Old news you likely missed

This country has been compromised. People have been conditioned to believe in deceit and when the truth comes along, it is suppressed by the media and the other deceivers in charge of our country. Fauchi and the heads of other health agencies do not even look at the evidence that goes against their beliefs. This pandemic makes these people seem more prestigious and they don't want to have anyone or any evidence interfere with their fame.

I see more corruption coming out of some high officials at these agencies than from the Pharmaceutical companies. The Pharma companies are not going to rock the boat though, they want to make sure their companies profit. If you notice, they are not the ones that are spreading BS, instead they give high paying commercials to the big networks so they make this pandemic look worse and to keep money flowing through their bank accounts...Media is what spreads the misinterpretted evidence.

a reply to: network dude

RE: www.worldometers.info...

36,052,000 people in the United States are no longer included in the back and forth arguments, disagreements, theories, trash talk, fear, and other illogical insanities accompanying these so-called "vaccines".

The higher we can get that number, the less important "vaccine talk" will become in America.

Those who make money, or exert control from Covid-19 don't want that day to come.

Cheer, as you watch that number grow day after day. Hopefully you will be one to help out. I was, and am damn glad of it.

a reply to: NorthOfStuff

Most of the time, illness is a combination of damage from the microorganism/systemic dysfunction in question and the things our immune system does to attack it.

That's the reason why so many illnesses have so many symptoms in common. Our body's repertoire of attack strategies is limited in how it manifests. Fever is our body's attempt to "smoke out" the attackers since heat inhibits function. Heat is also a by-product of the inflammatory process. And that's just one example. COVID doesn't cause the fever in anything it does. It just co-opts cells for its own reproduction and causes damage when they are destroyed in ever-widening circles of destruction.

a reply to: network dude

There’s no particular reason to believe that the APNews article is wrong, but I don’t think it necessarily means what you think it does.

Basically, either getting vaccinated or getting infected for the first time with the virus should stimulate a normal immune system to start generating new antibodies and memory T cells specific to that virus. It takes from 10 to 14 days for a normal immune system to reach peak antibody production, starting from zero. This is why you are not considered “fully vaccinated” until 14 days after getting the last shot. If you have the infection, the virus is reproducing as fast as it can during that time and causing death and destruction to the target cells it is attacking. If your immune system is eventually able to produce antibodies faster than the virus can reproduce, you win, and the virus is eliminated. If not, the virus wins and you die.

If you survive either the infection or a vaccination, you should have antibodies and memory T cells in your system that will be ready to go if you manage to get an infectious dose of the virus in the future. If you do get an infectious dose, a normal immune system is able to ramp up to max antibody production about twice as fast (5 to 7 days) compared to starting with either no natural immunity or no immunity from a vaccine. Ideally, because of this head start, the virus population in your body cannot reproduce anywhere near as much as it otherwise would. In other words your viral load should peak at a lower value and last for a shorter time. That would mean that you don’t get as sick, because the virus doesn’t kill as many of your cells, and you don’t shed viruses for as long, so you won’t be as contagious.

However, some people’s immune systems just don’t work worth a crap, for a variety of reasons. Old age is a big factor in reducing the effectiveness of an immune system. Taking immunosuppressive medications for a variety of diseases and for organ transplants also makes an immune system pretty ineffective. If you don’t have an effective immune system, then you probably don’t develop much lasting immunity from either being infected or from being vaccinated. That means you are at increased risk of getting re-infected if you were infected before OR at getting a breakthrough infection if you were vaccinated. In either case, if you have little or no preexisting antibodies and T cells and you manage to contract an infectious dose of the virus it’s as if your immune system is starting from zero again. You get a higher viral load for a longer period of time, so you should get sicker and shed more viruses for a longer time.

As a non-medical person, my conjecture is that if someone gets either a breakthrough infection after being vaccinated OR gets re-infected after having been infected before, that just means their immune system was not very effective at producing antibodies and memory T cells. For that reason, I’m not surprised to hear that vaccinated people with breakthrough infections can shed enough viruses to infect other people.

The question is, how many people who previously had the infection (the ones who supposedly have natural immunity) get infected again compared to the number of vaccinated people who get breakthrough infections?

