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My personal interpretation of 'how reality works'.

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posted on Nov, 4 2021 @ 11:08 PM
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What if our mind and consciousness does not 'observe' reality. What if reality is just a #load of different waves and frequencies and our body and mind solidify those waves in our perception, for our own personal experience of that spectrum of frequencies that we can observe.
Meaning, our reality that consists of 'matter' isn't actually solid, and we're just vessels, made of waves themselves, cruizing through these frequencies but our consciousness materializes these frequencies for us, giving us the perception it is actually solid.

This would mean that we indeed have to change our way of thinking and how we seem to perceive the outside world in order to change reality itself.
Small example: If you're really, really psychotic and you imagine there's people, who aren't actually there, and those people attack you, you will feel pain, because your mind makes it real for you.

This does not mean that the objective reality changes, but what if objective reality is just frequencies which our mind shapes into being for us. So at any given moment, depending on how powerful the observing consciousness is, related to the emotional and psychological state of the mind, reality can shapeshift into whatever we 'manifest' by perception.

Basically, reality would be a giant mass hallucination, a hallucination we all kinda agree upon, so we all observe the same things and can adress things by labeling them. But if enough minds alter their perspective on the world, we can potentially physically change reality and re-create it in a way we feel it actually is or should be.

What if there's only waves going through waves, a certain band of waves is actually 'you', your consciousness, and it interferes with other waves giving the impression that this world is 'real' and 'solid', which is just an illusion.

It would seem logical that every single possible version of 'reality' is already present amongst these waves and that the potential for changing reality is effectively stored within our consciousness, depending on how our collective, global consciousness thinks to perceive it.
This would mean that there are certain things that one person can see, but the other can't, depending on the dispositioning of the mind towards these waves. But both are actually right and effectively experience their respective reality.

What I'm getting at is, as many philosophers have notioned... We shape the reality with our perception and if we wish to see more love in the world then we should busy ourselves with projecting love into the world. To see love where there is no love, to light up the darkness, even if reality does not effectively change, then our perception will make us feel as if it somehow did, brightening our days, because it makes us feel better.
And by projecting this conscious energy and interfering with the waves of reality it slowly radiates into your own reality, because you wish to see it. Even if there wasn't anything changing, just a real desire to see these changes makes you more aware of these things around you, and automatically you will start to notice it more around you.

But in time it will affect the outer world too, because you will start to vibrate differently, because you believe that you can see this love in the world and by doing so you emanate it from yourself outward and the world reflects it back to you.
Perhaps David Icke isn't completely crazy. But stay cautious, beings that wish to manifest hate also have that power and if they can convince you and use your own mind against you, you can potentially manifest a reality that you do not wish to see.
So it's important to remain above these lower vibrational emotions and thought-forms like fear, anger, jealousy, resentment, loathing, dishonesty, etc... Because you are feeding this reality, well, it's more like an 'interface', and our mind controls this computer which simulates our world.
Perception is the creative, imaginative power to sculpt the world around us and shape it to our desires.
So wish to see love and wish well upon others, and hopefully the interface will project that back to you.




posted on Nov, 4 2021 @ 11:17 PM
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So basically you are saying you are a figmant of my imagination or I am of yours. Why should I listen to an imaginary being and why should you listen to one?

In your reality, existence is not valid. Nothing exists, not even you.



posted on Nov, 4 2021 @ 11:23 PM
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Existence is just a puddle of possiblities. We exist as certain waveforms which have the ability to react with other waveforms around us. Us (Human waveform) interacts with the world (reality waveforms) and shape those by interaction.

You could look at it like underneath what we observe as matter and such, is a whole bunch of code. And we touch that code with our consciousness and shape it accordingly in our perception.

You are a real and valid form of code that exists as consciousness and we can interact with each other within our combined perception of this reality.

Everything is real, but everything is also moldable and changeable, with the imaginative power of our mind, so that makes everything kinda an 'illusion', however that is not the right word for it. It means that everything is real and not at the same time, everything that 'can' be real, will be real, but everything that the global human consciousness perceives as not real will not be perceived as real and by our own definition of awareness of our reality does not exist.

