that was when he always went to the Post Office. The local authorities knew that, but the feds didn't care.

The feds preferred to have it all violent and televised.

a reply to: SirHardHarry

I should have worded it better, you are correct.

a reply to: Salander

also ruby ridge


if that didn't happen Oklahoma City may not have happened

they said they did it in retribution of the baby and mother killed by a FBI sniper that was also at Waco and is seen on FLIR shooting into the building

they found 300 winmag rounds in the shed he was in

he tried to clean up but missed one under the framing of the wall.


but those situations are a can of worms


police are out of control, and now with the militarization of police and thank god for cell phones these killers are being outed to the community and from time to time held to account for their actions.


ill tell you this now

if a cop kill someone in my family by 'mistake' i would gladly kill him and all involved and surrender to a news crew and smile to the die they executed me.


i have a long line of police and military current and past, but i don't trust a cop i don't know, period.

my older relitive who is a NYPD vice detective gave me and my dad these cards, they are get out of jail free cards.


two sets of rules, one for us normal civilians and one for thugs with guns.

what happened to the friendly cop on the beat that was loved by the town or neighborhood, don't get me wrong they exist but are rare these days

they are thought this us and them mentality and that the only thing that matters is that police get home at the end of the night, and that's not a police officers job. its to protect the community and serve the community.

every bad shoot is wiped away but the cops saying they were afraid, if they are so scared get a different job.

maybe they wouldnt have to be afraid if they treated us like human beings and not criminals, they are doing all this to them selves and it is only going to get worse and worse

where my brother lives if you score to high on an aptitude test your file is automatically tossed in the bin, they want followers and cowards not righteous men that follow the law;

a reply to: noscopebacon

I agree regarding Ruby Ridge, but one must remember that the Oklahoma City bombing was another inside job. McVeigh was rather like Oswald, a sort of patsy to put the blame on.

USAF General Partin found several locations inside the building that had explosives planted there too, point being that the fertilizer in the truck was not the only explosives that day.

a reply to: Salander

of course and the other bombs found and the illegal arms including tow anti tank missiles in the ATF offices right above the daycare and halted recues a few times for bomb squads to disarm and remove these large amounts of C4 and freaking anti tank missiles

a ANFo bomb could not do what happened to that building, period.

ANFO is a low order explosive and would need so much the FBI exponentially added more and more until they just said no comment.

it all goes back to Andres Strossmayer a know GRU asset and was in Elohim village with the alleged bombers, most of the people there were various agencies snitches, one woman who worked for the FBI(i think) even got a swastika tat

and don forget about thr leg in the rubble that was never ID'ed, how is that possible?

and the FLIR at Waco showing people shooting from the chopper during the so called cease fire.


then they burned them out with pyro charges and crushed people under tanks.


and people wonder why we think 9/11 was an inside job, i personally think Mossad and others had more to do with that than any Saudi.

Reminds me of something that happened in Detroit not too long ago. The police raided a house, and in the process accidentally killed a little girl who had been sleeping on the couch.

Oh yeah, I think it turned out to be the wrong house, too.

This isn't the first time someone has been killed in this situation.

No Knocks are getting innocents killed. One is too many, and it's gone beyond that number by quite a lot.

I think we need a SC rulings on this.

The No-Knock Warrant is criminal and unconstitutional

Bill Of Rights
Amendment 1V
The right of the people to be secure in their
persons, houses, papers, and effects, against
unreasonable searches and seizures, shall
not be violated, and no warrants shall issue,
but upon probable cause, supported by oath
or affirmation, and particularly describing
the place to be searched, and the persons or
things to be seized.

“Where rights secured by the Constitution are involved, there can be no rule making or legislation which would abrogate them.” – Miranda v. Arizona, 384 U.S. 436, 491.

Black’s law dictionary 4th edtion
ABROGATE. To annul, repeal, or destroy; to annul or repeal an order or rule issued by a subordinate authority; to repeal a former law by legislative act, or by usage.

The Constitution of the united States of America, Article VI, Cl 2, 3. “This Constitution, and the laws of the United States which shall be made in pursuance thereof;… shall be the supreme law of the land; and the judges in every state shall be bound thereby… The Senators and Representatives and members of the State legislature, and all executive and judicial officers of the United States and the several States, shall be bound thereby, anything in the Constitution or laws of any State to the contrary notwithstanding.”

To disregard Constitutional law, and to violate the same, creates a sure liability upon the one involved:

“State officers may be held personally liable for damages based upon actions taken in their official capacities.” Hafer v. Melo, 502 U.S. 21 (1991).