One recent study I am aware of that looked at this question found that people with natural immunity in the sample that they looked at were about 2.3 times as likely to get re-infected as vaccinated people were to have breakthrough infections:

“Reduced Risk of Reinfection with SARS-CoV-2 After COVID-19 Vaccination — Kentucky, May–June 2021”
www.cdc.gov...

That would mean that people with natural immunity (“the unvaccinated”) in a population like this would be responsible for about 70% of the transmission of the disease to others and the vaccinated with breakthrough infections would be responsible for about 30%.

a reply to: 1947boomer

Of course that study of yours also cautions that those results are lab only and could not corroborated in the real world.

a reply to: ketsuko

Interesting. Thanks.

a reply to: 1947boomer

I don't think you understand what this article states. Vaxed or unvaxed had the same viral load. that means that both can share the virus equally if infected. That's not against anything, it's just what was discovered. And it blows the whole lie Biden and Fauci have been telling out of the water. This is not a pandemic of the unvaccinated. it's just a pandemic. So vaxxed or unvaxxed, you have the same risk to society, the same ability to spread this to others. The main point is, treating the unvaxxed any different knowing this to be true, is demonstrably wrong. But as I have said, and we all have noticed, the truth isn't nearly as important as the narrative. Eventually, even the boot lickers will realize this, and wonder why they have that taste in their mouth. Do you?

a reply to: ketsuko

Of course, but the concern isn't that the vaccines could literally create, or even encourage mutations. The concern is that it creates an environment where a very small subsection of mutations can become dominant.

Especially concerning if that environment is one that is hostile to the spike protein, because that will ensure the only successful mutations will be ones that manage to mutate the spike protein enough to bypass the vaccine.

Considering the spike protein is what allows the virus to attack particular cells (and also very highly looks to be cytotoxic in of itself) could mutations in the spike protein make the virus attack different cells/organs or give it a foothold in a large animal reservoir? Could mutations make the spike protein itself more toxic?

originally posted by: network dude
This is not a pandemic of the unvaccinated. it's just a pandemic.

This right here is the real issue going on. It's not a pandemic. It never was a pandemic. We are living in a global version of 1984 where everyone believes we are at war with Eurasia, or is it East Asia, when the truth is the war is the government against it's own citizens.

The definition of a pandemic has been changed. One of the key factors in declaring a pandemic used to be a high degree of mortality. If you do a regular search for "define pandemic" the top results have wiped that part out.

I'm using Bing here and here's what I found second page in. Surprising, actually. Thought I'd have to go further.

Pandemic: An epidemic (a sudden outbreak) that becomes very widespread and affects a whole region, a continent, or the world due to a susceptible population. By definition, a true pandemic causes a high degree of mortality (death)

By contrast:

An epidemic affects more than the expected number of cases of disease occurring in a community or region during a given period of time. A sudden severe outbreak within a region or a group as, for example, AIDS in Africa or AIDS in intravenous drug users.
An endemic is present in a community at all times but in low frequency. An endemic is continuous as in the case of malaria in some areas of the world or as with illicit drugs in some neighborhoods.

www.medicinenet.com...

The following link is very interesting because it's from WebMD's archives from I think 2005. It's about the flu but it fits nicely with what's happening today.

The CDC's definition of a flu epidemic relates to the percentage of deaths in a given week caused by influenza and pneumonia. The "epidemic threshold" is a certain percentage above what is considered normal for that period. The normal level, or baseline, is statistically determined based on data from past flu seasons.

www.webmd.com...

My last link is a lengthy read but I highly recommend everyone wade in. It seems to be from 2018 and it's nice and official, but all the points line up nicely with what has happened.

Pandemics are large-scale outbreaks of infectious disease that can greatly increase morbidity and mortality over a wide geographic area and cause significant economic, social, and political disruption.

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov...

Long story short, we are being played. There have been no excess deaths anywhere in the world either last year or this year. Everyone who died "with" covid would have died due to their co-morbidities. If there is an uptick of deaths this year I believe history will discover that it was actually caused by the experimental "vaccine".

Best case scenario is that just doesn't plain work.

a reply to: ketsuko

You're being told you're going to die this winter because you got vaxxed? I was constantly warned that I was going to die for NOT getting the vax. My entire family, plus my best friend, all rushed to get their shots and pushed me hard to do the same. I was called names, told I'll get really sick and will be blamed for causing the economy to collapse. It wasn't fun being around them, but I stood my ground.