You got me a lil wrong there, I did not mean it like that. Reality is just an endless matrix of possiblities and we (consciousness) shape it into existence by our perception.


edit on 4-11-2021 by Lux96 because: spelling



posted on Nov, 4 2021 @ 11:54 PM
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a reply to: Lux96

If our consciousness shapes reality, then why are any two beings able to see the same thing the same way that neather has seen before and neather has any idea of its existence? Every being’s reality would be so different that we could not interact with each other at all if conciousness controls it. It would be as if magic were real. Imagin it and it is so but only for you and no one else. That is unless you are imagining that I am typing this to you. Am I real?

I can prove that others exist by dropping a brick on their foot. If they did not exist or did not think they existed, they would not try to move their foot. I can’t prove I exist that way because I expect the brick to fall and hurt if it hits my foot, therefore I expect the results of my own test and change the outcome by this expectation. This is why you can’t tickle yourself.



posted on Nov, 4 2021 @ 11:59 PM
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a reply to: beyondknowledge

I think the human consciousness has a sort of prefix in how it perceives reality, but it also has the potential to change it.
And to answer your question: The only thing I know to be real is myself, my emotions, my thoughts, etc. Other than that I have no real way of knowing if any what goes on around me is real. It's a scary way of looking at things, but that's how it is.
You could just be some figment of my imagination and I would never be able to know.

The brick analogy already takes for granted that you consider everything around you as real, even though you have no real way of knowing if anything is actually real to begin with.

I think human consciousness can be 'unlocked' as so we can perceive 'other waveforms' we were previously not able to perceive and thus create a new part of reality, or learn something entirely new about our existing reality.



posted on Nov, 5 2021 @ 12:14 AM
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No one sees things the same way. Our society, how we grow as mankind together, using the same tools and actions throughout life shape our same limitations, interactions, and how we communicate our experiences, mimicking each other. Creating a false blanket for a secure and comforting relatable connection.

If we go out and live in the bush and away from people... this connection begins to break down and our true physiological senses shapes our limitations. Making us seem completely alien once back in society.


originally posted by: beyondknowledge
a reply to: Lux96

If our consciousness shapes reality, then why are any two beings able to see the same thing the same way that neather has seen before and neather has any idea of its existence? Every being’s reality would be so different that we could not interact with each other at all if conciousness controls it. It would be as if magic were real. Imagin it and it is so but only for you and no one else. That is unless you are imagining that I am typing this to you. Am I real?

I can prove that others exist by dropping a brick on their foot. If they did not exist or did not think they existed, they would not try to move their foot. I can’t prove I exist that way because I expect the brick to fall and hurt if it hits my foot, therefore I expect the results of my own test and change the outcome by this expectation. This is why you can’t tickle yourself.



posted on Nov, 5 2021 @ 03:39 AM
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a reply to: Lux96

Spot on!

It's like light passing trough a prism. Your brain is the hardware the prism, the light is the software the waves,ä. the prism fractures light into all it's colors and projects it onto the canvas forming our sensational reality.
it's not and individual construct but a collective one.

It has much to do with critical mass.

Internalising this approach to reality is a very messy road if you haven't reached mental stability.

That prism has to be equilateral or you will project your own instabilities onto the world.

Most doctrines that deal with reality are creating prisms that fracture light in a very dichotomous way.

Good thoughts



posted on Nov, 5 2021 @ 08:15 AM
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a reply to: Lux96

Hi Lux96

Do you think it is possible that Aldous Huxley and George Orwell are more than partly responsible for the way society is being transformed? I mean a boot stamping on a human face forever is not a very positive projection. I have sometimes seen people ask:"is it possible that TPTB have used a brave new world and 1984 as their guide book? It seems so." By offering out such a detailed warning from their powerful imaginative minds have they not seeded the noosphere with a seed reality? Kind of like "be careful what you don't wish for."

Why so many dystopian films? Why are not people flocking in droves to see Quentin Tarantino's latest projection of a Golden age where artists are the most revered citizens? Where aesthetics is the highest value, and life is so cultured and beautiful that no-one dreams of a far away paradise.

When the first major satellite was launched into space and the Beatles enlisted it's scope for global transmission and broadcast the song All You Need Is Love I believe that John Lennon was in agreement with what you are postulating.





posted on Nov, 5 2021 @ 08:16 AM
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Prisms... more triangles. 3d triangle. Sounds like witches hats to me. Reality is subjective light belief mhm mhm.

