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A funny thing happend on the way to flattening the curve....

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posted on Nov, 17 2021 @ 07:54 AM
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originally posted by: AtomicKangaroo

Hmmm, pretty sure the Delta first came to Australia earlier than that. Around May 2021 I think, in Sydney, NSW. Yet amazingly no real kind of increase in cases for like 2 months or so....

Then you'd be wrong, first case was diagnosed in middle of June, and is a perfect timeline to start to see the spike exactly when we see it.

Your post seems to be about the vaccine, not lockdowns or mandates, so I will not muddy the waters by addressing those.

Your data and graphs show exactly what I said, the vaccine was amazing with the original strain, but with Delta it only helps a little with the spread of infection, where it really shines is protection against serious illness/death.



posted on Nov, 17 2021 @ 07:59 AM
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originally posted by: ScepticScot
a reply to: putnam6

I think what you will find is that the 'local skeptics' pointed our was what you were doing isn't how to measure if the vaccine is effective or not. As the text in red actually shows. Nothing about lab v real world data.


Sorry that you still don't understand that.



Well, explain to everybody else here as well... I purposely copied your exact quote

Honestly, I'm just flattered you are following me and giving me a distraction from my Mom's situation.

They are saying she has fluid around her heart and lungs, we don't know what is triggering this, 3 weeks ago she got her 2nd jab. It's probably just a coincidence, right? Like her doctor said "we will never know but it's possible.

He described it as the lining around her heart is like a balloon that has been inflated and deflated and now about 20% of it is sagging and weakened. Mostly around valve on top. But if her AFIB doesn't get under control, It's lessened but is still there they may have to shock it back into rhythm.

We asked I asked about do we get her booster in 6 months? He said we will cross that bridge when we get to it.

But yea knock yourself out, Ill keep posting your answers cause I do know if I ever want to have the pulse on America and Georgia SkepticScot will know the answer unequivocally.

So tell me oh wonderful soothsayer as now it has been determined your infinite wisdom and intellect on Covid across the globe and each individual state, province, and commonwealth.

WHAT SHOULD WE DO NEXT ?

because what I'm getting from this thread is considering it's lethality is still low, perhaps it would be better to wait for a vaccine that works on the variant that has been overwhelming the dominant strain since July.



nextstrain.org...

Even Fauci is saying the vaccinated need to worry... its the song that never ends

news.yahoo.com...




edit on 17-11-2021 by putnam6 because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 17 2021 @ 08:06 AM
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Bout the right time for flu season.



posted on Nov, 17 2021 @ 08:07 AM
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originally posted by: putnam6
Even Fauci is saying the vaccinated need to worry... its the song that never ends

news.yahoo.com...




That's because Fauci is a lying scumbag hack. No one should worry, we should live our lives and just be smart about it.



posted on Nov, 17 2021 @ 08:09 AM
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originally posted by: putnam6

originally posted by: ScepticScot
a reply to: putnam6

I think what you will find is that the 'local skeptics' pointed our was what you were doing isn't how to measure if the vaccine is effective or not. As the text in red actually shows. Nothing about lab v real world data.


Sorry that you still don't understand that.



Well, explain to everybody else here as well... I purposely copied your exact quote

Honestly, I'm just flattered you are following me and giving me a distraction from my Mom's situation.

They are saying she has fluid around her heart and lungs, we don't know what is triggering this, 3 weeks ago she got her 2nd jab. It's probably just a coincidence, right? Like her doctor said "we will never know but it's possible.

He described it as the lining around her heart is like a balloon that has been inflated and deflated and now about 20% of it is sagging and weakened. Mostly around valve on top. But if her AFIB doesn't get under control, It's lessened but is still there they may have to shock it back into rhythm.

We asked I asked about do we get her booster in 6 months? He said we will cross that bridge when we get to it.

But yea knock yourself out, Ill keep posting your answers cause I do know if I ever want to have the pulse on America and Georgia SkepticScot will know the answer unequivocally.

So tell me oh wonderful soothsayer as now it has been determined your infinite wisdom and intellect on Covid across the globe and each individual state, province, and commonwealth.

WHAT SHOULD WE DO NEXT ?

because what I'm getting from this thread is considering it's lethality is still low, perhaps it would be better to wait for a vaccine that works on the variant that has been overwhelming the dominant strain since July.



Even Fauci is saying the vaccinated need to worry... its the song that never ends

news.yahoo.com...





Sorry to hear about your mum.