Then my sister got covid and died three weeks ago. She was fully vaxxed. We are all in shock. It's horrible to have a family member pass away because she felt the shot would protect her.

I will NEVER get the shot. I don't think these breakthrough infections are as mild as the media is saying. And there are too many injury reports from the vaxx that the media won't report on so I don't trust anything they're saying anymore.

originally posted by: DontTreadOnMe
a reply to: ketsuko

What this whole thing has done to normally sane people is damn scary.
Both sides have a lunatic fringe.
Believe what you want to believe, but keep it to yourself.

IMHO.

It's one thing to debate on an anonymous forum, it's another for people to tell you to your face you're going to die, you are a menace, etc etc etc.

Hmm that’s exactly what governments and MSM have been doing, not directly to your face but as in your face as they can be. How anyone still believes any of it I don’t know.

originally posted by: xuenchen
They just keep telling people the vax will lessen the impacts when you catch TheRONA !!!!

But there's no proof of that bulls#t either is there 🤣🤣🤣🤣

There have been plenty of trials to show that it works, especially for those with an already compromised immune system. There is a reason why the mass majority of folks in ICU and general hospitalizations for Covid are unvaxxed as well. What other proof are you looking for here?

a reply to: network dude

You don't get it man.

Sure they lied to you when

1. They said you shouldn't wear a mask and they do nothing.
2. Sure they back peddled on wearing a mask and told you multiple mask is even better.

3. They told you the vaccine will prevent you from getting covid.
4. Sure they back peddled and said it wont prevent you from getting covid, but it will make dealing with the symptoms better.
5. Sure you will have less severe symptoms but for that to work you need to force your neighbor to get vaccinated.


6. Look dont get it if you have an allergic reaction to the first shot.
7. Oh wait its better for you if you do have an allergic reaction to get the second shot.

8. OK here is the truth, the covid vaccine cures everything and makes you immortal. Trust us ,we mean it this time


www.cnn.com...

Well even the CDC released a study showing that sometimes, vaccinated people who have covid have MORE viral load in their noses than unvaccinated. On an anecdotal level, I keep noticing people who get vaxxed, come down with covid, when somehow they went through 18 months without ever getting it.

originally posted by: interupt42
a reply to: network dude

You don't get it man.

Sure they lied to you when

1. They said you shouldn't wear a mask and they do nothing.
2. Sure they back peddled on wearing a mask and told you multiple mask is even better.

3. They told you the vaccine will prevent you from getting covid.
4. Sure they back peddled and said it wont prevent you from getting covid, but it will make dealing with the symptoms better.
5. Sure you will have less severe symptoms but for that to work you need to force your neighbor to get vaccinated.


6. Look dont get it if you have an allergic reaction to the first shot.
7. Oh wait its better for you if you do have an allergic reaction to get the second shot.

8. OK here is the truth, the covid vaccine cures everything and makes you immortal. Trust us ,we mean it this time

www.cnn.com...

when the scientists don't follow the science, it becomes problematic to trust them. I try to, but I just can't do it.

originally posted by: HawkeyeNation

originally posted by: xuenchen
They just keep telling people the vax will lessen the impacts when you catch TheRONA !!!!

But there's no proof of that bulls#t either is there 🤣🤣🤣🤣

There have been plenty of trials to show that it works, especially for those with an already compromised immune system. There is a reason why the mass majority of folks in ICU and general hospitalizations for Covid are unvaxxed as well. What other proof are you looking for here?

can you explain how you would quantify that? the statement you are responding to is about the claim that with the vaccine, your covid sickness will be lessened. We know people who were fully vaxxed have died, so it's hard to know if the death would have been more severe had they not been vaxxed.

I do understand what you are saying, and I agree that when the pro's and cons are weighed, over 65 people likely would have less risk getting the shot, than getting the virus and recovering, but that isn't true for all age brackets, based on facts that are factual. And the fact that adverse reactions to the vaccine is something you aren't allowed to discuss in public, makes it very hard to trust the system that is supposed to be in place to protect us all.

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