I see somebody mentioned dropping bricks on feet. So in trying to explain what is real you got bricks and feet. coincidence I think not. Bricks and feet.

Hmmmmn

excerpt from the wizard of Oz " the walking grew so difficult that the Scarecrow often stumbled over the yellow bricks, which were here very uneven."

Do you see? Witch were here. Witch were here. Right there in black and white or grey n green.... witch were here - very uneven (one sided witch)
in my reality the yellow brick road is coming back.



posted on Nov, 5 2021 @ 08:30 AM
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a reply to: HilterDayon

I imagine it is how 'they' operate, seed the minds of the mass population with a whole bunch of dystopian ideas and let the collective electro-magnetic charge of 7 billion brains in the earths magnetic field unfold it's magic in the 'human hologram'.

They manipulate the peoples consciousness with ideas and stories and then make some of it come true, and then that idea resonates in the minds of the peoples granting it even more energy because they now believe it is coming true 'just as they predicted'.

We have to be permanently aware of our consciousness and the electro-magnetic charge of our emotions and psychological state that gives energy to these ideas that gets projected upon us.
That's why alot of people are now deciding to try stay centered in the heart and even though the world is dark, to project loving and caring energy outwards into the world and giving THAT idea the energy it needs to blossom like some self fullfilling prophecy.. Just like how 'they' do with us.

But alot of people just get carried away with all the distortion in the world and live more on the fear frequency. This gives 'them' their energy.

Even I get carried away from time to time and lash out towards the common people, wondering how they can be so blind to it all...
But then I need to center again and know that, even if it is only for myself, to project caring energy outwards and to be able to see that energy in the world. Because there's still a enormous amount of loving human beings around, but we're all a bit in some form of hypnosis.

But if you can see it for yourself in the world, and you can feel it, and it makes YOU feel better, that is already one body and one brain whos electromagnetic charge is positive and that lends it's creative energy towards creating the world we actually want.

I'm just writing it as I think it works, I have totally no clue ofcourse.

But to create a certain 'vibe' in the world, we need the peoples mind to be 'aligned'. And that's how they use our mind against us, they align us in fear and low vibration, making us weak and preventing from creative energy to flow to our desired world.

Ahh.. I dunno..



posted on Nov, 5 2021 @ 12:19 PM
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a reply to: Lux96

Interesting.

Why is this thread in Rants instead of philosophy ?

It has been rumoured, that below the vibratory field : is the infinite ocean of potentialities.







posted on Nov, 5 2021 @ 12:56 PM
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a reply to: Nothin

Sorry, I'm not too familiar with this forum. I just quickly chose a place to make this thread. It's indeed more philosophical.
I also think that this reality were living in has the potential to manifest whatever, anything is possible.
But as Terpene said, it will require the collective consciousness to become 'different'. Not sure as to how or what.
But it makes sense that everything consists out of waves, in that way higher or lower level consciousness can experience alternate realities from each other, because the infinite reality provides for both levels of consciousness, we would be able to cross each other but still only each perceive our own 'limited reality' to which our consciousness is fixated and as such we do not disturb each other while we pass each other by.

I mean other beings than humans.
edit on 5-11-2021 by Lux96 because: (no reason given)

edit on 5-11-2021 by Lux96 because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 5 2021 @ 02:23 PM
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First, I think it is helpful to make a distinction between "reality" and "Reality." This might be best described as the former, "reality," being the human perception of the latter, "Reality." Ill be using the two words very specifically.

In this, reality is essentially a reductive abstraction of Reality based on a (largely) physiological and biological filter. It is only marginally representative of Reality. Even with as tenuous as this connection might be, we can still make useful inferences. Particularly when we ascribe a framework that accepts these limitations and inaccuracies, like we have done with the scientific method.

So, we have a bunch of stuff happening in Reality independent of anything having to do with humans, and we have our perception of those events (or "consciousness"). That consciousness can absolutely impact Reality, though perhaps the majority of this is not in some esoteric fashion.. I assume that anyone reading this will be doing so through a tool that exists as a product of human consciousness and in Reality, even if it was designed for, by, and from reality.

I dont think its so much that "everything is waves," more that that abstraction accurately described parts of the behavior of what is happening. In Reality, we have a process that starts with the Void, moves into a field of possibilities, then into a field of probabilies, then into material constructs. This happens over a relatively long span of Time, which is defined here as the relative movement between two or more objects ("time" would be the human perception and measurement of this movement).