The rest of your post makes no sense at all.



posted on Nov, 17 2021 @ 08:18 AM
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originally posted by: ScepticScot

originally posted by: putnam6

originally posted by: ScepticScot
a reply to: putnam6

I think what you will find is that the 'local skeptics' pointed our was what you were doing isn't how to measure if the vaccine is effective or not. As the text in red actually shows. Nothing about lab v real world data.


Sorry that you still don't understand that.



Well, explain to everybody else here as well... I purposely copied your exact quote

Honestly, I'm just flattered you are following me and giving me a distraction from my Mom's situation.

They are saying she has fluid around her heart and lungs, we don't know what is triggering this, 3 weeks ago she got her 2nd jab. It's probably just a coincidence, right? Like her doctor said "we will never know but it's possible.

He described it as the lining around her heart is like a balloon that has been inflated and deflated and now about 20% of it is sagging and weakened. Mostly around valve on top. But if her AFIB doesn't get under control, It's lessened but is still there they may have to shock it back into rhythm.

We asked I asked about do we get her booster in 6 months? He said we will cross that bridge when we get to it.

But yea knock yourself out, Ill keep posting your answers cause I do know if I ever want to have the pulse on America and Georgia SkepticScot will know the answer unequivocally.

So tell me oh wonderful soothsayer as now it has been determined your infinite wisdom and intellect on Covid across the globe and each individual state, province, and commonwealth.

WHAT SHOULD WE DO NEXT ?

because what I'm getting from this thread is considering it's lethality is still low, perhaps it would be better to wait for a vaccine that works on the variant that has been overwhelming the dominant strain since July.



Even Fauci is saying the vaccinated need to worry... its the song that never ends

news.yahoo.com...





Sorry to hear about your mum.

The rest of your post makes no sense at all.


LOL don't get shy with your wonderful intellect and advice now, it's simple


WHAT SHOULD WE DO NEXT ?

Now Fauci is saying 3 doses. SO if we get Mom's 3 doses she will be fine right? and completely protected right.

Do we get the boosters for my Mom? I sure don't want her to get COVID, with a damaged lining to her heart. We were so lucky she has avoided it for 19 months so far. But yea I don't want to miss getting that booster.


so 40% effectiveness is better than none at all right?



posted on Nov, 17 2021 @ 08:34 AM
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a reply to: Jeremiah33three
If you did research for 9 months, you would know that a real vaccine would keep you from transmitting the virus. What you chose to inject in your body is indeed not a vaccine. Asymptomatic cases existed before the vaccine. Back to the drawing board Pinky.



posted on Nov, 17 2021 @ 08:36 AM
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a reply to: bayouspirit

Completely false. Please show me a vaccine with 100% effectiveness at preventing both illness and transmission.



posted on Nov, 17 2021 @ 08:49 AM
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originally posted by: putnam6

originally posted by: ScepticScot

originally posted by: putnam6

originally posted by: ScepticScot
a reply to: putnam6

I think what you will find is that the 'local skeptics' pointed our was what you were doing isn't how to measure if the vaccine is effective or not. As the text in red actually shows. Nothing about lab v real world data.


Sorry that you still don't understand that.



Well, explain to everybody else here as well... I purposely copied your exact quote

Honestly, I'm just flattered you are following me and giving me a distraction from my Mom's situation.

They are saying she has fluid around her heart and lungs, we don't know what is triggering this, 3 weeks ago she got her 2nd jab. It's probably just a coincidence, right? Like her doctor said "we will never know but it's possible.

He described it as the lining around her heart is like a balloon that has been inflated and deflated and now about 20% of it is sagging and weakened. Mostly around valve on top. But if her AFIB doesn't get under control, It's lessened but is still there they may have to shock it back into rhythm.

We asked I asked about do we get her booster in 6 months? He said we will cross that bridge when we get to it.

But yea knock yourself out, Ill keep posting your answers cause I do know if I ever want to have the pulse on America and Georgia SkepticScot will know the answer unequivocally.

So tell me oh wonderful soothsayer as now it has been determined your infinite wisdom and intellect on Covid across the globe and each individual state, province, and commonwealth.

WHAT SHOULD WE DO NEXT ?

because what I'm getting from this thread is considering it's lethality is still low, perhaps it would be better to wait for a vaccine that works on the variant that has been overwhelming the dominant strain since July.



Even Fauci is saying the vaccinated need to worry... its the song that never ends

news.yahoo.com...





Sorry to hear about your mum.

The rest of your post makes no sense at all.


LOL don't get shy with your wonderful intellect and advice now, it's simple


WHAT SHOULD WE DO NEXT ?

Now Fauci is saying 3 doses. SO if we get Mom's 3 doses she will be fine right? and completely protected right.