“Anyone entering into an arrangement with the government takes the risk of having accurately ascertained that he who purports to act for the government stays within the bounds of his authority, even though the agent himself may be unaware of limitations upon his authority.” The United States Supreme Court, Federal Crop Ins. Corp, v. Merrill, 332 US 380-388 L1947)

All government officials and agencies, including all State legislatures, are bound by the Constitution and must NOT create any defacto laws which counter the Constitution:

The Oath of office is a quid pro quo contract cf [U.S. Const. Art. 6, Clauses 2 and 3, Davis Vs. Lawyers Surety Corporation., 459 S.W. 2nd. 655, 657., Tex. Civ. App.] in which clerks, officials, or officers of the government pledge to perform (Support and uphold the United States and state Constitutions) in return for substance (wages, perks, benefits). Proponents are subjected to the penalties and remedies for Breach of Contract, Conspiracy cf [Title 18 U.S.C., Sections 241, 242]. Treason under the Constitution at Article 3, Section 3., and Intrinsic Fraud cf [Auerbach v Samuels, 10 Utah 2nd. 152, 349 P. 2nd. 1112,1114. Alleghany Corp v Kirby., D.C.N.Y. 218 F. Supp. 164, 183., and Keeton Packing Co. v State., 437 S.W. 20, 28]. Refusing to live by their oath places them in direct violation of their oath, in every case. Violating their oath is not just cause for immediate dismissal and removal from office, it is a federal crime. Federal law regulating oath of office by government officials is divided into four parts along with an executive order which further defines the law for purposes of enforcement. 5 U.S.C. 3331, provides the text of the actual oath of office members of Congress are required to take before assuming office. 5 U.S.C. 3333 requires members of Congress sign an affidavit that they have taken the oath of office required by 5 U.S.C. 3331 and have not or will not violate that oath of office during their tenure of office as defined by the third part of the law, 5 U.S.C. 7311 which explicitly makes it a federal criminal offense (and a violation of oath of office) for anyone employed in the United States Government (including members of Congress) to “advocate the overthrow of our constitutional form of government”

All those in government today who took a oath of office and have violated that oath in any way is a federal criminal and should be fired right away and charged with treason and fraud and any other crimes you can find on them and all their assets seized. If your a congress man who voted for ANY unconstitutional law or have violated the constitution in any way that is not supporting the constitution and a violation of oath of office. If your the president and have broken the law or allowed any unconstitutional laws to stand and be enforced your a criminal and in violation of oath of office. If your a judge and you allow unconstitutional laws to be on the books or enforced your a criminal. If you are a police officer who enforces unconstitutional laws your a criminal too.

a reply to: frogs453

No knock warrants result in a lot of deaths. Its a rigged system and the cops know it.

Most people are under the impression, thanks to tv and movies, that cops have to announce their presence and show you a warrant before they enter your home. This, of course, in the absence of obvious probably cause. Because of that mistaken belief, when someone kicks their door in with no warning or identification, people react to defend themselves. For many that means using a firearm. Grab that gun and bang - you're dead. And you probably never knew who did it or why.

a reply to: Xtrozero

They ruled in 2006 that it was Constitutional. The Conservative Justices ruled in favor why the Liberal ones did not 5-4.

originally posted by: AugustusMasonicus

They ruled in 2006 that it was Constitutional. The Conservative Justices ruled in favor why the Liberal ones did not 5-4.

I wonder what the arguments were?

originally posted by: seagull
This isn't the first time someone has been killed in this situation.

No Knocks are getting innocents killed. One is too many, and it's gone beyond that number by quite a lot.

What is the old saying? Better to see 100 guilty go free than 1 innocent go to jail, or in this case killed.

originally posted by: Xtrozero
I wonder what the arguments were?

Hudson v. Michigan

Scalia basically says the Constitutional violation doesn't matter.

originally posted by: AugustusMasonicus

Hudson v. Michigan

Scalia basically says the Constitutional violation doesn't matter.

That was based on a "knock-and-announce rule" and not the no-knock as in this case. This argument was that the officers only waited about 5 seconds after knocking and announcing to enter through an unlocked door and that it was too short of time and so the defendant's right were violated.

I'm not sure how it can be applied to a no-knock enter. Also in this case they entered before they were allowed to do by state law.

originally posted by: Xtrozero
That was based on a "knock-and-announce rule" and not the no-knock as in this case.

It's the same thing, they announced in this case as well. Poorly, but they did.

originally posted by: AugustusMasonicus

originally posted by: Xtrozero
That was based on a "knock-and-announce rule" and not the no-knock as in this case.

It's the same thing, they announced in this case as well. Poorly, but they did.

I think it would be really nice if they covered the back doors and went up and knocked on the front door and waited a bit for an answer. If someone answers the door, show them a badge and a copy of the warrant.

That is the way it ought to be executed.

a reply to: butcherguy

I totally agree, I don't like the way these are being handled.