The perceptual construct of reality appears complete and cohesive, even when it isnt. The continuinity that derives from the human experience easily gives rise to the notion that building internal consistency indicates accurate representation of Reality. This can be as benign as simple ignorance, however, it is also a scenario that enables significant amounts of manipulation and coercion when someone(s) can control the flow of information that informs an individuals reality. This can happen on a relatively small level, when say.. someone lies to someone else about what they have done. Or, on a relatively large scale when the information about what is happening everywhere is controlled to create a very specific reality or story. It does not directly impact Reality. What happened is what happened, and what is happening is what is happening. However, this shaped Narrative can affect Reality downstream, as people act, behave, create, and interact based on the manufactured reality.

With this, realities exist as a derivative of Reality. Even when they are almost entirely inaccurate representations, they exist. The amount of realities that exist in Reality are countless to us, as each individual system structure yields an individual reality (i.e. each person has a reality, each tree has a reality, each bird has a reality, and so on). This can then give rise to what we represent with the abstraction of an "egregore," where those realities begin to interact on levels that transcend the individual realities/stories themselves. This could be described as everything from an individuals spirit (what many will label the "soul"), but it also points in the direction of the reality that is constructed when more than one individual system come together under some sort of shared understanding/existence/experience. It could be said that this is created in everything from secret societies, like Freemasons, to the nigh opposite: Corporations and NGOs.

In this understanding, ye olde thought experiment of "if a tree falls in the woods and no one is around to hear it, does it make a sound?" is answered in a pretty straightforward manner. In Reality, every-thing that would constitute a "sound" is present. The cracking of the timber.. the rustling of the leaves as they move through the air.. the deep thud as one reality & story collides with another at the ground. In human reality, however, it has no existence whatsoever as no information was exchanged through sensory input. Somewhat interestingly, even if sensory input does occur, but awareness of that input does not, it could be said that it still doesnt exist in human reality.

Many practices and approaches attempt to expand and grow the nature of human reality. From meditation to philosophy to the scientific method, and from microscopes to telescopes. Even though these will still be derivatives of human perception and senses, they can be immensely useful in getting in closer contact with Reality. A somewhat silly notion in some respects, given that it is all part of Reality anyway. But, when it comes to accurate abstractions versus inaccurate assumptions it is relevant.

However, the vast, vast majority of these practices end up exploring reality all while we convince ourselves otherwise. Most meditative practices strengthen the perception that the individuals reality reigns supreme, particularly when we commit to it under the auspices of doing the opposite (like in pursuing "ego death"). In philosophy, it is easy to begin making the assumption that what makes up human reality, something like "waves" and "sets of frequencies," actually applies to Reality even when it doesnt (at least not in the way we think). The scientific method, particularly the theoretical sciences, have begun to make the same error; they now tend to explore the reality that exists in the human mind rather than the Reality that informs the senses. This can still have incredibly reliable predictive capability even when it has emerged solely from a derivative reality, and that can fortify the illusion.

Something like a planet isnt round because we perceive it as such, nor is it not round simply because human perception is limited. The spherical nature of it is informed by processes, systems, and realities that exist completely outside of human influence and we just glimpse a part of that. This interaction can yield both illusion as well as accurate predictive frameworks, and those arent necessarily mutually exclusive.

So, we have one system, Reality, that is comprised of a great variety of realities. The latter can change the shape of the former, particularly over time, but it is probably better understood as a derivative function rather than an authoritative position. As a part of Reality, the presence of a reality could be said to directly exist as a part of it. In much the same way that the skin and seeds are part of an apple, but do not individually inform what an apple "is" in Reality.

In that way, realities absolutely exist even when they are completely misinformed aspects of Reality. This is in much the same way that an apple seed still exists even when it is taken out of the apple. And naturally, that seed, thus removed from all sense of reality as an apple, can then go on to change a part of Reality as a tree that bears more fruit by moving through the medium of Time and interacting with other realities & stories.