Do we get the boosters for my Mom? I sure don't want her to get COVID, with a damaged lining to her heart. We were so lucky she has avoided it for 19 months so far. But yea I don't want to miss getting that booster.


so 40% effectiveness is better than none at all right?



I think your mum would better served getting medical advice from her doctor rather than random people on the Internet.

Yes 40% is better than 0%.



posted on Nov, 17 2021 @ 08:57 AM
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originally posted by: ScepticScot

originally posted by: putnam6

originally posted by: ScepticScot

originally posted by: putnam6

originally posted by: ScepticScot
a reply to: putnam6

I think what you will find is that the 'local skeptics' pointed our was what you were doing isn't how to measure if the vaccine is effective or not. As the text in red actually shows. Nothing about lab v real world data.


Sorry that you still don't understand that.



Well, explain to everybody else here as well... I purposely copied your exact quote

Honestly, I'm just flattered you are following me and giving me a distraction from my Mom's situation.

They are saying she has fluid around her heart and lungs, we don't know what is triggering this, 3 weeks ago she got her 2nd jab. It's probably just a coincidence, right? Like her doctor said "we will never know but it's possible.

He described it as the lining around her heart is like a balloon that has been inflated and deflated and now about 20% of it is sagging and weakened. Mostly around valve on top. But if her AFIB doesn't get under control, It's lessened but is still there they may have to shock it back into rhythm.

We asked I asked about do we get her booster in 6 months? He said we will cross that bridge when we get to it.

But yea knock yourself out, Ill keep posting your answers cause I do know if I ever want to have the pulse on America and Georgia SkepticScot will know the answer unequivocally.

So tell me oh wonderful soothsayer as now it has been determined your infinite wisdom and intellect on Covid across the globe and each individual state, province, and commonwealth.

WHAT SHOULD WE DO NEXT ?

because what I'm getting from this thread is considering it's lethality is still low, perhaps it would be better to wait for a vaccine that works on the variant that has been overwhelming the dominant strain since July.



Even Fauci is saying the vaccinated need to worry... its the song that never ends

news.yahoo.com...





Sorry to hear about your mum.

The rest of your post makes no sense at all.


LOL don't get shy with your wonderful intellect and advice now, it's simple


WHAT SHOULD WE DO NEXT ?

Now Fauci is saying 3 doses. SO if we get Mom's 3 doses she will be fine right? and completely protected right.

Do we get the boosters for my Mom? I sure don't want her to get COVID, with a damaged lining to her heart. We were so lucky she has avoided it for 19 months so far. But yea I don't want to miss getting that booster.


so 40% effectiveness is better than none at all right?



I think your mum would better served getting medical advice from her doctor rather than random people on the Internet.

Yes 40% is better than 0%.



But with her age and now her heart and lung condition, she is at the highest risk of getting COVID?



posted on Nov, 17 2021 @ 09:15 AM
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originally posted by: putnam6

originally posted by: ScepticScot

originally posted by: putnam6

originally posted by: ScepticScot

originally posted by: putnam6

originally posted by: ScepticScot
a reply to: putnam6

I think what you will find is that the 'local skeptics' pointed our was what you were doing isn't how to measure if the vaccine is effective or not. As the text in red actually shows. Nothing about lab v real world data.


Sorry that you still don't understand that.



Well, explain to everybody else here as well... I purposely copied your exact quote

Honestly, I'm just flattered you are following me and giving me a distraction from my Mom's situation.

They are saying she has fluid around her heart and lungs, we don't know what is triggering this, 3 weeks ago she got her 2nd jab. It's probably just a coincidence, right? Like her doctor said "we will never know but it's possible.

He described it as the lining around her heart is like a balloon that has been inflated and deflated and now about 20% of it is sagging and weakened. Mostly around valve on top. But if her AFIB doesn't get under control, It's lessened but is still there they may have to shock it back into rhythm.

We asked I asked about do we get her booster in 6 months? He said we will cross that bridge when we get to it.

But yea knock yourself out, Ill keep posting your answers cause I do know if I ever want to have the pulse on America and Georgia SkepticScot will know the answer unequivocally.

So tell me oh wonderful soothsayer as now it has been determined your infinite wisdom and intellect on Covid across the globe and each individual state, province, and commonwealth.

WHAT SHOULD WE DO NEXT ?

because what I'm getting from this thread is considering it's lethality is still low, perhaps it would be better to wait for a vaccine that works on the variant that has been overwhelming the dominant strain since July.



Even Fauci is saying the vaccinated need to worry... its the song that never ends

news.yahoo.com...