At this point, we can begin introducing some more advanced aspects. Things like influencing which threads of Time coalesce into present Reality through conscious direction of both individual realities as well as egregores. Things like transcending material entropy. But, I suppose that is a different Story for a different Time
Character limit and all that.
edit on 5-11-2021 by Serdgiam because: Squirrel chaos



posted on Nov, 5 2021 @ 02:41 PM
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a reply to: Serdgiam

My main point of view was just that the whole 'material world' which we can perceive, isn't material at all. And our body and mind is just a vessel which in itself also isn't material, but it is only because our consciousness shapes it into being so we can perceive this reality that, for us personally, it appears as materialistic.

It's just some 'far-fetched' idea. And the only thing I really got going for me is that we can never be completely sure of the absolute truth concerning our reality, that and maybe quantum mechanics where everything starts getting particularly weird.

Another 'far-fetched' idea would be that, if we would evolve for millions of years, who knows what kind of 'state' our body/mind will be in. Maybe we can then 'travel' to higher 'dimensions' or something like that, which are just other layers of reality which we were initially not able to perceive.

You can go wild with speculation on this... I just thought it was an interesting thought to distance yourself from the basic material reality perception we have and try see it as a bunch of different energies that are constantly influencing each other and creating certain states of being relative to our consciousness.

For example, spirits or entities, non-physical. They supposedly exist.. But where are they located, and why can't we see them.. Assuming they can see us, their consciousness is able to perceive their own part of reality as well as ours or something like that..

Well, I'm really no intellectual or anything... I just like to think about these things, either way, in the end we'll never have a real answer because we just don't actually know 100% sure, ever.



posted on Nov, 5 2021 @ 06:22 PM
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a reply to: Lux96


Ummm…I kind of like this theory…however…

Why the eff…would any of you…and this version…be realized…if this impingement were due to my consciousness interacting with waves of energy…?

I certainly did not choose this version…and frankly…any effort to change this…“reality”…to suit my interpretation…causes at best…headaches…


So…while I admire the thought construct…I can’t give any credence to it’s truthfulness…




YouSir



posted on Nov, 5 2021 @ 08:06 PM
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a reply to: Lux96

We could request to have it moved to the Philosophy forum, but it will attract the Materialists to tell us we're all wrong.. LoL !!

Waves : dogs know when we are anxious, and cats know when you don't want them to come to you, and do it on purpose, of course.
Many migrating birds, insects, and animals, are thought to tune-in to various frequencies to guide them.

Personally don't know anything about aliens, or interdimensional beings.



“The pre-Socratic Greek philosopher Parmenides taught that the only things that are real are things which never change ... and the pre-Socratic Greek philosopher Heraclitus taught that everything changes. If you superimpose their two views, you get this result: Nothing is real.”

— Philip K. Dick




“[T]he atoms or elementary particles themselves are not real; they form a world of potentialities or possibilities rather than one of things or facts.”
― Werner Heisenberg




Everything we call real is made of things that cannot be regarded as real.
-- Niels Bohr




As far as the laws of mathematics refer to reality, they are not certain, and as far as they are certain, they do not refer to reality.
-- Albert Einstein





posted on Nov, 6 2021 @ 08:01 AM
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a reply to: Lux96

Having to trick our frequency that we "all just agree upon", so that we won't give into anger and jealousy ECT... sounds pretty New age...

How it actually works is doing what is right regardless of how you feel, because objective morals and values exist, regardless of whatever someone or some frequency puts out into the universe...

It's almost like a cop out, to blame other people or frequencies because you were greedy, or angry, or jealous at some point....



posted on Nov, 6 2021 @ 09:23 AM
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a reply to: ThyJudgeCometh

I don't think it's wrong to have negative emotions, but it's not good to dwell on them. It makes yourself feel bad and that radiates outwards.
I'm just thinking in terms of energy and frequency, it benefits us the most that we are positively charged, but when the situation requires it there must be a place for negative emotions too, which are just as valid ofcourse.



posted on Nov, 6 2021 @ 11:30 AM
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just thoughts in no particular order
starting with a whatif is quite a long way to approach your subject. nothing wrong with that, of course. the second one is a bit jarring. what if instead of wondering what if, one just approached the subject directly? its like having 20 tabs open while youre trying to get work done. it doesnt affect ram space at all, but does increase the potential for deviation. cutting down on excess verbage really helps streamline the process. efficiency is otp right?




What if reality is just a #load of different waves and frequencies and our body and mind solidify those waves in our perception, for our own personal experience of that spectrum of frequencies that we can observe.

a reply to: Lux96

then thats waves perceiving waves, meaning we still observe our reality xD




Meaning, our reality that consists of 'matter' isn't actually solid, and we're just vessels, made of waves themselves, cruizing through these frequencies but our consciousness materializes these frequencies for us, giving us the perception it is actually solid.


okay, i feel like yo might be getting a wee bit confused here, or at least, the verbiage is conflicting. in the first quote, you mention how our minds solidify our perception. but now it wasnt solidified? if its waves crusing through waves... if the soul creates the mind and body to descend into experience... then... isnt that the definition of solid?

scientifically speaking, nothing is solid in the sense that, yes, everything is made up of energy and and particlewavestates. eveyrthing is just empty space after all. the very feeling of solidity we experience when interacting with physical matter is actually justy the sensation of repulsion so that way you dont randomly merge with your environment or spontaneously combust reality.

to the audience, the whole play is just a show. but to the puppet, isnt the stage the epitome of real? we can talk of cats and coins all we want, but thats what ifs too. if we consider what we can objectify within our subjective realm(isnt this bthe very ideal of science?) than we must consider our sense and faculties to be reliable, except where they inform us that they are not. XD so talking of superposition, spin up spin down... all very useful info... but irrelevant to the fact that we are all here somehow.

i could delete all of that and sum up my argument by responding to the last bit of then last sentence of the second quote. if we percieve it to be solid... and this perception holds through our interaction... then... wasnt it actually solid? it doesnt have to always be solid, and it doesnt matter if it wasnt before or after. but for the duration of the experience, it definitely was...

ultimately, reality isnt a hallucination. consciousness is. reality has a definite truth, its not distorted at all.




we seem to perceive the outside world in order to change reality itself.


try percieving the inner world to change your reality. then, changing the outer reality is effortless, within your bounds




This does not mean that the objective reality changes, but what if objective reality is just frequencies which our mind shapes into being for us.


thenn.... thats literally not objective reality, if its dependent... thats just an example of how thew subjective mind maifests our direct experience. this is why shaping our thoughts is the first tool within our reach.




What if there's only waves going through waves, a certain band of waves is actually 'you', your consciousness, and it interferes with other waves giving the impression that this world is 'real' and 'solid', which is just an illusion


ive long had an adage for this: what is an illusion to another illusion, if not real?




It would seem logical that every single possible version of 'reality' is already present amongst these waves and that the potential for changing reality is effectively stored within our consciousness, depending on how our collective, global consciousness thinks to perceive it.
This would mean that there are certain things that one person can see, but the other can't, depending on the dispositioning of the mind towards these waves. But both are actually right and effectively experience their respective reality.


not present in the sense that the word seems to suggest. the whole thing isnt as fleshed out as all that. its kinda like a game of dnd, where a gm takes the players through the "game" the waves and frequencies you keep mentioning, wherein we are the tuning fork that prisms reality into the rainbow. its like art, each artist has a different process, but ultimately, every piece of art is a collaberation between the higher and the lower realms.

both people are right... in their respective fields... but there is a definite right and wrong... a sort of original template, if you will. dont get me wrong individuality and uniqueness are sacred. but there are certain rules to qualify certain criteria. you yourself said it wonderfully, about the positioning of the mind. in my thread we talked about the mind gate. so thats why theres definitely a right and wrong.




We shape the reality with our perception and if we wish to see more love in the world then we should busy ourselves with projecting love into the world. To see love where there is no love, to light up the darkness, even if reality does not effectively change, then our perception will make us feel as if it somehow did, brightening our days, because it makes us feel better.
And by projecting this conscious energy and interfering with the waves of reality it slowly radiates into your own reality, because you wish to see it. Even if there wasn't anything changing, just a real desire to see these changes makes you more aware of these things around you, and automatically you will start to notice it more around you.

But in time it will affect the outer world too, because you will start to vibrate differently, because you believe that you can see this love in the world and by doing so you emanate it from yourself outward and the world reflects it back to you.


as for this section...
(im not actually disagreeing with any of your thoughts, btw.)