Sorry to hear about your mum.

The rest of your post makes no sense at all.


LOL don't get shy with your wonderful intellect and advice now, it's simple


WHAT SHOULD WE DO NEXT ?

Now Fauci is saying 3 doses. SO if we get Mom's 3 doses she will be fine right? and completely protected right.

Do we get the boosters for my Mom? I sure don't want her to get COVID, with a damaged lining to her heart. We were so lucky she has avoided it for 19 months so far. But yea I don't want to miss getting that booster.


so 40% effectiveness is better than none at all right?



I think your mum would better served getting medical advice from her doctor rather than random people on the Internet.

Yes 40% is better than 0%.



But with her age and now her heart and lung condition, she is at the highest risk of getting COVID?




Probably.

Not sure how that relates to anything I said.



posted on Nov, 17 2021 @ 09:26 AM
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originally posted by: OccamsRazor04
where it really shines is protection against serious illness/death.


how do you quantify that? People who have been vaccinated are still getting sick, still going to the hospitals, and still dying.



posted on Nov, 17 2021 @ 09:30 AM
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originally posted by: network dude

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04
where it really shines is protection against serious illness/death.


how do you quantify that? People who have been vaccinated are still getting sick, still going to the hospitals, and still dying.


Reduction in serious cases compared to the unvacinated.



posted on Nov, 17 2021 @ 09:43 AM
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originally posted by: network dude

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04
where it really shines is protection against serious illness/death.


how do you quantify that? People who have been vaccinated are still getting sick, still going to the hospitals, and still dying.


It just sounds good. I makes for a good sound bite to some people.

There is no way, any doctor, with any disease or medical condition, can tell you how sick you are going to be, how fast you will recover, or if you will have the illness again.

The only ting they can do is give you as much of the pertinent data they have available, provide you the odds, and allow you to make a decision based on informed consent.

Medicine is not, and has never been, a precise science. It has always been a guess and a gamble, usually based on evidence. But every single person on this planet is different. There is no way they can tell you how you are going to respond to a medicine, if the medicine will be effective, or if it will be harmful.

That is exactly why no doctor, no business, no establishment, and especially, no government, should ever tell anyone, what they can and not choose as their medical option of choice.

To do so goes beyond tyranny, it becomes out and out slavery.



posted on Nov, 17 2021 @ 09:52 AM
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a reply to: network dude

You look at similar cases of vaccinated vs unvaccinated. We don't want to compare 18yo vaccinated vs 80yo unvaccinated, right? So we also won't do the opposite.

When you look at age groups and compare vaccinated vs unvaccinated (which still should favor the unvaccinated since the most at risk have the highest rates of vaccination in all age groups). If the vaccination does nothing we should see equal numbers when we look at % vaccination and % of illness that's vaccinated (90% of population is vaccinated, and 90% of illness/death is vaccinated). If we instead find 10% of the population (unvaccinated) account for 40% of illness/death, then it's very clear the vaccine works.



posted on Nov, 17 2021 @ 10:07 AM
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a reply to: OccamsRazor04

I think everyone knows the vaccine works for a little while (if it doesn't kill you with blood clots) but it doesn't last, which is why we are talking about boosters. I just wonder how better of a death someone may have being vaccinated as opposed to not. Dead is dead.



posted on Nov, 17 2021 @ 10:21 AM
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a reply to: network dude

Well we don't have much in the way of boosters yet so I would imagine if your supposition that they increase the effectiveness then we will see even fewer illness/death for the vaccinated.

So now we have two questions, is the vaccine effective (yes), and is the benefit greater than the risk. This is why we should not have mandates as everyone has different risk and benefit levels.



posted on Nov, 17 2021 @ 10:53 AM
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originally posted by: OccamsRazor04
a reply to: network dude

You look at similar cases of vaccinated vs unvaccinated. We don't want to compare 18yo vaccinated vs 80yo unvaccinated, right? So we also won't do the opposite.

When you look at age groups and compare vaccinated vs unvaccinated (which still should favor the unvaccinated since the most at risk have the highest rates of vaccination in all age groups). If the vaccination does nothing we should see equal numbers when we look at % vaccination and % of illness that's vaccinated (90% of population is vaccinated, and 90% of illness/death is vaccinated). If we instead find 10% of the population (unvaccinated) account for 40% of illness/death, then it's very clear the vaccine works.


I am not taking sides in this discussion, but I think this whole thing is a done deal by now.