"projection" "vibrating" "reflecting" these things sound cool but do #all for anyone. the satanist bible reads :do as thou willt. in the words of bob burns: dont just talk about it. be about it. the wors offender is "conscious energy" like im sorry but. thats not actually quantifying anything its just a loose term for a wide variety of phenomenon. genesis in land of confusion sings: This is the world we live in
And these are the hands we're given
Use them and let's start trying
To make it a place worth living in

out of time, might have more later but thats the main bit anyway



posted on Nov, 6 2021 @ 01:28 PM
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originally posted by: Lux96
a reply to: Serdgiam

My main point of view was just that the whole 'material world' which we can perceive, isn't material at all. And our body and mind is just a vessel which in itself also isn't material, but it is only because our consciousness shapes it into being so we can perceive this reality that, for us personally, it appears as materialistic.

It's just some 'far-fetched' idea. And the only thing I really got going for me is that we can never be completely sure of the absolute truth concerning our reality, that and maybe quantum mechanics where everything starts getting particularly weird.


Well, its almost certainly not material in the way that we think of it. However, it is most likely it is vastly more complex rather than less complex and relative scale has distinct differences.

Meaning, the way we perceive the world is not only a part of the world in and of itself, there is also a source for our abstractions. So, rather than the "material world" being significantly less than we perceive it, it is significantly more. I do not believe it to be an "either/or" scenario. The world can be just as "material" as we perceive it, as well as more "material" and less "material." And beyond that, our perceptions & thoughts themselves are part of the "material" order.

The only reason the quantum scale is perceived as "weird" at all is that it resides at the edge of our perception of scale, and therefore, relative frames of reference of time & space. This is coupled with becoming conditioned to the consistency with which we perceive the "material world."

Meaning, what we perceive on a daily basis is just as weird.. we are just used to it.


Another 'far-fetched' idea would be that, if we would evolve for millions of years, who knows what kind of 'state' our body/mind will be in. Maybe we can then 'travel' to higher 'dimensions' or something like that, which are just other layers of reality which we were initially not able to perceive.


Definitely an interesting thought experiment! Millions of years is probably far beyond our ability to imagine though. I dont mean that in a dismissive manner either, I believe that our imagination drives where our species and civilization "goes." What you describe here is likely to occur within the next 500 to maybe 1000 years at absolute most and would likely be rooted in technological foundations. We are reaching a stage where technology drives our evolution rather than solely biology, etc.

For instance, I believe that lucid dreams are actually an interaction with a technology of the type you describe.


I just thought it was an interesting thought to distance yourself from the basic material reality perception we have and try see it as a bunch of different energies that are constantly influencing each other and creating certain states of being relative to our consciousness.


Why distance yourself from it? Interesting word choice too..

The two approaches described here ("basic material reality perception" vs "see it as a bunch of different energies") are not in opposition or mutually exclusive. Both can be held simulataneously, and perhaps by eschewing one for the other.. we commit ourselves to the very path we believe we are avoiding.

I would even go so far as to say that what you describe here (bolded) is, in fact, essentially what constitutes "basic material reality perception" and is the very thing described & explored by science through things like General and Special Relativity.


For example, spirits or entities, non-physical. They supposedly exist.. But where are they located, and why can't we see them.. Assuming they can see us, their consciousness is able to perceive their own part of reality as well as ours or something like that..


Non-physical spirits and entities are a convenient catch-all concept for us that we apply to a vast diversity of beings, systems, and structures that exist at the edges of our senses, at the edges of human reality. Their reality is likely significantly different from our own, with different limitations. Plenty of them are probably just as tangentially aware of us as we are of them.. but no more than that. Others might be capable of understanding human reality to a greater degree than humans can understand their reality, and so on.

All together, they comprise only a small part of the abstractions of Reality, and at the same time exist as part of it.

This same concept to be applied to dogs and humans. Dog reality, as it were, isnt just "human reality with more smells" as most people inevitably think of it. The reality construct of canines is so far removed from our own that it is incomprehensible to us. What "colors" are their world painted with, with such an immensely powerful sensory input? We dont have any senses that even come close to comparing. The only thing that is comparable in capability is our mind.


Well, I'm really no intellectual or anything... I just like to think about these things, either way, in the end we'll never have a real answer because we just don't actually know 100% sure, ever.


The bolded part sure sounds like something you are "100% sure" about


Plenty of people find this sort of thing fun to talk about though. Posts like ours are all over ATS and almost always attract interesting individuals and conversation!




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