Using your numbers hypothetically, there are likely only about 32 million people in America that are unvaccinated. With 40% sick or dead, that only leaves around 13 million Americans unvaccinated. But using the assuming the majority of those 40% that recovered, we can guess that at least 90% have natural immunity. WE are now looking at about 1.3 million possibly unvaccinated.

I am willing to bet that out of that 1.3 million, over 600,000 have had the virus in the past and recovered, and some of this group will also die of non-virus related reasons. That leaves us less than 400 thousand unvaccinated in the US. With this dangerous, deadly virus still running rampant among us. I think the last thing we have to fear in America, with a population of about 320 million people, and nearly 290 million people already vaccinated, is the 1% of the population presently potentially unvaccinated.

I think we have much more, more potentially dangerous, and life altering things to worry about in America. That may be why they are keeping us distracted, pulling apart friends, families, and communities. Because they fear if we dare stop for a second and look at the reality of what we are fighting about, we may just be able to see what they are hiding among the trees.


I am at work and should not be even posting this. You get the drift. Math might be a bit off and I will not be able to respond for a few hours.

Just my two cents.



posted on Nov, 17 2021 @ 10:58 AM
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a reply to: NightSkyeB4Dawn

I said in this thread or another we should not be afraid, we should be smart.



posted on Nov, 17 2021 @ 11:41 AM
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a reply to: OccamsRazor04

You are wrong, and there is zero evidence to back up your argument. I would love to see you try and cite anything proving that published before 2020 thats not full of speculation and conjecture. You are talking about viral particles transmitted ​through bodily fluids and droplets, NOT airborne particles. Its a dishonest argument to conflate the two and hope the person you are discussing this with is ignorant of the science. Viruses are so small and light that they are hardly affected by gravity. They float on their own.

Lets imagine NONE came out of your lungs when you exhale mixed in with the air leaving your mask, lets pretend we failed science and believe that. What happens when the moisture you claim trapped those particles in your mask evaporates? What happens to the virus left behind in your mask? How long until your mask gets full? What is the viral capacitary of your N95 mask before it is overflowing and shedding virus? How many hours can you wear the same mask before it is no longer able to provide protection? What if you are in a closed room? How much time do they offer protection in a 15x15 room vs a 50x50 room? You dont know these things with any accuracy, because you are operating on faith, not science. Thats why none of these things are measured or concerns for people wearing masks, because its all kabuki theater. Its symbolic, thats all. You lack understanding of fluid dynamics. You are operating on faith. Even statistical data is not being presented to argue masks work, because it does not exist. Thats why NYC does not show lower cases due to their mask mandates per capita compared to Miami, or they would be flouting that data on every channel.


I used to work in a lab at Cornell with my GF under a hood full of petri dishes growing cancer cells. We had to bunny suit up to enter, and if you were sick, your lab mate had to handle your dishes to prevent contamination, even with higher quality PPE than nurses use, and a laminar flow hood, sick people would contaminate the lab within a couple of minutes of entering. Thats with controlled and heavily filtered airflow designed to protect the cultures from contamination.

On top of all that. I own a shop. I have a walk in media blasting booth you can use to remove the finish from anything. The particles created by that process cause fibrosis of the lungs if inhaled. I can take any nurse or doctor, with all their PPE on, and stick them in that booth. Those particles are closer to 0.1-1.0mm. You would be hospitalized with 5 minutes of breathing that air if you relied on an N95 with another mask on top to try and seal it. You would literally taste all the crap blowing right through the sides, and if you got it to seal, you would not be able to breath through it after about 15 seconds. Thats why I have a ridiculous amount of actual respirators that are lab grade and offer real protection with different carts depending on the hazard. I also work with organic acid and other chemicals that can eat your lung tissue if inhaled while relying on just any mask.

I am not a moron. I science, math, and my lungs are in great shape because I understand fully what I am talking about, and would be dead if I did not. Only people fighting things so small they cannot point to them argue non respirator masks stop airborne viruses smaller than 0.15 micron.

Maybe you should try this. GO stand in a closet and spray a powder fire extinguisher. Those particles are thousands of timers larger than viruses, so your PPE will keep you safe, right? How about smoke, can you not smell it through your mask? Have you done any research into why you can smell smoke?

TEST YOUR FAITH before you continue worshiping this religion. Judging by your handle, you should have known long ago you were being lied to. Thats by far the simplest solution with the least amount of leaps of faith to be true. You just dont like it because you fell for a lie. The first step is admiting you were lied to and fell for it. You can do it. Dont let the faith science cult get you. Go READ the science for yourself.
edit on 17-11-2021 by TrollMagnet because: (no reason given)

edit on 17-11-2021 by TrollMagnet because:




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